General Betting
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if you don't think this will affect everyone in the future
think again !!!
it will give every raceclub and sports club dollar signs in their eyes.
ignore this at your peril !
think again !!!
it will give every raceclub and sports club dollar signs in their eyes.
ignore this at your peril !
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Replies: 17
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It might be an idea to mention what you are talking about, rather vague.
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no interest.
no one has even bothered to find out what the implications will be. you all deserve what you get in the future !!!!! |
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So is BF pulling out ?
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this doesn't bother me in the slightest so are you talking about something else?
Australia’s High Court has unanimously ruled in favor of New South Wales racing organizations in their long-running battle with betting outfits Betfair and Sportsbet over fees charged for race field data. NSW passed legislation in 2006 that allowed Racing NSW and Harness Racing NSW to levy fees on bookmakers amounting to 1.5% of betting turnover. Betfair and Sportsbet challenged the fees as a breach of the Australian Constitution’s free trade provisions and suggested a fee based on gross revenue was more appropriate. The betting outfits lost a Federal Court appeal in 2010, but doubled down on getting a more favorable result at the High Court in Canberra. Sadly, their nag didn’t come in, meaning the NSW racing bodies get to keep the $100m+ in fees that Betfair and Sportsbet had hoped to claw back. In rendering their decision, the judges declared the fees were valid under the terms of the NSW legislation. Moreover, the fees were imposed uniformly on operators regardless of whether they were intrastate or out of state and thus were neither discriminatory nor protectionist. The judges also failed to identify a connection between a betting firm’s location and its turnover. Understandably, Racing NSW chairman John Messara welcomed an end to “four years of uncertainty,” and celebrated the money that had been held in limbo but will now flow into prize money at the tracks. NSW Racing Minister George Souris said the decision would “become the legislative national template to ensure the racing industry receives its fair share of fees from wagering operators.” Racing NSW CEO Peter V’landys called the ruling “terrific news for NSW racing but also for other race organizations in Australia and the world. It will also have ramifications for other sporting bodies.” Sportsbet CEO Cormac Barry rejected the notion that the decision would serve as a template for much of anything. Other states “may review the fee that they charge, but my understanding is that their preference is for a gross-profit model.” As for other sports, Barry didn’t think wagering was “as core” to their business model. Sportsbet marketing director Barni Evans told the Australian Associated Press the ruling was disappointing, but said the firm wouldn’t attempt to pass on its costs to their customers. Tabcorp CEO David Attenborough said it was “important that racing is able to charge a fee for its product that allows it to continue to be successful.” That last quote borders on taunting, given that Betfair had claimed Racing NSW had entered into a conspiracy with other bookmakers – including Tabcorp – to deliberately target the two firms. Betfair Australia CEO Andrew Twaits even claimed Tabcorp had been “running the case” in a bid to hobble a rising competitor. A year ago, Twaits said he was looking forward to “getting some finality” in the High Court. Careful what you wish for. |
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never mind
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OP seems to think a court ruling in Australia about Horse Racing turnover tax is significant.
Don`t think so.. |
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RAPS
You are correct. Means nothing today, but in 5 years down the track, and prizemoney in Great Britain continues to head down the toilet, well you never know. |
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If Betfair can build a business in Australia without the need for traders it could have massive implications for Betfair users. Their hand is forced but they might find their profits actually go up without traders.
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frog, while I agree that if betfair cut out the middlemen then losing gamblers churning the extra money might well compensate betfair for the pc losses (fewer crashes might also help) the 1.5% turnover tax will hit a lot of winning gamblers as well. If betfair had charged me 1.5% on turnover then I'd have paid a bit more than I did so BUT I'd still be paying less than the minimum 40% I'm being charged just now. Paying 1.5% on top of what I've previously paid would take me to around the 65-70% of profits mark and that assumes betfair would accept the loss of any future pc's (i.e. the 1.5% turnover charge would be included in pc calculations). While that would mean I'd still be in a position to profit if anything it would make me become even more selective than I was previously was whereas I'm currently looking to automate and create more liquidity (although most of it won't be on betfair). I think this effect would be even more marked with the much bigger liquidity providers.
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have betfair said whether they are closing down their operations in the relevant states of Australia.
I presume they will, otherwise we can imply that a 1.5% turnover tax is acceptable to their bottom line. If they contnue to operate I could see more authorities seeking such a tax change. |
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They have stated publicly , that they are going nowhere.
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now you're getting it!!!!!
traders will become loss making customers under a 1.5% on turnover model. as a business you ditch loss making parts of a business for high profit parts of your business. low volume/high profit might in the long run be very profitable if it is successful in Australia then I am sure it will be implemented everywhere. also traders use a lot of system resources,the site would run much better if there were less transactions also pure betting at low odds is unsustainable... have $1 million @ 1.01 and you make $10 000 betfiar makes $500 @ 5% commission... 1.5% tax on turnover is $15 000 betfair LOSES $14 500 IF SUCCESSFUL IN AUSTRALIA IT WON'T BE BETFAIR THAT CHANGES THINGS IT WILL BE GOVERNMENTS AND RACECLUBS !!! |
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Tax on turnover makes an exchange model infeasible. It will either force betfair out of Australia, or force them into making the markets themselves and out of the exchange model. (And even then, they wouldn't be able to offer many odds-on stuff.)
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Does anyone actually bet on Aussie markets?
Nothing there of interest to me whatsoever. |
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yeah.
rugby union, aussie rules, rugby league, cricket. some of the in-running stuff (actually in aus rather than nz or sa for super 15) is actually better because their ban means you aren't competing against folks betting on their phones at the venue as far as i can tell. |
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but i'm sanguine about the whole thing cos i'm heading towards 62.5% commission at which point i hope the government introduces a 99% special tax on betfair profits
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told you so......
I bet the levy board in the UK is looking at this and rubbing their hands together |