question about fast pictures.

you need to buy a modern satellite dish/decoder!!

I can't have a satellite dish as I live in a grade 2 listed building. sure there isn't another method?

.
http://www.ddelec.com/digiglobe.htm

ok thanks investor. but once I have the digiglobe, what do I do then to get the fast racing pics?

how much is it? does anyone pay them?

10k is a hell of a lot to shell out for a service which is still way behind live.

If you are even contemplating this, first book yourself a week in an exchange shop and see how easy it is to win money there.....

how far is home SIS behind exchange shops please?

10k is a hell of a whack I agree.

I mean the real question is, in the 21st century, why don't we have a level playing field? why doesn't everyone have access to the same pictures?

mythical prince, imo its because there are many dark forces at work in racing, it was going to happen with ruk in 2006 the the BHB stepped in, you couldnt make it up could you, no journalist dare talk about it and atr progressively get worse and worse.

But fear not, there are plenty of others sports that are purely about opinions and fair to you the punter. Personally i do alot of betting on cricket (as a favourite sport of mine anyway), the liquidity on the ipl doubled this year to about £16 million  per game. Liquidity would probably increase significantly if racing could sort itself out (including big increases in levy) but whilst the bha take their advice from bookmakers its not likely to, is it?

Its frustrating but whilst taking a stand you also have to adapt to whats happening, most other sports also have very good liquidity, racing is at the bottom of the pile for obvious reasons, will bittar do anything? judging from a recent interview with him i very much doubt it.

Rider, do you not think if pictures became live and everyone was betting ir on bf the levy would be severely affected? I can see why the BHB stepped in.

am i right in thinking you consider the bhb stepped in for fear of the bookmakers losing higher margin turnover ?

sis are updating the horse racing tracks to fibre optic cables starting as soon as next month + within a yr all the tracks will be complete.

this will decrease the the current delay from 2.5 - 3secs,  to 1 sec 

also the same pictures will be used on track in the boxs, therefore no more track players.... so getting the home service or a regular seat at exchange shop will be well worth it next yr

I'm not sure rider but if it had been me I'd have called it that way. Exchange ir has even more potential to take punters from the bookmakers than exchange pre-race.

ok all good answers , I pay SIS per annum

when you are trying to lay off I have already greened up and have all your money just wanted to say thanks stay the way you are
Love
xx

feck, all the bhb achieved was to reduce the audience racing has for the ruk tracks, nice one

I agree with that (should be a freeview channel showing ALL racing) but exchanges and racing will always be at loggerheads while levy is on gp's. Racing should have its own exchange with course bookmakers automatically tied in.

Why would we expect racing to be happy with betfair taking all the profits when we're not?

'aspy65
27 Oct 11 17:15

sis are updating the horse racing tracks to fibre optic cables starting as soon as next month + within a yr all the tracks will be complete.

this will decrease the the current delay from 2.5 - 3secs,  to 1 sec

also the same pictures will be used on track in the boxs, therefore no more track players.... so getting the home service or a regular seat at exchange shop will be well worth it next yr'


Aspy, you seem to be in the know about this....is it likely that SIS home subscriptions will increase, perhaps significantly, as a result of this? Also, is that correct that SIS is currently 2.5 - 3secs behind live....do any users still consider that a snip even given the latest Premium Charge revision? Thanks.

TURT TV use fibre optic cables on there tracks instaed of the copper cables currently on sis tracks +  turf tv have a 1 sec delay behind live.

and no sis home service will not be increasing the cost.  let the good times roll  even lingfield and southwell will be playable on sis next yr  :>)

why would the track players use the same sis pictures ?

i'd have thought they would continue to use the closed circuit pictures or are sis intentionally going to impose a delay on them (ie send the pictures to the satellite and back) to give parity with their home users ?

sis now own raceteck,   here is a link to raed  take note of the final paragraph.
http://betviewmagazine.com/news/bookmakers-trade-fair.html

doesnt answer my question aspy

thanks for the reply, aspy.

I thought Racetech were owned by the RCA

shaun   RCA did  however sis have now taken over racetech.   also when sis speed up if betfair do some deal with "betfair live vidio" then every 1 could play from home with graet picture speeds.

Things are certainly going to change.

However there is no way the racecourses(especially the poorer ones) will risk losing the income stream that track players provide by removing the Racetech feed.

This would be financial suicide.

Whether or not people would still go to the track for a dramatically reduced advantage is another matter though....

plenty of the Box 11 boys would be dead in the water with a mere 1 sec advantage imo

1 sec equals about 5 lengths, so clever chaps are still going to clean up with a 1 sec delay. However, it will make for a closer playing field.

If a horse misses the start in a sprint, that one second advantage is all they need :(

point is BTO, the chaps in Box 11 are not necessarily clever but are still able to clean up with current 3+sec advantage....suspect the Gold Rush will be over for a few if the above is correct about SIS pics

Since the issue of fast pictures and the pickpocket merchants who use them are well documented, my question is: Who on earth is being silly enough to bet against this?

I really can't understand how the in play horse market hasn't just dried up.

I understand why most satellite pics are a few seconds behind. But why are Eurosport sometimes 15 seconds or so off the pace? Cheaper equipment or something?

DaveEdwards, heres my take, currently and put simply you have:

1. the real time boys at the course who no doubt make money towards the end of races, laying/scalping at fences, slow starters etc anything where their picture speed most benefits them almost exclusively

2. the clued up sis and turf/ruk pic players who clearly need to apply a fair bit of knowledge and good race reading skills

3. bots

for these groups to do it full time you fancy they are all winning after bf take their cut, so who's losing ?

good question,

well i guess there are a few recreational punters on ruk and the occassional punter losing giving it a go in the shops but the main flow of money coming in could be from the keep bets, clearly those punters dont mind insuring their bet, perhaps an eqilibrium has been reached

i'm still doing ok even with the slow betfair pictures. But I think I could train a gerbil to win with fast pictures.

However as i've said before and how others have reitarated on here, the whole idea that we are seemingly living in the dark ages with only a lucky few having access to fast pictures, is somewhat preposterous. Not living anywhere near an exchange shop, I suppose the only method left open to someone like me is to fork out for the sis services.

incidentally rider I very much doubt that the main bulk of the "pros" income is coming from keep bets. I have no idea really, but I would guess is there are plenty of people out there who are doing their bollocks on a regular basis on in-running.

DaveEdwards
28 Oct 11 17:52
Joined:
06 Sep 07
| Topic/replies: 8,880 | Blogger: DaveEdwards's blog
Since the issue of fast pictures and the pickpocket merchants who use them are well documented, my question is: Who on earth is being silly enough to bet against this?

I really can't understand how the in play horse market hasn't just dried up.

I suppose the answer to this is that I believe it's still possible to win, as theres still plenty of mug money about. Just that you are not winning on anything like the same level as you would with fast pictures.

It's entirely possible to beat the fast pic boys a lot of the time I believe. Not saying it would be easy though, far from it. Just incase anyone is in the process of doing it or planning the work involved I'm not going to say what it is. I wouldn't be happy if someone did it the other way around.

The opportunity is certainly there though. Cue the responses saying I don't know what I'm talking about!

totally agree dave.

What, that I don't know what I'm talking about??

I've just thought of something else, whereby you could use fast pics to beat the fast pic pickpockets. The one thing I think these fast boys might suffer from is perhaps being a little too cocky.

Still that's all stuff for another lifetime, I'm never going to get around to it.

You don't need fast pics to win. Just watch where the money is going and piggy back it

You can't really, coupled with the extra 5 second delay, by the time you put your bet on the horse could have fallen or put six lengths on them depending on a back or lay bet.
Sod's law and all that.

However, there is bucket loads to be made if you can read a horse's stride, and head action.
The grail is being able to read the difference between a horse travelling well but not having much left in the tank and one travelling well having loads left in the tank.

Haven't mastered it myself, but picked up on quite a few common traits.

1 sec = 5 lengths!!!!

It's **** like that from established members like bto which makes in running so profitable.

People actually believe this tripe and follow it blindly.

1 sec can = 5 lengths, it can also equal 0.5 length or 12+ lengths all within the same distance (flat) race.

If you can't figure out why then stop reading message boards and learn about horse racing. Really learn.

If you want fast pictures go to some of the bookies in Nicosia, Cyprus. The guys there have it sussed out, as well as superfast internet. Eventhough they're much further away, their system blows away any exchange shop in the UK. You could also give the guys at Cobain in Ireland a ring. They're secretive because what they do might not be totally legal. They supply pics to lots of bookies on the qt allegedly

hmm interesting. not sure about the cyprus option though, seems a bit farfetched to commute there everyday

beat the overround, i'm not sure thats the holy grail. I think sometimes guessing whether a horse will find much off the bridle is often guesswork. take this a media luz today at ascot. was hacking around the turn at ascot, but finds very little off the bridle. unfortunately had a big lay at 1.78 but lowest it traded was 2.02.

actually one of the things i've learnt from the in-play, is that you get a much higher standard and more accurate prices in-play on a weekend and especially on the big races than you do on some bog standard weekday with low-profile meetings.
i'm pretty sure if that a media luz race had been on an obscure card at newton abbot it would have traded at 1.3... the pros give very little away.

Oh dear!

It's not a figure I just plucked out of the air.
Google Rem Plante, Don Scott, or Andrew Bayer.

Sorry that should be Beyer.

DrWhom, do you know if there are any official exchange trading shops in Cyprus or does anyone know of any others in the sun? I know there was talk of one opening in Spain some time back but not sure if it fell through?

'Bung It On
29 Oct 11 20:24

1 sec = 5 lengths!!!!


1 sec can = 5 lengths, it can also equal 0.5 length or 12+ lengths all within the same distance (flat) race.

If you can't figure out why then stop reading message boards and learn about horse racing. Really learn.'


Bung It On, you seem like a shrewdie and i want to really learn about horses racing....please can you explain to me how 1 sec can equal ½ length? Is that in the paddock?

12 lengths in one second? Is this downhill skiing?

Is that in the paddock?

12 lengths in one second

only frankel can post those kind of figures

Frankel couldn't get anywhere near 12 L per second. I'd be amazed if any horse could.

ttt

DrWhom, what is so special about the bookies in Nicosia, how are they able to access faster pictures?

in fairness, MythicalP, i think A Media Luz is a pretty high-profile short runner, as it were, tho i take your point in general that the better meetings (with the better-known horses) are sewn up by the fast-piccers.

yeah. don't normally do american horse racing but noticed that plenty of horses traded at 2.00 tonight on the breeders cup (and exactly 2.00)

don't know what to make of that fact but seems interesting. perhaps it suggests that when there isn't big money involved on the in-play markets (most of the money seems to trade pre-event on the breeders cup) that people are happy to hoover up any kind of price and value can be made?