Posters that work for Betfair

been here one month

idiot!

what has my joining date go to do with the slice of bread?

You can be here for a day and realise how obvious it seems that my initial point is true.

Thanks for calling me an idiot, that's a really intelligent input.

@acquiesce12

I'm intrigued how you detect BF employees.  Other than BCM, BCM2 and Nemesis and the like I mean.

What's your shibboleth?  Approval of anything to do with BF?

acquiesce12 you show some basic human nature that we all have within us, mistrust and I find it
interesting that if a person,company or political regime assigns its self to freedom of speech that as soon as the masses engage they themselves start to mistrust each other, oh dear will we ever learn[;)]

I just can't go with bff being a bf stooge. the perception that he is allied with the general sense that he's a raving obsessive can only do the firm damage.

what kind of company would have someone like that representing them, even covertly, and not shut them down?

Well mr president you are so in love with your self and everything that escapes your lips that truly no-one could ever accuse you of having any loyalty so you will be pardoned always on that basis.

It's obvious, the Pro PC Brigade.
FFS

Viva,

If you want a laugh, have a read of the birthday problem thread below.

Title: IS IT TRUE THAT IF THERES 52 PEOPLE IN A ROOM, 2 SHARE THE SAME BIRTHDAY?

bf_fananatic's analysis of the problem is quite comical.

I can admit contrarian that my formula is too basic like most of yours to be correct and the correct formula will be a field of distribution statistical  analysis which is of little use to me as I equate form with real results versus projection and don't rely on equations to work out unknown complex associations of factors that are fundamentally UN-predictable via equations to any useful accuracy.

On the subject of intelligence the human race with all its fancy equations and best minds has failed to
discover the processes involved in one of the five fundamental forces known as gravity or another example is finding a unified theory that joins quantum mechanics with the five fundamental forces or detecting one neutrino or discovering the higgs boson so don't be surprised if mathematics in all its glory cant help discover the most important things in the cosmos via a formula, such tasks will be left to minds that think beyond the constraints of preformed ideas and values and go in the real university of the universe of cause and effect where mathematics can prove the concepts, conception being the breeding ground for great revelations past, present and future.

I can admit contrarian that my formula is too basic like most of yours to be correct and the correct formula will be a field of distribution statistical  analysis which is of little use to me as I equate form with real results versus projection and don't rely on equations to work out unknown complex associations of factors that are fundamentally UN-predictable via equations to any useful accuracy.

I have no idea what this gibberish amounts to, but if you are trying to say that you place no importance in statistical theory, but only rely on 'real results', then I fear for your gambling future.

And, as a couple of posters pointed out in the thread below, the solution to the birthday problem (how many people must be there be in a room so that the probability of at least 2 of them sharing a birthday is over 50%?) is very simple.

Suppose there are 2 people - the probability that they have different birthdays is 364/365.
3 people - 364/365 x 363/365
4 people - 364/365 x 363/365 x 362/365

etc

If you carry on this sequence, you will find that when you come to 23 people, the probability that they all have different birthdays drops below 0.5 for the first time (and so this is the minimum number required in the original question).
Prob(

On the subject of intelligence the human race with all its fancy equations and best minds has failed to
discover the processes involved in one of the five fundamental forces known as gravity or another example is finding a unified theory that joins quantum mechanics with the five fundamental forces or detecting one neutrino or discovering the higgs boson so don't be surprised if mathematics in all its glory cant help discover the most important things in the cosmos via a formula, such tasks will be left to minds that think beyond the constraints of preformed ideas and values and go in the real university of the universe of cause and effect where mathematics can prove the concepts, conception being the breeding ground for great revelations past, present and future.

I tend rather to be impressed by the extraordinary extent to which humans have managed to understand their world. That space-time is relativistic (a very counterintuitive, non-commonsensical idea), and that we have discovered this fact, is pretty amazing.

acquiesce12
It's obvious, the Pro PC Brigade.
FFS

That's quite a bigoted opinion you have there, I have given the pc situation a great deal of thought and I understand the reasons that it has been implemented and how it affects some of the various different type of user on here. I never have worked and never will work for betfair.

That's quite a bigoted opinion you have there, I have given the pc situation a great deal of thought and I understand the reasons that it has been implemented and how it affects some of the various different type of user on here. I never have worked and never will work for betfair.

What a complete misuse of the word 'bigoted'. If you worked for Betfair - you'd hardly be likely to say either way.

contrarian- thanks, I'll treat myself to that in a quiet moment.

The idea that it is not possible to disagree with your view on pc without there being an ulterior motive is a perfect example of bigotry.

Very good point Contrarian and I totally agree with you, also I did read your post about my mistake in the 52 birthday problem and I have to admit my formula was  comical in retrospect and thanks for pointing it out, laws of distribution not my cup of tea, also owe viva el presidente! an apology for a thread I made and that was wrong of me to use humor in that way and as for my pro pc stance before I cant believe I have defended betfair without good cause after all they may be good at what they do but if someone one day beats them then good luck to them as competition is what has failed the exchanges, there is good competition between the bookmakers but its been all one-sided with the exchanges and its sad to see BF spoiling the goodwill that they have promoted, gained from and sold so well up to pc2.

The idea that it is not possible to disagree with your view on pc without there being an ulterior motive is a perfect example of bigotry.


The idea that a poster such as myself coming to the conclusion that Extremely Pro PC posters have an ulterior motive (see thread title) and then being subsequently subjected to basically being called a bigot - is insulting, inaccurate and low grade.

You're full entitled to say the PC is for the good and that you have no ulterior motive - and I haven't pigeonholed you into being a betfair worker as I'm not familiar with your posts - what I'm entitled to say  - is that IMO, it would be a simple but smart idea to have a poster who works for Betfair - to promote the new PC and/or diffuse potential uproar from the regulars who are affected and talk of 'taking their money elsewhere' - it's actually common sense.

Well, i never intentionally insult anybody I just say things as I see them and this:

a poster such as myself coming to the conclusion that Extremely Pro PC posters have an ulterior motive

is bigotry.

I'm sorry if you find the word offensive but I have used it accurately and in context.

I'm sorry if you find the word offensive but I have used it accurately and in context.


I would probably of been apt if you'd have said "IMO" after you said "accurately and in context" as you're not speaking for the majority, only yourself.

No, it's not bigotry imo to say that a poster such as myself coming to the conclusion that Extremely Pro PC posters have an ulterior motive - it's well of of context to call me a "bigot" imo because I've said something very obvious - that if someone is ott with praising the PC, it can easily be construed as them having an "ulterior motive" - this is not something that is original , been mentioned before by others I remember from the first day I joined.

And, yes, I did feel insulted - but then again I must remind myself you don't know me, and I don't know the truth - only have opinions.

I personally would like to state an important point without being accused of being a worker for betfair or pro pc as I was really shocked when I found out about pc2, I couldn't believe my eyes at the rates and could go on about sharing everyones disgust with it as it is disgusting to move towards
punishing punters for being successful at something they promoted at our and there wish.

There seems to be two different exchanges at loggerheads at the moment and both have completely different pedigrees and  yet seem to have the same common problem that possibly underlines
that there may be a problem in the exchange model that they currently use.

case 1....Betdak

founders initial funding = billionaire so very good.
interim funding = unknown personal millions

current staffing = 50

web and server upgrading budget = minor

advertising budget = medium

growth over 10 year period = 10% of market leader rival

important business statements ;


case 2 .....betfair

founders initial funding = around million.

interim funding = many hundreds of millions from many backers
current staffing = 2000

web and server upgrading budget = huge

advertising budget = huge

growth over 10 year period = 10 fold the liquidity of bedak

important business statements ;

In September 2008, Betfair introduced a "Premium Charge" for bettors whose winnings were deemed to be disproportionately high when compared to the amount of commission they pay. Specifically, members whose commission charges amount to less than 20% of their gross profits (across at least 250 markets) are required to pay the additional charge to make up the difference.[13]

Even though Betfair insisted that the charge would only affect a very small portion of its members (less than 0.5%), it attracted a great deal of criticism on its member forum and from the broader exchange betting community.[14][15] According to The Guardian, the charge has significantly changed the relationship between Betfair and its customers, as Betfair can no longer claim to be a neutral bet exchange provider "where winners are welcome" (its mantra for many years).[16]

The customers most likely to be affected by the Premium Charge are successful traders, whose repeated backing and laying at small margins results in few losses (and hence yield little commission). Backers with a particularly good strike-rate may also be subject to the additional charge.

In June 2011 Betfair announced that it will raise the Premium Charge to 60% for some customers, a move which has been met by outrage.


What we clearly have is two different types of polarized businesses types
betfair that started with little except a dream and put everything into it, massive investment
and when it cant make the projected marginal mark up from its potential revenues is forced to
create premium charges.

And betdak where the founder has no real passion to make the best exchange as he is already rich so has never given betfair any trouble at all, possibly he is waiting out for a big buyer maybe
a consortium of bookmakers to then challenge betfair to run it down so to speak, who knows perhaps there is some form of assistance from bookmakers as there has been many talks between them yet no
account of the content fueling buy out speculation.

Had betfair had more healthy competition earlier on then there would of been no chance of betfair
spending so much, in fact probably over spending and there would of been less chance of a premium charge being either needed or sustainable as a clear competitor would of purged there customer base
drastically.

So If betfair fails because it tried to hard and sold the farm then what is Desmond going to do with a site that if offered the right price he would be rid of.

It seems the whole future of the exchange model is in the balance and lets hope what ever happens
foolishness doesn't play right into the bookmakers hands at the loss of all the betting community.

I don't agree.  Whether I have used the word accurately and in context is something that can be judged objectively, not a matter of opinion.

If I started a thread called 'Posters that work for Betd@q' and made out that anyone who argued against the pc (the anti-pc brigade) was obviously an employee, that would be bigoted.

I'm not having a go, you're right - many others have said it already but it is bigoted.

And btw, you can accuse me of pedantry without fear of causing insult [;)]

If I proceeded to answer your latest post, it'll be the 3rd time I've answered the same point, this time of night - I really can't be bothered to go over worn out ground but I'll give it another go.

All I'll say is my opinion on the matter, that it's very possible for betfair workers to be pro pc workers is such an obvious conclusion to come to, that no matter how you try to defend your 'bigot' comment or articulate your reason for doing so it can never take away from the fact that my opinion is as plausible as an opinion can get.

Anyone that stand up for the PC charge vehemently, can easily be mistaken for being an employee for betfair - I haven't insisted that every single person that has had good words to say about the new charge works for them have I - what I've said is that I wouldn't be in the least bit surprised if they did, or words to that effect.

Bigotry doesn't even come in to it.

*pro pc posters

I agree with catfliipo with his statements and know we dont work for each other and I detect
acquiesce12 that you are agreeing with him but defending this thread whaich is up to you its your thread mate but if you didn't let others have there say then you are acting like a bigot and you seem to intelligent to be that way at heart.

Great dialogue between you both though

I agree with catfliipo with his statements and know we dont work for each other and I detect
acquiesce12 that you are agreeing with him but defending this thread whaich is up to you its your thread mate but if you didn't let others have there say then you are acting like a bigot and you seem to intelligent to be that way at heart.
WALOFS

- You would disagree with me on each point, your ursername is a gives that away before you even type.
- please don't tell me what I am agreeing with, I completely disagree that my comment was bigoted.
-where and when have I stopped letting people have their say - incase you hadn't noticed, I'm no betfair employee - which means I don't possess the capability of restricting people's opinions here (I'm not a moderator)
-I'm now bored to tears of this tread

I'm sorry acquiesce12 but you are ignoring the actual meaning of the word.

You have responded three times but each time you have basically followed up a statement that you are not being bigoted with a clearly bigoted remark about it being an obvious conclusion that someone not opposed to the pc must be a bf employee.

Its like me saying "I'm not being racist but obviously all irish people are stupid"

conclusion that someone not opposed to the pc must be a bf employee.


WHERE HAVE I SAID THAT EVERY SINGLE PERSON THAT OPPOSES THE PC CHARGE 'MUST' BE A BETFIAR EMPLOYEE FFS, I'VE SAID THAT IT'S EASY TO COME TO THE OPINION THAT EXTREMELY PRO PC POSTERS CAN BE EASILY VIEWED AS BEING BETFAIR WORKERS

I'VE JUST REALISED I'M TYPING IN CAPS AND CAN'T BE BOTHERED TO DELETE IT.

THEREFORE - IT MEANS I AM NOT BIGOTED, YOU ARE CLEARLY FISHING, WHICH MAKES SENSE, CAT'S LIKE FISH.

SERIOUSLY.

acquiesce12 try to be more original if you want a bigoted pop at me, Ive been called a bf worker, a troll, a nutjob, any many other things and its been done in levels of ingenuity ranging from knuckle dragging and swearing up to the finery of the delectable delights of the viva el presedante with his silver tongue, I am sure if you warm up your biggoted brain it will produce some fine wonder to pigeon hole me well and trully, give it your best shot please.

The entire basis of this thread was how amusingly easy it is for you to spot bf employees because they are obviously, and i quote, "the Pro PC Brigade, FFS".

Read it and see for yourself.

Anyone that is lucky or unlucky enough to get the pc2 will effectively be working for them as it seems we all are if generating comms for them that have to reach beyond a fair expected profit out of the system, rather sad that a company that most punters and the press embraced so much has slipped so far down the moral ladder but thats business in general and they bigger they get the more they want.

I am sure I was warned about what betfair has done by a story told as a child, when the hero of the story needed to find wealth to keep himself and his family going and greed nearly got the better of him
"jack and the beanstalk" the betfair giant is sleeping now but get what you can while you can before he comes crashing done upon us all.

don't forget the legendary HORNETS

bf_fanatic, considering there are many people in this forum that have your number, and I'm not talking the type of number that leads to a phone call, I wouldn't entertain your trolling comments a second further after this post as I agree with the others about you.


Cat
[i]The entire basis of this thread was how amusingly easy it is for you to spot bf employees because they are obviously, and i quote, "the Pro PC Brigade, FFS".[/u]


Don't remember saying it was "amusingly easy to spot a bf employee".
And that's right, IMO, the pro pc brihade can easily be suspected of being bf workers - it doens't take a rocket scientist to work that out. That's not to say all pro PC posters are, but the ones that are extremely PRO PC makes me even more suspicious - and it;'s just that, a suspicion.

You must be really bored to keep putting the same points across in a different way.

 
You keep insulting my intelligence by deliberately twisting the truth of my words, you know you're doing it, as it's 01:32 in the monring and I need to sleep - some of us have to work (don't tell me you;re a pro here) I won;t proceed much further - as I feel as if I've pretty much answered my points fairly and accordingly - you on the other hand - or just looking to fish, it's obvious IMO.


Goodnight Cat, I might answer any post from precisely 7pm later today

You must be really bored to keep putting the same points across in a different way.

and I was bored to answer them

7pm[;)]

acquiesce12 goodnight and check your bed incase your sleeping with the enemy or the bogey man gets you
[;)]

betfair believe it's technology (amount of money spent) give betfair a edge (the size of liquidity),and stops other from entering the betting exchange market

But as now betdak horse racing  is 20% of betfair (and growing), and soccer also look to be about 20% of betfair ( a guess) if betdak keep growing with betdak sh!t technloogy, then betfair edge is worth nothing

Don't remember saying it was "amusingly easy to spot a bf employee".

I didn't quote you. 

The evidence is here for anyone that reads the thread and I'm happy to let everyone see for themselves - I'll say no more on the matter.

And at the risk of ruining your 7pm forum experience, yes - I work on here full time.

Nairda do you think desmond is really bothered about having the best exchange when being a billionaire he has done little to gain any liquidity via marketing or site appeal in 10 years and only gets some slight headway because a rival has over-invested to get where they are, Desmond has been talking with bookmakers recently if you do some research, and his site looks more like a bookmakers now to get more appeal for a possible buy-out from the bookmakers as hotly speculated in the press recently so if your a pro punter you will know all this right nairda? or maybe you wont or you dont want to acknowledge that you do and will do your usual remark to me along the lines of, bf are bookies, f-k -ff etc

Your not the real mc coy nairda and you don't have me fooled for one minute.

Yes , no fly's on you

Betfair keeps 72% of all money (higher now with this PC)  betfair is the f-cking bookmaker...it's a bookmakers who doesn't take much risk (92% core from no risk, 8% from risk)

nairda

Betfair is a business, not some form of betting utopia.

As a business it will seek to :-

- maximise profits
- remove uneconomic customers from its customer base.

The premium charge does both!

Surely you can understand that.

As I work by a computer, I thought I'd answer you now, otherwise you'd be waiting in anticipation until later tonight

The evidence is here for anyone that reads the thread and I'm happy to let everyone see for themselves - I'll say no more on the matter.

You don't say, I'm more than happy for anyone to re-read this thread to see if they think that I am a "bigot".

I must ask, why is this so important to you - because you've made 63 comments in nearly 50 months, I'd say you've made about 20% of them comments on this thread alone - in just a few hours(although I haven't bothered to check, just an estimation)! - obviously the subject means alot to you.

And at the risk of ruining your 7pm forum experience, yes - I work on here full time.

For Betfair ?

Definition of a bigot
"A bigot is a prejudiced person who is intolerant of any opinions differing from their own "

Doesn't apply to me at all, I am clearly not intolerant of other people's opinions at all, if I was, I'd have dismissed the thoughts of you and others in a arrogant manner - I havne't, I put across a point that IMO, they're seems to be a lot of people who are so Pro PC that it would not surprise me in the least if they were Betfair workers, - how on God's green earth can you than say I'm bigoted from the dialogue that ensued. - All I can come up with is when i said "the Pro PC Brigade, FF - that's me putting emphasis on the strength of my opinion - that's not me being intolerant.

Now try again.

[i]Johnny The Guesser
Date Joined: 15 Apr 02 Add contact | Send message
When: 02 Sep 11 08:01 Joined: Date Joined: 15 Apr 02 | Topic/replies: 289 | Blogger: Johnny The Guesser's blog
nairda

Betfair is a business, not some form of betting utopia.

As a business it will seek to :-

- maximise profits
- remove uneconomic customers from its customer base.

Johnny Guesser I think you is worst poster on here.  You have no idea what you talks about.  If you maximises profit, you extract from business at best possible rate.  This mean you have to find balance.  Debate about pc is where that balance is.  You do not understand that if everyone think they have no chance to win, many will never bet.  Is ok to lose money if at least a few can make moneys.  By having no "uneconomic customer", you will lose many "economic customer".  You seem too dumb to see that.


The premium charge does both!

Surely you can understand that.[/i]

Is painful read Johnny Guesser.  Thinks is genius, but is like reading stuff written by 11 year old.

Actually Ballabriggs I think Johnny summed it up quite neatly.

Doesn't apply to me at all, I am clearly not intolerant of other people's opinions at all, if I was, I'd have dismissed the thoughts of you and others in a arrogant manner - I havne't

Actually, that is pretty much exactly what you've done and you're still doing it:

And at the risk of ruining your 7pm forum experience, yes - I work on here full time.
For Betfair ?

If you maintain that I am only saying I can see the logic and purpose of the pc because I am a bf employee then that is displaying intolerance and contempt for me and my opinion.

@catflmasppo

what's this a another username? don't tell - it's for betting purposes.

Actually, that is pretty much exactly what you've done and you're still doing it:

Actually no it doesn't and you are still repeating yourself, well I can go on forever answering - I don't mind as I quite like this site, I might be new, but I am actually here to make money and not doing too badly, but not in full-time status yet.

If you maintain that I am only saying I can see the logic and purpose of the pc because I am a bf employee then that is displaying intolerance and contempt for me and my opinion.


You really need to re-read this thread - you making a fool out of yourself.

I have not said let alone "maintained" that "you can only see the logic of a new pc charge if you were a BF employee" - now read carefully the following sentence, it's importnat you do.

I am maintaining that it is plausible for a pro pc supporter to be suspected of being a betfair worker(and I am convince a large proprotion of them are - however I don't decry another person objecting to that - hence my stand on the "bigot" comment) this is the 5th time I've repeated - I will repeat for a 6th and a 7th and an 8th and the...... I really don't mind - because maybe if I keep repeating one day you may be able comprehend the fact that I am no bigot.

I have several usernames and we all agree [;)]

Johnny The Guesser

Yes, you are right...this is what PC was set up to do

But betfair is no longer an Exchange

That's the only drawback with the "block user" button.

When you guys reply and quote, I have to see the tiresome drivel.

BF can we please have a "block quotation" button?

Ta.

[:)][;)]

Slartybartfast thats all you ever come on to say the block button and I blocked BF, your just another jar of picked eggs in the fish and chip shop of life, utterely boring and useless to the core slarty.

purples liquidity seems to be getting better all the time nairda so thats a positive, perhaps betfair need a strong runner in the race to move them back to respecting winners fiscally.

I can't read that unless someone quotes you and even if they do, I still won't read it.[:)][;)]

Slarty everyone knows you can still read posts from blocked persons by not signing in, who you kidding[;)]

Keep bumping your own posts (as per usual) I still can't/won't read them. [:)][;)]

Slarty you have only made 57 replies in 7 years and about 8 of them are telling me you don't cant read my posts by method of blocking, pretty strange to say the least and surreal at the most.
I admire your peculiarity.

bff surely is/was/is related to Fine As Frog Hair no?

ok just read through this whole episode, thanks to acquiesce for pointing it my way. i can now pronounce to you all that this is my favourite thread of all time. well done all invloved.

Youy are easily pleased paulme...I switched off as soon as that idiot bff started posting his rambling drivel.

please read it through. the dialogue is superb. and i am not fishing here

Can't paul...i really can't be ar$ed to read the guff that he posts (bff)...goes on and on and on..........

swearbox I like your direct style, reminds me of me - only with more swear words[;)]

Cheers acquiesce12, that's very gracious of you

BEST. THREAD. EVER.