profits withheld

Do you mean open another account but in the same name with the same details?

If so, I've wondered the same thing before (never bother reading the small print).  Anyone have the answer?

yeah thats exactly what i mean, thought there'd be more views/knowledge on this in this forum!

Isn't the withholding profits on re-opened accounts written in the bookmakers Terms and Conditions ?

I had a read through one of the terms and conditions myself and saw nothing about that, have you ever seen it before artie?

Yes, I have .I'll try to find it.

Can't find it in terms and conditions.Perhaps it says it in the letter closing the account.I'll try and find one!

Sorry.I misunderstood the question.I thought you meant if THEY closed your account and you re opened it at a later date.

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Whatever you're trying to do it all sounds a bit dodgy to me.

There will be people with a better legal knowledge than me but I can't believe a Court would find in their favour in such a case.

The other way around there was the Brough greyhound trainer who self excluded but was allowed to open another account in the exclusion period with Billys and did his brains in. His court action to recoup losses was unsuccessful.
Am I being naive in expecting the same to apply should a firm close my account, allow me to open another one (through poor in-house procedure) despite telling me I was not allowed, then spit their dummy out afterwards when it comes to payout?

Didn't realise the question was to do with self exclusion. I was wondering what they are entitled to do if they effectively close an account and then you open up another one with same details (or someone else's details from same household). Are they entitled to withhold on the 2nd account when they clock it?

do you guys find that many of them actually 'close' the accounts? i have had one or two do that but mainly it seems these days it's just a case of them reducing the max bet to zero or winnings to a couple of quid

I quite often bet zero quid with my bookie. The losses can be hard to take sometimes but I think about even overall.

Nah most don't close they just severely limit your stakes.

Silverback it aint to do with self exclusion the idea is your stakes have been limited so you ask them to close the account, then reopen with the exact same details, the question is can they withhold profits from you on the 2nd account?

Most bookmakers will have something in Ts and Cs to say you cannot have multiple accounts.  If they close your account they will tell you that you cannot reopen.  If you do and they spot it is the same person they can legally withhold all profits, but not stake.  You would not have a leg to stand on.  Sorry to be the bearer of bad news

I had an account closed by coral recently! They actually stated in the email that any bets that could be linked to me via accounts would be void win/lose! I did have numerous emails with them trying to actually clear the statment up! All they could say was if I opened a new account!

I also recall a punter on here who had an account frozen by hills with winnings in and the were using "bonus abuse" as the reason

perhaps someone who can recall this can let us know the final outcome!

Excuse typos on iPhone

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prestbury road, that is not automatically correct. A company can put what it likes in it's T&Cs, whether they are legally binding is completely different!

Surely the bookmaker should know whether they want the business before they start taking bets.  Not difficult for them to do.  For instance, VC are in my opinion the worst bookmaker I have dealt with.  I had an account with them 4 years or so that became worthless due to their restrictions.  God only knows what my old passwords, login etc are.   If I go to open an account with them and then find they lay me a proper bet am I not to assume they have changed there policy and now want to play?

it seems nobody really knows, i contacted ibas, the gambling commission and other bodies and they all refused to answer my question!
is there any way of finding out apart from actually going ahead with opening a second account and risking losing all profits?

Have you asked a lawyer ?

They'll all remove profits once they spot you, it's multi-accounting. When books limit/ban it's not for a laugh, it's cos they think you're betting value - ie they're likely to lose money to you. As a business, makes sense to boot.

Might not get your stakes back if you lose though......

yeah artie i play ball with a lawyer, he didnt really have a clue, looks like it's not worth the risk of losing profits anyways...

Ask another lawyer. There will be an answer.

any lawyers on here so?

Lots of lawyers give free interviews to create goodwill.Have you tried wandering around your town centre and going into a few soliciters offices ?

nearly all the accounts I have had have been severely restricted (not closed by the bookie) and I have simply withdrawn the balance and asked for the account to be closed. Usually get an email saying 'should you decide at a future date to consider using a betting service again, we would be delighted if you choose ....'

Some while later I have opened another account with the same bookie (often, but not always, in the wife's name) using a fresh bank account and card. The worst I have had is that if picked up then the previous restriction is applied - but often get away with it until they realise the fresh account is not profitable from their viewpoint. This can sometimes take several months.

Have never had a problem with a bookie witholding funds etc.

If you close the account and then reopen it they have no right to withhold winnings.  If however they close the account and write to you saying if any bets are taken in the future they will be null and void , they probably will be if they notice.  All IMHO of course.

Ron - the only time I had an account actually closed by the bookie was VC. Could not log in one day and when I phoned they just said that they were closing it and sent me the balance. In my experience most other books just seem to restrict accounts without closing them.

If possible its always best to close the account yourself before the bookmaker does, then open again with a new card.  I used to get away with this but not any more.  When the bookie has written to me saying that any future bets taken will be null and void I've given up on them in my own name.  I've never had any monies witheld but I've only used the main UK ones and avoided the more dodgy ones.

artie, i emailed about 40 different lawyers and got zero informative replies

The short answer is yes.  Nearly all online sportsbooks have it written in their terms and conditions.  If they have closed your account and informed you that you cannot bet with them then if they are clever enough they are effectively having a free bet at your expense with your new account.  Similarly, if they limit you right down but dont close your account then they can point to ts and cs relating to related accounts and withhold profits again.  They have the legal right to do both