General Betting
There is currently 1 person viewing this thread.
I lay horses in the place market at betfair SP at a fixed liability, i do this first thing in the morning because i cannot always get on-line during the day. During the day if there are non-runners then my liability is reduced by a certain percentage, is there any way i can stop this from happening? i want to keep my liability the same even if there are non-runners.
cheers
cheers
sort by:
Show
per page
Replies: 20
|
By:
Depends if you're bothered about the odds you wish to take or not
|
|
By:
i take the SP
|
|
By:
k, say you want to lay to a £100 liability, just lay £10,000 @ 1.01 that way the liability is £100 and the reduction factors can't take your bet less than 1.01 so it'll be fixed.
|
|
By:
meant to say lay as an exchange bet with the take SP at event start option ticked
|
|
By:
Right, then click the take Sp option, cheers thanks alot
|
|
By:
Although thinking about it, it won't save you from situations where there are a few non runners as it'd convert to SP n the first non runner then be liable to any later deductions :(
Don't think there's any foolproof way round it, even using software to place the bets you may get caught with late withdrawals |
|
By:
hmmmm, but at least then i will need two non-runners before my liability is reduced not one, thanks anyway.
|
|
By:
If you lay at sp there is no deductions, or there never has been for me.
It is calculated after the event so your liability stays the same |
|
By:
you must be doing something diffent to me then mate.
|
|
By:
I think the only time the reduction comes after the race is if there is a late withdrawl and there isnt time to form a new market, if a new market is formed then there is always a reduction, unless the non-runner is a rank outsider.
|
|
By:
When laying at SP you are laying to a liability.
When reductions are made they effect the odds. If I laid a horse to a liability of 100.00 and there was a late withdrawal my lay is calculated after the race has concluded. I have not laid to a price to be recalculated by a reduction. So when they determine the new odds because of withdrawals that new price is what they calculate my profit on. If the horse wins, I lose my lay which is my liability of 100.00 I stand to be corrected if this is not the case. |
|
By:
They reduce the layer liability because of the following
Suppose a horse is trading at 2.0 shortly before the off and that there's 1K wanting to back it at SP and 1K wanting to lay it at SP. Those amounts make the projected SP 2.0. Suppose now that the second favourite refuses to enter the stalls and is withdrawn with a RF that leaves the old 2.0 shot now trading at 1.25. Without reducing the layer's liabilities the SP could end up at 2.0 if the SP back & lay amounts stayed the same. |
|
By:
Feck is this not the case?
To determine the final price for SP they not only use the pool that is bet and laid on SP but also "keep amounts" and some matching logic. |
|
By:
Feck in your example surely the layer would be at a big dis-adavantage or am I missing something?
|
|
By:
Compound, yes, they also use unmatched bets in the normal market at the off.
dunter, in my example the sp layers' liabilities will be reduced in line with the RF so will only be around 25% of their requested liabilities. That would leave 1K wanting to back the horse at SP and 250 wanting to lay the horse at SP giving an SP of around 1.25. The layers would be at a big disadvantage if they didn't reduce their liabilities. |
|
By:
In my experience Dan is right and compound is wrong, at withdrawals liability is reduced accordingly.
|
|
By:
Thanks Feck, thought for a minute the layer would be offering evens a 1/4 shot
B-) |
|
By:
if i lay a horse at sp for a liability of £100 and put in maximum odds of 10, and then there is a non-runner and a reduction of 20%, my liability is reduced to £80 and my maximum odds are reduced to 8.
this is the way it happens to me anyway :D |
|
By:
what i would like to happen is to have my maximum price and liability unaffected by non-runners.
|
|
By:
Adjustments to SP bets for non-runners
For SP back bets, Betfair will at no point amend either the stake or the odds requested by a customer, despite any non-runners or withdrawals. However in all cases customers can reduce the minimum SP odds they are prepared to accept on a selection. For SP lay bets on win markets, Betfair will reduce a customers liability based on the reduction factor(s) of any non-runner(s) and the reduction factor of the runner on which the customers bet has been placed. This is to ensure that the balance between the backers stakes and the layers liability reflects the revised market after the runner has been removed. For example if a horse with a 50% reduction factor becomes a non-runner, then another horse in the same market priced at about 5 (i.e. a reduction factor of 20%) will change to a price of about 2.5. Therefore the liability on a £200 lay bet on that runner will need to change to a liability of about £75 to ensure that a balancing back bet will have the same £50 stake. This is done by multiplying the liability by 100%-(50%/(100%-20%)) = 37.5%. Where the lay bet has a maximum odds limit specified, this limit will be reduced by the reduction factor of the non-runner, if the non-runner has a reduction factor of at least 2.5%. For SP lay bets on place markets, Betfair will still reduce a customers liability based on the reduction factor(s) of any non-runner(s) but the calculation will be slightly different, in line with the application of place reduction factors. The liability will be reduced by the reduction factor of the removed runner. Where the lay bet on a place market has a maximum odds limit specified, the potential winnings on the bet (i.e. the odds 1) will be reduced by the reduction factor of the removed runner. Note that SP lay bets will not be cancelled when there is a non-runner. |