i losed my bank for betfair server problem..

jesterday 14.40 wolwerampton

Just got to take it on the chin, my friend. Hope your luck turns

Welcome to betfair

all this beacuse i had a negative balance..

if i have a negative balance i can do nothing

i wanted lay for a all red or all grenn..

no...because theri service sign a negative balance i can do nothing

ffs betfair

**ers

now i have a negative balance..

i must give money at betfair

if betfair server no had this problem i have my money and betfair haven't a credit whit me

i must pay to betfair 60 euros

very very good

This has happened before (a -ve balance) on the FGS MSE fiasco.

Long story, but in the end betfair paid up all the -ve balances (basically voided all losing bets) as they do not operate a credit account, which seems to be what you have, if I'm reading it right.

Ring betfair, and demand that your account be settled to a point pre-race. Your account should never be allowed to go in to -ve.

please jimbo..may you explain in simple english?

this is the situation

i trade whit all my bank an horse (for example)at@11..1000euros

the odds go down...at@10 i layed for 1100

i have a gain of 100 euros...on all horses

now...

i back other horse..1000euros at @9
this odds go up
i layed 900 at @10

now my situation is perfect draw

now i back another horse ...1000 at@12

now..
the first horse non runners

my situation is change..now i don't have a perfect draw..but -100euros
my bank was 1000

but now real bank is 900

but i just back 1000 on the other horse

stop
my balance is negative
i can do nothing


i can not lay the last traded horse

the horse lose..i lose 1000

more 100


i must pay to betfair 100


(this is an example,but this is my situation)

is correct this??

is it normal that betfair not refund my money???

i spoken whit betfair

they says that the negative balance is my responsability..
i had to deposit

in this mode i can layed..if their server sign a negative balance i can do nothing

in this mode i lose and betfair lose

very very intelligent

You will not get a refund. You somehow got caught by your own "greed".
Lesson learnt - Do not use your entire bank if you aim to trade out at some point.
Others have been caught like this just because of currency exchange rates. They may have been only a penny into negative balance and therefore not been able to trade out.
You ended upå with a gamble on a horse. Would you have started this thread if that horse won ? I don't think so.....

but to be fair eagle, betfair have infact allowed him to bet with money he doesn't have, hence being -£100.

Surely this is against their terms to allow people to bet with money that "isn't theirs"?

Granted, you're correct in that he has massively overstaked and is now suffering the results, but at the very least, betfair should refund the -£100, and perhaps void the back bet that caused this.

No they haven't . He had the funds when he placed the bet. It's due to the non runner that he got a negative balance. In case like this you can call Betfair and they will credit your account with enough money to trade out of the position.
I know it probably wouldn't have been time enough to do this if the non runner was withdrawn just as the race was starting , but in most cases there will be enough time ....

Do you think the layer would be pleased if the bet was voided ?

no..but this is an error of their server

you betfair pay for your problem..not i
imo

Just one of those unfortunate things. Keep a few quid in the oz wallet or dont use all your bank, imo.

i push click click click on betangel for all red and stop

but i can not

jes stringer

keep liquidity

it's true


but this is an error of betfair

jacopo , what if the bet won ? Would you have given your winnings back to Betfair/the layer ?

You ended up with a bet on a horse at roughly the correct market price. You just have to live with that.

i had a similar problem 1 jears ago

i asked to betfair an insurance..

i earn for live whit trading on betfair

i asked an insurance..i asked their:
please..i pay at you an insurance..if there is a strange situation is all void


i asked this an year ago

their answer no

I see you don't want to answer my question.

And if you had a similar problem one year ago , why haven't you learned from that ?

eddie...no.

but for one reason no

because for their problems i losed 3 things

if now i win.i want all


but an year ago,and now,i would want pay(PAY)an insurance

i will win,i will lose...not interest
void...i want pay an insurance for have all void in those situations


no..jesterday i never refund money at betfair..but i'm serious...you are serious and i'm serious
you "**" money other 2 things for their problems

i never won when there was a problem

but i would want an insurance

i learn....

in those situation i learn the redution factor...

i didn't know

i'm not expert of horses

If you're putting your bank on the line with each trade you should have made it a priority to know the rules. It's happened to you before and there are often late withdrawals in horse racing for various reasons so you should have known the risks. Sorry for your loss but it was inevitable if you use your entire balance on each trade.

You don't have to know much about horses , but if you make a living out of trading on Betfair there really are no excuse for not knowing the rules on here.

i backed prelive..and layed in live

an favorite non runners

the rest is easy to imagine(my horses traded win)


i was very angry

but for a simple reason
ok..i wrong..but why you betfair allow that in live anyone backed the fav and keep the fav at short odds??

why?

if you keep the fav(non runner)at short odds,anyone backed other horses at high odds

no regular this

ok..you can not cancel the non runner..ok...but you can do the odds @1000
in this mode any**er on betfair not back other horses at very high odds

no regular this

why betfair don't closed the account of this people?those is **ers

no entire buzzer

i used less...but the strong lose on an horse has changed all

jacopo25, regarding your negative balance, I don't think this has anything to do with a server problem.
This is a design flaw of Betfair. I think it is because they use shortcuts in calculating someone's balance to make the site faster. This is a good thing, but they should allow any trade that lowers a users liability regardless of their zero or negative balance.

It happens to me regularly that I can't trade out due to a zero balance. In my case I have bets on dozens of different markets though. Have to cancel one, so that there is money available in my account again.

Although Betfair are not going to get involved with insurance, it's a good point. I trade in total goals and over/under markets. Sometimes I hedge my risk across the two markets. However in certain scenarios this could be disastrous. If I lay over 1.5 goals and back 2 goals or more, and the match gets abandoned when two goals have been scored, I lose one bet and the winning bet is voided. I asked Betfair if I would be refunded in this case, and they said it is at their discretion. Some very clear rules about this would be nice. I know it's rare, but over a long enough time frame it will happen.

Exactly investor. And why should a flaw in the design of betfair system be a good enough reason to stop a punter trading out of their position?

I don't think jaco was being intentionally greedy, yet he's expected to pay for his loss and betfairs too.

Whereas people in this thread

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=386063

Who were just being plain greedy, had all their loses refunded (winners paid by betfair)

Hardly fair, methinks.

Deposit enough money to cover your activities and you won't have this problem.
You can use your Australian wallet as a reserve tank of money, if you have done the KYC process.

jes moonlight...this is a simply

but for me is important not have much on bf

i backed ever before..and after lay..not the opposite..i renounce at 1 opportunity on 2

but for the moment it's better

i,1-2days to a month losed my head...
no money on bf no lose in those days

but this is another problem.
this regard me

not normal(imo) that i losed all for betfair problems

The point here is that it is not Betfair's problem. It's your problem and you have to adapt your trading to avoid things like this. Just keep a little more money in your account , but hide that extra money in a long term market lay , something like a 1.01 lay on the no hopers in the English Premier League win market.
The extra funds will then be available for you to use in situations like this with just a click with the mouse.

I agree with Eddie the eagle.

Although I think Betfair should sort these issues out, until they do they have to be taken into account.

If you know there is a possibility of loss due to a design flaw, incompatible rules across markets, the site going down etc., you need to factor this in when placing your bets.

If you trade close to the off, it is inevitable that sooner or later you will have an involuntary bet on a horse.
Internet connection can fail, computer fail, BF site crash, sudden need to go to the toilet...

You should still be able to place a bet that will reduce your liability on a market regardless of your balance...

You should... but sometimes you can't.

Which is why you need a reserve tank, using either my or Eddie's suggestions.

What I Mean is that BF should change it so that you always can...

i,whit the past of time adapt at all

but is the same not correct that you prevent to trade

what mean in english language?trade out?

not correct that you oblige me to bet on a horses..expecially when i click 100things(whit betangel)for sell the bet,and lose a part of my money

i think that this is wrong

the problem is not have more money on the account
the problem is that you not oblige me at backed my bank on an horses because your central pc is crazy

spent 2sterlings for better your system..my account is 100?ok..you oblige me to use only this..gain 20 and lose....now i use only 100-30...70!

this is the problem..not i can not lay losing part(not all)of my bank because your system is defic.ent that when an account sign - become crazy and block all

Moon Light 02 Feb 12:37
Which is why you need a reserve tank, using either my or Eddie's suggestions.

Decent suggestion, but it unfortunate to have to use resources in this way.
In my case it's not necessary, as my best are always split across different markest, so there are always unmatched bets I can cancel.

Cran , Betfair should change this , but this issue has been raised on several occaissions before and Betfair hasn't made the change then , so we have to assume that they wont change it in the future either...

if there is a new problem whit your sistem
you betfair refund

the next thing explain this on the rules
and if there is same problem no void..ok

but no that your rules are:

any problem have betfair..you pay

The Investor , don't look at it wrong use of resources.
It seems he has a certain bank he uses for trading. If he deposit another 10 - 20 % and hide them away somewhere , all he lose is bank interest on those extra money and with todays bank interests I really don't think it will add up to much money over a year.

I'm struggling to understand jacopo's last 2 posts, but he seems to think that we are BF :^0
jacopo, I can see no connection between your problem and BF's server issues.
They let you bet the profits from a green trade on a horse that was withdrawn, and that left you without funds. This could happen at any time! You need a reserve of money, as previously suggested.

trade out moonlight

trade out

this i mean

why not?

i had money for trade out

Re-reading the first post, jacopo, I get the impression that you had a green trade, a red trade, then bet your bank. Then the green trade was lost because the horse was withdrawn, leaving you with a negative balance.

This can happen at any time! You do need the reserve money as suggested. I can't see why you think it's a server problem.

It can be (and has been) argued that it's a design problem with BF software that you can't reduce your liability when your balance is negative, but that seems to be the way it is, and we just have to live with it.

The amount of reserve needed is not large. Just enough to get you out of this kind of situation.

i don't understand moonlight
example

i have 1090euros on betfair

i back horse A at@11 for 1000euros
i lay horse A at@10 for 1 1 0 0euros

my situation is this..if horse A win i have +100 if horse A lose i hace +100
i have +100

back now horse B
i back 1000 at @9
i lay 900 at @10

i have now:exact draw(+100-100 for this second trade)

third trade...back 1000 on horse C at @12

horse A non runner

my account of the race sign now -100..not draw

but i have put 1000 on horse C...but my account no have 1000euros(because horse A is now non runner...disappear my profit on this horse)..now my account 990...but i put 1000

STOPPPPPPPPPP

SISTEM CRASH
MY BALANCE IS NEGATIVE
STOP..I CAN DO NOTHING

IF THE SERVER OF BETFAIR IS NOT DEFIC.
I COULD LAY(for example)900 on horse C

NOW I LOSE 200(100of horse B and 100 of horse C)


not -1000 more -100


THIS IS THE PROBLEM...THIS IS A BETFAIR PROBLEM IMO

For the last time. Due to the removal of the non runner your balance ended up with a negative balance of € 10. When your balance is negative you can neither back anything nor can you lay anything. Not even lay something you have backed earlier , just to reduce liability.
One can argue that this is wrong and that one should always be able to reduce liability , but it isn't so and probably will not be so in the future.
You are the one that lost money due to this , not Betfair. Therefore it is your problem and you have to adapt in order to not make the same mistake in the future.

ok...for the moment i don't understad well..

but i will try to understand why you say this..

everymode,thanks at all

jacopo , if you have problems understanding this because your English isn't good enough , you should call the Italian help desk and get an explanation in your own language.

i understand what you say

i don't understand why you think this

but perhaps i wrong

I'm not thinking anything , I'm only stating the facts.

. Not even lay something you have backed earlier , just to reduce liability


this is on the rules of betfair???

Eddie the eagle 02 Feb 13:25
When your balance is negative you can neither back anything nor can you lay anything. Not even lay something you have backed earlier , just to reduce liability.

is this on the rule of betfair?

if jes stop..i wrong..

at call center not say me this


is on the rules???

This is probably not mentioned anywhere in the rules , but I'm pretty sure there are other points in the rules that will cover Betfair's ar$e in cases like this.
The software is designed in a way that people are not allowed to place any bets if there balance is negative. This problem have been raised several times on this forum by people in the same situation as you are in now , but nothing has been done by Betfair to allow people to reduce their liability in cases like this , so we have to assume nothing will be done in the future either.
Therefore you have to adapt your trading style in order to avoid the same problem in the future.

ok eddy..thanks a lot

They may be scared to change that mission-critical s/w.
They can't reliably make small changes to the web screens!

people...incredible

5minutes ago,a man of betfair phone me

in the next 30minutes they refund money

thanks betfair..this is serious society

he says:the next thing i must phone immediately and they put money on account for allow me of reduce libnility

this is an english man(hard to speak italian)...refund money for this thing

incredible

grazie grazie betfair
siete una societa' seria
grazie

well done.^

Amazing stuff!

not refund all

neithr 50% of my bank

but not important

cheers betfair the same

complimenti

^
what do you mean?

you have lots of these problems

lol , he doesn't seem to be the luckiest trader, buzzer.

Hard to keep the ' pidgeon english ' consistent over numerous posts imo !!

jes a lot

perhaps betfair doesn't love the traders

jacopo25 03 Feb 17:26


5minutes ago,a man of betfair phone me

in the next 30minutes they refund money



he says:the next thing i must phone immediately and they put money on account for allow me of reduce libnility


this thingh i call immediately
nothing...to much negative balance