Impossible to make a profit on hear

Thought you did this ft and were 60k up?

on the very long run that is

hows you last 7 days?

**ed it up big time thats hows my last days

there is people who can make a profit on here, im just not 1 of them in the long run :(

carsten didnt you quit your job and go pro with 30 euros and turned it into 70k in 30 days

crap

I am under pressure while betting and almost getting broken as unable to handle pressure. Stats says I am good in betting long term but still due to lack of discipline in staking in individual bets I struggle to handle the emotions of loss.

This year I made 100k plus but still it is very hard work. It takes just few bets to lose few thousands and if you chasing you may lose quickly big amounts. It is not possible for me to stake disciplined because of the way I bet. When I see value I jump with all money. One thing that changed over years is my punting and trading skills. My punting skills are better than before but my trading skills and patience to trade is going down the hill.

lol u25k loves publicly patting himself on the back

honest evaluation of myself not bragging.

since I joined on 04/11/09

American Football: -£25.18 | Basketball: £49.63 | Boxing: £32.15 | Cricket: £1.83 | Football: £22.98 | Golf: -£25.59 | Horse Racing: £103.08 | Rugby League: -£2.68 | Special Bets: £9.50 | Tennis: -£12.45 Total P&L: £153.27

^^small fry i know^^ :)

beginners luck.

Nick Luck.

i cant loose on here

freddie, you can't spell either.

3 months :

Horse Racing: £31.66 | Soccer: -£12.96 | Tennis: -£5.65 Total P&L: £13.05

Proof you can win in the long term and live a life of luxury ;-)

So its its no more spam for you hopeless bettor from now on its going to be corn beef all the way.

We'l meet again
Don't know where
Don't know when
But I know we'l meet again
Some sunny day

show us your P/L carsten? ?:|

American Football: £1.25 | Boxing: £3.14 | Cricket: £229.67 | Financial Bets: £7.57 | Golf: £1.90 | Horse Racing: £33.25 | Motor Sport: £1.14 | Rugby League: £15.29 | Rugby Union: -£43.15 | Snooker: £0.53 | Soccer: -£207.26 | Special Bets: £3.89 | Tennis: -£65.98 Total P&L: -£18.76

last three months

soccer and tennis my best sports............honest.

nobody looses on betfair FACT

you've got Snooker by the balls, takethestand ;)

Well. in the last 3 days, I have nearly tripled my bank, which now stands at over £7.

^ you my sir are in the top 0.5 percent of all betfairians congrats

Howling 16 Nov 22:16

^ you my sir are in the top 0.5 percent of all betfairians congrats

That stat is some years old and even then, I think it was 2% that are in profit. The 0.5% was 15k+.

JPG , you've got the numbers wrong.
I would be very surprised if not at least 10 % of active customers on here are winning accounts and by active I mean those who have at least one bet a week on average.

you have no idea how to gamble

Young Mr Davies said there were no winning accounts who were resident in Britain. :)

Eddie the eagle 17 Nov 10:44

JPG , you've got the numbers wrong.
I would be very surprised if not at least 10 % of active customers on here are winning accounts and by active I mean those who have at least one bet a week on average.

The strange thing is, my own instinct would put the figure in the 10-15% bracket as well (in the terms youve expressed) but I was trying to remember the (old) figures that BF were quoted. Im still fairly confident that the 0.5% was 15k+ though. :)

Of course, NONE of these are located in the UK either! ;)

I'd be surprised if it was as high as 10%.
The 5% commission is a huge hurdle for the small punter.

Aarrghh! Zealot be correct. ye have to understand more 'bout what ye be doin' 'n th' bigger picture. Stop gamblin', scurvy dog! Start makin' doubloons!

JPG ,the figure they threw at us a few years back was 0.71% win 15k+.

And I think their definition of an active account was someone who had placed at least one bet in the last 12 months.
I certainly wouldn't call someone placing one or two bets during a year an active customer !

I suspect the new regime are too crafty to give out this sort of info.

ML , they never gave this of free will. I think they they were asked about this in some kind of tax hearing.

The majority of people on here are the likes who play FBOTs, so it's no surprise they want to drive the educated away and keep the mongrels about. It is a shame that they introduced the charge as soon as they had raised the barriers to entry to the exchange industry to such heights that they undoubtedly had an almost untouchable monopoly on it.

JPG 17 Nov 15:46
Eddie the eagle 17 Nov 10:44

JPG , you've got the numbers wrong.
I would be very surprised if not at least 10 % of active customers on here are winning accounts and by active I mean those who have at least one bet a week on average.

The strange thing is, my own instinct would put the figure in the 10-15% bracket as well (in the terms youve expressed) but I was trying to remember the (old) figures that BF were quoted. Im still fairly confident that the 0.5% was 15k+ though. :)

Of course, NONE of these are located in the UK either! ;)

If you count having just one bet in the last 12 months as an active account (as betfair do), then the figure would be around 25%. Based on the statement that 0.5% of customers pay PC and 2% of winning customers pay PC.

JPG,

I've heard that 0.5% make £15k+ a few times, never seen where that originally appeared though, some audit I heard?

I would be interested in seeing that, and also to see what the figure would be today.

JPG 17 Nov 15:46
[...]

Of course, NONE of these are located in the UK either! ;)

Was that Evening Standard article thread from last month pulled? Can't find it anymore.

yes it was the evening standard article and it isn't on the net now, not as i can see anyway, a rather strange way of attempting to promote the site. 'We offer 20% better odds but still nobody can win' :)

buzzer,

I don't think it ever was on the net, due to it being in the 'spread betting & sophisticated investing' pull out.

There was a thread on the article last month, that seems to have been pulled??

Here's the article though:

http://i37.tinypic.com/t50qom.jpg

The Investor : http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/jt200304/jtselect/jtgamb/63/4012215.htm

Thank you Eddie,

I will assume Mr Davies' quotes are more accurate in this article than in the Evening Standard one :D

Yes , but bear in mind that he says somewhere that some of these 0.71 % are bookmakers and some come from abroad.

I would be very surprised if the % making £15k+ wasn't much higher now. 2-3% at least, I would have thought.

Would that be before or after PC are taken ?

after PC

Simply because there are more customers now. Those at the very top will be creaming hundreds of thousands, maybe even millions?

Here's an extract from the Parliamentary publication:
[i]The other thing with any form of gambling

my last 3 months , if i can win on here any feka can !!!!




American Football: £48.97 | Baseball: -£0.01 | Boxing: £3.35 | Cricket: £7.82 | Darts: £7.95 | Football: -£52.04 | Golf: £0.47 | Horse Racing: £582.46 | Rugby League: -£7.54 | Rugby Union: £6.76 | Snooker: £23.49 | Special Bets: £0.07 | Tennis: £4.97 Total P&L: £626.72

If it hadn't been for Baseball, davescrazy, you'd be on easy street!

done your brains on Baseball imo

Moon Light 18 Nov 16:14

[...]

The experiments with random number generators perform by Sandown and myself suggest that random chance plays a large role in profitability with data samples of less than 1000 bets.

There are a number of interesting experiments you can do like this. One that I really liked was to take the percentage gain/loss of each active day since January 2007. If there are 500 days, pick 500 of the days at random to see what your PL could have looked like. Take into account deposits and withdrawals too.

The less volatility there is in your PL the more each randomly generated set of results will be alike.

You can also use this to find out how much luck was involved if you have achieved positive results. In my case, every iteration gives a positive result (I've done hundreds). However the level of profit can vary substantially (the lowest result being less than half of the highest).

So let's say someone has made £100k, doing this kind of test a few hundred times and coming up with results ranging from £50k to £110k, it means that they did have a positive expectancy, but they were lucky to make as much as they did.

If there are big losses or profits at the extreme end, it means the range could be -300k to 200k

For ever thousand customers losing, one player is winning massive amounts.
1% of customers win very little or lose very little.
The rest are doing their wages and loans every week.

Fact.

Last 3 months:
Basketball: -£962.44 | Cricket: £5.08 | Greyhound Racing: -£3.56 | Horse Racing: -£227.68 | Snooker: -£126.60 | Soccer: £2,568.80 | Special Bets: £7.52 | Tennis: £208.18 Total P&L: £1,469.30

[x] These checkboxes suck 18 Nov 16:41


done your brains on Baseball imo

i cant even remember putting a bet on any baseball game , ever !!!! strange

The Investor 18 Nov 12:30

JPG,

I've heard that 0.5% make £15k+ a few times, never seen where that originally appeared though, some audit I heard?

I would be interested in seeing that, and also to see what the figure would be today.

Investor,

I must admit, I dont have any concrete evidence for this, just that Im repeating a certain amount of rumour here thats probably got a lot of truth in it (or at least at the time.)

I could be wrong on this but I think it has something to do with an investigation into the exchange model when the fixed-odds firms were saying that customers here would each need a permit etc to lay and so on. This is going back some years when it was a very new environment for everybody.

The poster "Frames" on this thread mentioned the 0.71% making 15k+. Im not 100% but that specific figure definitely sounds familar. As for figures now, havent heard anything from BF (other then an employee once told me how much standard commision they make on racing and non-racing markets when looking at the matched volume figure.)

Part of the "problem" of all this is the different contexts that it can be applied and viewed from, especially as the dynamic of "active customers" is crucial.

Thanks JPG,

Actually Eddie the eagle posted a link showing it:



Eddie the eagle 18 Nov 12:44
The Investor : http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/jt200304/jtselect/jtgamb/63/4012215.htm

I believe Betfair view anyone that has bet at least once in the last 12 months as active.

The Investor 18 Nov 18:08

I believe Betfair view anyone that has bet at least once in the last 12 months as active.

I asked BF for their definition of this on the first forum chat they did after the PC introduction.

Their answer was what youve put or in whatever timeframe/context that their comment is being made in.

For example, if they say "we've had 200k active customers this month" then obviously thats what they mean. But when they say it generally, its exactly how you've put it.

Boxing: -£2.00 | Darts: £38.24 | Football: £228.81 | Horse Racing: -£11.00 | Mixed Martial Arts: £21.99 | Tennis: £44.55 Total P&L: £320.59




Started with 50 pound bank. Been here a month. Not tooo bad eh?

I think when they say active customers they include everyone not just exchange users. I remember reading in the 2009 report that nearly 90% of active customers have used the exchange.

http://www.juicestorm.com/betfairgen/


cmon carsten do illuminate us with another great P&L !!!

Last 30 days


Boxing: -£24.74 | Football: £2,090.87 | Horse Racing: -£12.72 Total P&L: £2,053.41

The Investor 18 Nov 13:33
Simply because there are more customers now. Those at the very top will be creaming hundreds of thousands, maybe even millions?

____________

Investor, would that be possible though ,as surely the sharpest minds cancel each other out ,no one would therefore assume a dominant position ?