Soccer Market Reduction Trial

writings on the wall...thats all

Far too many empty markets cluttering up the site, about time they did this imo.

making room for more casino products

Yes acc very true, but if you look through the list there are some strange choices there.
Such as: Dutch Juliper League - Half Time Score, Half Time/Full Time, BTTS, over 5.5/6.5/7.5

The thing is when new customers see these markets with no money in them they will just go elsewhere.
The basketball markets were like this about 6 months ago. They had about 20 markets, now been reduced to 6 or 7 markets, but at least they have some money in them.

speaking of basket ball, they've now cut the nba down to 5 markets.

Does anyone actually bet in most of these markets they're getting rid of? Frankly, they're almost no loss to me. I probably bet too much, but have only a few pennies in comparison on about three of these markets they're aiming to ditch.

over 5.5/6.5/7.5 is disgusting...

Impossible to get matched for anything worthwhile in some of those high goal markets until there's goals though. Either people should use them if they want them, or the other proviso would be for additional goal markets to be added if a game racks a few goals up; and for market managers to do so swiftly.

whats the difference..

Can't believe they're removing the O5.5, etc. markets in the Dutch Jupiler League, there always seemed to be good liquidity and it's a high-scoring league.

put it this way, tonigh in the copa game

2.5 7k
5.5 2k

I will miss the Dutch Jupiler league HT score market.  Volendam scored something like 34 first half goals in 29 games, Almere City quite good for first half goals too.  Liked the Half Time match odds in Go Ahead Eagles games.
Just not sure why they need to close these ones, don't care about bookings/corners etc...you can use a bookies for that.  BTTS you can bet in play by laying all the 0's in correct score or improvising next goal/match odds but you can't get the odds similar to half time score market in the remaining markets.  They always had high 0-0 ht as well.

I just thought more markets is generally better whether or not they have money in.  I like having the option of getting involved in an empty market, you get better prices and less trade options.
Anyone who likes 10k on every tick is crazy if you ask me

over .5 goals in 1st half should go on every game, its the same as nil nil i ht market.
personaly think they should open the bookings/corners markets up in running on the big games[ ie tv games eng prem/ tv spanish games.

the over 5 6 7  goals lines shouldnt b got rid off.

ttttt

Go Ahead Eagles vs Volendam later...exciting. 
Although if you want a match with half time score please try XSKT Can Tho v Than Quang Ninh from Vietnam first division.  Thank you and remember, your opinion matters.

sick of having to go to b365 to bet on corners and cards.
they should be adding markets not reducing them.
maybe the one person they employ to type in all the markets is getting arthritis in his hands.

I do find it quite hard to believe that in this day and age that almost all of the market setups and settlements can't be done automatically without any manual data entry.

On the plus side, this does seem to be the first public acknowledgement that all is not well in the Betfair world.  All of the meddling with the ecosystem must finally be starting to have a negative impact on the company's profit margin.

Anyone who says "you can use a bookies for that" probably isn't worth taking notice of.

Betfair doesn't have any markets for certain matches, especially a lot of tennis matches.  I would recommend using a bookies for them.
What would you recommend Preck?

Betfair can't even bring themselves to get the date and kick off times right for some games, they should concern themselves with that first.

And if they want to increase liquidity, make sure that all matches (on all sports) are on the correct coupons. I can't be the only one who misses matches because I don't know they're on.

16/12/2012 Volendam 4-3 Go Ahead Eagles
13/01/2012 Go Ahead Eagles 5-0 Volendam
28/08/2011 Volendam 2-2 Go Ahead Eagles

Great match so far.  Lack of markets is noticeable and puts me off this game a bit.  Correct score has 2.7k matched so far, so I imagine the HT score market might have slightly more matched than the FC Inter Baku reserve game this morning.

0-1 Volendam in the first half.  Might have been nicer odds.  I am only involved in over 4.5 in this game...if there were more markets I might have more than £15 on it

Almost a 2nd.  There are no odds even close to what I could find on the half time score market.  Bet365 offering 1.66 on a second goal in the first half.

1-1

Just tried to take a bit of cash on unders in the Jupiler. No go.

Well done Betfair.

Non Live Premier League games

What does that mean?

really shocked they remove Half Time/Full Time markets. always bettin on them and mostly markets have more matched bet than half time marked..

the lack of high-goal markets for games with high-scoring teams really doesnt make much sense does it...

... unless part of their test is to see if any of the O/U 5/6 liquidity ends up on their sportsbook instead

you can see the problem already, 4.5 market is 1.58/1.65 under 2.58/2.76 over, what happen when there is 5 goals? no more commission apart from next goal market which I won't be playing

2-1 fooking great betfair, thanks for removing the best market to bet on in this event

loadedgimp, some of us have been banned by all online bookies.  I'm not faffing around trying to get around these bans to bet on markets which most likely will be limited anyway.

They've got rid of some decent markets yet left some effing dross.

I guarantee there will be next to no money on the 'Norwich Win a Half' market in their match with Villa.

And why on earth keep 'Over/Under 5.5 Goals' which is replicated in 'Correct Score'?

They introduced a load of new markets a while back and most have failed.  Yet they've kept those and removed some staple markets!  There has to be an ulterior motive.

Liquidity in submarkets has been poor on 3pm EPL games for some time and I've been wondering whether it's worth me carrying on with them.  Removing some of the markets I work on has probably made the decision for me.  So they're plan to increase liquidity will backfire when it comes to me.

*their

My point was more that you have viable substitutes for some of those markets. There is NO substitute for the half time correct score which they have removed, and I outlined Volendam as being one team and lo and behold 3 first half goals.
I manage to keep my bet365 account open by using betfair to cover losses when I need to create them.
Since the beginning of the year my account is staked     26,223.60  returned    26,244.35

They've got rid of some decent markets yet left some effing dross.

----------------

seems that way to me. would be looking to axe icelandic women's football before I started messing about with hattrick markets in saturday afternoon epl games, personally.

the point about o/u markets is over settles in game, so they're not fully replicated in total goals.

Leave the Icelandic womens football alone. Some of us need the money!

viva, I hadn't thought about overs being settled earlier than the related market.  Not something that would affect me but can see how it would affect others. Just started a bl00dy thread on General Betting saying they should have cut the 'duplicate' markets!

No last goalscorer for 3pm Prem?

As a long standing user of betfair i was somewhat surprised to find out that to score a hatrick and 2 goals markets on Premier League games not on TV  have been removed as part of the trial. To me these are great markets which have a good amount of liquidity in and so I dont get why when there are other markets which remain. Really frustrating. Not a good move. Its bizarre that these markets though are available for all TV matches even if they are lower divisions. No common sense. I cant make my usual money on bale scoring 2! :-(

They haven't removed markets based on liquidity alone.  There's definitely an ulterior motive that nobody has picked up on.  If they have, they haven't mentioned it on the forum.

It's really quite bizarre.

Panic manoeuvre imo
If they get rid of high unders, 6.5 and the like, withdraw all funds, say thank you for a lovely evening and just walk away.

My favorite markets to play are the half-time correct score and over 1.5 first half goals in the Dutch Second Division. These have been inexplicably removed.

However, you can still play these markets in the Polish Third Division East for instance and any under-19/21 game you care to think of.

Utterly outrageous.

Templeton Peck 03 May 13 08:56 Joined: 17 Sep 02 | Topic/replies: 3,734 | Blogger: Templeton Peck's blog
Anyone who says "you can use a bookies for that" probably isn't worth taking notice of.

Disagree strongly with that. What it tells you is that if a decent market steps in with overrounds that handily beat the best bookie, and put up fair chunks of at least hundreds, people will come and bet in these markets.

I'm in favour of them getting rid of some markets; but some of the ones they've chosen to axe combined with ones they're keeping makes me very suspicious that this is just part of a long term project to grab liquidity for the sportsbook by removing the on-site competition.

I wonder - how many straws in the wind does it take before you have a full-blown tumbleweed?

I have been a betfair customer for over 10 years and I have to admit that I am really, really annoyed with some of the markets they have removed - especially the HT market. The odds were usually great and I would put a few quid on that market for virtually all the game I would bet on.

I was also a Blue Sq customer and they use to offer great odds on 'team to score in both halves' which sometimes I would form as part of a accumulator. I was annoyed when Betfair took them over and did not replicate that particular market.

I haven't checked but some posters are saying that the 'over 1.5 goals in 1st half' market has also gone.  Another one of my favourite markets.

Betfair used to stand out from the rest so I am truly dissapointed by Betfair's decision to remove the markets and am now seriously considering moving my money somewhere else.  Bet365 seems to be heading in the right direction and I may end up using them more now.

There's definitely an ulterior motive behind the decision.

That should say 'Hat Trick scored - yes/no?' market not the HT market.

thing is, they can't be that stupid that they don't realise people want to bet on hattricks in some games with key players in them (bale, suarez, rvp), televised or not. especially with the historical figures in front of them.

so either this is a dismally p!ss-poor bit of management, or there's another motive behind it than the stated one.

I think someone from Betfair should come on the forum to explain this decision and answer some questions.  They haven't asked for any opinions from users and obviously this is a money grabbing move.
Whatever happened to the Betfair Community Manager?  If these forums are monitored then it would be common courtesy for a response from the company.  Betfair owes us nothing, but since we are their customer base a little communication would be appreciated.

I imagine there is a large gap in the online gambling industry for a company who takes notice of it's customers.

BCM2 still posts in site feedback, but I doubt you'd get much out of him there, tbh. think he's very much constrained in what he can say.

might be worth starting a thread though.

Joined: 17 Sep 02 | Topic/replies: 3,734 | Blogger: Templeton Peck's blog

They haven't removed markets based on liquidity alone.  There's definitely an ulterior motive that nobody has picked up on.  If they have, they haven't mentioned it on the forum.

It's really quite bizarre.



Absolutely.

It is possible that the markets they are removing would clash with something they are going to offer at fixed odds. Clearly they want to move as much money as possible from the exchange to the fixed odds where their margins are higher. If they can get people across to back a single market they might have some of their other bets while they are there..

Basically betfair want high value traders on the exchange and all the penny punters on the fixed odds. The next trial will be increasing the £2 min trade to £5 or £10.

W A N K E R S!

It was the side markets were you could pick up some value.

Spot on.

They have removed Hattrick markets and last goalscorer to get the business to the sportsbook.

That's why they have left non-liquidity booking markets as there would be no interest on the sportsbook.

tbh, the only thing it incentivises me to do is reactivate my quack account and start laying the HT markets there - at better prices than BF's inevitable FO offers will be.

Getting rid of player 2 score to goals or more is nonsense. Plenty of interest there.

Exactly the type of bet they will probably price on their sportsbook.

basically, we can all see the way this is going.

they have a mountain of price and customer p/l data, and there's nothing to stop them analysing it and taking over relevant strategies they find profitable by replicating them on the sportsbook and taking them off the exchange.

Yep, I think this is a sportsbook thing.  They've seen markets where there's the potential for money to be made from casual punters and decided to take them for themselves.

Time for another email to BDaq...

liquidity very low

Very low would be a polite way of putting it.  Comfortably the lowest I've ever seen.

Meaningless matches, Championship football a distraction and the weather all play a part but I think something very serious is happening here...

the only thing I can see stopping this process will be a panic-inducing fall in exchange profits and liquidity shift to the quack.

or I suppose a takeover by people committed to the exchange concept.

It's not just football with low liquidity.

Yep, not just football. If properly managed, liquidity should be increasing all the time but it's plummeting.  Whilst some of the cause is outside of Betfair's control - in particular many countries (effectively) banning the exchange - most is as a direct result of the PC, sportsbook, new exchange site, poor advertising, etc.

I had a look at the Sportsbook today to see if any of the scrapped markets were on there.  The ones I saw had absolutely horrific prices.  Not just a huge margin but actually way out of kilter with reality!  Such a pity they only let me bet pennies!

I don't have much hope for BDaq in the near term and I'm not sure what CVC's intentions for Betfair are.

The relevant posts on Mark Davies's blog are well worth a read:

http://www.markxdavies.com/2013/04/20/fantasy-betfair/

Not happy at all about the lack of over 5.5/6.5 markets, and getting rid of them is the Jupiler league is a real joke.