Mark Clattenburg is stood down as FA investigates Chelsea racism claim

Only if you agree Rooney should have had two yellow's for two  cautionable offences,but Clatts does not send Rooney off.

Another point. I feel worth making, we are taking about 80k a week football players, young men owning or having access to every luxury 99% of us could only dream of.they will have gone home in their 200k cars to their 1m mansion with thier stunning wags, waiting for them. 2 days later are they really bothered if someone has retaliated to their bullish abuse and called them a name?

W

Who knows ,ask Anton .

You would think that situation would make them not make the accusations, you would think jt would say, hang on lads lets not be hypocritical look what happened to me saying something in the heat of a moment

You would think that situation would make them not make the accusations, you would think jt would say, hang on lads lets not be hypocritical look what happened to me saying something in the heat of a moment

dsmith you're forgetting they're thick.

what is going to be done about all the abuse directed at referees week in week out??

It awful behaviour from the players and club allweatherking I'd be embarrassed to be associated with cfc ATM 

You hound a bloke 1 bloke against however many, lets say he does say something and then you report him. Christ what utter xxxxxxx plenty of words to fill in the blanks.

It's funny, had Chelsea won this match, we would not have heard a single word. Sour grapes because United, in some cases with the official's help slapped them and put them in their place. Cockney's hate loosing as we all know and the proof is indeed in the pudding. Over-rated team, over rated manager and not in the same league as United...............god the truth hurts. One day the banker will withdraw from Chelsea and the end of will soon follow.

liverbird:  post of the day imo.

gave to say chelsea have played this right.

and full respect to them imo.

clatenburg would have no doubt been in the good "books" and in line for games at ot some time very soon.

what better way to get him struck off .....the main toic of the moment which has dragged football to it knees

one player gets done on another players word..........so surely this ref has to go the same way.

An interesting thread. Just wanted to say as a long term Chelsea fan that I'm sick of the Torres type of dive that seems to be the norm these days.
Evans caught him, Clattenburg almost certainly didn't see it but saw the dive. No honesty from any of the players anymore.
Stand up man! If the ref sees it, great. Evans is booked and we get a dangerous free kick. If not, bad luck, keep trying.

None of the Chelsea principles are native English speakers.

Luiz's hearing is further impaired by his ridiculous hair.

Suggest FA recommend English language courses for all and additional short back and sides for Luiz.

Case closed.

There as I posted yday mikel stands alone his team mates have deserted him  and he will be charged with threatening to break clatters legs and then out of Chelsea in january and sued to the ground soon after
I'm hearing this morning that he went berserk after the game not because  he was told by luiz and rameriz but because many of his team mates were rollicking him for  his performance and for keep giving the away

mikel didnt hear any abuse, he was told of it

not wise to react to hearsay !

He's also a native english speaker.

Having carefully read through this thread it is clear posters are letting their feelings towards Chelsea dictate their thinking,as was the case with John Terry.
  Clattenburg had an absolute shocker of a match,he made far too many wrong decisions for a professional referee,and that sort of thing is always likely to cause problems.In yesteryear it would cause brawls on the terraces.
Whether Clattenburg is guilty ,or not,and I have no idea,he should be demoted and learn to referee properly.Bad decisions,like he made,will always lead to heated exchanges,regardless of which teams are competing.Our game is sadly lacking in that department,and there is no room for wrong decisions,that shouldn't rest on the shoulders of one man.
When a match is refereed fairly,then bad language drops away,as do the contesting of decisions.There have been a few good refs,but,unfortunately,too many bad ones.
  Collini had great rapport,and respect from the players,we need more like him.

Which were the bad decisions that he made?

indeed unbiased, the tribal divides are set out and stuck to

you simply cant get em all right, but guessing can only back fire in the end

clattenberg has had an amazing climb given his off field problems, and i
cant see that he is a better ref than a.n other

berto, did he get more than 50% of his guesses correct

he may as well have tossed a coin every time there was an incident

I thought he got the second Torres booking wrong.

The winning goal was offside but that was the lino's decision.

So one major bad decision.  I just don't think he had the shocker some have made out.

The Premier League has become massive,in many ways.Millions are invested,millions are wagered,millions watch it,and there is no room for poor officials.The FA are an outdated organisation,and are guilty of letting standards drop.
Refs. get respect from players in rugby,as has been brought up,because decisions are checked by other officials,so practically reducing the risk of error to the bare minimum.This is not the case in football,and wrong decisions lead to heated disputes,and very often more fouls,due to tempers letting loose.This does not have to be the case.

I'm sorry unbiased you are simply incorrect.

Rugby players have always respected refs, and called them Sir, long before technology came in.  Respect for the referees decisions, right or wrong, is a culture that runs through the sport in a way it never has in football.

Refs / umpires in any sport will always make genuine mistakes.  Yes video replays can be used to correct them, but that's not the same as laying into the refs we have for doing a difficult job pretty well most of the time.

berto,get real.Your trivialisation of "the one bad decision" would be laughable was it not so serious.Just think what was entailed,and how it changed one of the biggest Premier League games of the season.Trivial,it wasn't,serious inefficiency,most certainly.

I live in the real world thanks.  I know refs will make genuine mistakes and I'm not prepared to batter them having watched countless slow mo replays.

Yes Torres can feel hard done by, but it's not like they're the only team ever to get a rough call from a ref.  Reading got a few last night but I don't hear them crying about refereeing standards.

Yes,but this isn't just about his poor performance,is it?I am saying poor performance leads to confrontation,which apparently happened in this match.
GOOD REFEREEING=MOSTLY GOOD BEHAVIOUR
POOR REFEREEING=CONFRONTATION,BAD BEHAVIOUR

there are lists elsewhere of chelsea gripes and counter gripes by man utd

he repeated the torres error on a man utd player at the end, and it looked to
me as if he had lost his head

theres plenty of offside decisions wrong and i agree its nothing to do with the ref,
and i also think our technology is such that you cant use it for offside unless they stick a bank of super slow mo cameras around the pitch, but then we wouldnt see the action !!

I've watched that Torres sending off a dozen times since sunday and every time,even in HD slow motion,it looks like there was barely any contact from Evans.Now imagine seeing that in real speed and you've got a fraction of a second to call it.....i think there would be no option but to call a dive.Why on earth didn't Torres stay on his feet,he made the ref's call easy for him the way he went down.

You cant demand a crackdown on diving one minute then have a pop at refs who finally send someone off for it the next.There will be mistakes but at least it'll get the players thinking about staying on their feet a bit more.

I dont think Clattenburg got much wrong in that game and the nonsense "racial abuse" charge will be dropped in a few days with,hopefully,Mikel getting in serious trouble if he cant back up what he acccused Clattenberg of.

shirley

clarkie you have to be 100% to send someone off for diving,agree players do go down to easy but basically you are calling them cheats if you book/send them off.

Again i will add torres went down easy,but there was contact,i am sure edurado got his card resinded(sp?) because there was slight contact against celtic

how it looked in real time !!!


as there was some contact i struggle to see how it could look clear that there was no contact ???


seriously ?????

I'm just going to go ahead and assume that Chelsea believe he did not officiate the match in a fair manner, that for whatever reason he was against them. With that in mind, it seems like they have decided to show him that he is not the only one who can play at that game. I thought they might go after him, I even said so on here right after the game, it seems I was right. We all know the score right, if you throw enough mud then some of it will stick. I'm not sure the man's position will be tenable after all of this. When he showed that second red he may well have committed career suicide.

"Career suicide"?  After the Mendes and Gomes affairs already on his CV and him not suiting parks football only, I am of the opinion he will rise again.  Depending whether you are blue or red, it will be like a phoenix or a zombie.

maybe they will promote him upstairs !

Racism from a player is one thing but from an official it is something else entirely. He may or may not be able to referee again, the point is as of right now his career is in serious jeopardy. I think Chelsea have made their point.

donny,we only arrived at the conclusion that there MAY have been contact after countless super slow motion replays.Even now im not convinced Evans foot actually made contact with Torres shin.

I honestly believe that if any of us reffed that game on Sunday,the first impression would have been DIVE.....even now it looks like a dive 3 days later!!

as if he called him a monkey.. complete bollox, WHEN he is cleared, chelsea should be deducted points

I have heard it was Ramirez who was supposed to have heard Clattenburg call Mikel a monkey & Mata  a Spanish tw@t, by the way Ramirez cannot speak English?

either way his ref carer is over, if he is cleared, he should take chelsea for everything they own,,,

According to reports,this is starting to look quite bad for Mikel and Chelsea now.

You can guarntee the FA and Premier league will throw the kitchen sink at them if these claims prove to be unfounded.

Chelsea stars now claim referee Clattenburg told Mikel: 'Shut up you monkey' as club's race case looks in jeopardy.

•Two players have told teammates this is what Premier League official said in alleged outburst
•Clattenburg confident he will be cleared of wrongdoing, with source saying: 'He said nothing of the sort - and he will fight this all the way'
•Chelsea's legal case could collapse as it has gone to external lawyers who may believe the claims made by players do not stand up

By Neil Ashton , Sami Mokbel and Martin Robinson http://www.dailymail.co.uk
31 October 2012


The race-row that has engulfed Premier League referee Mark Clattenburg intensified further today as two Chelsea players claimed they heard him call teammate John Obi Mikel a 'monkey'.

It has emerged that the pair of unnamed stars say this is what happened during their match with Manchester United on Sunday - but the official categorically denies making any racist comments.


Clattenburg has been accused of saying to Mikel: 'Shut up you monkey' as he booked him for dissent as well as calling Juan Mata a ‘Spanish t***’ in their 3-2 defeat at Stamford Bridge.

Mystery had surrounded what Clattenburg actually said to Mikel - until these allegations were made this morning.


But a source close to the referee told The Sun: 'He said nothing of the sort - and he will fight this all the way.

'There is a lot of noise on the pitch and the players could have easily misheard.'

Meanwhile, Chelsea's race case against Clattenburg is in serious danger of collapsing completely after it emerged that the club have employed independent lawyers to investigate the claims of their players.

The club are expected to conclude their internal investigation into allegations that the referee racially abused John Mikel Obi and swore at Juan Mata.

The external lawyers will then provide Chelsea with legal opinion as to whether their case will be successful. Despite issues over the available evidence, Chelsea remained robust.

Clattenburg, who has been taken off the Premier League match list this weekend, has protested his innocence since his controversial handling of Chelsea’s 3-2 defeat by Manchester United on Sunday.

Now it has emerged that Chelsea are fearful of the backlash if the players have misheard or misjudged Clattenburg’s conversations during the stormy clash against United.

Chelsea will proceed with the case against the referee only if they are satisfied the claims made by the players after the game will stand up to the FA’s burden of proof.
It means they will need to satisfy an FA commission ‘on the balance of probability’, but they also have to negotiate the complexities of the Metropolitan Police’s investigation into the affair.

If the case breaks down, it will reflect badly on Chelsea, who made their claims of inappropriate language against Clattenburg in a strongly worded statement on Sunday, two hours after the final whistle.

Earlier it emerged that the club and Mikel could be charged with misconduct by the FA after the midfielder had to be restrained from manhandling the referee in his dressing room following the clash.

Clattenburg did not mention the behaviour in the ‘extraordinary incident’ report he filed on Sunday, but he now has to make a detailed statement to the FA. Clattenburg’s assistants, Michael McDonough and Simon Long, and fourth official Mike Jones have filed reports in which they say they did not hear the Durham official say anything inappropriate.

All four were in the referee’s room when Mikel burst in with Chelsea chief executive Ron Gourlay and manager Roberto Di Matteo.

Mikel’s aggressive manner, along with the behaviour of other Chelsea officials, raises the possibility of FA action against the club.

Both Mikel and Mata claim they have a witness to Clattenburg’s comments, and PFA chief executive Gordon Taylor, who has assessed both complaints, told Sportsmail the pair have his ‘100 per cent support’.


However, it has emerged that the allegations about the referee’s comments were made only after a debate in the Chelsea dressing room. Mikel and Ramires were discussing the alleged use of racist language and were then quizzed by senior Chelsea players about what they had heard before the matter was taken further.

Sunday’s controversy is also the subject of a police investigation and Clattenburg will be interviewed by them as well as the FA, who are conducting a separate inquiry into his handling of the clash.


The PFA had a delegate at the game and he has discussed the matter with Taylor, who said: ‘The main thing is that the police investigation will not affect the process at the FA.


‘We are supportive of the players and they have our 100 per cent backing. I find it difficult to believe that Chelsea’s players would make something like this up. At the same time I find it hard to conclude that a referee could say something of this nature.’


Clattenburg found an unlikely ally in Leeds manager Neil Warnock, who said he was disgusted with Chelsea for ‘trying to kill’ the official.


Warnock, preparing for Leeds’ Capital One Cup win over Southampton last night, was critical of the accusations against Clattenburg, who enraged Chelsea by sending off Fernando Torres for diving when replays showed he had been fouled.




Warnock said: ‘You know my relationship with referees but I have to say I am disgusted with what’s gone on. I’m on Clattenburg’s side. We ask referees to man-manage and that’s what he does. I’m sure he might have said a few things but are you telling me if Chelsea had won that game that there would have been one iota of a complaint?


‘I hope if it is proved wrong, that the players, whatever they alleged Mark to have said, get done as well. I think he made a mistake but they are trying to kill him and I don’t agree with that.’


In a further development, police chiefs upgraded security at Stamford Bridge for the Capital One Cup tie against United as tension between the teams threatens to escalate.

sorry clarkey but i thought the contact fairly obvious

watched at sjp , couldnt hear commentary but thought it a foul

most newcastle fans were surprised at the decision at the time

Warnock said: ‘You know my relationship with referees but I have to say I am disgusted with what’s gone on. I’m on Clattenburg’s side. We ask referees to man-manage and that’s what he does. I’m sure he might have said a few things but are you telling me if Chelsea had won that game that there would have been one iota of a complaint?

has warnock met sir alex ???

But a source close to the referee told The Sun: 'He said nothing of the sort - and he will fight this all the way.


is this part of the no further comments will be made

Only my opinion but there is absolutely no chance on earth that a ref would call a black player a "monkey" in this day and age.It's a quite ludicrous accusation.

so the chelsea players got together did they - oh dear - this is going to be messy if clatterbuk is cleared - how about the threats to the ref!!??

Oct 31, 2012 -- 1:33PM, clarkey wrote:

Only my opinion but there is absolutely no chance on earth that a ref would call a black player a "monkey" in this day and age.It's a quite ludicrous accusation.

exactly, an with everything going on about racism at the mo its complete bollox..

If Chelsea drop it's accusation and the police find no evidence,i think Mikel could be under criminal charges such is the seriousness of the claim.........and Chelsea could well have a suspended points deduction.

The FA/Premier league will want clamp down on this very,very quickly,imo.

Oct 31, 2012 -- 1:40PM, clarkey wrote:

If Chelsea drop it's accusation and the police find no evidence,i think Mikel could be under criminal charges such is the seriousness of the claim.........and Chelsea could well have a suspended points deduction.The FA/Premier league will want clamp down on this very,very quickly,imo.

he didnt make the claim...

but chelsea as a club should be charged with Incitement to racial or ethnic hatred, and so should the racist black lawyer idiots

i find it hard to believe that he would say it, and hard to believe a club would make a claim
that he did, if he didnt


seems a total lack of evidence to support either side

Will probably get a 20 grand fine, flee on elephants backside to Roman

clattenburgs friend spinning a story to the sun would be a further worry about clattenburg

Maybe Chelsea should have taken 24hours to take a calm,rational look at the claims rather than make a rash decision less than a few hours after a hugely controversial game in which they feel they got the wrong end of a few poor ref decisions and emotions were still high.

I genuinely hope all involved get severly punished when the case gets dropped.

I wouldn't want to be in Clattenburg's shoes, he cant win no matter what happens now. If he brings more trouble to Chelsea then the fans will be after his blood even more than they are already, possible attacks, death threats etc. He will be forever seen as a racist. It will get even worse if there is a court case. His reputation might well be so damaged that he won't be able to continue as a referee.

If MC called Obi a monkey then he will deserve everything he gets. However,it would be extraordinary if he did and I find myself agreeing with Neil Warnock that nothing would have happened had Chelsea won the game. Those Chelsea players involved in all this together with Gourlay and di Matteo could be in hot water if the allegations dont stack up.

Oct 31, 2012 -- 1:50PM, high_lander wrote:

I wouldn't want to be in Clattenburg's shoes, he cant win no matter what happens now. If he brings more trouble to Chelsea then the fans will be after his blood even more than they are already, possible attacks, death threats etc. He will be forever seen as a racist. It will get even worse if there is a court case. His reputation might well be so damaged that he won't be able to continue as a referee.

exactly, i fear a massive payout by chelsea if this is cleared..

Correct Clarkey. The internal investigation being carried out today should have happened before Gourlay, Di Matteo and Obi stormed into the ref's dressing room to berate MC for supposedly using racist language. As I have said earlier this is a club out of control with utterly clueless management who must take most of the blame.

Chelsea have a issues with match officials ever since that infamous Barcelona Champions League match. I think what they are doing now is brought on by that anxiety. They are determined to fight back against what they see as blatant cheating. I think this was one bad decision too many, the straw that broke the camels back.

the time for action was lost after the player claimed to hear to racist remark and did nothing

waiting 24 hours would have been laughable

is it common for players to invade the refs dressing room after the game

the f a should stamp that out too ...

Mikel  is unlikely to ever play for Chelsea again   It seems mata is  the good guy in this  mikel has no support other than the black lawyer mob
Surprisingly JT is gonna come out of this well he was the main guy stopping a riot
As I keep saying mikel was in 2007 behind the most laughed at case of racism in football history calling crouch  a racist for saying foreign players dive more
He's not ferries fav guy in the world either and should have been banned when he signed for Chelsea  over the bunging

berto77 31 Oct 12 11:06
I thought he got the second Torres booking wrong.

The winning goal was offside but that was the lino's decision.

So one major bad decision.  I just don't think he had the shocker some have made out.


The one major bad decision he made was to give Torres the first yellow.  It should have been a red.  Other than that the ref did very well.

Is there a Spanish Lawyers Association?

Oct 31, 2012 -- 1:42PM, donny osmond wrote:

i find it hard to believe that he would say it, and hard to believe a club would make a claimthat he did, if he didntseems a total lack of evidence to support either side

Well, if theres any club that would make a fake racism claim against a ref...to quote someone else "Chelsea, drunk on self-pity and collective indignation (something that has galvinised them and developed their hugely effective siege mentality) have lost the plot."

..


http://www.bsla.org.uk

I really hope the ref's go on strike, fans will stay away and these overpaid fkin ponces will see what its like in the real world.

I wonder what players and indeed refs call Mikel?

My guess would be 'Mickey'.

Is this what Mikel heard and interpreted as 'monkey'?

john ?

jobi?

won kenobi

in decline lazy  unfit  useless bad tempered  and that's his own team mates

CHELSEA STATEMENT

Posted on: Wed 31 Oct 2012

http://www.chelseafc.com


Chelsea Football Club today lodged a formal complaint with The Football Association regarding inappropriate language directed at John Mikel Obi by referee Mark Clattenburg. This is a result of a thorough investigation carried out by the club, and led by outside legal counsel, of all information available to us including interviews with a number of players and staff.


Following Sunday's Premier League game against Manchester United, club board members were quickly made aware, upon entering the home dressing room after the final whistle, that there were allegations of inappropriate language directed at Chelsea FC players by Mr Clattenburg during the game.


Board members began establishing the details of the allegations, speaking to all relevant players and staff. After those initial interviews it was clear that the matter had to be reported. The correct protocol for doing so was to report the incidents to the match delegate, and the club took immediate steps to inform him as soon as he was available. It was not a decision the club took lightly.


Since reporting the matter to the delegate, the club and outside legal counsel have conducted further investigations. Having completed that process we have now followed the correct protocol and lodged a formal complaint with The FA regarding John Mikel Obi. There was not sufficient evidence to support a second claim to The FA with regard to the alleged verbal abuse of another first team player.


We will cooperate fully with The FA and the Police as they each investigate the matter. As events on Sunday are now subject to those investigations we are unable to comment further until those processes are complete.

however clattenberg will continue to make comments via a third party to the sun .....

I'd bet 1.01 that Clattenburg did not call Mikel a monkey. It just didn't happen. 'Shut up Mikel' or something like that is probably what happened and has been misheard by the other players. I'm totally amazed that Chelsea are pursuing this. Surely they would know that the chances of a miked up ref making such a comment are bordering on zero. I'm shocked that this is the accusation. Clattenburg will be found not guilty and hopefully Chelsea will be taken to the cleaners.

i,m amazed at some of the carp being spouted here. from the lunatic who told ud mikel wouldn't play for chelsea again [that was quickly put to bed] through to the peolpe who reckon it's a conspiracy going back years

the fact is some players reported that clattenberg had used racist language towards mikel.

as a club chelsea have an obligation to make the fa aware of such a claim

they did this by making a formal complaint.

they then imported a crowd of lawyers to go through the facts that were reported to them.

acting on their advice they fave made an "official" complaint.

if they'd have acted any differently they would have been guikty of ignoring their "duty of care" towards their player.

if nobody else heard it that dosen't mean he definatly didn't say it.

in the same way that the fact that some said he did dosen't mean he did say it.

an awkward one for the fa.

one that they will have to decide on the balance of probabilities.

Nothing awkward about it all. It's just so unlikely that a ref would make such a comment. The balance of probability is clear to any neutral.

so if two or three "witnesses" testify that he said it, and he says he didn't, somebody has to decide on the motives of people saying what they did.

his motive is obvious.

so somebody would have to decide "on the balance of probabilities" that the witnesses were part of a conspiracy to discredit him.

they would have to come up with a bit more than prejudice.

Let's hope the refs hit back and send off any Premier League player who uses foul language at the weekend.

SPECIAL REPORT: Did ref Clattenburg really use the word 'monkey' at Mikel? A Brazilian player's grasp of English, a referee's Geordie accent and a £2,900 set of earpieces hold keys to the big question


http://bit.ly/YpEX8p

Chelsea dare not withdraw their claim against him as they would get the book thrown at them. They will carry on with shut up monkey claim but will then claim players miss heard because of the crowd etc... & Clattenburg said shut up Mikel.
I cannot see any referee saying to a player shut up monkey

I once loved watching football but now with these under talented,over payed,foul mouthed people playing the game I don't watch it anymore. The continual spitting is another turn off. They question every decision up to and including throw ins' and continually disabuse the officials,who I have to say nine times out of ten, get it right. Solution: An open letter sent to all Premier League clubs stating that if they don,t get there house in order regarding there players disabusing match officials a one month strike by match officials will take place starting on 14th December 2012 until 12th January 2013. That may be better than paying lip service to the Respect programme and may concentrate the minds of clubs.

Mikel,monkey think Chelsea just got their get out of jail free card FFs how low will these people go clattenburg not my up of tea as a ref but he ain't no racist and Chelsea know it horriblehorrible club

Have a look at this Chelsea supporter last night

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/chelsea/9647967/Chelsea-launch-investigation-after-fan-appears-to-make-monkey-gesture-during-clash-with-Manchester-United.html

Defo not the sharpest knife in the box

why would the ref call him mikel

he uses first names .....

Apparently the inappropriate language Mark Clattenburg used was he called Torres a striker

something needs to be done not right just not right here's me defending him never again string Im up I say death too good for him

Chelsea are digging themselves a very big hole.

Who get paid so much money for such poor decision making, it's a another load of nonsense like the John Terry saga, players and fans like dishing it out but not taking it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=bow-UhcqSfI#!

perhaps its time to bring uriah rennie back to officiate

trelford mills on standby

If a black player comes into the dressing room and complains he has been racially abused ,Chelsea have to report it.

Will the FA sentence Clattenburg on the balance of probability?

  If Mikel is found to have lied in a civil court and not the FA kangaroo court that convicted JT I hope the club terminate his contract.

mikel cant have lied as he didnt hear anything

AP FFs jt   another person with similar initials was innocent OJ

That was for ah hunter

Rob Harris‏@RobHarris

Chelsea believe they have sufficient evidence to pursue Clattenburg case & sent files of evidence to the FA

As I posted the other day Chelsea now in deep s hit as they realise he said mikel not  monkey. To rameriz and luiz it sounded like monkey now mikel s gonna b charged with threatening to break clatters legs
Oh dear what punishments relegation mikel banned from football and sued for 50 m ?

mikel's agent flies in
chelsea's legal team organising mikel's statement
black lawyers association ask met to investigate

can you see how all this is so wrong

Mikel had allegedly been getting stick from team mates for his performance and wasn't  happy then rameriz  tells him and he goes ballistic if  half the team were not holding him back or it would have been much worse