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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18407309
Part of the plan is to transfer the Rangers assets for £5.5m (ie. the amount administrators are owed).
Is the stadium, training ground & players only worth £5.5m.
Could HMRC get more money by owning the stadium and renting it to new Rangers out or building houses there.
Part of the plan is to transfer the Rangers assets for £5.5m (ie. the amount administrators are owed).
Is the stadium, training ground & players only worth £5.5m.
Could HMRC get more money by owning the stadium and renting it to new Rangers out or building houses there.
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Treat Rangers like any other company in the same circumstances. Sell lock, stock and barrel and HMRC get their full whack. Rangers can always start all over again in the lower leagues...just without the cheating this time.
Paying a penny in the pound back is no example to set for any future business. Ibrox and all other assets must be sold off as a matter of correctness. SPL clubs must not vote them back into SPL otherwise they or somebody else will cheat again. In the long run it will be better for Scottish football if everything is done correctly. Ironic really that the demise of GRFC was overseen by a fellow called Green and a fella called White... The end of the world is nigh and the truth of Scotlands Shame is there for all to see.
BYE BYE RANGERS.
The reason they were in administration was cos they cheated.
However even in administration they were still trying to cheat.
Duff and Duffer signed an agreement to sell Murray park and Ibrox to Green for 5.5 million despite it being shown to be worth 10 times that.
HMRC will now appoint their own liquidators and no doubt scrap this agreement.
It all fkn stinks and their needs to be an investigation.
Meanwhile enjoy the 3rd division you cheating chunts.
The reason they were in administration was cos they cheated.
However even in administration they were still trying to cheat.
Duff and Duffer signed an agreement to sell Murray park and Ibrox to Green for 5.5 million despite it being shown to be worth 10 times that.
HMRC will now appoint their own liquidators and no doubt scrap this agreement.
It all fkn stinks and their needs to be an investigation.
Meanwhile enjoy the 3rd division you cheating chunts.
Div 3 is where most of the Rangers support want to be Shuda.
Lets hope the rest of Scottish football learns from Rangers mistakes and keep within their fiscal means.
Taxes have to be paid no one should be exempt, you would imagine that there will be many English sides looking over their shoulders now after this announcement.
Lets hope the rest of Scottish football learns from Rangers mistakes and keep within their fiscal means.
Taxes have to be paid no one should be exempt, you would imagine that there will be many English sides looking over their shoulders now after this announcement.
I don't understand why HMRC is allowing the company's assets to be sold for only £5.5m.
They cheated on their tax they should now cough up every last penny even if that means Rangers being never playing another match again.
They cheated on their tax they should now cough up every last penny even if that means Rangers being never playing another match again.
Agree Nobby,
The players must be worth £5.5m alone.
How much is Ibrox & training ground worth?
Does Glasgow really need three decent football stadiums?
Can't believe how they could run up such a large debt. The board have a legal duty to know what is going on with the club's finances.
The players must be worth £5.5m alone.
How much is Ibrox & training ground worth?
Does Glasgow really need three decent football stadiums?
Can't believe how they could run up such a large debt. The board have a legal duty to know what is going on with the club's finances.
Mexico 12 Jun 12 14:07
Agree Nobby,
The players must be worth £5.5m alone.
Don't know enough about this but if Rangers are skint and don't even know if they'll exist next season, surely they can't afford to pay their players.......which would make their contracts worthless..........meaning the players would be free to leave and seek paid employment elsewhere?
Agree Nobby,
The players must be worth £5.5m alone.
Don't know enough about this but if Rangers are skint and don't even know if they'll exist next season, surely they can't afford to pay their players.......which would make their contracts worthless..........meaning the players would be free to leave and seek paid employment elsewhere?
the most baffling things is why are their still staff at all (incl. players). When any normal company is in this state (I know this first hand) the staff get their notice immediately and stop being paid and moreover simply become creditors for the pay they are due. HMRC should have forced this upon the club immediately instead the administrators ran up £6m bill messing about for a solution which was never going to happen.
BTW the subtext for HMRC decision is that they feel confident in pursuing Murray for more than they would ever receive via the CVA. At worst he'd probably cough up the same to avoid going to criminal court.
Still no remorse shown by anybody at Rangers, they even have the cheek to continually cry for sympathy. They owe clubs money all around the world let alone the smaller clubs in Scotland. David Murray has a lot to answer for and frankly when the investigation begins one thing is guaranteed ... he will not have a leg to stand on
Th new company should pay the going rate for the assets.
I wouldn't mind owning a huge chunk of Glasgow for £5.5m
I wouldn't mind owning a huge chunk of Glasgow for £5.5m
Rangers should be dissolved completely. If they reform they can start in the Highland League and hire a small field somewhere. The ground should be sold of to property developers, with the money going to HMRC, although in the area its in it probably isnt worth much. All player contracts should be held in escrue by HMRC who could start a team, HMRCFC.They could slowly sell off players and replace them with employees and slowly sink through the leagues.
So as things stand, what league will Rangers be in next season?
Rangers to reform as British Rangers Newco
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18407309
Rangers will re-form as a new company after a creditors' deal was rejected by Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs.
It means clubs will have to vote on whether to re-admit Rangers to the Scottish Premier League.
HMRC rejected prospective owner Charles Green's bid to exit administration via a company voluntary arrangement giving creditors nine pence in the pound.
"The club will continue to operate as it has always done but in a new company structure," said the administrators.
Green, who said he was "hugely disappointed" by HMRC's decision, will now seek to buy the club's assets for £5.5m and form a "newco", under the terms of the deal his consortium struck with administrators Duff & Phelps.
"We will be liaising with the football authorities at the earliest opportunity to establish our position regarding the SPL," said Green, who will approach the Scottish Football Association and the SPL.
Rangers' footballing fate will be decided by their 11 fellow SPL members. There is an SPL board meeting at Hampden on Monday to discuss the league's inquiry into alleged dual contracts at Rangers.
What is a CVA?
A CVA enables companies to reach an agreement with creditors about how debts could be repaid and provides for partial or full repayment depending on what the company can reasonably afford to pay.
They could hold a vote then if a newco proposal can be put together in time. Perhaps more realistic is for the 11 clubs to vote at the AGM next month.
In recent weeks clubs have expressed the dilemma they face: Rangers' presence in the SPL brings revenue through the turnstiles and from broadcast deals, but many fans have said they will not return if "sporting integrity" is not seen to be upheld.
These supporters have been in contact with their clubs to demand that they vote against Rangers playing in the SPL next season. Their preference is for Rangers to apply to join the Scottish Football League and to start again in the Third Division.
HMRC said that the sale of the club "is not being undermined, it simply takes a different route".
In a statement it said: "Liquidation will enable a sale of the football assets to be made to a new company, thereby ensuring that football will continue at Ibrox.
"It also means that the new company will be free from claims or litigation in a way which would not be achievable with a CVA. Rangers can make a fresh start."
Green's consortium had hoped to have its CVA - offering nine pence in the pound at best - approved by creditors when they meet at Ibrox on Thursday so that the club could exit administration in mid-July.
But Green needed major creditors HMRC and Ticketus, who had loaned money to owner Craig Whyte in exchange for future season ticket revenue, to vote in favour to avoid the assets being sold off.
Rangers CVA key facts
Rangers administrators' CVA offers 8-9p in the pound (best case scenario)
Administrators fees: £5.5m
Football debts: £3.5m
HMRC owed: £21.5m
Ticketus owed: £26.7m
Total owed to unsecured creditors: £55m
"The solemn promise I can make to Rangers fans today is that this club will continue as Rangers Football Club and will continue to play at Ibrox Stadium," said Yorkshireman Green.
"I am hugely disappointed by the decision of HMRC not to support the CVA proposal and that disappointment will be felt acutely by Rangers fans across the world.
"Frankly, I do not see what benefit will be achieved by this decision. My consortium's offer for a CVA amounted to a total of £8.5m.
"Now that we will have to complete the purchase via the formation of a newco, the purchase price and therefore the amount available to creditors will be £5.5m.
"I can understand HMRC deciding that football clubs which do not pay their taxes need to be punished, but by effectively banning Rangers from Europe for three years all that will happen is that there will be less revenue generated by the club and consequently less money paid over to the taxman."
Rangers entered administration on 14 February and await the outcome of a First Tier Tax tribunal at the Court of Session in Edinburgh over unpaid taxes - the so-called "Big Tax Case".
If that decision goes against the club, it would mean a further bill of anything from £35m to £70m.
That would have reduced the pence-in-the-pound deal in the CVA to close to zero.
The club's total debts to unsecured creditors listed in the CVA was £55m, with HMRC accounting for £21.5m of that sum.
BBC Scotland has learned that Duff & Phelps held a meeting with HMRC on Monday and were told of their decision.
Duff & Phelps say HMRC's decision was based on "its general policy of not agreeing to a CVA where there is strong evidence of non-compliance by a company with its tax liabilities".
They said HMRC had agreed to consider the CVA proposal along with all other options but decided that the club's level of indebtedness made it unacceptable.
The administrators say HMRC would also have rejected the other offers for the club that proposed a CVA.
Administrator Paul Clark added: "HMRC has taken the view that the public interest will be better served with the liquidation of The Rangers Football Club plc as a corporate entity."
The CVA required the approval of 75% or more in value of the creditors, and more than 50% in value of the members, voting on the resolution.
it will now try to buy the business and assets of Rangers for £5.5m.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18407309
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18407309
Rangers will re-form as a new company after a creditors' deal was rejected by Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs.
It means clubs will have to vote on whether to re-admit Rangers to the Scottish Premier League.
HMRC rejected prospective owner Charles Green's bid to exit administration via a company voluntary arrangement giving creditors nine pence in the pound.
"The club will continue to operate as it has always done but in a new company structure," said the administrators.
Green, who said he was "hugely disappointed" by HMRC's decision, will now seek to buy the club's assets for £5.5m and form a "newco", under the terms of the deal his consortium struck with administrators Duff & Phelps.
"We will be liaising with the football authorities at the earliest opportunity to establish our position regarding the SPL," said Green, who will approach the Scottish Football Association and the SPL.
Rangers' footballing fate will be decided by their 11 fellow SPL members. There is an SPL board meeting at Hampden on Monday to discuss the league's inquiry into alleged dual contracts at Rangers.
What is a CVA?
A CVA enables companies to reach an agreement with creditors about how debts could be repaid and provides for partial or full repayment depending on what the company can reasonably afford to pay.
They could hold a vote then if a newco proposal can be put together in time. Perhaps more realistic is for the 11 clubs to vote at the AGM next month.
In recent weeks clubs have expressed the dilemma they face: Rangers' presence in the SPL brings revenue through the turnstiles and from broadcast deals, but many fans have said they will not return if "sporting integrity" is not seen to be upheld.
These supporters have been in contact with their clubs to demand that they vote against Rangers playing in the SPL next season. Their preference is for Rangers to apply to join the Scottish Football League and to start again in the Third Division.
HMRC said that the sale of the club "is not being undermined, it simply takes a different route".
In a statement it said: "Liquidation will enable a sale of the football assets to be made to a new company, thereby ensuring that football will continue at Ibrox.
"It also means that the new company will be free from claims or litigation in a way which would not be achievable with a CVA. Rangers can make a fresh start."
Green's consortium had hoped to have its CVA - offering nine pence in the pound at best - approved by creditors when they meet at Ibrox on Thursday so that the club could exit administration in mid-July.
But Green needed major creditors HMRC and Ticketus, who had loaned money to owner Craig Whyte in exchange for future season ticket revenue, to vote in favour to avoid the assets being sold off.
Rangers CVA key facts
Rangers administrators' CVA offers 8-9p in the pound (best case scenario)
Administrators fees: £5.5m
Football debts: £3.5m
HMRC owed: £21.5m
Ticketus owed: £26.7m
Total owed to unsecured creditors: £55m
"The solemn promise I can make to Rangers fans today is that this club will continue as Rangers Football Club and will continue to play at Ibrox Stadium," said Yorkshireman Green.
"I am hugely disappointed by the decision of HMRC not to support the CVA proposal and that disappointment will be felt acutely by Rangers fans across the world.
"Frankly, I do not see what benefit will be achieved by this decision. My consortium's offer for a CVA amounted to a total of £8.5m.
"Now that we will have to complete the purchase via the formation of a newco, the purchase price and therefore the amount available to creditors will be £5.5m.
"I can understand HMRC deciding that football clubs which do not pay their taxes need to be punished, but by effectively banning Rangers from Europe for three years all that will happen is that there will be less revenue generated by the club and consequently less money paid over to the taxman."
Rangers entered administration on 14 February and await the outcome of a First Tier Tax tribunal at the Court of Session in Edinburgh over unpaid taxes - the so-called "Big Tax Case".
If that decision goes against the club, it would mean a further bill of anything from £35m to £70m.
That would have reduced the pence-in-the-pound deal in the CVA to close to zero.
The club's total debts to unsecured creditors listed in the CVA was £55m, with HMRC accounting for £21.5m of that sum.
BBC Scotland has learned that Duff & Phelps held a meeting with HMRC on Monday and were told of their decision.
Duff & Phelps say HMRC's decision was based on "its general policy of not agreeing to a CVA where there is strong evidence of non-compliance by a company with its tax liabilities".
They said HMRC had agreed to consider the CVA proposal along with all other options but decided that the club's level of indebtedness made it unacceptable.
The administrators say HMRC would also have rejected the other offers for the club that proposed a CVA.
Administrator Paul Clark added: "HMRC has taken the view that the public interest will be better served with the liquidation of The Rangers Football Club plc as a corporate entity."
The CVA required the approval of 75% or more in value of the creditors, and more than 50% in value of the members, voting on the resolution.
it will now try to buy the business and assets of Rangers for £5.5m.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18407309
how can Ibrox and Murray park only be worth 5.5 million
If they were going for that I would get a few mates together and buy them.
Rent them back to Rangers and you are set for eternity with a vast income.
A bank building on a small high street goes for 1 million +
If they were going for that I would get a few mates together and buy them.
Rent them back to Rangers and you are set for eternity with a vast income.
A bank building on a small high street goes for 1 million +
I understood that the 'assets' were previously valued at £100m in the company accounts....however I think things are complicated by Whyte have a 'floating' charge over assets which renders then not open to market value. He may we still make good here.
Ibrox and murray park where recently valued at 113 milion pounds.
This valuation, which enabled rangers to borrow up to near this value from the bank of Scotland, enabled them to carry on buying players. (lloyds almost fainted when they looked at the rangers books.)
It is now suddenly worth 4.5 million.
This 9pence in the pound is absolute and utter nonsense, it would depend on them winning the big tax case appeal, sueing lawyers for 25 million, getting in to Europe, allowed to stay in SPL,etc. etc. in other words, fantasy.
The true value would be near or even less, 1 pence in the pound.
So e.g. Hearts get 8k for the 800 k they are owed for Wallace, rapid Vienna get 10k for the 1 million on Jelavic,(whilst rangers pocket the full fee from Everton), the newsagent owed 500 pounds gets a fiver, while Green talks about signing 5 players currently playing at the Euros, they have no shame or sense of reality.
I have been saying for long and weary, this is the biggest sporting scandal the world has ever seen.
There should be jail cases coming out of this, this story is only just beginning.
Remember, we still have to come:
Big tax case- 56million?
Paye from last year- 13 million?
Money owed to football and the other creditors.
Players paid by EBTs, using dual contracts.
Punishment for taking a footbal matter to a civil court.
No accounts submitted to SFA
Stripping of titles and cups. (how would you even begin to financially compensate teams for this? Impossible.
Etc, etc etc.
I know rangers fans are saying they will be happy to go to the 3rd division, imo, they will not be playing anywhere for a year.
The new club will then be fought over between fans and venture capitalists, there might even be 2 new rangers, who each try to vie for any Scottish league place.
Yes, this is just the beginning.
This valuation, which enabled rangers to borrow up to near this value from the bank of Scotland, enabled them to carry on buying players. (lloyds almost fainted when they looked at the rangers books.)
It is now suddenly worth 4.5 million.
This 9pence in the pound is absolute and utter nonsense, it would depend on them winning the big tax case appeal, sueing lawyers for 25 million, getting in to Europe, allowed to stay in SPL,etc. etc. in other words, fantasy.
The true value would be near or even less, 1 pence in the pound.
So e.g. Hearts get 8k for the 800 k they are owed for Wallace, rapid Vienna get 10k for the 1 million on Jelavic,(whilst rangers pocket the full fee from Everton), the newsagent owed 500 pounds gets a fiver, while Green talks about signing 5 players currently playing at the Euros, they have no shame or sense of reality.
I have been saying for long and weary, this is the biggest sporting scandal the world has ever seen.
There should be jail cases coming out of this, this story is only just beginning.
Remember, we still have to come:
Big tax case- 56million?
Paye from last year- 13 million?
Money owed to football and the other creditors.
Players paid by EBTs, using dual contracts.
Punishment for taking a footbal matter to a civil court.
No accounts submitted to SFA
Stripping of titles and cups. (how would you even begin to financially compensate teams for this? Impossible.
Etc, etc etc.
I know rangers fans are saying they will be happy to go to the 3rd division, imo, they will not be playing anywhere for a year.
The new club will then be fought over between fans and venture capitalists, there might even be 2 new rangers, who each try to vie for any Scottish league place.
Yes, this is just the beginning.
HMRC say that football assets can be sold to a new company.
They do not say that it will be Green’s new company
They do not say that it will be Green’s new company
Whyte offered 8.5 million,but only as a loan and to be paid back with interest.
For this he would have got Ibrox AND Murray park,valued at 100 million.
Plus the transfer fees of all signed players even at the reduced value,this would raise another 15 million maybe.
So for a loan of 8.5 million he would have gained assets worth over 100 million.
What a fkn joke and they wonder why it was turned down.
For this he would have got Ibrox AND Murray park,valued at 100 million.
Plus the transfer fees of all signed players even at the reduced value,this would raise another 15 million maybe.
So for a loan of 8.5 million he would have gained assets worth over 100 million.
What a fkn joke and they wonder why it was turned down.
shudacuda 12 Jun 12 17:17
Whyte offered 8.5 million,but only as a loan and to be paid back with interest.
For this he would have got Ibrox AND Murray park,valued at 100 million.
Plus the transfer fees of all signed players even at the reduced value,this would raise another 15 million maybe.
So for a loan of 8.5 million he would have gained assets worth over 100 million.
What a fkn joke and they wonder why it was turned down.
____________________
Green thinks hes getting the same deal for 5.5m
Whyte offered 8.5 million,but only as a loan and to be paid back with interest.
For this he would have got Ibrox AND Murray park,valued at 100 million.
Plus the transfer fees of all signed players even at the reduced value,this would raise another 15 million maybe.
So for a loan of 8.5 million he would have gained assets worth over 100 million.
What a fkn joke and they wonder why it was turned down.
____________________
Green thinks hes getting the same deal for 5.5m
Whytes in cuckoo world.
There is no way that agreement with Duff and duffer for him to pay only 5.5 million will stand.
HMRC are moving in their own liquidators and sacking Duff and duffer.
It must be illegal to undervalue your assets and make an exclusive agreement.
There is no way that agreement with Duff and duffer for him to pay only 5.5 million will stand.
HMRC are moving in their own liquidators and sacking Duff and duffer.
It must be illegal to undervalue your assets and make an exclusive agreement.
Rangers FC, like their abhorrent values and songs are history, but as Alex Thompspon has bloggedl
1. Theywill be banned from European competition for at least three years.
2. Most of their players can and will leave in the coming weeks often – many having no doubt had enough of doing their bit on wage cuts of up to 75 per cent.
3. The club still faces the Big Tax Case tribunal decision laughingly due “soon after Easter”, and on that the HMRC still have no news, this could see Rangers face a further tax bill of up to £70m in dues and penalties.
4. The Scottish Premier League will soon run out of excuses to not report on its investigation into alleged wrongful player registration which, if the club is found guilty as charged, could see the club losing much of its silverware won over the past decade or so.t
5. The liquidation makes it even more difficult for both the Scottish Premier League and its appeal body the Scottish Football Association to readmit and license Rangers to play in the Scottish Premier League.
6. Despite the Green consortium’s lofty statements about buying the club’s assets, there is no guarantee that they will in fact be bought up as a job lot. There is no guarantee about simply playing on at Ibrox. There are, as things stand, few guarantees in terms of the asset sale at all.
It is hard to see any way forward with any kind of probity except starting a clean sheet at the foot of the Third Division in Scotland and playing their way back, thereby sending a message across the sporting world, at last, that some things matter more than money – even in football.
1. Theywill be banned from European competition for at least three years.
2. Most of their players can and will leave in the coming weeks often – many having no doubt had enough of doing their bit on wage cuts of up to 75 per cent.
3. The club still faces the Big Tax Case tribunal decision laughingly due “soon after Easter”, and on that the HMRC still have no news, this could see Rangers face a further tax bill of up to £70m in dues and penalties.
4. The Scottish Premier League will soon run out of excuses to not report on its investigation into alleged wrongful player registration which, if the club is found guilty as charged, could see the club losing much of its silverware won over the past decade or so.t
5. The liquidation makes it even more difficult for both the Scottish Premier League and its appeal body the Scottish Football Association to readmit and license Rangers to play in the Scottish Premier League.
6. Despite the Green consortium’s lofty statements about buying the club’s assets, there is no guarantee that they will in fact be bought up as a job lot. There is no guarantee about simply playing on at Ibrox. There are, as things stand, few guarantees in terms of the asset sale at all.
It is hard to see any way forward with any kind of probity except starting a clean sheet at the foot of the Third Division in Scotland and playing their way back, thereby sending a message across the sporting world, at last, that some things matter more than money – even in football.
Sell the lot and pay back the creditors,let them start again by all means but never in a million years should they be allowed to start off in the SPL.
Message to Super Ally,you may think your club should be treated differently but the rest of Scotland most certainly does not.
Message to Super Ally,you may think your club should be treated differently but the rest of Scotland most certainly does not.
Will be interesting to see if the Gers fans (post liquidation) are still so keen to sing God Save the Queen, given it was her tax collectors that are doing for them ;0
No way can the other clubs let a newco start in the SPL.
This would be a newco without any debt and starting off at an advantage against the other tax paying clubs.
Rangers as a club and their fans have shown absolutely no shame or apologised for cheating the British public and many small business's out of millions.
Therefor the punishment must be at LEAST 3years of community service in the lower divisions and out of Europe.
This would be a newco without any debt and starting off at an advantage against the other tax paying clubs.
Rangers as a club and their fans have shown absolutely no shame or apologised for cheating the British public and many small business's out of millions.
Therefor the punishment must be at LEAST 3years of community service in the lower divisions and out of Europe.
For the millionth time, sigh.
A new club cannot be punished, why should they be?
what on earth could a new club have done wrong?
Do not get confused with any new club and old rangers 1873.
rangers 1873, when liquidated, cease to be.
When you look up rangers 1873 in future on wiki, it wil say what they won, legally and otherwise.
Any new club can play in blue, at ibrox, their fans can sing the sash, they are not rangers, they have no history, they start afresh.
This of course all depends on them being voted in to the 3rd division, which will be no formality, e.g. Spartans may feel they are more entitled to it.
A new club cannot be punished, why should they be?
what on earth could a new club have done wrong?
Do not get confused with any new club and old rangers 1873.
rangers 1873, when liquidated, cease to be.
When you look up rangers 1873 in future on wiki, it wil say what they won, legally and otherwise.
Any new club can play in blue, at ibrox, their fans can sing the sash, they are not rangers, they have no history, they start afresh.
This of course all depends on them being voted in to the 3rd division, which will be no formality, e.g. Spartans may feel they are more entitled to it.
so if doomsday happens, who would officially be the most succesful scottish club domestically?
Rangers in liquidation Q&A
By Martin Conaghan
BBC Scotland
BBC Sport examines what comes after liquidation for Rangers after HMRC decided not to appove Charles Green's Company Voluntary Arrangement offer.
Can Rangers newco get back in to the Scottish Premier League?
When the company is liquidated, its registrations with the Scottish Football Association and the Scottish Premier League will be terminated. The new company will not automatically inherit the old registrations.
The newco would have to request a transfer of Rangers' share in the SPL. The SPL will then vote on whether to admit the newco to the top-flight. The SPL rules require eight of its member clubs to vote in favour of a share to be transfered to another company or club. This would require seven other SPL clubs to vote in favour of transfering the oldco's share to the newco, since Rangers will have a vote.
Will the SPL issue any punishments to the newco?
This has been the subject of much debate recently. The SPL decided not to vote on rules introducing punishments for a prospective newco, because the situation has not yet arisen. The SPL insists it will deal with each situation on its merits. However, it is likely that the SPL would seek to apply sanctions to a newco in an attempt to deter other clubs from following the same route. Sanctions could include a period of reduced income from media rights and sponsorship, a points decuction and restrictions on player transfers.
What if the application to transfer the SPL share is not successful?
If the SPL rejects the share transfer, the new club could then make an application to join the Scottish Football League. If successful, it would then apply for SFA membership. The new club can only apply for SFA membership when it has a competition to participate in. An opening would arise in the SFL if a club is promoted from the First Division to replace Rangers in the top flight.
All applications to the SFA are assessed on their merits. However, the SFA say any sanctions placed upon the oldco would be taken into consideration to act as a deterrent to other clubs following the same route. Additionally, the new club will not be able to participate in European competition for three years.
Who actually owns Rangers' assets?
Use accessible player and disable flyout menus
Interview - Rangers joint administrator Paul Clark
At present, Craig Whyte is the majority Rangers shareholder after Sir David Murray sold his shareholding to the Motherwell businessman for £1 in May 2011.
Whyte currently holds a floating charge over Ibrox, Murray Park and the Albion Street car park, which were transferred to Liberty Corporate Limited in April. Liberty Corporate is Rangers' parent company and its sole shareholder is another company known as Liberty Capital Limited, which is owned by Whyte and registered in the British Virgin Islands. Whyte's father, Thomas Whyte, is the sole director of Liberty Corporate.
The floating charge is not guaranteed if the club is liquidated and could be subject to a legal challenge by the appointed liquidators.
Will the players all transfer to the newco?
Under the Transfer of Undertakings (Protection of Employment) Regulations 2006, all employees have the legal right to transfer to the new employer on their existing terms and conditions of employment and with all their existing employment rights and liabilities intact.
It could prove problematic for the newco to maintain the level of wages currently being paid to players if the club's income is reduced. Similarly, employees are under no obligation to accept the terms of the transfer to the new company and can terminate their employment contracts.
Effectively, this means that when Rangers is liquidated, all current players would be free to seek new clubs and there would be no transfer fees due to the newco. However, there could be complications with player contracts under Fifa, Uefa and SFA regulations.
Can the newco buy players?
Technically, there would be no resitrictions on the new club purchasing players during allocated transfer windows as long as it holds an SFA licence.
However, the current club is under a transfer embargo for entering administration on 14 February and was also handed a 12-month transfer embargo by an SFA appeal tribunal for bringing the game into disrepute, which was set aside by the Court of Session in Edinburgh. The SFA appelate tribunal has still to meet to discuss what punishment should be handed down to Rangers.
However, the punishment would not automatically transfer to the newco - although, the SFA has said any sanctions levvied on the old club would have to be taken into consideration when assessing the newco's application for SFA membership in order to deter other clubs from following the same route.
What happens to the club's history?
The Rangers Football Club PLC is a public limited company registered in Scotland (company number: SC004276) and was incorporated on 27 May 1899. When the current company is officially liquidated, all of its corporate business history will come to an end.
When this happened to Airdrieonians in 2002, all of the trophies, titles and records associated with the club discontinued - a new club, Airdrie United FC took over. Airdieonians' official history ended in 2002, then Airdrie United's took over.
The answer lies principally in the eye of the beholder - some supporters will view the new Rangers as the same Rangers, while others will feel the old Rangers no longer exist.
By Martin Conaghan
BBC Scotland
BBC Sport examines what comes after liquidation for Rangers after HMRC decided not to appove Charles Green's Company Voluntary Arrangement offer.
Can Rangers newco get back in to the Scottish Premier League?
When the company is liquidated, its registrations with the Scottish Football Association and the Scottish Premier League will be terminated. The new company will not automatically inherit the old registrations.
The newco would have to request a transfer of Rangers' share in the SPL. The SPL will then vote on whether to admit the newco to the top-flight. The SPL rules require eight of its member clubs to vote in favour of a share to be transfered to another company or club. This would require seven other SPL clubs to vote in favour of transfering the oldco's share to the newco, since Rangers will have a vote.
Will the SPL issue any punishments to the newco?
This has been the subject of much debate recently. The SPL decided not to vote on rules introducing punishments for a prospective newco, because the situation has not yet arisen. The SPL insists it will deal with each situation on its merits. However, it is likely that the SPL would seek to apply sanctions to a newco in an attempt to deter other clubs from following the same route. Sanctions could include a period of reduced income from media rights and sponsorship, a points decuction and restrictions on player transfers.
What if the application to transfer the SPL share is not successful?
If the SPL rejects the share transfer, the new club could then make an application to join the Scottish Football League. If successful, it would then apply for SFA membership. The new club can only apply for SFA membership when it has a competition to participate in. An opening would arise in the SFL if a club is promoted from the First Division to replace Rangers in the top flight.
All applications to the SFA are assessed on their merits. However, the SFA say any sanctions placed upon the oldco would be taken into consideration to act as a deterrent to other clubs following the same route. Additionally, the new club will not be able to participate in European competition for three years.
Who actually owns Rangers' assets?
Use accessible player and disable flyout menus
Interview - Rangers joint administrator Paul Clark
At present, Craig Whyte is the majority Rangers shareholder after Sir David Murray sold his shareholding to the Motherwell businessman for £1 in May 2011.
Whyte currently holds a floating charge over Ibrox, Murray Park and the Albion Street car park, which were transferred to Liberty Corporate Limited in April. Liberty Corporate is Rangers' parent company and its sole shareholder is another company known as Liberty Capital Limited, which is owned by Whyte and registered in the British Virgin Islands. Whyte's father, Thomas Whyte, is the sole director of Liberty Corporate.
The floating charge is not guaranteed if the club is liquidated and could be subject to a legal challenge by the appointed liquidators.
Will the players all transfer to the newco?
Under the Transfer of Undertakings (Protection of Employment) Regulations 2006, all employees have the legal right to transfer to the new employer on their existing terms and conditions of employment and with all their existing employment rights and liabilities intact.
It could prove problematic for the newco to maintain the level of wages currently being paid to players if the club's income is reduced. Similarly, employees are under no obligation to accept the terms of the transfer to the new company and can terminate their employment contracts.
Effectively, this means that when Rangers is liquidated, all current players would be free to seek new clubs and there would be no transfer fees due to the newco. However, there could be complications with player contracts under Fifa, Uefa and SFA regulations.
Can the newco buy players?
Technically, there would be no resitrictions on the new club purchasing players during allocated transfer windows as long as it holds an SFA licence.
However, the current club is under a transfer embargo for entering administration on 14 February and was also handed a 12-month transfer embargo by an SFA appeal tribunal for bringing the game into disrepute, which was set aside by the Court of Session in Edinburgh. The SFA appelate tribunal has still to meet to discuss what punishment should be handed down to Rangers.
However, the punishment would not automatically transfer to the newco - although, the SFA has said any sanctions levvied on the old club would have to be taken into consideration when assessing the newco's application for SFA membership in order to deter other clubs from following the same route.
What happens to the club's history?
The Rangers Football Club PLC is a public limited company registered in Scotland (company number: SC004276) and was incorporated on 27 May 1899. When the current company is officially liquidated, all of its corporate business history will come to an end.
When this happened to Airdrieonians in 2002, all of the trophies, titles and records associated with the club discontinued - a new club, Airdrie United FC took over. Airdieonians' official history ended in 2002, then Airdrie United's took over.
The answer lies principally in the eye of the beholder - some supporters will view the new Rangers as the same Rangers, while others will feel the old Rangers no longer exist.
As a celtic fan i hope they let them back in SPL as 3 years w/o them will seriously effect us and others but they should be punished (whyte and murray castrated lol) not all hoops fans agree but how can u get excited about new season w/o old firm derby
They can't seriously vote them into the SPL and keep Ibrox , so that they will have effectively walked away from £100M Debt 
This Green bloke sounds even more deluded than all the other characters involved
This Green bloke sounds even more deluded than all the other characters involved
In reply to the original query I say let's build houses. Govan could do with houses.
knock down ibrox build houses rename murray park itwasntme park and not let them get any penalties from biased officals for 10 years. That would fair 
To "InAndOut". You must work for the Glasgow Town Planning Authority.
David Murray; Donald Findlay; Walter Smith; Alistair McCoist; The Queen of England; Prince Philip; Maggie Thatcher; Mark Hately; Andy Gorum; Sandy Jardine; Alistair Johnstone; Martin Bain; John Gregg; Mathew Lindsey; Daryl King; Daryl Broadfoot; Neil Doncaster; Stewart Reagan; Jim Traynor; Graham Spiers; Kyle Bartley; Steve Davis; Barry Ferguson; Lee McCulloch; Allan McGregor; Rino Gattiso; Nacho Novo; Alex Salmond; Jim Whyte; Charles Green; Paul Murray; Mark Dingwall; Rangers Media; RST; Follow Follow; Leggat; Vanguard Bears; Duff & Phelps; Clarke and Whitehouse; The Orange Order; The Masons…
Your Billy boys took a hell of a beating (and will continue to do so fro some time yet)......
Your Billy boys took a hell of a beating (and will continue to do so fro some time yet)......
this tickled me:
What to do if you cannot pay the VAT you owe
VAT
VAT is a tax you have collected on behalf of HMRC – it is not your money to spend. Therefore, if you using the VAT to keep your business afloat, it is worth reconsidering whether your business is worth continuing.
Even if you cannot pay the VAT, you should still submit your VAT return
There is guidance on what to do if you cannot pay your VAT on the HMRC website at http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/vat/managing/payments/problems.htm
If this is the first time you have had difficulties paying VAT, you can contact HMRC’s Business Payment Support line on 0845 302 1435.
If you miss a submission or payment deadline, HMRC can fine you a percentage of the VAT owed. The more deadlines you miss the greater the fine (surcharge) will be. If HMRC agree you have a ‘reasonable excuse’ (i.e. significant ill health problems) for submitting your return or paying your VAT late you will not have to pay a surcharge. Seehttp://www.hmrc.gov.uk/vat/managing/problems/penalties.htm for details.
Full information about the action HMRC can take to reclaim money owed to them can be found here: http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsPortalWebApp/channelsPortalWebApp.portal?...
What to do if you cannot pay the VAT you owe
VAT
VAT is a tax you have collected on behalf of HMRC – it is not your money to spend. Therefore, if you using the VAT to keep your business afloat, it is worth reconsidering whether your business is worth continuing.
Even if you cannot pay the VAT, you should still submit your VAT return
There is guidance on what to do if you cannot pay your VAT on the HMRC website at http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/vat/managing/payments/problems.htm
If this is the first time you have had difficulties paying VAT, you can contact HMRC’s Business Payment Support line on 0845 302 1435.
If you miss a submission or payment deadline, HMRC can fine you a percentage of the VAT owed. The more deadlines you miss the greater the fine (surcharge) will be. If HMRC agree you have a ‘reasonable excuse’ (i.e. significant ill health problems) for submitting your return or paying your VAT late you will not have to pay a surcharge. Seehttp://www.hmrc.gov.uk/vat/managing/problems/penalties.htm for details.
Full information about the action HMRC can take to reclaim money owed to them can be found here: http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsPortalWebApp/channelsPortalWebApp.portal?...
you deluded earls have mistaken corporate identity with a football club.just like when your own corporate identity changed your football club retained all its honours, child sex abuse and all .RANGERS FC will continue and remain the most successful club side in world football .
kind regards .
kind regards .
If this was happening in the States Whyte & Murray would already be in cuffs wearing Orange overalls.
How anyone can get away with defrauding the tax payer of £35m to £70m and still be at liberty is a national scandal.
How anyone can get away with defrauding the tax payer of £35m to £70m and still be at liberty is a national scandal.
They are still in denial.
Derek Johnstone just been on the radio saying THEY have been treated badly.
So they do not want to pay any taxes or debts.
So they do not want to be relegated to the 3rd division.
So they do not want a ban on signing players.
So they do not want a 3 year European ban.
Sounds fair to me.
Derek Johnstone just been on the radio saying THEY have been treated badly.
So they do not want to pay any taxes or debts.
So they do not want to be relegated to the 3rd division.
So they do not want a ban on signing players.
So they do not want a 3 year European ban.
Sounds fair to me.
From the Telegrah
Rangers in crisis: the final whistle sounds on Rangers’ 140 years of history
The degradation of Rangers as an institution – which for many years regarded itself as part of the Scottish Establishment – will reach its nadir on Thursday when the only surviving proposal to bring the stricken club out of administration is formally abandoned and the process of liquidation begins.
The decision was forced by Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs after a change of attitude by the taxman which spells the end of the continuity so prized by Rangers supporters, whose club was founded in 1872 and became a limited company in 1899.
As Telegraph Sport revealed soon after Rangers went into administration, HMRC sources indicated that a Company Voluntary Arrangement would not be opposed provided that there was an equitable settlement and a guarantee of no further involvement by Craig Whyte, whose use of PAYE and VAT deducted at source to pay for his cash flow tipped the club into insolvency.
There was also, Telegraph Sport understands, a degree of political pressure applied at Treasury level for HMRC not to push Rangers over the brink but when the proposals made by Charles Green – who is fronting a consortium whose members remain shadowy – were examined in detail it was felt that the payout to creditors was too low to be acceptable in a case where tax had been withheld to such an extent.
There was, in addition, the question of the club’s use of Employee Benefit Trusts which have been the subject of a tax tribunal – known as the big tax case – the decision of which has been awaited since January and which could amount to a liability of as much as £75 million.
The administrators were informed of HMRC’s decision at a lengthy meeting on Monday morning after which Green’s advisers were due to meet the tax authorities’ representatives. The second meeting was cancelled.
Rangers in crisis: the final whistle sounds on Rangers’ 140 years of history
The degradation of Rangers as an institution – which for many years regarded itself as part of the Scottish Establishment – will reach its nadir on Thursday when the only surviving proposal to bring the stricken club out of administration is formally abandoned and the process of liquidation begins.
The decision was forced by Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs after a change of attitude by the taxman which spells the end of the continuity so prized by Rangers supporters, whose club was founded in 1872 and became a limited company in 1899.
As Telegraph Sport revealed soon after Rangers went into administration, HMRC sources indicated that a Company Voluntary Arrangement would not be opposed provided that there was an equitable settlement and a guarantee of no further involvement by Craig Whyte, whose use of PAYE and VAT deducted at source to pay for his cash flow tipped the club into insolvency.
There was also, Telegraph Sport understands, a degree of political pressure applied at Treasury level for HMRC not to push Rangers over the brink but when the proposals made by Charles Green – who is fronting a consortium whose members remain shadowy – were examined in detail it was felt that the payout to creditors was too low to be acceptable in a case where tax had been withheld to such an extent.
There was, in addition, the question of the club’s use of Employee Benefit Trusts which have been the subject of a tax tribunal – known as the big tax case – the decision of which has been awaited since January and which could amount to a liability of as much as £75 million.
The administrators were informed of HMRC’s decision at a lengthy meeting on Monday morning after which Green’s advisers were due to meet the tax authorities’ representatives. The second meeting was cancelled.
celtic in the papers again ,out with the old in with the new .
http://www.martinfrost.ws/htmlfiles/scotnews09/091030-paeds.html
same old celtic .
of course this will have nothing to do with the old celtic and athletic fc and nothing to do with celtic plc 1994 .
scotlands shame involved again , " sweeping since 1884 "
rather be a tax fiddler than a kiddy fiddler
http://www.martinfrost.ws/htmlfiles/scotnews09/091030-paeds.html
same old celtic .
of course this will have nothing to do with the old celtic and athletic fc and nothing to do with celtic plc 1994 .
scotlands shame involved again , " sweeping since 1884 "
rather be a tax fiddler than a kiddy fiddler
Start a new thread if you want to talk about that. This thread is about the death of the vilest club in history.
Seriously, will anyone in Scottish, British, or World football miss these knuckle-draggers, with their bone-headed songs and vile horrendous views about a) anyone who doesn't support Newco F.C. and b)anyone of a different religious persuasion to themselves?
Has Sandy Jardine announced the details of those sanctions they were taking against other clubs yet?
Been a few weeks now, come on Sandy!
Been a few weeks now, come on Sandy!
In every programme about Rangers in the last 24hrs they have reeled out the likes of Andy(i hate dentists)Goram,Derek(i hate food)Johnstone,Gordon(i hate scoring from 12 ")Smith.
None of them have shown any remorse and have threatened action against other clubs and the SFA.
Totally deluded.
None of them have shown any remorse and have threatened action against other clubs and the SFA.
Totally deluded.
Gordon Dalziel was in great form on superscoreboard last night.
"I was stunned, but not surprised."
From the same brilliant mind that brought us "I'm not interested in facts, I'm interested in statistics."
"I was stunned, but not surprised."
From the same brilliant mind that brought us "I'm not interested in facts, I'm interested in statistics."
Neutrals finally coming round to reality.
Aberdeen, Hearts, Hibs and Dundee United supporters all want them kicked down to the Third Division.
And their outspoken opinions have dramatically raised the stakes for SPL top brass ahead of the crucial ballot.
Dons fans’ chief Greig Ingram said: “We have already made representation to chairman Stewart Milne about how we’d like to see him vote.
“We believe he should vote AGAINST a newco getting into the SPL.
“Financial considerations should not be the first thing here — they should not over-ride integrity and fair play.
“We keep hearing how financially important Rangers are to the SPL and that they should be given special consideration because of money.
“But we gave figures to the club and they were scrutinised by the chief executive, who is an accountant, and he did not take issue with them.
“It only takes 300 season ticket holders to wipe out the benefits of having Rangers in the SPL.
“The fans should be consulted by every club.
“If this was any other club than Rangers this debate would not be happening.”
Derek Watson, chairman of the Hearts Supporters’ Trust, echoed Ingram’s sentiments.
He said: “We believe very much that Rangers should be relegated from the SPL and have to work their way back through the divisions again.
“I don’t think the amount of money involved will be massively significant and I think that an SPL without Rangers would bring about more of a challenge at the top.
“Celtic would probably win the league, but the battle for second place — and possibly Champions League football — would see the crowds come back.”
Dundee United followers have already lobbied chairman Stephen Thompson over the thorny issue.
ArabTrust chairman Derek Robertson admitted his group’s attitude towards Gers has been influenced by the way they have handled themselves through the unfolding saga.
He said: “It’s been a classic example of how not to win friends and influence people.
“The whole thing has been handled terribly — a PR disaster from start to finish.
“The lack of humility has been astonishing.
“It has certainly made the mood among people very bad.
“The level of sympathy towards Rangers, because of the way they have conducted themselves, is going rapidly.
“You’d be hard pushed to find anyone who thinks a newco should be voted back in.
“A lot of that is down to their attitude — and the bully-boy tactics.”
Hibs fan chief Mike Riley agreed last night: “There is only one course they can take and that is not to allow them back into the league.
“If things are not done right then you don’t deserve to be there in the first place.
“There are a lot of clubs who can’t afford to lose the money.
“But there again, they face losing money anyway because a lot of fans have said they won’t go back to games if Rangers are involved. I honestly believe the majority of clubs will vote against Rangers.
“The whole thing has been an embarrassment for Scottish football. I can see the fallout from it dragging on for years.
“I think the majority view among the Hibs supporters is that Rangers should be punished. And punished severely.
“They have done wrong and should stand up and take whatever comes their way.
“For them to come back as a newco and go straight back into the SPL would upset a lot of people.
“I know a lot of Hibs fans who would be very unhappy if that was to be the case.”
Gers will need eight votes to stay in the top flight when SPL chairmen meet.
Inverness Caley Thistle chairman Kenny Cameron has promised to listen to his fans before casting his vote.
He said: “I would expect the SPL to call a meeting of the clubs very shortly.
“It is never good to see a Scottish club going into liquidation and it is a pity that Rangers have come to such a position.
“We will consider our position and listen to our supporters once the picture becomes clearer.”
Ross County chairman Roy MacGregor added: “Rangers need an 8-4 majority but I have no idea how the other clubs will vote because so much has happened since I went to the first meeting.
“I will listen to all the arguments for and against admitting a newco to the SPL.
“I am conscious of having to balance fair play with the financial realities of the league.
“Once I know what all the options are then I’ll think about which way to vote.
“I have only been to one SPL meeting and, I have to say, everyone left thinking the CVA would go through.
“But what has happened with HMRC has changed the goalposts dramatically.
“I’m surprised HMRC rejected the offer but they clearly want to make an example of the decisions made at the club.
“It now leaves the SPL with a huge decision to make.”
Aberdeen, Hearts, Hibs and Dundee United supporters all want them kicked down to the Third Division.
And their outspoken opinions have dramatically raised the stakes for SPL top brass ahead of the crucial ballot.
Dons fans’ chief Greig Ingram said: “We have already made representation to chairman Stewart Milne about how we’d like to see him vote.
“We believe he should vote AGAINST a newco getting into the SPL.
“Financial considerations should not be the first thing here — they should not over-ride integrity and fair play.
“We keep hearing how financially important Rangers are to the SPL and that they should be given special consideration because of money.
“But we gave figures to the club and they were scrutinised by the chief executive, who is an accountant, and he did not take issue with them.
“It only takes 300 season ticket holders to wipe out the benefits of having Rangers in the SPL.
“The fans should be consulted by every club.
“If this was any other club than Rangers this debate would not be happening.”
Derek Watson, chairman of the Hearts Supporters’ Trust, echoed Ingram’s sentiments.
He said: “We believe very much that Rangers should be relegated from the SPL and have to work their way back through the divisions again.
“I don’t think the amount of money involved will be massively significant and I think that an SPL without Rangers would bring about more of a challenge at the top.
“Celtic would probably win the league, but the battle for second place — and possibly Champions League football — would see the crowds come back.”
Dundee United followers have already lobbied chairman Stephen Thompson over the thorny issue.
ArabTrust chairman Derek Robertson admitted his group’s attitude towards Gers has been influenced by the way they have handled themselves through the unfolding saga.
He said: “It’s been a classic example of how not to win friends and influence people.
“The whole thing has been handled terribly — a PR disaster from start to finish.
“The lack of humility has been astonishing.
“It has certainly made the mood among people very bad.
“The level of sympathy towards Rangers, because of the way they have conducted themselves, is going rapidly.
“You’d be hard pushed to find anyone who thinks a newco should be voted back in.
“A lot of that is down to their attitude — and the bully-boy tactics.”
Hibs fan chief Mike Riley agreed last night: “There is only one course they can take and that is not to allow them back into the league.
“If things are not done right then you don’t deserve to be there in the first place.
“There are a lot of clubs who can’t afford to lose the money.
“But there again, they face losing money anyway because a lot of fans have said they won’t go back to games if Rangers are involved. I honestly believe the majority of clubs will vote against Rangers.
“The whole thing has been an embarrassment for Scottish football. I can see the fallout from it dragging on for years.
“I think the majority view among the Hibs supporters is that Rangers should be punished. And punished severely.
“They have done wrong and should stand up and take whatever comes their way.
“For them to come back as a newco and go straight back into the SPL would upset a lot of people.
“I know a lot of Hibs fans who would be very unhappy if that was to be the case.”
Gers will need eight votes to stay in the top flight when SPL chairmen meet.
Inverness Caley Thistle chairman Kenny Cameron has promised to listen to his fans before casting his vote.
He said: “I would expect the SPL to call a meeting of the clubs very shortly.
“It is never good to see a Scottish club going into liquidation and it is a pity that Rangers have come to such a position.
“We will consider our position and listen to our supporters once the picture becomes clearer.”
Ross County chairman Roy MacGregor added: “Rangers need an 8-4 majority but I have no idea how the other clubs will vote because so much has happened since I went to the first meeting.
“I will listen to all the arguments for and against admitting a newco to the SPL.
“I am conscious of having to balance fair play with the financial realities of the league.
“Once I know what all the options are then I’ll think about which way to vote.
“I have only been to one SPL meeting and, I have to say, everyone left thinking the CVA would go through.
“But what has happened with HMRC has changed the goalposts dramatically.
“I’m surprised HMRC rejected the offer but they clearly want to make an example of the decisions made at the club.
“It now leaves the SPL with a huge decision to make.”
A facebook poll shows that the majority of Rangers supporters AND ANY I HAVE MET want to start NEXT year in The SFL
“Celtic would probably win the league, but the battle for second place — and possibly Champions League football — would see the crowds come back.”
doubt very much that UEFA would give two champions league spaces to a one horse race.
doubt very much that UEFA would give two champions league spaces to a one horse race.
Aberdeen fans Rep:
“It only takes 300 season ticket holders to wipe out the benefits of having Rangers in the SPL.
...............................
SKY TV are today threatening to pull their 110m SPL sponsorship deal if Rangers are demoted to div 3 by other SPL clubs.
Last season Dundee Utd`s take from the SPL was 1.4m without the SKY money it would have been 200k.
Must be helluva expensive season tickets in Aberdeen if it only takes 300 to wipe out the benefits of having Rangers in the SPL. .
SKY also stated they are prepared to wait one year at most for the Old Firm derby`s to resume so it`s either SPL or Div 1.
It is clear that the majority of fans from all clubs want Gers in Div 3 so what happens next is anybody`s guess?
“It only takes 300 season ticket holders to wipe out the benefits of having Rangers in the SPL.
...............................
SKY TV are today threatening to pull their 110m SPL sponsorship deal if Rangers are demoted to div 3 by other SPL clubs.
Last season Dundee Utd`s take from the SPL was 1.4m without the SKY money it would have been 200k.
Must be helluva expensive season tickets in Aberdeen if it only takes 300 to wipe out the benefits of having Rangers in the SPL. .
SKY also stated they are prepared to wait one year at most for the Old Firm derby`s to resume so it`s either SPL or Div 1.
It is clear that the majority of fans from all clubs want Gers in Div 3 so what happens next is anybody`s guess?
The SPL clubs would rather have the collective W@NKFEST of the thought of Rangers being demoted....EVEN if that meant Armagedon to their own clubs and bye bye to SKY money.
It would be the same here if it happend to Liverpool or Man Utd.
The ideal negotating platform would be all of Rangers Sky money should be divvy up between the rest of the SPL clubs, and let Dunfermline Athletic stay up
But my advice would be for the integrity of Scottish football is to just start all over again without the old firm and just let them play in England.
It would be the same here if it happend to Liverpool or Man Utd.
The ideal negotating platform would be all of Rangers Sky money should be divvy up between the rest of the SPL clubs, and let Dunfermline Athletic stay up
But my advice would be for the integrity of Scottish football is to just start all over again without the old firm and just let them play in England.
I wonder what Celtic's odds will be to win the SPL next season.
Marxist-Leninist
Please don't use long links like your one on 13 June 00:5?
It makes the entire page unreadable on the 'new' forum.
You could either break it up into chunks by inserting spaces, or use tinyurl.com, which condenses long links into a small format that doesn't screw things up.
The reason I said 00:5? is that I can't see the full time because of the problem.
Please don't use long links like your one on 13 June 00:5?
It makes the entire page unreadable on the 'new' forum.
You could either break it up into chunks by inserting spaces, or use tinyurl.com, which condenses long links into a small format that doesn't screw things up.
The reason I said 00:5? is that I can't see the full time because of the problem.
It's actually possible that it was TheBetterBettor's pic though.
Sorry... if it´s me
if you change the "show 40 per page" to "5 per page" it will go back to normal
if you change the "show 40 per page" to "5 per page" it will go back to normal
Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs
How Ironic
All together rangers fans.
´God save our gracious Queen.....´ (but she doesn´t wanna save the rangers)
How Ironic
All together rangers fans.
´God save our gracious Queen.....´ (but she doesn´t wanna save the rangers)
Don't know. Could have been either of you.
Ultimately it's the **** forum designers' fault, not people's postings. But given that we're stuck with it, I try to change people's habits.
If it was your picture, then I don't think that there's anything you could have done short of not posting it, but long links are normally the culprit.
Ultimately it's the **** forum designers' fault, not people's postings. But given that we're stuck with it, I try to change people's habits.
If it was your picture, then I don't think that there's anything you could have done short of not posting it, but long links are normally the culprit.
that deaf dumb and blind kid sure plays a mean pinball
It even saw through me putting a couple of ** in the second time. It doesn't even do that with f*ck.
A censor with odd priorities. It really doesn't like people drinking a certain Irish beer either.
A censor with odd priorities. It really doesn't like people drinking a certain Irish beer either.
"some supporters will view the new Rangers as the same Rangers" I'd say all Rangers supporters will view them as the same Rangers. And that is why the old Rangers must be STRIPPED of the illegal titles. It is only right and fair.
liamcol
Neutrals finally coming round to reality.
Aberdeen, Hearts, Hibs and Dundee United supporters all want them kicked down to the Third Division.
What do you mean by this "neutrals"?
Where is your clubs statement?
Lawlell has went very quiet.
Aberdeen for one has been against newco from the start.
Neutrals finally coming round to reality.
Aberdeen, Hearts, Hibs and Dundee United supporters all want them kicked down to the Third Division.
What do you mean by this "neutrals"?
Where is your clubs statement?
Lawlell has went very quiet.
Aberdeen for one has been against newco from the start.
“David Murray statement: for every 5 years Craig Whyte spends in jail, I will spend 10!”
Neutrals meaning non Celtic or ex rangers fans, obviously.
Peter Lawell, and Celtic, do not have to say a thing at present.
They will have their vote, the same as the rest.
Some clubs may show a drop in income, others maybe not.
Football should be no different to any other business, pay what you can afford.
How much did Celtic pay for the following-
Ledley, Wanyama, Matthews, Hooper, Kayal, Izaguirre, Commons, Ki, Mulgrew, Forrest?
Around 8 million? in total.
How much are they worth now?
Conservative estimate- 60- 70 million?
This is the way ahead, buy young players with potential and sell them on when the right offers come in.
If Celtic can do it, so can the others.
Peter Lawell, and Celtic, do not have to say a thing at present.
They will have their vote, the same as the rest.
Some clubs may show a drop in income, others maybe not.
Football should be no different to any other business, pay what you can afford.
How much did Celtic pay for the following-
Ledley, Wanyama, Matthews, Hooper, Kayal, Izaguirre, Commons, Ki, Mulgrew, Forrest?
Around 8 million? in total.
How much are they worth now?
Conservative estimate- 60- 70 million?
This is the way ahead, buy young players with potential and sell them on when the right offers come in.
If Celtic can do it, so can the others.
12 Jun 12 15:11 Joined: 27 Jan 02 | Topic/replies: 5,852 |
I know rangers fans are saying they will be happy to go to the 3rd division, imo, they will not be playing anywhere for a year.
The new club will then be fought over between fans and venture capitalists, there might even be 2 new rangers, who each try to vie for any Scottish league place.
Yes, this is just the beginning.
mmmm, walter smith now leading a consortium, will Green step aside, with nothing? what about Craig White?
It has a long way to go yet.
I know rangers fans are saying they will be happy to go to the 3rd division, imo, they will not be playing anywhere for a year.
The new club will then be fought over between fans and venture capitalists, there might even be 2 new rangers, who each try to vie for any Scottish league place.
Yes, this is just the beginning.
mmmm, walter smith now leading a consortium, will Green step aside, with nothing? what about Craig White?
It has a long way to go yet.
Sold to Green
Now watch Smith buy it back with Mcoll
All seems a bit fishy , was this a plan from the start.Mccoll wanted to buy 2 year ago but wouldnt because the debt.So now its all panned out lovely for him he gets the club for 6 million.
Now watch Smith buy it back with Mcoll
All seems a bit fishy , was this a plan from the start.Mccoll wanted to buy 2 year ago but wouldnt because the debt.So now its all panned out lovely for him he gets the club for 6 million.
TheChaser
Thats exactly the reason that they must start in the 3rd division.
Methinks they are taking the mick.(no pun intended)
Thats exactly the reason that they must start in the 3rd division.
Methinks they are taking the mick.(no pun intended)
No brainer mate they should be in 3rd division even without the votes.Or even the lower leagues
If Spl teams vote for them to remain in Spl then they only have themselves to blame if anything like this happens again
If Spl teams vote for them to remain in Spl then they only have themselves to blame if anything like this happens again
Today`s papers saying they are looking at ways to get Gers into Scots 1st division.
SKY are willing to take a 12 month "hit" as its new 80 million TV deal kicks in next season but have warned it cannot sustain its investment without The Rangers Football Club.
This is going to cause a lot of trouble in Scottish Football.
SKY are willing to take a 12 month "hit" as its new 80 million TV deal kicks in next season but have warned it cannot sustain its investment without The Rangers Football Club.
This is going to cause a lot of trouble in Scottish Football.
Jim McColl: Why I have to save Rangers.
MILLIONAIRE entrepreneur Jim McColl and former manager Walter Smith were last night putting together a deal to take over Rangers.
The club was bought by businessman Charles Green for £5.5million yesterday as it was plunged into liquidation.
However, Mr McColl last night urged Mr Green to sell the club to his consortium, which also includes wealthy car dealership and coach hire business owner Douglas Park.
Mr McColl, a Rangers fan and one of Scotland's best-known businessmen, is lending his expertise to a bid which would see Ibrox hero Smith installed as club chairman.
He explained that he had "real concern" Mr Green's takeover would be a "re-run of what has happened before".
He added: "None of us have any confidence that it is a secure way forward for the club. We want to make sure it is in good hands, safe hands."
Mr McColl revealed his plans after another dramatic day in Rangers' 140-year history.
Mr Green's proposed company voluntary arrangement – which would have avoided liquidation – was formally rejected at a meeting at Ibrox lasting just nine minutes after HM Revenue & Customs announced it would not support it.
He then bought the club's entire assets through his "newco" firm of Sevco under a pre-arranged deal.
However, Mr McColl, who became one of Scotland's wealthiest men after building up the Clyde Blowers engineering empire, last night said: "I would like to issue a public appeal to Charles Green to strongly consider selling the club to the Walter Smith consortium.
"This would be in the best interests of Rangers, the Rangers fans, and all of Scottish football. Mr Green does not have the backing of the Rangers support and, the longer he delays, the harder the situation will become.
"I don't think he will get the fans' support or the players' support."
Referring to reports yesterday that manager Ally McCoist was to quit the club after falling out with Mr Green, Mr McColl said: "You saw the announcement about McCoist, indicating that Green was a wee bit duplicitous with him, if that's the right word. Alistair obviously had some issues."
Explaining his reasons for launching a bid to save the club, Mr McColl added: "I think there is real concern about the Charles Green bid and what might happen. A number of people have been approached by him. They feel uncomfortable about the way it is going.
"We wouldn't have come out with this if we had been comfortable, if the deal was going through, the club was being saved and everything was going to be hunky-dory. But I think there is real concern about this being a re-run of what has happened before.
"There is a real concern. The focus here is to make sure this is stabilised and safe, that is all. Rangers Football Club is far too important for Scotland, Scottish football, and Glasgow to be messed up again.
"Our bid is because the group that is involved want to make sure that it is in good hands, in safe hands.
"A number of the individuals in our group have great concerns because of their interactions with Green. The way it is going, there is not enough transparency. There is just worry, with all the club has been through. The group here has decided that something had to be done to fix this – to try to recover the situation with the club.
"The question we will be asked now is why didn't we come forward before.
"The answer is that none of us wanted to own a football club, but when we saw the way it is going, everyone has been forced to say, 'Look, we have to do something'."
Mr McColl refused to reveal how much money he was putting into the Walter Smith-led consortium, saying: "I don't want to comment about me or any of the consortium. I have no comment to make about who, or how much, or what. This is a genuine effort to support Walter Smith and the Rangers supporters to secure their club going forward."
Mr Green last night installed Malcolm Murray, a former pensions fund boss and an Ibrox season ticket holder, as chairman of Rangers and vowed the club "will rise again".
Mr Green also said he wants McCoist to remain as manager and "firmly believes he is the man to take Rangers forward."
But Rangers fans' chiefs last night urged supporters not to buy season tickets until Mr Green "steps aside" and allows Smith and Mr McColl's consortium to take control of the club.
MILLIONAIRE entrepreneur Jim McColl and former manager Walter Smith were last night putting together a deal to take over Rangers.
The club was bought by businessman Charles Green for £5.5million yesterday as it was plunged into liquidation.
However, Mr McColl last night urged Mr Green to sell the club to his consortium, which also includes wealthy car dealership and coach hire business owner Douglas Park.
Mr McColl, a Rangers fan and one of Scotland's best-known businessmen, is lending his expertise to a bid which would see Ibrox hero Smith installed as club chairman.
He explained that he had "real concern" Mr Green's takeover would be a "re-run of what has happened before".
He added: "None of us have any confidence that it is a secure way forward for the club. We want to make sure it is in good hands, safe hands."
Mr McColl revealed his plans after another dramatic day in Rangers' 140-year history.
Mr Green's proposed company voluntary arrangement – which would have avoided liquidation – was formally rejected at a meeting at Ibrox lasting just nine minutes after HM Revenue & Customs announced it would not support it.
He then bought the club's entire assets through his "newco" firm of Sevco under a pre-arranged deal.
However, Mr McColl, who became one of Scotland's wealthiest men after building up the Clyde Blowers engineering empire, last night said: "I would like to issue a public appeal to Charles Green to strongly consider selling the club to the Walter Smith consortium.
"This would be in the best interests of Rangers, the Rangers fans, and all of Scottish football. Mr Green does not have the backing of the Rangers support and, the longer he delays, the harder the situation will become.
"I don't think he will get the fans' support or the players' support."
Referring to reports yesterday that manager Ally McCoist was to quit the club after falling out with Mr Green, Mr McColl said: "You saw the announcement about McCoist, indicating that Green was a wee bit duplicitous with him, if that's the right word. Alistair obviously had some issues."
Explaining his reasons for launching a bid to save the club, Mr McColl added: "I think there is real concern about the Charles Green bid and what might happen. A number of people have been approached by him. They feel uncomfortable about the way it is going.
"We wouldn't have come out with this if we had been comfortable, if the deal was going through, the club was being saved and everything was going to be hunky-dory. But I think there is real concern about this being a re-run of what has happened before.
"There is a real concern. The focus here is to make sure this is stabilised and safe, that is all. Rangers Football Club is far too important for Scotland, Scottish football, and Glasgow to be messed up again.
"Our bid is because the group that is involved want to make sure that it is in good hands, in safe hands.
"A number of the individuals in our group have great concerns because of their interactions with Green. The way it is going, there is not enough transparency. There is just worry, with all the club has been through. The group here has decided that something had to be done to fix this – to try to recover the situation with the club.
"The question we will be asked now is why didn't we come forward before.
"The answer is that none of us wanted to own a football club, but when we saw the way it is going, everyone has been forced to say, 'Look, we have to do something'."
Mr McColl refused to reveal how much money he was putting into the Walter Smith-led consortium, saying: "I don't want to comment about me or any of the consortium. I have no comment to make about who, or how much, or what. This is a genuine effort to support Walter Smith and the Rangers supporters to secure their club going forward."
Mr Green last night installed Malcolm Murray, a former pensions fund boss and an Ibrox season ticket holder, as chairman of Rangers and vowed the club "will rise again".
Mr Green also said he wants McCoist to remain as manager and "firmly believes he is the man to take Rangers forward."
But Rangers fans' chiefs last night urged supporters not to buy season tickets until Mr Green "steps aside" and allows Smith and Mr McColl's consortium to take control of the club.
Have to laugh at McColl.
"A number of the individuals in our group have great concerns because of their interactions with Green. The way it is going, there is not enough transparency.
..........................................
Mr McColl refused to reveal how much money he was putting into the Walter Smith-led consortium, saying: "I don't want to comment about me or any of the consortium. I have no comment to make about who, or how much, or what.
wtf
"A number of the individuals in our group have great concerns because of their interactions with Green. The way it is going, there is not enough transparency.
..........................................
Mr McColl refused to reveal how much money he was putting into the Walter Smith-led consortium, saying: "I don't want to comment about me or any of the consortium. I have no comment to make about who, or how much, or what.
wtf
On the betting front had a tickle at York in the 5.15
Ginger Ted win / load the place.
At around 14/1 he looks a decent enough proposition if they can bring him back to some sort of form.
Ginger Ted win / load the place.
At around 14/1 he looks a decent enough proposition if they can bring him back to some sort of form.
I agree Shuda they are typical businessmen trying to portray themselves as normal fans.
Rangers will not be in the SPL fixture list published on Monday.
We dont give a fk Nobby we will take what comes our way m8.
I have nothing against Rangers as a football club. I just think the previous owners need to be in custody facing a long time in jail for tax evasion.
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