How many goals would Messi get in EPL?

If you cant compare leagues, compare the champions league.  32 goals in 31 games over three years against all comers.

He would score hatfuls here.  How many would he have got v that wolves defence today?

Playing in a good side (which he would do if he came to the Prem), he'd get around 50 goals in a season IMO.

Anyone who has seen young Lionel play in his last 10 matches and doesn't recognise that he is the greatest striker ever knows **** about football. FACT.

Hes hardly 'a striker' Nobby, but you are along the right lines.

Jam you clearly know **** about football. FACT.

You claim Messi is a 'striker' yet say I know **** about football.

Strange.

Aguero has got about 15/16 league goals so far in his first season.

Since Messi is about 1000x as good as him, I think Messi would get 30+ goals.

How else would you describe someone who just hit 5 goals in a Champions League match?

It's a little simplistic to imagine a striker must always be on the shoulder of the last defender. Next time you watch Barca take a look at what young Lionel is doing while his team mates nonchalantly knock the ball about. he is constantly doing nothing other than staying away from the ball looking to be ignored, looking for space.

When the ball is played in Messi appears as if from nowhere. Unseen he got a run on the defence. That is the work of a striker.

How many times did you see Paul Scholes in yards of space around the 6 yard box?

Nobby he is not a striker and is more or less given a free role and gets involved in the build up with Xavi and Iniesta or plays out wide as much as he does playing on the defenders shoulder.

Hope this helps your understanding of the game.

Jam as I said you know **** so no point in replying.

But you just did reply.

Calm down and at least try to make a sensible post.

always an argument on every thread, kids these days

Ronaldo must be the better player because he scores more goals in La Liga than Messi does.


Problem solved

rio n jt twice a year so 70

Return Of Dawsy
Date Joined: 21 Jul 09
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18 Mar 12 15:02
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no way, he would struggle to score in this league.

25 max.



If he was to sign for United he would clearly be on the bench more times than not, so expect 10 goals tops.

Messi has been moulded into that Barca team. He needs players within 10 yards of him all the time. Those players more often than not will provide him with the space he needs to shoot or create a goal scoring opportunity for himself. Messi is a special players just like Rooney and Ronaldo. Special players can adapt themselves to suit any league.

In light of the Messi - Greatest Footballer Programme. Who would everyone rather in their team, Ronaldo or Messi?

My vote goes to Ronaldo. Football is about winning.

Messi, is th

Messi is not a striker ,Barcelona don't really have any.

He is maybe the best finisher ever though .

I doubt he would threaten Dixie Dean's record if he played in England .

He would score fewer, partly as he would not play in a dominant team, partly due to the negativity of the managers. No coaches like McLeish in Spain.

messi is the best player ever - FACT. How many goals would he score in the EPL, a few more than he does in La Liga and lets face it that League, is streets ahead of the EPL. Man Utd likely League Champions, this year, were absoloutly slaughtered in both games, against mid table Athletic Bilbao, from La Liga, so forget about that League being a 2 team League, it has far more depth than our League, although only Barca or R/Madrid are likely to win that League.

i wonder how many he would actually get on a damp ,drizzly ,dark, chilly , Tuesday night at Stoke in Decemeber with the wind blowing in a NNW direction and the crowd throwing greasy hot dogs onto the pitch

Mar 18, 2012 -- 4:46PM, Latinquarter wrote:

He wouldn't score as many as people think, and my reason is a simple one:In Spain goal difference doesnt count to determine league position, so teams can lose 8-0 without any consequences, so what often happens in Spain, is that once a team is 2 or 3 down, they just throw in the towel. If Spain scrapped this silly head to head rule for teams level on points, i think you would find teams would have to try harder, if it meant that 8-0 home drubbing counted for something.  So in England, where teams know goal difference mattered, they wouldnt just surrender at 2-0, and invite Messi to score when he felt like it.

This, sort of. I think he would be competing with Van Persie. No better.

totally agree with you there.. :)

How many of the people posting on this thread watch Messi week in week out?

I'm guessing I might be the only person here who has seen all his La Liga & CL games this season. To compare RVP to Messi is a joke.

Van Persie, is a good player, but with the sort of football Arsenal play, Messi would comfortably exceed 50, his all round game is fantastic. Watch some of the goals he scores they are unbeleivable at times. I am comfortable over 50 and even Pele, is behind Messi in the all time great players, since I've been alive.

Coachbuster's hit the nail on the head.

Messi & Ronaldo score similar amounts of goals in La Liga - fact!

Ronaldo won the golden boot in the EPL the season before he left for Madrid - fact!

Ronaldo was the first player to score more than 30 goals since Shearer in 96'.

So if Messi can keep pace with Ronaldo in La Liga there is no doubt in my mind he could transfer that to the EPL.

Messi would break 20 goals every season, in a good season he would get to 30 and beyond.

Mar 18, 2012 -- 8:31PM, NobbyClarke wrote:

How many of the people posting on this thread watch Messi week in week out?I'm guessing I might be the only person here who has seen all his La Liga & CL games this season. To compare RVP to Messi is a joke.

Just because you are a better player doesn't mean you will score more. Messi might get 30 goals and 30 assists therefore Van Persie gets 30 goals 0 assists. I just don't think he would get a goal a game like he does in Spain.

70/80 a season

Mike-lfc I suggest you go actually watch Messi play.

OKAY.  I GIVE UP!!!!!!

HOW MANY GOALS WOULD MESSI GET IN EPL?

Messi would never play in the Premiership as he has stated that he does not believe that tackles should be allowed in football.However give it a few years and they might be outlawed.That is why he is not fit to lace the boots of the former greats.How many goals would George Best for example score in La liga today ? In fact how many goals would he score in the Premiership ? Ronaldo is better than Messi today just as Real Madrid are better than Barcelona.But conditions are so easy for the flair players today compared to in the past.

Messi would stroll it in the premier league as he has shown every time he has met the top English clubs in europe.

The idea that he couldnt handle the physical side of the league is just a farce, if anything the technique he brings would be nothing those big lumps of defenders had seen before.

He would run riot.

Mar 18, 2012 -- 9:00PM, NobbyClarke wrote:

Mike-lfc I suggest you go actually watch Messi play.

Whatever you say mate. He would score 100 goals a season.

it depends who he played for.

wigan ? maybe 5.

another supid hypothetical question that has become the norm on here

100% confident he would get over 20 goals playing for Wigan.

As for one of the top two over 50 goals in a season.

JamDav1982
18 Mar 12 20:15 Joined: 03 Jul 04 | Topic/replies: 3,334 | Blogger: JamDav1982's blog
100% confident he would get over 20 goals playing for Wigan.

As for one of the top two over 50 goals in a season.
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Seek help...PLEASE....

the defending in lol liga is shambolic, not as strong as epl. he didnt score against english oppostion in europe for a number of games.

playing for arsenal or utd he would get bundles. hard to say the exact amount, think 50 is bit ambitious.

Defending in La Liga shambolic?

HAve you been watching the premier league defences this season?

Worst of all the top leagues in europe defensively.

So Messi not scoring against English team at the start of his career makes the Prem strong defensively?

Are you just choosing to ignore his six goals in four games against Arsenal and his two goals in two champions league finals against Man Utd.

The fact that Aguero, Mata and Silva are handling the prem easy enough suggests it isnt far ahead of La Liga.

132

Drug testing is much more rigorous in the epl compared to la liga ,a player with Messi's history of steroids and HGH would make Rio look clean...

Poor attempt dashero.

276?

i still stand by my comments. the defending is similar to the dog & duck pub team down the road.
it really is laugh out loud stuff.

14.

high_lander
18 Mar 12 15:57
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The best way to judge Messi is when he is playing for Argentina, they are a top class International side but they don't dominate in the way that Barcelona do. Messi often looks very average for Argentina. He never dominates international matches, like he does with the backing of his Barca team mates. If Only Iniesta and Xavi played for Argentina. If only...

I must look out for your posts going forward. You are a shrewd one. I have done this to death with Jam, good luck.

Messi is without doubt different gravy  but the number of people that under estimate the support framework he gets for barcelona is incredible.

I remember him scoring a great goal against 10 man madrid late in the game, a solo dribble last year and comments to the effect of thats why he's number one and messi is barcelona etc etc...people failed to factor in that part of the reason he was able to do that was because madrid had been chasing shadows all game because barcelona keep the ball so well, particularly for the last 30mins with 10 men. A small example but there are countless others.

In xavi and iniesta in particular he has the perfect platform. You only need look at the contrast in him as a player for argentina. Gets far less quality ball in quality areas and often looks like he's dribbling too much..the reality more like the opposition have not been pulled apart as much so his dirbbles are less successful. etc

1224.

Roy Keane - 'Messi best player ever and La Liga best in the world'

Real R0y Keane and not the betfair forum member.

jamdav if you think Messi would score 70/80goals in the Premier league then you are clearly on some kind of substance yourself.Fact is the Premier League is going through a lull as teams are attempting to rebuild.These things always happen in Europe and if the alleged "fair play" from FIFA ever gets put into place (no chance whatsoever) then Barcelona and Real Madrid will never be seen again in the Champions League in my lifetime.Their debts and spending make Man City and Chelsea look like well run clubs.

homefortea - Another one that doesnt understand the Financial Fair Play rules.

They will benefit the likes of Man Utd, Real Madrid and Barcelona more than anyone else.

Go and read up on it.

Is this like a game of Trumps?

Can I join in?

Yes the 'Fair Play' is likely to consolidate the top teams position, as they will generate massive revenue from 80,000 stadia and merchandising.

If a Billionare takes over at Everton or Seville they will not be able to spend what they want.

jam you sir, are a whopper

He has scored 8/16  v Premier Lg teams .

That was against the best of the premier league, and the teams he played in the early part of the run were far stronger than english teams today.

So you'd think he would go over a goal a game.

Though it is a small sample.

r0y why u always trolling messi threads?

There is only one La Liga player who can score 30+ goals a season in the EPL and he has already proved he can do that when he used to play for United.

Though thats assuming a season of  Barcelona v EPL . 40+ more than likely, so much the same as in Spain.

Jam is deluded.Real Madrid and Barcelona owe so much to the banks that their debts will never be recovered.They will be written off like so much Spanish Debt.If it was called in then the fans would go ballistic !! Contrary to Man Utd whose debt is being paid off via the US model, but if it was not there would make Man Utd the richest player in the game and make the Spanish clubs look like Bolton or Wigan...

Remember Messi is not a striker

depends who he was playing for and what position.

If he played wide ahead of j oshea ala ronaldo doubt he gets double figures tbh

He has scored 8/16  v Premier Lg teams .

That was against the best of the premier league, and the teams he played in the early part of the run were far stronger than english teams today.

Nonsense, a lot of these games were when he was 18/19. Why don't use Ronaldo when he was a youngster at United and cite it as proof that he wouldn't be able to do it these days as he lacks end product.

He would destroy some teams on his own and on a good team he would be scoring at the rates of Ronaldo's and Henry's probably even more.

barca would beat teams like wolves about 12-0

They would put 5 or 6 past teams a lot higher up the division then Wolves.

R0y is there anything on this forum you have ever been proved right about?

How does it feel that even your hero would think you are a clue less mug?

Squigs  i  wasn't saying he wouldn't score loads . My stat was in his favour

8/16 v teams that are stronger than today's premier league would mean 40/50 in 38 games v the current teams

You are aware im sure he would not be playing with barcelona?

Wow, mugmerised taking his meds tonight. Some good points. Doubt you wil penetrate the whopper's skull though.

I reckon if you offered the choice of Messi and Ronaldo to every manager in the PL, most of them would take Ronaldo because he would be the more potent in a more physical league.  Wenger, Martinez and Rodgers would probably plump for Messi though

A few point mesmirised -

1.  Messi isnt over protected in La Liga he gets brought down cynically more than any other player in the world and in particular the games against Madrdid are brutal.
Is Messi protected in the CL as well? Where his goalscoring record is actually better than in La Liga?

2. Please sont use Stoke as a reference point for which technical players couldnt handle the physical game.
Valencia reserves went to Stoke and played them off the park and were unlucky not to win by more than one. The big physical Stoke players couldnt handle the smaller technical players.

3 The current Man Utd style would not suit Mess to the same degree as this Barcelona side but then again the passing game of Barcelona wouldnt suit Ronaldo.
But the point is that all teams who sign Messi or Ronaldo would play to their strengths and wouldnt carry on playing a style that doesnt suit them.
Man Utd would change their style a bit to suit him and would get the best out of him.

R0y keane, you've been in my pocket for the last 17 months as my intellectual inferior, start talking sense and I might start to acknowledge some of your good points/posts - although tbf I'd have to dig hard to find them inh te minefield of dross you post.


JamDav1982     18 Mar 12 22:01 
R0y is there anything on this forum you have ever been proved right about?
How does it feel that even your hero would think you are a clue less mug

in the*

Mugmerised you are fast growing on me sir. A true mug.

Roy, get lost you plum, you have about as much credence as Eddie the Eagle applying for a job as a ski coach. The most delusional united fans known to man - and I've met a fair few of them - in London.

muppet.

high_lander 18 Mar 12 15:57 
The best way to judge Messi is when he is playing for Argentina, they are a top class International side but they don't dominate in the way that Barcelona do. Messi often looks very average for Argentina. He never dominates international matches



You must've missed his internationals this season then.

highlander thinks that Argentina have 'world class players in every position'.

I have gone through it with him on another thread and asked him to name this world class defence and midfield but he avoids it.

He doesnt have a clue and constantly brings out tired cliches that he can never back up.

messi has dominated games in friendlies, but in a world cup where it matters - and he's played in two, I've yet to see it so he has a point.

If RVP has got over 25 and Rooney has 20, then i think it's fair to say Messi would easily match them, if not better. People say la liga defences are sh*te, and they mostly are, but the likes of Blackburn and Wigan and that Wolves defence today are not exactly rock solid.

Someone made a good point earlier, if you're discrediting his goal record in la liga because of the defences then just look at his CL record instead. He scores in almost every game against the best teams in Europe. If he can do that then he's hardly going to struggle against QPR and Bolton!!

Mar 19, 2012 -- 1:31AM, mesmerised wrote:

messi has dominated games in friendlies, but in a world cup where it matters - and he's played in two, I've yet to see it so he has a point.

Messi will be the same age Maradona was when he won a WC in 2014 I think

Messi has played in two - one where he was eighteen, started one game and didnt play any part in the game they got eliminated.

The last world cup he didnt get the goals or direct assists but was easily one of the best players up until the quarter final. The game against Germany he could do nothing about due to a lunatic in charge that put out a defence and midfield that was of mid table EPL quality at best.

He was nominated as one of the players of the tournament at that World Cup, yet everyone seems to have it drilled in their heads that he was poor.

He was very good through the tournament but did play poorly v Germany.

He could not be blamed for the defensive/tactical failings but he did get plenty of the ball and was wasteful/ineffectual.

Messi will be the same age Maradona was when he won a WC in 2014 I think

fair point
____________

I think JamDav is on a mission to disagree with everything I post tonight

Until he dominates and takes control of a world cup like Maradona - the debate will always be there, what Maradona did by all accounts was something special, like Pele winning the World Cup at 17 and a further two from the next 3

The comparison with Maradona will be there but Maradona had six international tournaments and excelled in one of them.

What Maradona also had was a very solid side that gave him a platform to perform. No player has ever or will ever win the World Cup single handedly without that.

Will Messi ever have a world cup like Maradona? Its unlikely for various reasons but then again Maradona never did the things that Messi has done in terms of club football and individual accolades.

Playing with the Barcelona squad he would get 70+ easily

Playing with the top 2 (Man City or Man Utd) he would get around 45

Oh really, so he didn't turn an average Napoli side in to serie A winners?

If Maradona had players like Xavi and Iniesta along side him at club level, he'd thrive just as much I'm sure.

Point will always remain, he can be lauded until his dying day as the greatest, but if he never has a great world cup, the '?' will always remain.

I have nothing against him, I love watching him play, but as for the greatest? still very debatable and there is no clear winner in that repsect.

As for how many goals he could score in the EPL, comes down to opinion and never fact - until the day he chooses to leave Barca and play here - I doubt I'll ever see that, do I think he'd score over 30 for example? like I said before in my post that was strangely deleted, it's not clear cut, put a gun to mu head and I'd say no though, simply because despite you claiming he gets hacked every week in La Liga - he simply doesn't, I watch La Liga more than the Prem, I just find it more enjoyable than listening to everyone here crowing and hying our own league - and I can tell you apart from the Madrid games which have indeed been brutal, players more often than not - leave messi alone in terms of tough tackling, put him the EPL, I wonder how long he'd last against  the much more uncompromising English defending teams, all remains to be seen, and nothing here is fact - only opinion in terms of the initial question. As for the champions league record, he's only played against the top English clubs that carry more flair - put him up against more rugged sides week in week out - something he's never experienced and who knows.

Night.

Without a doubt Messi and Ronanldo are the 2 best club players in the world, both score goals for fun at times. If Messi transfered over on mass with the entire Barcelona team he would score as many goals as he does in Spain. But coming over here on his own i think he would score as many as say Rooney or Van Persie though he is a better player than both. Messi would not play every week he would be kept for the big games and the Champions League, i doubt he would play against Wolves, Wigan, Blackburn etc but be rested.Pretty much as Aguero is rotated with Balatelli and Dzeko, or Rooney, Hernandez and Wellbeck.With our season being longer he might spend quite a time on the bench.

dont really want to get involved in the debate but just thought i would add something that i saw last year, maybe the year before. barca cruising against one of the lower league teams in stoppage time messi had the ball by the half way line took on 2 players and then got mullered and was stretchered off, had a pretty nasty injury to his ankle. it annoyed me as the game was already won and was in stoppage time and he was by the half way line so really no need for it to happen. i havent seen alot of la liga so maybe messi doesnt get taken out that often but i did see that one event which there was no need for which could have endangered one of the greatest ever players to grace the games career, i definately wouldnt have liked to have been in the players shoes who made the tackle if the injury to messi was anymore severe, i wouldnt be able to live with myself.

The '6' international tournaments is a bit misleading for Maradona , as the Copa America was a Carling Cup (being generous to it) in those days.

He played in 4 World Cups, played about as well as Messi has in WCs in '82 , before being eliminated by very strong teams who had players who not only were prepared to foul, but were intent on injuring him .

'86 nothing needs saying .

'90 lead an awful (by 'big nation' WC standards, to The Final)

'94 Was -despite supposedly being finished at 34 -looking as good as anyone in the tournament until thrown out for using cocaine, which was unlikey to have assisted his performances IMO.

His International Career was of course vastly superior to Messi's.

For  Club level, Jamdav will say - rightly - that Napoli were not an average team at all, but they were not anywhere near as strong as Milan, but still finished above them 2/3 years  , which would have been 3/3 but for an improbable late turnaround in 1988. Maradona won 2 titles in maybe the strongest league in football history, where even teams in 6th/7th had players that would be worth £30M in today's money.

European Cup level ,Messi clearly miles ahead , and arguably has played better than anyone in the competitons history .Though the format in Maradona's day (and unlucky draws) did not give him much chance.

maybe maradonna wasnt in the best side but that does not mean that it was completely down to him or even his side at all why they won the league. look at man city this year, easily the best and strongest team in the league, if man u win the league this year, which will most likely happen, will people be saying that ashley young or nani (just for an example) are world class players who should be hailed as greats of the game and carried them to a title over a much stronger team    i think not. i am not downplaying how good maradonna as i know ill probably be getting some jip for saying that im just merely stating that it is not always the best and strongest team that wins the league. also you say players in lower teams worth towards £30m when maradonna was at napoli, what about david villa, david silva, aguero, llorente, mata just to name a few who have moved for similar money recently or are valued at around that figure.

With regard to the perennial Maradona question.

I wonder what percentage of forumites have watched (live or TV) him play more than a dozen 90min games?

Not many Poppydog .

I think a few World cup games and a handful of Serie A and that's about it .

'94 Was -despite supposedly being finished at 34 -looking as good as anyone in the tournament until thrown out for using cocaine, which was unlikey to have assisted his performances IMO.

Not quite true Tobermory, he was thrown out as ephedrine was found in a drugs test.  This was (according to Maradonna in his autobiography)  given to him by his personal trainer in a sports nutrition drink however the U.S version contained the chemical while the Argie version didn't.

I do remember many people saying he was on Coke then after his wild eyed celebration against the Greeks though so can see why you might have thought that

By 94 he was finished ,that performance against a very weak Greek side was underwhelming tbf

Little things like (quick checking Wiki), were all Argentina's games on the TV in Mexico '86 - some kicking off at mid-late evening our time and clashing with other KO's?

Did people watch (or was it even on?) Arg v Hungary, when Scotland (Narey screamer) v Brazil was on exactly the same time during Spain '82

and I'm sure we didn't watch the 80s Copa Americas, where some lasted several months and weren't tournements

i don't remember much hoo-ha around Maradonna in 82, he wasn't regarded as the worlds best at that point - plus he was Argentinian .

We were more excited about Brazil .

The guy had his finest moments in 86 ,in 1990 he played well but didn't win many hearts

1990 shows Argentina somehow scrambled to the Final with an awful statistic of 2 wins from 7 matches

1990 shows Argentina somehow scrambled to the Final with an awful statistic of 2 wins from 7 matches.

but they beat Brazil in the last 16,knocked out Italy in the semis  and lost to Germany in the final.only the 3 most successful teams in world cup history.
Just shows how you can twist stats to suit your own agenda.

"There are lies, there are damn lies, and then there are statistics"

I know his form for Argentina isnt great, and id expect it to be much lower. The barcelona midfield is literally feeding him half his goals, though the other half probably comes from his own skill.

I'd say 30 goals in 38 matches.


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tobermory are you trying to make out that Maradona had good tournaments in 1990 and 1994?

1994 nothing needs to be said as it was a non event of a tournament due to his own fault.

1990 - so he dragged a poor team to the final did he? Please tell me what game other than the Brazil QF the he played well in.

So many myths about Maradona 'dragging average sides to victory'. Its simply not true.