Fair play to rafa benitez....

and alaves in one

and alaves in one

Alves*

obv not as high up as sir gary in his prime though im sure

well im not sure how good he is defensively but the geeer looked the most potent attacking weapon on the field from right back a hard task to be sure

Another flat track bully full back. Birmingham offered absolutely nothing down Liverpool's right and gave Johnson free reign to bomb on whenever he wanted to, which completely played to his strengths. Stronger opposition with a left sided midfielder who is a real threat and forces Johnson to respect him have exposed his shombolic defending in the past and will do so again regularly.

Same thing with Dani Alves. He's a worse defender than Johnson but looks great at home to poor sides who are unable to offer any attacking threat to him. Alves being ruled out of the Champions League final was one of the most important factors in Barcelona winning it. If Alves had played Ferguson would have played Ronaldo wide left and prevented Alves from getting forward, Ronaldo would have destroyed him. Puyol playing right back was a massively important facet of that match, and it wouldn't have happened but for Alves being ruled out. Not saying United would have won necessarily, but it would have been a very different game. Funny how football works....

not having that flat track bully thang, he has been excellent all season to be fair to the guy.

going forward, he's top class - good enough to play as a winger.

when it comes to defending, he's a mid-table player.

certainly looks better value than Valencia

Well he's not been excellent all season has he. Was he excellent in the Holland - England match at the beginning of the season where he was absolutely destroyed defensively? Or the home game against Villa when Ashley Young had a field day? He's looked good going forward in a lot of games, I'm not disputing that. But he's supposed to be a right back. You cannot tell me he truly played right back tonight. He spent the majority of the game in attacking mode, except of course when he was playing Benitez onside for the equaliser.

tobermory 10 Nov 01:09
certainly looks better value than Valencia

seriously?!?!

both overpriced, but cannot say johnson looks a better value purchase.

Well i was very suprised at the Valencia deal . I never thought he even stood out in the Wigan team.

Nothing i've seen of him for United changes my view . No Composure , takes wrong options , doesn't seem to beat defenders much, whats the point of him

not that i thought the Johnson deal was smart business btw, but as R0y says , he has looked Liverpool's best player in several's games already.

wtf did i put an apostrophe there for

Valencia didn't have the best of starts at United but has started to look like the class player he was at Wigan recently to me. Can't believe you said he didn't stand out at Wigan, I can only assume you didn't watch them very often. I have a strong feeling that long term he will be a central midfielder rather than a wide player.

tbh i didn't watch them very often , but i must have seen them 6 or 7 times last season and it never occured to me they had any players that the Big 4 would want in their 11

I thought they had four prior to last January - Valencia, Palacios, Cattermole and Figueroa all looked to have top four potential to me. Palacios obviously went to Spurs so that's his top four hopes dead for a while but I do think he'd cut it at that level, Cattermole followed Steve Bruce to Sunderland, and trust me, he'll play for England sooner rather than later and will end up at a top club in a couple of years, so now Figueroa is the only one of the four still at Wigan. He's a better full back than some of those playing for top four clubs currently. Class act.

I'd be very suprised if Cattermole makes an International , more so if he makes Big 4 level!

fair play to you if you get that right :)

I'll be right - combative midfield players mature with age. You very rarely see a dominant defensive midfield player at 21 years old. If he improves at anywhere near the rate you'd expect from a 21 year old footballer he's going to become a real class act. Consider that Fletcher, with all the superstars he has around him, has taken to until the age of 25 to grow into that role at United, up until the middle of last season the vast majority of people were unconvinced he'd be a United regular. Cattermole is producing performances at, or close to, that level at 21. It's so rare for a player in that role. He's a future international waiting to happen.

tbh i thought he was about 24/35 , seems to have been around a long time

*24/25

RMB doesn't aftertime 10 Nov 01:19
Valencia didn't have the best of starts at United but has started to look like the class player he was at Wigan recently to me. Can't believe you said he didn't stand out at Wigan, I can only assume you didn't watch them very often. I have a strong feeling that long term he will be a central midfielder rather than a wide player.

Wtf...with pace like that? You are having an absolute shocker here RMB.

The boy has all the raw assets to becoem a top wide man under the mentorship or sir alec

Johnson has been good for liverpool so far, and as pointed out his defending is not as good as his forward play, he would never imo make a decent winger, as his thought process and actual consitent control of the ball is not up to it, but as an attacking full back he is currently up there with the best in the prem, and no he is not yet as good as gary neville was over aperiod of time

You're telling me that a footballer has to play wide rather than centrally purely due to possessing excellent pace? That's just not correct. Watch Valencia when he plays for Ecuador and he tucks in from the left hand side, he has a far greater influence on games. The same occured at Wigan, he was more effective when coming inside than when hugging the touchline. He is doing well for United in his current role, but he has all the attributes to become a central midfielder should he/Fergie ever wish to do this, perhaps that will never be the case, I was merely speculating.

Also r0y, you really ought to avoid telling people they're "having a shocker" just because they have a view that differs from your own. That's a very unattractive trait in a human being.

I challenge you to name 3 center mids with the sort of pace that valencia posessesse center mid at the top level.

^its not a coincidence. The defence rests your honour.

ffs

Agreed looks another fine purchase by the greatest.

Hope Terrys mouth isnt still hurting after he elbowed this honest lasd in the head.

Utd fans really think Valencia has done as well as Johnson this season?

Blimey.

Johnson looks a quality buy, no mileage in comparing him to a different player, in a different team who plays a different role.

I am sure Liverpool fans will be happy with Johnson, i'm certainly happy so far with Valencia.

The 2 things aren't mutually exclusive.

potential is there. valencia reminds me of kan kan

Agree entirely Digby. Just surprised that some Utd fans felt so on this thread.

Gerrard, Essien, Xavi, there's three central midfielders that possess excellent pace. Would you have ever believed Ryan Giggs would play a role in central midfield ten years ago? Valencia has the ability to do so. If his manager believes that his pace is currently required in a wide role then so be it, but that pace will not always be with him. It's just an opinion r0y, please don't be so desperate to prove people wrong. It's a sign of insecurity.

None of the above have pace like valencia.

Gerrard has a surge that prob makes him the quickest of the 3 and its no surprise to see his best position is arguably not in center mid.

Im just saying you're having a shocker cos you are. Valencia has displayed next to nothing that suggests he's going to be anything other than a wide player.

p.s. xavi is not fast (inesta is quicker for example), neither are rapid ala valencia.

I mean not to offend. Just educate

R0y, you have a terribly simplistic view of football which is why you hold Andy Gray in high regard. Just consider for a moment that perhaps your opinions are opinions rather than facts and then maybe those who are worth discussing football with will afford you more time. For "having a shocker" see your Foster and Berbatov threads. For having an opinion and expressing it eloquently, whether you agree with it or not, see RMB DA's, Live Forever's, maverick's etc etc.

Roffle,

Ronka my view is far from simplistic and In the long run 95% of my views are dare i say nailed on correct on the game. Some of these geezers are relatively clueless on the game.

You just dont convert someone like valencia with his raw assets into a bloody center mid. Its obvious. Next

RMB doesnt aftertime, respect fella...first time in ages i've read someone on the footy forum who actually interested me with what they are saying.

Think you're a little harsh on Johnson, though. Any full back who is encouraged to press on to the extent that he is is going to be found out defensively at times. He can't be in two places at once and it's up to the likes of Mascherano to provide cover. I think the fact the rest of the Lpool defence has been unsettled this season has made it harder for him to setlle in in terms of knowing when to stick or twist.

There you go again, R0y. A hopeless case, sadly.