Cricket
Welcome to Live View – Take the tour to learn more
Start Tour
There is currently 1 person viewing this thread.
30 Jul 15
23:45
Joined:
Date Joined:
28 Jun 10
As an occasional dipper in and out of test cricket these days I'd have thought that England would have been thankful they had a bowler of his height who could whip the ball down in excess of 90mph and with an enviable strike rate in tests. From what I had seen in the past he looked dangerous when he hit his straps and I'd have thought any team would be happy to have that kind f player to call on. It seemed he was a wicket taker who will occasionally have bad spells and I remember thinking at the time when he got a bit of stick in the test which caused him to be dropped that he seemed to be being set up to fail given that there didn't seem much in the pitch for him.
Do others see anything in that or was he too wayward and he's made some requested adjustments?
Do others see anything in that or was he too wayward and he's made some requested adjustments?
Show More
After The Typhoon he's the fastest player to 50 wickets by tests played in the English game. A player like that is gold dust. You nurture him but I suspect he was handled badly and suffered as a result.
he was handled appallingly.
he didn't conform to Flower's stunted dogma around conserving runs to get wickets, rather than bowling well.
and then when he started hitting the stumps with his leg and it being called firstly a dead then a no ball, Saker decided that he needed to remodel his action.
slowly, his lovely smooth action, was torn to pieces, his confidence shredded, and the final humiliation came when Cook was too much of a coward to give him the new ball in australia's 2nd innings at trent bridge in 2013, waiting until much later in the piece when all the nip had gone from the ball on a pudding of a wicket. Had Cook and Flower not been such yellow-bellied incompetents they would have talked him up and let him bowl on the much quicker Lord's wicket the following test, but he was dropped.
Things got worse as he tried to fix something that was never broken culminating in his being unselectable by the winter of 2013/2014.
He has been appallingly treated, and was utterly wrecked by Flower and Saker. It has taken two years of him and his county fixing away from England and regaining his confidence on the county circuit.
It is one of the biggest scandal and mismanagement of Flower's tenure, but once again nothing is said, with KP providing a lovely smoke screen.
I'm delighted he's back. He has the potential to be a genuinely great bowler (a different league to Anderson and Broad) and that he's come through such appalling mismanagement and treatment is more a celebration for me, than england winning this test.
he didn't conform to Flower's stunted dogma around conserving runs to get wickets, rather than bowling well.
and then when he started hitting the stumps with his leg and it being called firstly a dead then a no ball, Saker decided that he needed to remodel his action.
slowly, his lovely smooth action, was torn to pieces, his confidence shredded, and the final humiliation came when Cook was too much of a coward to give him the new ball in australia's 2nd innings at trent bridge in 2013, waiting until much later in the piece when all the nip had gone from the ball on a pudding of a wicket. Had Cook and Flower not been such yellow-bellied incompetents they would have talked him up and let him bowl on the much quicker Lord's wicket the following test, but he was dropped.
Things got worse as he tried to fix something that was never broken culminating in his being unselectable by the winter of 2013/2014.
He has been appallingly treated, and was utterly wrecked by Flower and Saker. It has taken two years of him and his county fixing away from England and regaining his confidence on the county circuit.
It is one of the biggest scandal and mismanagement of Flower's tenure, but once again nothing is said, with KP providing a lovely smoke screen.
I'm delighted he's back. He has the potential to be a genuinely great bowler (a different league to Anderson and Broad) and that he's come through such appalling mismanagement and treatment is more a celebration for me, than england winning this test.
Agree with a lot of that DStyle - but to say he has the potential to be "a different league" to Anderson is total garbage.
i think you're probably right to call me out on a bit of over-excited hyperbole.
i suppose what i really meant is that at his best he's got the ability to win us matches against good sides with less reliance on a specific set of conditions.
i suppose what i really meant is that at his best he's got the ability to win us matches against good sides with less reliance on a specific set of conditions.
Absolutely. He is a very fine bowler - scary to face due to the lift he gets off a decent length.
Poorly treated - as was Anderson in the early days when they messed around with his action.
Funny how things work out - Andersons injury means Wood will be back in.
He bowls well at Trent Bridge and Anderson is fit for The Oval...?
Three of Anderson / Broad / Wood / Finn - or do Ali and Stokes come under pressure?
Would be very tough on Ali who I think has been excellent with the bat this series - and Stokes provides the "balance" which every side seems to love.
Poorly treated - as was Anderson in the early days when they messed around with his action.
Funny how things work out - Andersons injury means Wood will be back in.
He bowls well at Trent Bridge and Anderson is fit for The Oval...?
Three of Anderson / Broad / Wood / Finn - or do Ali and Stokes come under pressure?
Would be very tough on Ali who I think has been excellent with the bat this series - and Stokes provides the "balance" which every side seems to love.
Not having all the info to hand it further surprised me when Gower/Nasser/Ponting were discussing Finn after the game and another nugget came up that Strauss dropped him during a series where he was the leading wicket taker.
Presumably this also ties in with the Flower era?
That was Down Under in 2011 when I think Tremlett or was it Bresnan replaced him..
Either way we won the series 3-1 but yes Finn has a history of being the fall guy.
On the last Ashes tour Flower and Saker made him bowl off a shorter run up. It was madness and screwed him up for months. He went back to Gus Fraser at Middx who told him to go back to the long run and he immediately started taking wickets.
An awful lot has been hidden about that tour and as DStyle has said been covered up by the KP nonsense.
The handling of Finn, Tremlett, Panesar, Rankin and Carberry was extraordinary.
Either way we won the series 3-1 but yes Finn has a history of being the fall guy.
On the last Ashes tour Flower and Saker made him bowl off a shorter run up. It was madness and screwed him up for months. He went back to Gus Fraser at Middx who told him to go back to the long run and he immediately started taking wickets.
An awful lot has been hidden about that tour and as DStyle has said been covered up by the KP nonsense.
The handling of Finn, Tremlett, Panesar, Rankin and Carberry was extraordinary.
Remember to took a hat trick against the AUssies in the world cup, but went big in his 10 overs. Very expensive. imo he is a top bowler on his day but very inconsistent.
Strike bowlers often are. If he gets hit for five fours in an over as long as he knocks someone over with his sixth ball then he's done his job. That very much seemed to be the Flower attitude which DStyle referred to which saw average bowlers who may have only gone for three or four and over but just didn't take wickets getting in before him.
I don't know if it was in the reporting but I was worried when Bayliss was talking about throwing the new ball to Wood at Trent Bridge. They should be making Finn feel like he can run through walls instead of chipping away at his confidence.
yes!
I thought the outswinger was most inetresting!
I thought the outswinger was most inetresting!
Sam Sherringham's little piece seems to have a middle and end, but is lacking a beginning.
The story of his recovery, away from both Flower and Saker, the architects of his downfall, is telling enough, and it would seem apt to start with where things starting go wrong; not when they started going right.
Obviously it's not the same as a back injury, but i hope the intense recovery and remodelling does for his career what it did to Lillee's.
It does seem that recovery from major setbacks at a young age, in many sports, can be the making of greatness. Although there is probably a big confirmation bias in that only those with the necessary grit pull through.
The story of his recovery, away from both Flower and Saker, the architects of his downfall, is telling enough, and it would seem apt to start with where things starting go wrong; not when they started going right.
Obviously it's not the same as a back injury, but i hope the intense recovery and remodelling does for his career what it did to Lillee's.
It does seem that recovery from major setbacks at a young age, in many sports, can be the making of greatness. Although there is probably a big confirmation bias in that only those with the necessary grit pull through.
Post Your Reply
Please login to post a reply.
Wonder
Instance ID: 13539