Excess Deaths - A fairer way to judge individual countries

Hence why there's a massive push to go back through the achieve and add in December, January, February deaths as well

You can't tell me no one is seeing this lie? Even adding in those 3 months it still wont add up so why are they trying to keep this charade up?

What have they got planned? they wont get away with it so why are they brothering? the likes of bill Gates days as free men should be coming to an end ffs

And the 17,000 seems to high to me, flu/pneumonia is down over the past 2 months

I can believe 17,000 there are a lot of old folk who don't stand a chance against this, especially in nursing homes where they prefer profits over PPE
85% of nursing homes are privately owned
17,000 is not worth closing the economy down for
I know it would have been more but even so, virtually all under 40s recover

https://twitter.com/ganeshran/status/1257750001033326594/photo/1

They need to let this rip and just look after the groups that are more likely to die

thank feck,i have being saying this for last month

Witty and others have been referring to excess deaths as being the ultimate measure right from the start.
Here are the figures from the ONS up to the end of Week 17 (24 April).

For weeks 14 to 17, the five year average is 41,780.
The actual figures for 2020 are 79,251, an increase of 90%.

Well it's certainly a better measure than the covid league table that most people seem determined to use.  And it will be age-adjusted which obviously makes a lot of sense.  Whatever measure you use, it will be still be difficult to see the true long term effects five years from now

At the briefings, they are still using that graph comparing countries without even dividing by populations ("ooh look how badly the US is doing")

Currently if you die of something other than covid (which is still the majority, remember) you're not even a statistic.  No daily briefing about you.  No questions about what could have been done to prevent your death

At least, from what I've heard, the chief medical officer does seem to be acutely aware that his job is about the long term health of everyone, whether covid-related or not.  This is a good thing and I hope he can stand his ground on that

The government used comparisons until it showed government in bad light

Now we are worst in Europe the comparisons are discouraged

Tory mps seem to be deleting tweets about how well UK is doing compared to italy

Surely, while new (Covid-related) deaths are obviously going up then the residual deaths would also be going down right now. Road traffic accidents for example must be a fraction of the normal. People staying at home more, being much more careful not to catch bugs and infections etc must be having a real impact on deaths from other areas.

Is being indoors 23 to 24 hours a day good or bad for your health ?  I think most medical folks would say that for most people it's bad.  For the elderly, or those living alone, I'd say very bad

Don't think you'll find too many disagreeing with you.

It's got to be bad under normal circumstances.

It's counter to how we like to live our lives.

17,000 isn't the number because its below half

Its more like 9,000, so they closed the world down on a lie, the 9,000 could be easily explained away when the NHS is no longer treating none covid patients, they've admitted this in the past couple of days, they've let people die that could have been saved

Johnson can open this country back up and then toodle do on the way down the road the spineless little scruffy bas*ard, go and look that girlfriend and kid

May 6, 2020 -- 12:27PM, PorcupineorPineapple wrote:

Surely, while new (Covid-related) deaths are obviously going up then the residual deaths would also be going down right now. Road traffic accidents for example must be a fraction of the normal. People staying at home more, being much more careful not to catch bugs and infections etc must be having a real impact on deaths from other areas.

Wrong

Deaths through the NHS cancelling treatments have gone up and they've admitted as much

17,000 they say, 95% are elderly and would have suffered badly with a cold ffs, even that number as pointed out above when you factor in the largest age group is a disgrace when you look at what's coming because of the lockdown implemented

Johnson can do one, one of the most pathetic, most spineless leaders we've had, he's still hiding even now so just hurry up and fack him off

Priti Patel another one

"elected to lead" and they've sent a uni bloke, a ****, and a Raab out for the majority of it

Get rid of the lot of them

May 6, 2020 -- 3:01PM, SontaranStratagem wrote:

May  6, 2020 -- 11:27AM, PorcupineorPineapple wrote:Surely, while new (Covid-related) deaths are obviously going up then the residual deaths would also be going down right now. Road traffic accidents for example must be a fraction of the normal. People staying at home more, being much more careful not to catch bugs and infections etc must be having a real impact on deaths from other areas.Wrong Deaths through the NHS cancelling treatments have gone up and they've admitted as much 17,000 they say, 95% are elderly and would have suffered badly with a cold ffs, even that number as pointed out above when you factor in the largest age group is a disgrace when you look at what's coming because of the lockdown implemented Johnson can do one, one of the most pathetic, most spineless leaders we've had, he's still hiding even now so just hurry up and fack him off

Sont - please provide evidence that people have died because of cancelled treatments. That argument has always been a specious "we'll feel it in the future through delayed intervention" one, and has also been based more on people choosing not to visit the GP/hospital rather than a cancellation. A good friend of ours went in two weeks ago to get half his lung removed and there was no issue or delay whatsoever.

17,000 people are still dead who otherwise would be alive. You can be as dismissive as you like but it's the truth. My mum's best friend got buried today. My mum couldn't go. In fact only ten people could. Her daughter is utterly devastated. She was the wrong side of 70 but absolutely fine before this. And the idea of what's coming is always wide open. I think we're basing it on recent history. That the tories will go into austerity mode by cutting valuable public services and still allow the rich to not pay an extra dime but the fact is we can control the future if we choose to.

As for your last line, well no disagreement from me. Utterly, utterly hopeless.

17,000 are yes, but they've been allowed to die

The first question it'll all come out eventually, the NHS are blurting it out already, give them 6 months after this is done and the official figures will be released, and the court cases will start and its going to take years to complete.

My dad's next door neighbour of 45 years died last week, 3 doors away was an early casualty of corona

My mate was diagnosed with cancer after lockdown and has been for first course of treatment

There is so much false info flying around.... that is more scarey than Owt elss

3 doors away from dad, not me.


Dad would have loved to turn out to pay his respects to old pals

Feckin keyboard


owt else

Yep, my mum is struggling today. They've been best mates for over 25 years and both been widowed for the last ten years so have been going on holiday together twice a year etc. Bad enough that she's not here any more but the fact that she can't even go to her funeral is just twisting the knife frankly.

From the FT …...

50k excess winter  deaths 17-18.


https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/excesswintermortalityinenglandandwales/2017to2018provisionaland2016to2017final

Did winter 2107/18 occur within the last five years ?

Why is it the UK have always got a * next to the deaths columns?

We get it you want this to carry on but we've no more deaths that the others (Spain, Italy and France), we are top just be grateful

We can assess excess deaths in 5 years or so from everything.

Places like Greece and New Zealand who shut down at the expense of everything else early may pay the long term price.

Places like Sweden that did no lockdown or Belarus that did nothing may pay the long term price.

Places like Spain, France, USA and UK that fell between 2 stools and did a late lockdown may pay the long term price.

Time will tell.

We wont because we've got a never ending pit of cash we can call upon, the fed helps us all out in that regard

I just wonder if all these profiteering care homes will be bankrupt when all the old people are dead.

its hardly an effective business model

We are seeing damage control now, more data coming in is telling us it was an utterly made up event and they are moving to the "culpability" end game

Years of court cases, inquiries and lots and lots and lots of can kicking

They shouldn't be allowed to get away with this though

you need help, badly.

The truth is coming out now pecker

Which makes you the one who needs to seek help

They are trying to get this thing over and done with