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my employer has put a few on furlough for around 6 weeks, were only a small business , anyway theyre been paid 80% of their weekly wage only, employer is not topping up their pay which is fair enough. BUT today hes told them hes actually taking 3 weeks of their holiday leave out of the furlough, im a bit confused re the advice on the furlough sites. are the employes allowed their 80% plus their full holiday pay for the 3 weeks or as the boss says , all he has to do it just top up on their 80% to give them a full weekly wage for those 3 weeks. hope you follow !
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My understanding is your holiday entitlement stayed intact. I thought you might lose it for the time off (eg if you have 24 days per year and are furloughed for one month then you would lose 24/12 x 1 = 2 days of your entitlement) but I've been advised that the employee keeps their full hit.
May be different for small businesses but if I've read it right that sounds completely illegal by your employer.
May be different for small businesses but if I've read it right that sounds completely illegal by your employer.
Are you still entitled to bank holidays or annual leave if you have been furloughed?
Although the government is yet to clarify, it is understood that if you are furloughed, you are still entitled to bank holidays and annual leave, and taking them will not ‘break’ your furlough.
The government has remained largely silent on this matter, however, the Advisory, Conciliation and Arbitration Service (Acas) offer some non-binding advice.
They write: ‘If an employee or worker is temporarily sent home because there’s no work and the employer intends to claim for their wages under the Coronavirus Job Retention Scheme (‘furloughed’), they can still request and take their holiday in the usual way. This includes bank holidays.’ UK law doesn’t differentiate between annual leave and bank holidays as they are both included within employees’ mandatory 5.6 weeks of leave.
The National Law Review states: ‘Employees and workers may still be required to use a day’s paid holiday for bank holidays, including when they’re furloughed. If bank holidays are given on top of the 5.6 week’s paid holiday, employees and workers should check their contract or talk to their employer about taking this holiday.’
They also write that remuneration should not be affected and that people should not be paid less salary than usual if they take a holiday.
Their advice states: ‘Case law has made clear time and again that an employee’s statutory holiday pay should correspond to normal remuneration based on periods of actual work. It must not be based on or take account of periods of non-working. ‘The application of this principle would mean that an employee taking holiday, including a bank holiday, while on furlough should be paid their ‘normal remuneration’ based on what they’d be paid if they were working as usual on those days.’
Read more: https://metro.co.uk/2020/04/09/paid-bank-holidays-furloughed-pay-12534630/?i...
Although the government is yet to clarify, it is understood that if you are furloughed, you are still entitled to bank holidays and annual leave, and taking them will not ‘break’ your furlough.
The government has remained largely silent on this matter, however, the Advisory, Conciliation and Arbitration Service (Acas) offer some non-binding advice.
They write: ‘If an employee or worker is temporarily sent home because there’s no work and the employer intends to claim for their wages under the Coronavirus Job Retention Scheme (‘furloughed’), they can still request and take their holiday in the usual way. This includes bank holidays.’ UK law doesn’t differentiate between annual leave and bank holidays as they are both included within employees’ mandatory 5.6 weeks of leave.
The National Law Review states: ‘Employees and workers may still be required to use a day’s paid holiday for bank holidays, including when they’re furloughed. If bank holidays are given on top of the 5.6 week’s paid holiday, employees and workers should check their contract or talk to their employer about taking this holiday.’
They also write that remuneration should not be affected and that people should not be paid less salary than usual if they take a holiday.
Their advice states: ‘Case law has made clear time and again that an employee’s statutory holiday pay should correspond to normal remuneration based on periods of actual work. It must not be based on or take account of periods of non-working. ‘The application of this principle would mean that an employee taking holiday, including a bank holiday, while on furlough should be paid their ‘normal remuneration’ based on what they’d be paid if they were working as usual on those days.’
Read more: https://metro.co.uk/2020/04/09/paid-bank-holidays-furloughed-pay-12534630/?i...
More from ACAS here
https://www.acas.org.uk/coronavirus/using-holiday
https://www.acas.org.uk/coronavirus/using-holiday
Sounds to me Like the Employer is at it , trying to make sure no one has any holidays Left
Paying the 20% extra to get rid of them , you can bet he has not contacted the GOV to tell them
He is paying Holiday Pay , Its the Employees Choice to take holidays not the Employers to
Force them on him ... In any circumstance .
Hardly a holiday being banged up at home for 3 weeks ??
Paying the 20% extra to get rid of them , you can bet he has not contacted the GOV to tell them
He is paying Holiday Pay , Its the Employees Choice to take holidays not the Employers to
Force them on him ... In any circumstance .
Hardly a holiday being banged up at home for 3 weeks ??
it seems that he can tell employees to take their holidays out of the furlough, all he has to do is top up the 80% the gov pays with his own 20% , it is confusing but it seems he is allowed to do that.
Dont know the ins and outs but I don't think that is Correct Elis ..
Annual leave
Holiday pay has been a hot topic since the scheme was announced, with Brumpton noting that little guidance was available on the issue until very recently. “HMRC has now updated its guidance to say that employees can take annual leave without breaking furlough,” she said. “Although any period of holiday must be paid at full rate, with the employer topping up the grant to 100% of normal pay”.
However, it is still unclear whether employers can require staff to take annual leave while furloughed. “The government has updated its guidance for employees (but not employers), which states that employees will continue to accrue annual leave while on furlough and they are entitled to take leave during this time,” said Laura Kearsley, employment solicitor at Nelsons. But Kearsley noted the guidance was still silent on whether an employer can compel staff to use their annual leave.
“Some commentators take the view there is nothing wrong with this approach in principle (although it may be unpopular), whereas others disagree,” said Brumpton. “The safest course of action at the moment would be not to force holiday on staff until further guidance is forthcoming.”
Holiday pay has been a hot topic since the scheme was announced, with Brumpton noting that little guidance was available on the issue until very recently. “HMRC has now updated its guidance to say that employees can take annual leave without breaking furlough,” she said. “Although any period of holiday must be paid at full rate, with the employer topping up the grant to 100% of normal pay”.
However, it is still unclear whether employers can require staff to take annual leave while furloughed. “The government has updated its guidance for employees (but not employers), which states that employees will continue to accrue annual leave while on furlough and they are entitled to take leave during this time,” said Laura Kearsley, employment solicitor at Nelsons. But Kearsley noted the guidance was still silent on whether an employer can compel staff to use their annual leave.
“Some commentators take the view there is nothing wrong with this approach in principle (although it may be unpopular), whereas others disagree,” said Brumpton. “The safest course of action at the moment would be not to force holiday on staff until further guidance is forthcoming.”
this is the best i can find, seems it all in employers favour
Annual leave during furlough
Q: Can furloughed workers cash in holiday to top up their 80% salary pay?
The detailed government guidance does not yet address if furloughed workers can cash in holiday to top up their 80% salary pay if the employer has chosen not to top up the pay. However, if holiday is taken the latest guidance outlines that employers should top up the holiday pay to the full normal salary amount. If it is not taken, annual leave continues to accrue during furlough.
If employees book holiday time to take off during furlough, employers can claim for 80% of the holiday pay through the grant, in the same way as normal salary.
Government guidance states that the employer and employee must agree in writing that the employee will cease all work. Depending on the wording of the contract, most employees have to agree to being furloughed anyway, especially if the employer is not topping up their pay. Different scenarios may arise:
Employees who are worried about the drop in income may propose taking holiday between two dates on full pay. They may only agree to being furloughed before or after some leave on full salary for the holiday part of the period.
Employers who are not in a financial position to pay furloughed employees in full during annual leave can refuse employees’ requests for holiday in what would otherwise be a furlough period. The employer must give the normal notice which is as much notice of a refusal as the amount of leave requested, so two weeks’ notice if the leave requested was for two weeks.
Other employers may prefer employees to use up their holiday allowance rather than storing it up. There are normal rules enabling employers to require staff to take leave on certain days. However, requiring an employee to take annual leave during a period of furlough is not without risk. Special coronavirus rules on the ability to carry holiday forward into the next leave year have been introduced to prevent a build-up of leave to be used up by the end of the leave year; see the FAQs on this.
Q: Can employers require furloughed employees to use up their holiday leave during furlough?
Yes, employers can require furloughed employees to use up their take holiday leave during furlough. Employers may want to do this to reduce outstanding annual leave to be taken once the lockdown ends and businesses return to normal.
Standard employment law provisions (which are not frequently used) state that employers can require force workers to take holiday as long as they give twice as many days’ notice as the period of leave the worker is required to take. For example, if the employer requires the worker to take two week's annual leave at a certain time, it must give the worker at least four weeks' advance notice (or whatever is outlined in the employment contract).
So, an employer could furlough the employee and require a proportion of that to be annual holiday as long as the requisite notice is given. Insisting an employee take annual leave during a period of furlough, when government advice prevents them from travelling freely anywhere, is not without risk. The employees’ agreement should therefore be sought to take annual leave while on furlough. Employees may agree as it would be on full pay.
Updated Acas guidance clarifies that employees can ask for and take holiday leave as usual while on furlough. However, this remains a complicated issue, particularly in relation to pay, and employers may need to seek specific advice, especially if a disagreement arises.
Annual leave during furlough
Q: Can furloughed workers cash in holiday to top up their 80% salary pay?
The detailed government guidance does not yet address if furloughed workers can cash in holiday to top up their 80% salary pay if the employer has chosen not to top up the pay. However, if holiday is taken the latest guidance outlines that employers should top up the holiday pay to the full normal salary amount. If it is not taken, annual leave continues to accrue during furlough.
If employees book holiday time to take off during furlough, employers can claim for 80% of the holiday pay through the grant, in the same way as normal salary.
Government guidance states that the employer and employee must agree in writing that the employee will cease all work. Depending on the wording of the contract, most employees have to agree to being furloughed anyway, especially if the employer is not topping up their pay. Different scenarios may arise:
Employees who are worried about the drop in income may propose taking holiday between two dates on full pay. They may only agree to being furloughed before or after some leave on full salary for the holiday part of the period.
Employers who are not in a financial position to pay furloughed employees in full during annual leave can refuse employees’ requests for holiday in what would otherwise be a furlough period. The employer must give the normal notice which is as much notice of a refusal as the amount of leave requested, so two weeks’ notice if the leave requested was for two weeks.
Other employers may prefer employees to use up their holiday allowance rather than storing it up. There are normal rules enabling employers to require staff to take leave on certain days. However, requiring an employee to take annual leave during a period of furlough is not without risk. Special coronavirus rules on the ability to carry holiday forward into the next leave year have been introduced to prevent a build-up of leave to be used up by the end of the leave year; see the FAQs on this.
Q: Can employers require furloughed employees to use up their holiday leave during furlough?
Yes, employers can require furloughed employees to use up their take holiday leave during furlough. Employers may want to do this to reduce outstanding annual leave to be taken once the lockdown ends and businesses return to normal.
Standard employment law provisions (which are not frequently used) state that employers can require force workers to take holiday as long as they give twice as many days’ notice as the period of leave the worker is required to take. For example, if the employer requires the worker to take two week's annual leave at a certain time, it must give the worker at least four weeks' advance notice (or whatever is outlined in the employment contract).
So, an employer could furlough the employee and require a proportion of that to be annual holiday as long as the requisite notice is given. Insisting an employee take annual leave during a period of furlough, when government advice prevents them from travelling freely anywhere, is not without risk. The employees’ agreement should therefore be sought to take annual leave while on furlough. Employees may agree as it would be on full pay.
Updated Acas guidance clarifies that employees can ask for and take holiday leave as usual while on furlough. However, this remains a complicated issue, particularly in relation to pay, and employers may need to seek specific advice, especially if a disagreement arises.
My Mrs had Holidays booked was asked if she wanted to cancel them if Furloughed , in the end she was not furloughed
Doesn't seem right to me that Elisjohn.
Your employer will be claiming furlough pay for the whole 6 week period in all probability (I mean why would they not do so?)
Holiday pay
Whilst furloughed you will continue to accrue leave as per your employment contract. You can agree with your employer to vary holiday pay entitlement as part of the furlough agreement, however almost all workers are entitled to 5.6 weeks of statutory paid annual leave each year which they cannot go below.
You can take holiday whilst on furlough. Working Time Regulations (WTR) require holiday pay to be paid at your normal rate of pay or, where your rate of pay varies, calculated on the basis of the average pay you received in the previous 52 working weeks. Therefore, if you take holiday while on furlough, your employer should pay you your usual holiday pay in accordance with the WTR. Employers will be obliged to pay the additional amounts over the grant, though will have the flexibility to restrict when leave can be taken if there is a business need. This applies for both the furlough period and the recovery period.
If you usually work bank holidays then your employer can agree that this is included in the grant payment. If you usually take the bank holiday as leave then your employer would either have to top up your pay to your usual holiday pay, or give you a day of holiday in lieu.
During this unprecedented time, we are keeping the policy on holiday pay during furlough under review.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/check-if-you-could-be-covered-by-the-coronavirus-job-retention-scheme
You are entitled to your holiday pay as any other worker would be.
Your employer is trying it on in my opinion and should be taken to task over it.
Sounds like you're not unionised and might explain why this swine is trying it although you could contact ACAS to act as a mediator.
Don't let them pull the wool over your eyes.
Stinks to high heaven
Your employer will be claiming furlough pay for the whole 6 week period in all probability (I mean why would they not do so?)
Holiday pay
Whilst furloughed you will continue to accrue leave as per your employment contract. You can agree with your employer to vary holiday pay entitlement as part of the furlough agreement, however almost all workers are entitled to 5.6 weeks of statutory paid annual leave each year which they cannot go below.
You can take holiday whilst on furlough. Working Time Regulations (WTR) require holiday pay to be paid at your normal rate of pay or, where your rate of pay varies, calculated on the basis of the average pay you received in the previous 52 working weeks. Therefore, if you take holiday while on furlough, your employer should pay you your usual holiday pay in accordance with the WTR. Employers will be obliged to pay the additional amounts over the grant, though will have the flexibility to restrict when leave can be taken if there is a business need. This applies for both the furlough period and the recovery period.
If you usually work bank holidays then your employer can agree that this is included in the grant payment. If you usually take the bank holiday as leave then your employer would either have to top up your pay to your usual holiday pay, or give you a day of holiday in lieu.
During this unprecedented time, we are keeping the policy on holiday pay during furlough under review.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/check-if-you-could-be-covered-by-the-coronavirus-job-retention-scheme
You are entitled to your holiday pay as any other worker would be.
Your employer is trying it on in my opinion and should be taken to task over it.
Sounds like you're not unionised and might explain why this swine is trying it although you could contact ACAS to act as a mediator.
Don't let them pull the wool over your eyes.
Stinks to high heaven
The current qualifying period is between March 1st and June 30th.
That's subject to any extensions being added.
I'll bet you a pound to a penny they are claiming 6 week's Furlough pay at 80% of your contracted wage.
Taking 3 weeks holiday pay, or stating their intention to do it is scandalous.
You should not agree to it.
That's subject to any extensions being added.
I'll bet you a pound to a penny they are claiming 6 week's Furlough pay at 80% of your contracted wage.
Taking 3 weeks holiday pay, or stating their intention to do it is scandalous.
You should not agree to it.
mail running a story today about a virgin trolly dolly,[yes they found one 
] on furlough taking a job stacking shelves,i thought you couldn't take a job if furloughed
was talk of special exemptions for fruit picking
] on furlough taking a job stacking shelves,i thought you couldn't take a job if furloughedwas talk of special exemptions for fruit picking
The employees’ agreement should therefore be sought to take annual leave while on furlough. Employees may agree as it would be on full pay.
No way would I agree. Much rather sit at home for 80% and then take a full paid day off when all this sh1t is over.
No way would I agree. Much rather sit at home for 80% and then take a full paid day off when all this sh1t is over.
millions of workers accrue holidayts as they work through the year 2,something dayts a month etc, end of tax year,beginning of a new one ,wont be many people whove accrued any/many hols
youd be bonkers to take say weeks holiday pay, when youd only be 20% better off than on week furlough. and youd still have that week to come as hols
I suppose it depends on how much/what debt 6 weeks on 20% less leaves you,if your on 2500 a month,you could be 2500 out of pocket
Another reason why employers may want to rob you of your Annual Holiday to stop you carrying them over to next year as you sit furloughed.
Rules on carrying over annual leave to be relaxed to support key industries during COVID-19
Workers who have not taken all of their statutory annual leave entitlement due to COVID-19 will now be able to carry it over into the next 2 leave years.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/rules-on-carrying-over-annual-leave-to-be-relaxed-to-support-key-industries-during-covid-19
Rules on carrying over annual leave to be relaxed to support key industries during COVID-19
Workers who have not taken all of their statutory annual leave entitlement due to COVID-19 will now be able to carry it over into the next 2 leave years.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/rules-on-carrying-over-annual-leave-to-be-relaxed-to-support-key-industries-during-covid-19
similarly here
https://inews.co.uk/inews-lifestyle/work/furlough-annual-leave-holiday-explained-furloughed-coronavirus-uk-job-retention-scheme-2546684
https://inews.co.uk/inews-lifestyle/work/furlough-annual-leave-holiday-explained-furloughed-coronavirus-uk-job-retention-scheme-2546684
it's not a holiday if you can not holiday, he's taking the pish and the money.
Employees are contacting HMRC reporting that Employers are forcing them back to work even though they are being paid furlough pay.
I'd like to say this was an untruth but it's not.
'Greed is not good'
#Scumbags
I'd like to say this was an untruth but it's not.
'Greed is not good'
#Scumbags
i burned the yard down when it happened me, no more lorries
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