Don't forget to clap at the sky tonight...

I've got an air raid siren.

Can't wait.

I usually include the supermarket staff but today Waitrose had no Tangy Tomato Chutney on the shelf so fcuk em!

I make sure I am out for my run.....I am not a Number !

I'm a free man !

NHS staff are lucky to be working and getting paid !

Some of us are getting nothing !

And we're getting pretty cheesed off !

Leopard

That must be great you can imagine whilst running they are all cheering you.

I go in a park to avoid that nonsense !

1984 clip :
.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0wH6YDfCzg

Apr 23, 2020 -- 6:32PM, stridingedge wrote:

LeopardThat must be great you can imagine whilst running they are all cheering you.

Was actually driving once during the clapping.....couldn't resist the urge to do the royal wave

Get ready for the siren

There was a time a siren meant bombers were coming over, now its to clap people who CHOSE to do that job, they are not heroes they are nurses and doctors who CHOSE that path

Fack off

Wait till we get to 100k tests.  Everyone will be dancing in the streets.  In fact is Big Ben fixed yet ? 

In decades to come people will ask  "Where were you when we tested 100k people that one special day ?"

I have not done it once, Pure Tokenism & absolutely meaningless....folk who want NHS defunded have been out there clapping.

If you feel gratitude for health workers which I do, you carry it in your heart Tokenism is the blight of this country

The same people applauding them now will be nowhere to be seen when this is over

The NHS is finished as we know it once this is over, its going to be privatised to the moon, be lucky to see a doctor if your poor.

And remember, the people your applauding are turning away cancer patients...

never a truer word said on this forum
i'm going to light a candle

to de Cardinal ob

Agree with the cardinal,sick of tokenism for this or football,etc. More inclined to get out and deliver volunteer than stand on my step clapping thin air.

SontaranStratagem 23 Apr 20 19:15 
The same people applauding them now will be nowhere to be seen when this is over

The NHS is finished as we know it once this is over, its going to be privatised to the moon, be lucky to see a doctor if your poor.

And remember, the people your applauding are turning away cancer patients... Cry


Total nonsense

The most pathetic thing I have ever heard in my entire life . Stood at the door clapping . For what ??

Give them some financial reward FFS

Its not nonsense, people who had chemo rounds have been told they are suspended

Pure Tokenism & absolutely meaningless

My child doesn’t see it that way
She asks why the person over the road doesn’t come out
One word I say
He’s a ****

Apr 23, 2020 -- 9:06PM, crystalhunt wrote:

SontaranStratagem 23 Apr 20 19:15  The same people applauding them now will be nowhere to be seen when this is overThe NHS is finished as we know it once this is over, its going to be privatised to the moon, be lucky to see a doctor if your poor.And remember, the people your applauding are turning away cancer patients... CryTotal nonsense

my mum has a friend who died the other day, she was late stage pancreatic cancer patient & not getting chemo

so get your facts right crystalhunt

Kids will ask questions because you've got them out clapping so they'll want to know why your mate isn't doing it

its common knowledge that a lot of treatments that are non-covid have been suspended

My dads reverse colon operation was cancelled in late March, wonder

He has no idea when its going to be done either

God help anyone who has something serious during this as they're probably going to die from it, and the absolute irony of it is they'll be indirectly killed by "covid19"

Same for the old in the care homes, they've been left to die

correct

The shaming of people who want to go out is quite sad, the narcissism is rampant with this in nurses and doctors     

They are playing on basic modern narcissism, which is installed into everyone from a young age nowadays

That's how they are getting away with this, people like being on the tele, like to be the centre of attention

agree again

All nurses and doctors are narcissists, wanting to "help people" is very narcissist by nature anyway

And the less said about mental health workers the better, the most mentally damaged people calling others "mentally ill" is irony 101

was pointed out to me today a resource on the world economic forum...have you seen it SS?

No wonder

A Dr "heals people"

How sanctimonies is that ?

sent you a link via pm...pretty mind blowing what they've just knocked up "off the cuff"

Cheers wonder

Apr 23, 2020 -- 9:40PM, FATTIEWHITEYSLOVEADRINK wrote:

Pure Tokenism & absolutely meaninglessMy child doesn’t see it that way She asks why the person over the road doesn’t come out One word I say He’s a ****

Your neighbour may be a **** but should you be using that language in front of your child?

Shame on you !

My next door neighbours both work for the nhs.i asked them if they’d like me to clap or would they prefer some bottles of wine.they told me not to bother clapping.

The definition of mental illness .. an old dear banging a pot and pan together outside the door in celebration of a "service" that will leave them to drop dead in order to prioritise younger people. Bang bang bang


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8178189/Older-coronavirus-patients-...

Banging pots and pans together in celebration at people who are letting cancer sufferers die at home

I mean this same service who have done nothing for peoples health since its inception, it was set up to keep people sick and dependent

And the nurses and doctors that work for it have learned everything from a book that were written many decades ago, nature discarded, instinct discarded

I'm going to get bashed here for sure

But cancer is best left alone, let the body try and sort it

Chemo? does nothing but destroy the bodies own immune system

But they had people booked in for treatments and these people are in stress, their bodies are now relying on these drugs after they ravaged the sodding immune system

NEVER take drugs from this day on

What about caffeine ?

I wouldnt go that far sontarin but whilst there are decent nurses/doctors there are equally many that can barely speak English, fail patients routinely etc. Every other day I read about doctors who are convicted of horrific things such as failure to spot sepsis in children, performing unnecessary operations allowed to keep their medical license, elderly drinking out of vases etc. Only last year I had to call an ambulance for a relative and it took 3 hours to turn up.. still better than a case I read a few days earlier where an elderly woman was left to die in the streets. Much of it may be down to government underfunding, but a great deal is down to a service which is far from great and kills many people due to its incompetence ranging down from government officials to poor standards of healthcare from many immigrant/native workers. For every pot and pan banged by an old dear( who may well be sacrificed by the NHS) there will be a case like my ex neighbour who was belatedly diagnosed with breast cancer at 26 with repeated failed opportunities to spot the disease. Her family won a large payout from the NHS but not much use other than upgrading her gravestone with the usual guff of " lessons learnt".

NHS dentistry is probably the worst in any civilised country on the planet- no wonder we are mocked as a nation for our teeth but of course with a population of 60 plus million thanks to Blair, no surprise many have teeth like a Jeremy kyle contestant with millions unable to even access one

Thanks to Blair ?

Why do you still believe this nonsense . He is just a mouth piece . He is just a puppet . Please understand this .

Wolf3011.....good post ! .....

My 88 year old Dad was in Macclesfield Hospital 2 years ago with Pneumonia and one of the main ward nurses was a pretty grumpy most of the time.

I realised after a few days they were putting what they called meals in front of him and were not bothered that he was only eating 20% of it each time.

I wouldn't give that stuff even to my ex-wife.

If me and my sister hadn't brought food in regularly I reckon he would not have made it out of there !


That said, I would still pay all Hospital staff and Carers 20% more at least.


I'm sure they would prefer the extra cash to being applauded for 5 minutes every Thursday.


Tories are criminally at fault for extreme underfunding of the NHS......which is the reason we are all under Lockdown !

Leopard paying more surely is not the answer, only to my mind encourage more incompetent staff to the job. We all need nhs staff who are naturally minded to care for others not thinking about the wages at the end off a month. BTW imo a nurses wage is more than ample.

l'd to see you try to live on a nurses wage in London !

.
https://www.nursingtimes.net/news/workforce/nhs-workforce-being-hollowed-out-by-registered-nurse-shortages-28-11-2019/



Data from the Health Foundation found that, while more doctors and support staff have joined the NHS in 2018-19, not enough nurses have.
In the first quarter of 2018-19, nurse vacancies reached 44,000. According to the report, this number could spiral to 100,000 in a decade.

The nursing crisis has been a major point of interest for political parties in the run up to the general election.

The Conservatives have promised 50,000 new nurses and Labour are committed to reinstating the nursing bursary.

The Health Foundation report found that the overall workforce has seen the biggest annual growth since 2010.

But the charity warned that this was masking an ongoing shift in skill mix because support staff, such as healthcare assistants and nursing associates, were being brought in to compensate for the nursing shortage.

While registered nurses undertake a three-year degree, there are no set entry requirements to become a healthcare assistant, it noted.

According to the Health Foundation, this has effectively caused a “hollowing out” of the NHS workforce, as there is growth in both the most- and least-clinically skilled workers – leaving a gap in the middle.

The report, called Falling short: the NHS workforce challenge, revealed that during 2018-19 there has been a small increase of 4,500 full-time equivalent (FTE) nurses – a rise of just 1.5%.

However, the number of healthcare assistants has gone up by 6,500 – an increase 2.6%.

The number of nurses working in the community, not including health visitors, grew by just 0.7% and mental health nurses went up by only 0.6%, but both groups remain below 2014 levels.

The NHS is also missing its target to recruit at least 5,000 overseas nurses a year until 2023-24 – in 2017-18 only 1,600 joined the service.

Wonder if those clapping are the same ones who are in the parks and open spaces in their thousands, or maybe they're the ones raiding supermarkets like fkg locusts?

My missus works at the local hospital, and while she appreciates the sentiment, it's pretty meaningless when it's done by politicians or those who normally wouldn't give NHS staff the steam off their p!$$.  Pretty much like thoughts & prayers:  looks good, takes little effort and costs nothing.  And done by many just so they can put it on social media and get some sort of vicarious acceptance.
How many would be happy to pay a bit more tax to see health care professionals paid a more acceptable wage in future???

Understand your point Leopard which is why the NHS needs total remodeling. These staff shortages were always going to come about due to the poor AFC. Also remember not everywhere is London a nurses wage are more than ample elsewhere, Band 6 30k,8 weeks annual leave, enhanced night shift rate, enhanced public holiday rate, 6months full pay sick leave(abused by some). Not to shabby when all added up. Then you will get your London allowance, various accommodation packages etc, etc, etc. We need staff that want to do the job, not the financial reward more important than caring for humans.

If the nursing staff were paid more then they would be happier in their jobs.

There is a shortage so the pay must be increased.

Found this :

Band 6 nurse :

These nurses are assigned band 6. In some NHS Trusts, these will be known as Sisters/Charge Nurses. Ward Manager/Ward Sister/Charge Nurse/Nurse Manager/Clinical Ward Nurse Lead – this nurse is responsible for running a ward or unit, and usually has budgetary control.

It takes on average 18 months for a nurse to amass the necessary job experience to be considered for a band six position. During this time, nurses must prove they are capable of safely practicing the extra senior duties necessary to thrive in the role.
.
https://www.rcn.org.uk/employment-and-pay/nhs-pay-scales-2017-18


Band 6  : £13.59  per hour in first year

Increase in wages does not bring around better staff, infact it is well known to do the opposite.
The Leopard how about the wages off all London workers, ie TFL, supermarket, bank staff, pharmacy workers, refuse collector's, bar, resturant workers, takeaway, betting office staff, etc, etc, etchow do they all stay and work in London?

difficult to see that cutting nurse pay will make things better

Not advocating cutting, just don't see how throwing money at a wage increase is what's required, infact it's not the answer.
Not every NHS worker during this pandemic is run off their feet and stressed(infact the complete opposite (a few are). Infact the hardest part off a nurses job with most object too is dealing with relatives which currently don't do so have plenty time to make up silly dances and post on social media to fill time.

London workers : TFL, supermarket, bank staff, pharmacy workers, refuse collector's, bar, restaurant workers, takeaway, betting office staff

These are all workers who do not have the salary determined  by government policy ..... There is a job market and if someone's salary is not high enough then they can leave and find higher paid job elsewhere.

There are not many nursing jobs which are not connected to the NHS.

I would estimate that 70% of nurses are overworked, 20%  are just about managing and 10% have not enough to do (private hospitals ?).

44,000 vacancies means a nurse has to cover for each of those missing nurses.

so you are saying you only want people who really want to be a nurse (kind of agree) but dont pay them well because they are doing it because they want to

Apr 24, 2020 -- 12:43AM, SontaranStratagem wrote:

I'm going to get bashed here for sure But cancer is best left alone, let the body try and sort it Chemo? does nothing but destroy the bodies own immune system But they had people booked in for treatments and these people are in stress, their bodies are now relying on these drugs after they ravaged the sodding immune system NEVER take drugs from this day on

there's a lot of sense in GNM for sure SS
the body is a GREAT healer if looked after properly

What iam saying is, a remodeling of the NHS to attract the correct type off candidate for the position (caring profession), throwing money in wage increase is not the way to go.
The current wage and benefits (good pension scheme) is more than satisfactory.

The Leopard you'r estimates in 70%,20%,10% are a million miles off mark.
A nurse does not have to cover for those missing absolutely incorrect.
Numbers legally have to be maintained hence bank staff, overtime time in liue etc etc etc.

so what incentive is there to attract the correct type of candidate,the days when people do a job because its what they have always wanted to do dont apply to many people now

Absolutely correct GAZO, great point. Which is why importantly we need a complete remodeling off the NHS from top to bottom, with people who possess a greater mind than mine(although mine and everyone's) contribution welcome. I truly feel now is the time while we all realise how important the NHS is to our society and it certainly should not be money driven.

GAZO, perhaps promote the profession (not the wage and benefits), the importance of the career for life(it is a job for one's working life). So so many ways,but stay away from cash rewards

but thats like saying its what they have always wanted to do so pay them as little as we can get away with

No GAZO a proper wage for the role, I belive in todays life the pay more than matches the role. Not wanting to take away but come on GAZO, the nurses role is?

so who would you compare a nurse with,jobs wise ?

If there is a nurse shortage....keep offering more money until you fill that shortage....the market will solve the problem.

If the NHS does not have enough money then the Government has to allocate them more funds.

If the Government does not have enough money then they have to raise taxes.

Austerity has failed and has damaged the NHS such that we are being forced into lockdown to protect it.

The lockdown is the responsibility of  the Tory governments of the last 10 years.

T. L. What a ridiculous flawed statement
"keep offering more money until you fill that shortage"
What standard off care are you looking for?

There should be no shortage ! ....if they paid a market salary then more would join the profession.

A level of no shortage should be normal !

Also, we should stop swiping nurses from other countries who have trained them up only to get no benefit from their expertise.

T. L. You are absolutely correct "There should be no shortage!"
Throwing money through wages,perks, pension etc is absolutely the 100% wrong approach.
I ask again, what standard off care are you looking for?
Also, delivered to you by what kind of professional?

but there is a shortage so people wont come into the profession for the wages on offer

But GAZO those that do come into the profession for the Money on offer are not the type we want to attract into said profession..

some yes but i would imagine if they went back to training mainly on the job like previously a lot of those would leave before qualifying

T. L. Can I ask you about the police force and shortage of officers? Do you think by throwing eg a 20% wage rise will attract the dedicated fair honest officer we require, nedd and indeed want, or would could the outcome be.
How does a regular PC survive in London?