imagine asking a fire man to fight a fire with no protection.

400 thousand gowns will last 3 days as per original safety instructions wear once so you would need close to 50 million for a year which sounds a lot but not as close to the billions of plastic supermarkets 5p bags used which are now defunct

what freaks me out is one of the care home nurses say they need them now as the virus is here as they need 2 people to lift move etc old people

but she also said we dont normally wear face nasks on a day to day basis only now

so think about flu epidemics colds novavirus etc wtf arent they wearing them full time everyday

how many people have died who shouldnt of died because of this practice over the decades even if the flu rate is 20 times lower than covid

the porential is still going to kill people as flu vaccines only protect they dont cure it, normal colds can cause pneumonia in old people etc etc

im not saying staff go to work with the flu or heavy colds or feeling unwell with old people but you can still carry the germs before it hits you

therefore it will hit anyone else you contact

Imagine sending soldiers over the top of the trench with no bullets in their guns.

You can ask Tony Blair and his cronies about that!

There are 200 NHS trusts with 200 CEOs. It's their responsibility not the govts to procure the correct equipment.
It's been as much an allocation problem as a supply problem.
Some hospitals with very few Chinese flu cases have excess and the reallocation has been poor.

The gown advice came from the WHO a few days ago, it wasn't the govt.
They advised that if you needed to due to lack of supply, you should re use gowns

How many times do people need to be told that the fake death numbers coming out of China were so minuscule as a percentage of population that no country was on high alert.
Especially as they continued to tell everybody it was under control and they wouldn't allow western scientists into the area.
Then all of a sudden the penny dropped across the world and there was a mad scramble for PPE

People are going to die and continue to die, it's inevitable.
Look at Singapore, they locked everybody down but now they are having 1000 new cases a day
It's a bitter pill to swallow but that's the way it is until a vaccine is found or herd immunity becomes a reality

The most startling stat for me at the moment is that if you have to become ventilated your chance of survival is 5-15%
A doctor on the radio said he hadn't seen one recovery yet in a month!
Everybody he'd seen ventilated had died or was still on a ventilator

imagine being a fireman so stupid as to run into a burning building with no protection or being fire service management forcing the fireman into the same building knowing they had no protection.

The NHS deserve as much flack.

These people are spreading the virus through ineptitude

Well when you have Bojo or is that Capt Mainwaring in charge of the troops within the cabinet it was always likely to end up a farce
Tory apologists quickly on the scene to try and offer offer their help to Bojo ... mind you jucel & queenie are like Pvte Pike & Jones the butcher helping the home guard ... don't panic they don't like it up em  ...
Lets put the blame where it really lies ... with this Government following a discipline of inaction until we are almost overwhelmed by weight of numbers ...

400 thousand gowns will last 3 days as per original safety instructions wear once so you would need close to 50 million for a year

That is a huge number. The problem with countries around the world is that they had put all their eggs in 1 or 2 baskets. China and rumour has is Turkey. Surely emergency regular usages such as gowns can be produced in THIS country. An advanced modern factory up in the poor Northeast can churn out the gowns we need and other NHS goods rather than relying on foreign countries.

Apr 20, 2020 -- 9:20AM, Ski-Wiz wrote:

400 thousand gowns will last 3 days as per original safety instructions wear once so you would need close to 50 million for a yearThat is a huge number. The problem with countries around the world is that they had put all their eggs in 1 or 2 baskets. China and rumour has is Turkey. Surely emergency regular usages such as gowns can be produced in THIS country. An advanced modern factory up in the poor Northeast can churn out the gowns we need and other NHS goods rather than relying on foreign countries.

You can but it's elf and safety bollox
There are plenty of companies that could make masks, gowns and gloves etc but they have to pass certain standards.
It's time consuming as they are scared to death of litigation
None of the ventilators that were designed were deemed acceptable either

For example if a nurse wore a locally produced mask that wasn't certified and then got sick she could sue the arse off the NHS

Listened to a brits interview the other day. He said he didn't call an ambulance because all his friends who got the virus never returned from the hospital. He was basically telling people to isolate themselves at home and tough it out. He looked like a fit lad so probably it was possible for him to just wait it out. But his point was spot on. People can't be expected to survive In a hospital with the current conditions.

Why are doctors still working if they aren't safe themselves?

i feel a lot safer working in an ICU than working as a bus driver

Apr 20, 2020 -- 11:29AM, detraveller wrote:

Listened to a brits interview the other day. He said he didn't call an ambulance because all his friends who got the virus never returned from the hospital. He was basically telling people to isolate themselves at home and tough it out. He looked like a fit lad so probably it was possible for him to just wait it out. But his point was spot on. People can't be expected to survive In a hospital with the current conditions. Why are doctors still working if they aren't safe themselves?

Well over 100 doctors alone have died in Italy!

The death toll doesn't say much. Some are saying over 15000 doctors have tested psotive. Some said 25% of cases in Italy at one point, were health workers.

I haven't bothered reading those news items but they would make sense. How can you treat people when you are carrying the virus yourself.

Apr 20, 2020 -- 11:42AM, Eric.Cartman wrote:

i feel a lot safer working in an ICU than working as a bus driver

Someone swing it for you ?

100 doctors and estimated 30 nurses/nursing assistants...one of those figures is obviously complete bollox

Apr 20, 2020 -- 11:42AM, Eric.Cartman wrote:

i feel a lot safer working in an ICU than working as a bus driver

Someone swing it for you ?

Haven't you got some Palestinians to bulldoze off the West Bank ?

Why are doctors still working if they aren't safe themselves?


Nail on the head. History will show this as mass stupidity on the part of vast swathes of healthcare workers who work with inadequate PPE and end up causing more harm than good.

Apr 20, 2020 -- 11:53AM, Eric.Cartman wrote:

Haven't you got some Palestinians to bulldoze off the West Bank ?

I don't support the right-wing dictatorship running Israel but I do pull people up if they make jokes concerning the Holocaust....is that what has wound you up?

Off out  ---------->

I'm just trying to help you keep up your 100% record of somehow mentioning the holocaust in every topic you post on.

my main point is that the government lied,they said the were prepared for EVERY eventuality,they said they had more than enough PPE,
They lied through their teeth for the last two months.i understand that governments do a lot of spin and bend the truth and juggle percentages ,and talk out of both sides of their mouths at the same time,but people lost their lives because of the situation that has developed and many more will follow.Its murder...................BUT its glossed up to be an unfortunate sad event.
if your child was taken to hospital today and a nurse said i can not attend this child because i have no protection equipment ,who do you blame.?you blame the guy who said there is loads of PPE.WE have tons and tons of it.yes,you blame the guy who came on national TV and swore black and blue that there was no shortage of PPE.am i correct Matt?

Why is it all single use . Can't anything be made that you clean and reuse ?

We have not prepared enough....it does not surprise me sadly

Medical staff are paying with their lives

We have not prepared enough....it does not surprise me sadly

Medical staff are paying with their lives

Thats a very valid point eyeball,we are told that soap and water kills the virus,and every hospital has a laundry.????????????????

Bleach is the answer,sterilise them in bleach.

no the plastic one of course.

not=correction

cotton suits ,they could be bleached.

Nail on the head. History will show this as mass stupidity on the part of vast swathes of healthcare workers who work with inadequate PPE and end up causing more harm than good.

possibly the most stupid comment i've read on here ... the same idiot would be writing to complain of mass murder by NHS staff if they refused to intervene to help patients despite the lack of proper clothing & masks
fortunately the medical & ancillary staff are going above and beyond the call of duty to try and save lives; if they are trasmitting the virus which is possible because of inadequate assistance the blame lies with Gov't
NHS frontline staff are fantastic people deserving of every bit of praise; the critics ...

* assistance = equipment (PPE)

I totally agree with that Geordie....the medical profession are treating people who already have the virus!!!!!

The medical profession are showing great self sacrifice.

The medical profession are showing great self sacrifice.


no they are showing stupidity by working with inadequate equipment.
vast majority of spread no occurring in hospital settings due to incompetent staff not practicing proper infection controls.

the best course of action would be refuse treatment without ppe.
they have no cure/vaccine and treatment amounts to throwing em on a ventilator and hoping for the best.

So you are saying Racingqueen perfectly healthy people are being admitted to Hospital and then
being infected with the virus?

They would not be admitted to Hospital if they were not already showing symptoms of the virus, would they???????
So they are already infected.

Also if Hospitals followed your advice Boris Johnson would now be dead

People working in the medical profession have a duty of care. it is part of their ethics

The lack of PPE is the fault of the Government not the medical profession