Chit Chat
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06 Jan 15
20:13
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Date Joined:
06 Apr 05
What a rip off! It might look interesting on a cheap tv prog, but the reality is its a dying industry.
My Dad went in a home a couple of years ago, and I packed up a few things in a box and put them in my loft.
Usual things that old people had in their display cabinets, vases, china plates, silver and wooden knick-knacks etc, some of which were my grandparents things and over 100 years old.
The auctioneer suggested lumping things together in lots, except for a pair of chinese vases which were valued at £250-£300. He advised against putting up a reserve price. All the items were also on
an internet site, for which you could bid up to the night before. These pre-bids were brought in during the auction so nothing was sold for less than the highest internet bid.
Auctioneers fees were £2.50 per lot, plus 15pc + vat.
What suprised me though was that there was a "buyers premium" of 17pc + vat ??
So if something sold for £100, the buyer would have to pay about £120, and the seller would receive about £80, so the auctioneer would get 40pc!!
There were about 800 lots, and the whole thing went on for about 6 hrs. The place was packed but I doubt there was anyone there under 40.
My 15 or so minor items made a grand total of £55 after commission.. The vases only went to £80, so I bid myself and bought them back. (Costing an extra £16).
So my grand profit was less than £40.
I wont be going again.
My Dad went in a home a couple of years ago, and I packed up a few things in a box and put them in my loft.
Usual things that old people had in their display cabinets, vases, china plates, silver and wooden knick-knacks etc, some of which were my grandparents things and over 100 years old.
The auctioneer suggested lumping things together in lots, except for a pair of chinese vases which were valued at £250-£300. He advised against putting up a reserve price. All the items were also on
an internet site, for which you could bid up to the night before. These pre-bids were brought in during the auction so nothing was sold for less than the highest internet bid.
Auctioneers fees were £2.50 per lot, plus 15pc + vat.
What suprised me though was that there was a "buyers premium" of 17pc + vat ??
So if something sold for £100, the buyer would have to pay about £120, and the seller would receive about £80, so the auctioneer would get 40pc!!
There were about 800 lots, and the whole thing went on for about 6 hrs. The place was packed but I doubt there was anyone there under 40.
My 15 or so minor items made a grand total of £55 after commission.. The vases only went to £80, so I bid myself and bought them back. (Costing an extra £16).
So my grand profit was less than £40.
I wont be going again.
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Replies: 21
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I know where you're coming from many people forget about the VAT and buyers premium, what you might think is a bargain turns out sh1t when added up.
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only cmat sworsdsmans
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I used to go but it got harder and harder to pick up a bargain.
I now just scout the antique shops, lower end ones though. |
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I go to memrobilia ones and have never paid VAT, so what are the rules on VAT at auctions. Just befor christmas I picked up a box of cricket programmes and scorecards(about 200)for £22 plus 15% buyers premium. A Lords Taverners programme had some autographs in the centre, David Frost, Eric and Ernie , Willie Rushton, Harry Secombe and a load of old England cricketers, might get a couple of quid back off that.
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I am amazed you have never paid VAT!When I moved I put some stuff in auction. After my experience, unless one has a genuine antique worth a lot of money, the only reason to use an auction would be to get rid of stuff and to get some money for it however little. An "expert" appraiser at one of the auction houses featured on Bargain Hunt valued an antique book of mine at £40.
I subsequently sold the same book at a West End auction house for £850. But I only received £650 after expenses. Only you, as an individual, can decide whether it is worth it. I hope this is of assistance. |
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From what I've seen, there are very few serious bidders, even if the place is packed.
The majority of older folks are just there to pass the time, in between the library and a half of bitter at the local, and a couple of hours keeping warm with their bus pass! |
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Don't knock it
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you should also see the prices some of the delivery firms want. I was interested in a case of red wines an auction house had up at Xmas, the firm wanted £90 + VAT to delivery them 40 miles
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i'd say my local auction house is well run, prices are usually pretty accurate and there's normally a large bidding crowd in attendance
sells everything thing from household clearance to rembrandts, everything i've stuck through has made more than i expected |
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Some misunderstanding here. Vat is always charged on the premiums (buyers and sellers) but is hardly ever charged on the hammer price (unless the seller is a Vat registered trader). As a buyer (I don't sell at auction much), I don't give a toss about the buyer's premium because I and other bidders will factor that into their bidding limit, and the hammer price will generally reflect that a buyers premium (+vat) is payable.
I do have sympathy for the OP as the results must have been disappointing but generally things will nearly always find their value. Sounds like the Chinese vases were over-valued by the Auction House. and remember you can INSIST on having a reserve even if they do not recommend it. You are the customer, remember! |
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Cheers for clearing that up.
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I go to a lot of auctions and it certainly looks a good business to be in as they take a decent bite out of each end.But the better auctions are usually worth the fees because they have a good trade reputation and therefore attract serious buyers. I buy silver from fairs,ebay and rubbish auctions and put it back through a local auction house that I know will usually get the best price.The advice for you to not set a reserve was rubbish advice especially with a highish estimate.There is always a risk that the right buyers are not in the room so a reserve is essential.
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Dobbo you find that northern auctions still offer better value for buyers than the south?
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I don't venture up north these days I'm west midlands,but I think the reputation and quality of the auction house is the key to better prices rather than where it is.
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I don't venture up north these days I'm west midlands,but I think the reputation and quality of the auction house is the key to better prices rather than where it is.
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is there a list of auction centres anywhere?
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google "the saleroom"
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Must be. I had a book of auction houses and antique shops addresses which the wife accidently threw out.
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UKAuctioneers.com is another DV
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My nearest auction is owned By Anita Manning of Bargain Hunt fame
but I gather she only takes the gavel when the cameras are there. Cant prove it but I suspect dealers will ramp up prices for each other when they see newbies bidding. |
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If you are new to an auction you are always liable to the tactics of the local dealers ring. If they see you bidding they will keep bidding against you making you pay top dollar for something. If you drop out and they end up as last bid they meet up afterwards and divide the extra they've had to pay between them. Similarly when they've discouraged the new people and there is something in the sale worth buying they do not bid against each other to get the item very cheaply and then auction it between themselves after the sale. In this case they divide the profit . Illegal but very difficult to prove and stop particularly if the auctioneer is in the ring as a lot are.
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