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Hello forumites
I don't usually post but am at my wits end, I know there are some well informed people on here and am interested in differing views on my situation.
I live in a 4 in a block, 2 up 2 down kind of property, they are all privately owned but in May 2012 my downstairs neighbour went to live with her son/grandchildren and rented her property out.
There is now a family living there that don't work, at least 6 of them, they have other family close by who all are popping in and out every day so it seems more like theres about 12 of them. They originate from one of the lower class areas of my city (Edinburgh) (and sorry to sound like a snob) and have gradually turned the area surrounding our property into something resembling a skip. They are up until an average of 4am, the noise isn't what you would call ridiculous but is enough to prevent me from sleeping, doors opening, the wife coughing every 3 mins, telly on etc.
Ever since they moved in I have had confrontation with the guy which has escalated each time, the last time being 2 weeks ago when I thought at one point blows were about to be exchanged. The situation has left me feeling that I have no alternative but to sell up and move, but who would want to buy my "hell", IMO my property price must be affected by having to live next door to this.
I have been in contact with the letting agent who is meant to be contacting me again after sounding quite wishy washy about it 1st time I spoke with him. I am beginning to think about actually fighting to retain my property and trying to get them out, my solutions being to threaten legal action against the landlord for devaluing my property, to find faults with the property which the landlord would be 50% responsible for, or to go down the anti social behaviour route.
I hate reading long posts myself so I'll leave it there
Your comments/advice appreciated even if you think I'm wrong here.
I don't usually post but am at my wits end, I know there are some well informed people on here and am interested in differing views on my situation.
I live in a 4 in a block, 2 up 2 down kind of property, they are all privately owned but in May 2012 my downstairs neighbour went to live with her son/grandchildren and rented her property out.
There is now a family living there that don't work, at least 6 of them, they have other family close by who all are popping in and out every day so it seems more like theres about 12 of them. They originate from one of the lower class areas of my city (Edinburgh) (and sorry to sound like a snob) and have gradually turned the area surrounding our property into something resembling a skip. They are up until an average of 4am, the noise isn't what you would call ridiculous but is enough to prevent me from sleeping, doors opening, the wife coughing every 3 mins, telly on etc.
Ever since they moved in I have had confrontation with the guy which has escalated each time, the last time being 2 weeks ago when I thought at one point blows were about to be exchanged. The situation has left me feeling that I have no alternative but to sell up and move, but who would want to buy my "hell", IMO my property price must be affected by having to live next door to this.
I have been in contact with the letting agent who is meant to be contacting me again after sounding quite wishy washy about it 1st time I spoke with him. I am beginning to think about actually fighting to retain my property and trying to get them out, my solutions being to threaten legal action against the landlord for devaluing my property, to find faults with the property which the landlord would be 50% responsible for, or to go down the anti social behaviour route.
I hate reading long posts myself so I'll leave it there
Your comments/advice appreciated even if you think I'm wrong here.
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your local council should have a dept that deals with bad neighbours, they can set up recording gear if required to get a conviction
I replied to a similar post some time ago. When i stated that you have to prepared to move at least
every 10 years just to get away from neighbours as the area goes downhill i was given some(mild) abuse!
Some even suggested that the fault was mine. It is simply modern Britain.
Always try and have the option of moving...nearly every area gets worse over time.
every 10 years just to get away from neighbours as the area goes downhill i was given some(mild) abuse!
Some even suggested that the fault was mine. It is simply modern Britain.
Always try and have the option of moving...nearly every area gets worse over time.
trouble is I don't know what their definition of "bad" is, all i know is that for me it's unbearable, I'm off work with stress, a lot of it caused by this, being at home more now is making me worse rather than better, it is no longer my sanctuary. I'm in a cycle thats now hard to break and am struggling to see a way out.
ultimately I really wanna pi$$ the landlord off to the point of selling, if you own something you take better care of it etc.
ultimately I really wanna pi$$ the landlord off to the point of selling, if you own something you take better care of it etc.
I know what it's like Omaruss we lived in a similar set up when we first got married. Fortunately I do not have any neighbours now.
Edinburgh has some new anti social laws,which can be enforced
where about?
where about?
lfc i agree with you to a degree
the property in question is the only 1 in the street as far as i know that is not owner occupied.
the property in question is the only 1 in the street as far as i know that is not owner occupied.
I have a lot of sympathy with the OP.
I too live on what would once of been called a "private estate" but now is a mix of mortgage payers, private renters and housing association tenants. For some reason the housing association people seem to be allergic of disposing of their own rubbish, maybe they just don't have the time(lol). I've had troublesome neighbours in the past but they have moved on when the pig got preggers again and needed a bigger house. No one is safe from these people as they can turn up on any street through an housing association. You don't even know when they are moving as there is no for sale sign, they just go and new people appear. No moving fees for them they just look on the swap board, pick a property and move,easy.
Average cost for moving house is 6.5k they move for zero and these days can end up on the best streets in town.
HOUSING ASSOCIATION TENANTS ARE COMING TO A HOUSE NEAR YOU!
NO ONE IS IMMUNE!!
CHECK THE SWAP BOARD
I too live on what would once of been called a "private estate" but now is a mix of mortgage payers, private renters and housing association tenants. For some reason the housing association people seem to be allergic of disposing of their own rubbish, maybe they just don't have the time(lol). I've had troublesome neighbours in the past but they have moved on when the pig got preggers again and needed a bigger house. No one is safe from these people as they can turn up on any street through an housing association. You don't even know when they are moving as there is no for sale sign, they just go and new people appear. No moving fees for them they just look on the swap board, pick a property and move,easy.
Average cost for moving house is 6.5k they move for zero and these days can end up on the best streets in town.
HOUSING ASSOCIATION TENANTS ARE COMING TO A HOUSE NEAR YOU!
NO ONE IS IMMUNE!!
CHECK THE SWAP BOARD
yh steve
it pretty much makes in pointless even considering buying a property in a good area now, some might even say it's added grief in the long run.
it pretty much makes in pointless even considering buying a property in a good area now, some might even say it's added grief in the long run.
im guessing northfield farm rd or northfield drive
the area is pretty decent on the whole
3/4 owners renters in your stair,need to get together,write letter to council,also does the owner hav the legal rights to rent out property?
I stay up fountainbrige,15 flat tenement,guy in groundfloor was a a constant nuisance,we got risd of him in 7 months
the area is pretty decent on the whole
3/4 owners renters in your stair,need to get together,write letter to council,also does the owner hav the legal rights to rent out property?
I stay up fountainbrige,15 flat tenement,guy in groundfloor was a a constant nuisance,we got risd of him in 7 months
steve,your so right about housing asscociation,one of them in my stair wasn't paying the rent,so they wanted him out,they asked me to write down any anti social,i said no you got them in do it yourself
its Mountcastle Gdns xmoneyx
interesting point about legal rights to rent out, i just assumed that anyone could rent out their own property, any idea how i would find that out ?
interesting point about legal rights to rent out, i just assumed that anyone could rent out their own property, any idea how i would find that out ?
property insurance wont pay out on fire,if tenents are diff to whats on mortgage
say to edin council your worried about legalities of all the properties if something was to happen
say to edin council your worried about legalities of all the properties if something was to happen
xmoneyx........on mortgage or title deeds ?
i dont know, but lets assume she owns it outright
my dad used to rent out my grans house and gave me a "Landlord Pre Letting Checklist" used by his agent.
It says under "Remainder of items to be completed prior to installing a tenant"
"Make arrangements for suitable Buildings Insurance Cover"
I would presume that this is something she would have to have had done, but if what you are saying is true then her insurance would be invalid.
i dont know, but lets assume she owns it outright
my dad used to rent out my grans house and gave me a "Landlord Pre Letting Checklist" used by his agent.
It says under "Remainder of items to be completed prior to installing a tenant"
"Make arrangements for suitable Buildings Insurance Cover"
I would presume that this is something she would have to have had done, but if what you are saying is true then her insurance would be invalid.
What do the other two occupiers in your block make of it ?
Burton-Brewers
23 Aug 13 17:10
I know what it's like Omaruss we lived in a similar set up when we first got married. Fortunately I do not have any neighbours now.
All buried under the patio (NAP)
23 Aug 13 17:10
I know what it's like Omaruss we lived in a similar set up when we first got married. Fortunately I do not have any neighbours now.
All buried under the patio (NAP)
Biscar
I spoke to the neighbour who lives next door to them the other day. Unfortunately the sounds at night dont seem to be an issue, the noise seems to travel up the wall rather than through it.
It didn't stop her saying though that she has seen the tribal gatherings going on and felt very sorry for us. The other trouble is she doesnt really see their mess because of fencing.
I spoke to the neighbour who lives next door to them the other day. Unfortunately the sounds at night dont seem to be an issue, the noise seems to travel up the wall rather than through it.
It didn't stop her saying though that she has seen the tribal gatherings going on and felt very sorry for us. The other trouble is she doesnt really see their mess because of fencing.
ok omaruss, I know the council like corroboration (the word the council used) from other neighbours when I spoke to them recently about my neighbour who blares music from a hot tub till the early hours.
I understand your plight, I am constantly muting the tv if I hear a noise wondering if f@nny features next door is out again.Your instinct says go round and sort him out but your sensible head says where does that get you.
They don't sound like people you could reason with and I dont think you should be spending your money on sorting them out, maybe Citizens Advice could help.
Good Luck dont let them get to you they are not worth it.
I understand your plight, I am constantly muting the tv if I hear a noise wondering if f@nny features next door is out again.Your instinct says go round and sort him out but your sensible head says where does that get you.
They don't sound like people you could reason with and I dont think you should be spending your money on sorting them out, maybe Citizens Advice could help.
Good Luck dont let them get to you they are not worth it.
cheers man
im emailing the council antisocial behaviour dept as I speak
im emailing the council antisocial behaviour dept as I speak
some of the best anti social neighbours is posh upmarket,what ive read in DM anyway 
You have my sympathies I've been in the same position only I was renting. The fact is there are some people who don't give a **** about anyone else and you can be as reasonable as you like but it doesn't have any effect.
My advice would be to contact the owner of the property if possible and keep hassling the agent and the council.
Don't fight battles you can't win, so if you have to cut your losses, get out, it's not worth damaging your health for scum like this.
My advice would be to contact the owner of the property if possible and keep hassling the agent and the council.
Don't fight battles you can't win, so if you have to cut your losses, get out, it's not worth damaging your health for scum like this.
There was a guy at my dads work who got told to take the job or lose his benefits. He was in his mid 40s, hadn't worked in over 10 years and going by what my dad said it had been even longer since he washed himself or brushed his teeth.
Anyway, he was remarkably open about his personal life and his girlfriend was a 20 something ex (or maybe not ex) hooker with 3 children and they were living in a 3 bedroom detached house in a new estate paid for by the social.
Noise gets on your t1ts and the worst bit is waiting for it. It's especially annoying in the middle of a 20 runner 5f handicap, am I right Biscar?
Anyway, he was remarkably open about his personal life and his girlfriend was a 20 something ex (or maybe not ex) hooker with 3 children and they were living in a 3 bedroom detached house in a new estate paid for by the social.
Noise gets on your t1ts and the worst bit is waiting for it. It's especially annoying in the middle of a 20 runner 5f handicap, am I right Biscar?
yh
it's trying to get out of it without enduring a massive financial hit though
it's trying to get out of it without enduring a massive financial hit though
Speak to the landlady and tell your not happy with the situation see what reaction you get........
YOU NEED TO GO THROUGH THE RIGHT CHANELL,CITIZENS ADVICE BEARU ETC,REMEMBER THERES LOTS OF PEOPLE GOING THROUGH WHAT YOUR GOING THROUGH,ITS MURDER AND CAN MAKE YOU VERY ILL ,IVE BEEN THERE ,SOMETIMES YOU FEEL AS THOUGH YOUR NOT A MAN ,BECAUSE YOUVE NOT PUNCHED THEM AND THAT LIFES UNFAIR ,TRY AND STAY CALM AND GO THROUGH THE RIGHT PROCEDURE AND IF THAT DOESNT WORK ,MOVE YOUR HEALTH MEANS MORE THAN MONEY
Good luck Omar. I had problems with music from my neighbour 10 years back. I kept calm about it while complaining to the right people. It is strange how these people get housed by the state...sad really.
I wish you luck
I wish you luck
Bollox why should he move because some scummy family canna see further than the end of the next can of cheap lager or 20 ****.........
Fight fire with fire
Fight fire with fire
THEY TURN THE RADIO UP ,YOU TURN THE RADIO UP ,THEY TURN IT UP LOUDER YOU TURN IT UP LOUDER ,YOU KNOCK ON THE WALL THEY KNOCK ON THE WALL ,THEY GET MORE DRUNK YOU GET MORE ILL ,
lol Diddy
thats the most prophetic thing i've ever read from you
so true
thats the most prophetic thing i've ever read from you
so true
11kv
the landlady is 80ish and is losing the plot, thinks now she's got an agent it's got nowt to do with her, it's another complication
the landlady is 80ish and is losing the plot, thinks now she's got an agent it's got nowt to do with her, it's another complication
Try and talk to the son maybe he can have a word with the letting agent but don't let them get the better of you I know it can be horrible but why should they be able just to turn up out of the blue and ruin what you have....
scare the bast***s,push a bar of soap through the letterbox
Omaruss, find out when universal credit comes into force in your locality, when it does the council will no longer be able to pay the rent direct to the landlord, but to the tenant. in parts of the country where this has happened the stupid morons who have never had to take responsibility for themselves just spend the rent money, I read recently that it's as much as 60% in danger of eviction. It will be the nail in the coffin for greedy selfish landlords.
thing that really bugs me is that ive had to work all my life to get to where i am (im 43), my property is probably worth circa £200,000. These fks just get given something they would never be able to afford, they even went to Disneyland a couple of months ago, I can barely afford to drive to work.
housing associations can kill property prices in days,they don't give a monkeys who's in them
Imagine saving like mad in your early twenties. Sacrificing many of the fun and exciting things in life so that you have a £20,000 deposit for mortgage, paying solicitors fees, stamp duty and feck knows what else, only to find that your 1st time buy has neighbours who are housing association type.
what a fecking mare
what a fecking mare
It's 1 of the many reasons this country is fooked Steve
the middle class white man is a dying breed
the middle class white man is a dying breed
First time buyer: Man i had to scrimp and save to get this place, plenty of overtime worked too i can tell ya.
Neighbour: Feck that sh1t i just looked at the swap board and thought i will try this place for 12 months. why not it didn't cost me a bean.
Neighbour: Feck that sh1t i just looked at the swap board and thought i will try this place for 12 months. why not it didn't cost me a bean.
from what youve said i doubt they are doing anything wrong. within reason, people are allowed to do what they want in their own home. and nothing youve said sounds unreasonable. i know its difficult, i had a situation where i could never sleep cos of the neighbours walking across a wooden floor. clomp clomp clomp. it drove me crazy. the problem you have is piss poor soundproofing. you got lucky that the people in before were quiet.
i would add that i listen to heavy metal, punk, all kinds of loud music. generally i use my headphones so not to piss people off, but the odd time i put music on without them. if a neighbour put their music/tv on really loud or banged on the walls etc to make a point, id put mine on even louder to **** them off. if they talked to me like im a human being, i would apologise and try to reach a compromise. being a bellend is highly unlikely to achieve a positive response.
I totally agree with your people being allowed to do what they want in their own home to a point.
As for apologising and trying to reach a compromise
A. I have nothing to apologise for
B. The relationship between me and him has got to a stage where he tries to intimidate me, i'm wondering if I need to be "tooled up" when I go outside now.
It's very much a case of they go or I go now, but as has been said already, that costs me money , it doesn't cost them.
As for apologising and trying to reach a compromise
A. I have nothing to apologise for
B. The relationship between me and him has got to a stage where he tries to intimidate me, i'm wondering if I need to be "tooled up" when I go outside now.
It's very much a case of they go or I go now, but as has been said already, that costs me money , it doesn't cost them.
yeah i think you have.
you shouldnt feel intimidated. thats not good. i honestly think your main problem is the poor soundproofing. you cant expect everybody who moves in to be little old ladies who never do anything. i was in a flat that was the same, you could hear them walking, shagging, coughing, running the tap, everything. it was made worse cos they took the carpet up and put down a wooden floor.
even if they move out you could easily have a similar situation again. moving out is probably your best option. though how you find somewhere with better sound proofing i dont know. im looking to move again soon and its something that really concerns me. i know how bad it gets when you cant sleep for noise.
you shouldnt feel intimidated. thats not good. i honestly think your main problem is the poor soundproofing. you cant expect everybody who moves in to be little old ladies who never do anything. i was in a flat that was the same, you could hear them walking, shagging, coughing, running the tap, everything. it was made worse cos they took the carpet up and put down a wooden floor.
even if they move out you could easily have a similar situation again. moving out is probably your best option. though how you find somewhere with better sound proofing i dont know. im looking to move again soon and its something that really concerns me. i know how bad it gets when you cant sleep for noise.
I sympathise with your situation mate. Nothing worse than anti social neighbours when all you want is some peace and quiet in life.
your annoyed by their coughing and the other neighbours dont seem to find much to get involved about your not being a tiny bit sensitive?
You believe it will be impossible to move but the other neighbours seem unfazed by them so why would a potential buyer?
You believe it will be impossible to move but the other neighbours seem unfazed by them so why would a potential buyer?
Take legal action to quiten them? and you know it probably wont work long term, and if you have to sell subsequently to alleviate the problem, you may be legaly bound to tell the potential buyer you've took the quite exceptional route of going to court because things were so dire. I think they'd of guessed going to court hadn't worked because your in the process of selling up. If your the potential buyer in that position would you buy the house?
You should try living around here. At night, I get my entertainment watching the world pass by from my garden. How could I explain it better 
Sort of live version of "SHAMELESS" 
Sort of live version of "SHAMELESS"
rent your place out to a large extended somalian family, and go on a holiday.
".... my solutions being to threaten legal action against the landlord for devaluing my property!"
See how far that gets in court, and no wonder the guy wants to batter you!
Problem seems to be generational.
Young people who see the place as home, like music, and watch BBC News 24 at 4am (someone has to watch it). And an old codger who see's the property as nothing more that his investment, but is too tight to have the walls sound insulated.
See how far that gets in court, and no wonder the guy wants to batter you!
Problem seems to be generational.
Young people who see the place as home, like music, and watch BBC News 24 at 4am (someone has to watch it). And an old codger who see's the property as nothing more that his investment, but is too tight to have the walls sound insulated.
"They originate from one of the lower class areas of my city (Edinburgh)!"
Compelling evidence in court!
Compelling evidence in court!
I would be very cautious of buying property, and especially a flat, in Britain because there is a very good
chance of getting major stress from neighbours. It is best to have a quick escape route from...well nearly
everyone actually!
chance of getting major stress from neighbours. It is best to have a quick escape route from...well nearly
everyone actually!
"They originate from one of the lower class areas of my city (Edinburgh)!"
Compelling evidence in court!
just roll the film trainspotting
Compelling evidence in court!
just roll the film trainspotting
Terrible situation a 200k property too as well, ouch. The DSS lot are getting everywhere nowadays no area is safe. It's one of the reasons I'm hesitant to buy. They can bring an area down very quickly. I would come down hard on the agent, middle-man and the landlady if you can get hold of her be relentless until the problem dominates their lives as well as yours. Things will happen.
northernlad
Firstly, wall insulation is designed to trap heat not sound, your ignorant brain was probably trying to think of the word deafening which sits it the gap between their ceiling and my floorboards, Im afraid it is impossible to insert anything into solid brick.
You sound like the sort who probably wants to move in with them tbh
and I don't think courts troll the betfair forum just to see if i've said anything "controversial"
Firstly, wall insulation is designed to trap heat not sound, your ignorant brain was probably trying to think of the word deafening which sits it the gap between their ceiling and my floorboards, Im afraid it is impossible to insert anything into solid brick.
You sound like the sort who probably wants to move in with them tbh
and I don't think courts troll the betfair forum just to see if i've said anything "controversial"
More of this will happen in the too near future, You can blame the BEDROOM TAX for this.
Omawhatever,
Sound insulation, you know? Like what Heavy Metal bands use in their recording studio's.
When I was a kid me & my mates (we were a punk band)sound insulated the garage by gluing the bottom of hundreds of eggs boxes to the walls - very effective!.
Besides you said in your original post the noise wasn't "ridiculous", now you say it's "deafening". Make up your mind because the court will probably see through your contradictions - unreliable witness!
Sound insulation, you know? Like what Heavy Metal bands use in their recording studio's.
When I was a kid me & my mates (we were a punk band)sound insulated the garage by gluing the bottom of hundreds of eggs boxes to the walls - very effective!.
Besides you said in your original post the noise wasn't "ridiculous", now you say it's "deafening". Make up your mind because the court will probably see through your contradictions - unreliable witness!
"Deafening" is the name given to material placed inbetween their ceiling and my floorboards u ignoramus, i did not say their noise was deafening.
hundreds of egg boxes glued to my walls, that will look really attractive, should increase my property value 10 fold that idea. Thanks for the great advice.
hundreds of egg boxes glued to my walls, that will look really attractive, should increase my property value 10 fold that idea. Thanks for the great advice.
Tell them to get a nice chiminea to burn all that wood and they can have a few barbecues out in the garden til 3am in the morning with a few friends
EMR
i believe the area where that would lies is actually classed as my secondary fire exit
more likely to be the cause of a fire
i believe the area where that would lies is actually classed as my secondary fire exit
more likely to be the cause of a fire
count yourself lucky that they have trimmed the shrubs
It's been better than the photos show and its been worse, thats just what its like atm.
I wish I had a photo of what it was like before they moved in, then you would really see the difference.
I wish I had a photo of what it was like before they moved in, then you would really see the difference.
northernlad5 Make sure they're free range eggboxes. .
I was involved in the sound Insulation at the Hilton hotel Heathrow, (then the Sterling)the jumbo jets revved up just a few hundred meters away behind Buffalo fencing which was useless, they wanted 80 decibels rating, but relented when we did a mock up demonstrating that the room would just be an echo chamber, settled for 68. the cost is out of the question for house owners, and besides you still have the problems, of Impact noises,doors slamming etc, the place looking like a knackers yard, and the intimidation.
.I was involved in the sound Insulation at the Hilton hotel Heathrow, (then the Sterling)the jumbo jets revved up just a few hundred meters away behind Buffalo fencing which was useless, they wanted 80 decibels rating, but relented when we did a mock up demonstrating that the room would just be an echo chamber, settled for 68. the cost is out of the question for house owners, and besides you still have the problems, of Impact noises,doors slamming etc, the place looking like a knackers yard, and the intimidation.
the letting agent is meant to be seeing them next week, it'll be interesting to see if theres a mass clean up before he arrives, then as soon as he's gone it'll be back like this within a week.
Dont worry Omarus, most of those kids toys will be moved out of the garden and into the hallway come winter
you only really see half of what they actually have in these photos.
it all just sits there rain,shine,gales & snow
the kids toys i can handle, its all the other random crap that lies about
it all just sits there rain,shine,gales & snow
the kids toys i can handle, its all the other random crap that lies about
bonfire night will soon be here, A couple of old mattresses and a few old tyres would go down well with that wood come nov 5th.
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