Cheltenham Festival
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Plenty of darts yet STILL no Champion Chase or Gold Cup wins after years of trying.
Why cant Willie Wontie train top class chasers?
Why cant Willie Wontie train top class chasers?
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Manages to win the second rate Ryanair but cant win the big ones?
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Just a guess but I’d say it’s because there is always a better horse in the race.
Besides how the stewards didn’t overturn the result when Lord Windermere won is one of life’s great mysterys. |
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still wouldn't have felt like a win even if they did....Wylie agreed too.
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No wins for him or no wins for thee,who cares who wins if race's are enjoyable,what's the point in highlighting this fact,do you have an agenda of certain trainers that have beaten you're selection in other race's but this trainer is most prominent among them do you ever take an hour/day off from posting on here,I don't post much but like to read and can say have seen eric_morris in most books in this library
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Not a fan of factual debate i see.
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4 of the 15 runner field this year, over a quarter of the field could only manage one finisher who came 5th of 9. Staying chasers not a strength?
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In which case take advantage of your incredible insight and just lay your bank on every Mullins runner in a 3m plus grade 1 chase and you’ll soon be a millionaire.
Simples.  |
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I guess having so many hoses falling last week don't help in a trainers quest for chase winners.
Lost count how many, but I suspect somewhere between 10 and 20. |
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Actually had 10 horses fall last week, but 4 of those were hurdlers.
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Mullins had a shocking number of fallers last week - of the 27 fallers, 10 were Mullins.To put this another way, Mullins had 13% of the total runners but 37% of the total fallers. That reads very badly.
However people can get way too hung up on stats like these. These stats are an anomaly and not typical of his Cheltenham record over the years and there is no reason to believe he would have a similar rate of fallers in the future. While he may not have won a Gold Cup yet, he has trained 6 runners up, so its not as though he doesn't know how to train a top class chaser. His overall record is superb and he once again had a fantastic Cheltenham with 7 winners for 7 different owners which would suggest to me that he is now in a far healthier position than ever before. |
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It's going to be interesting watching Ricci going forward with regards to the great success he's enjoyed perhaps just petering out now and needing a new bunch of stars racing in his colours, both he and Wylie are in the same boat to a degree on that score.
Let's just see how things pan out if the glory horses providing the glory dry up a bit. |
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glory days
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Its too many fallers for a supposedly top trainer,simple as that.
I have always had the opinion that Nicholls and Henderson are the best at training horses to jump a fence. Mullins may have more ammo these days, but imo hes behind those two when it comes traning horses to jump fences. |
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Total Recall was out of his depth in the Gold Cup; he was also money-grabbing in his previous race prior to the Gold Cup ie a hurdle race - what the heck for?
I'm, without a shadow of a doubt, had he been owned by Ricci that would not have happened. A hurdle race before the Gold Cup? What was Mr Mullins thinking? Utterly bizarre. |
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Uhhh, perhaps he needed a run to bring him on.
The only reason he ran in the GC was because Mullins is desperate for a GC winner, so any horse likely is going to run in it, ideally he'd have been kept for the national but they couldn't afford that luxury. |
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Nothing bizarre about it at all. Mullins improved the horse beyond recognition. There was a 100k handicap hurdle and the horse was entitled to run off his old, pre-Mullins, hurdles mark and he duly bolted up.
I would assume the plan is still to run in the Grand National and he would look to have as good a chance as any other at this stage |
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Said before on here he cant train them to jump fences and needs to bring someone in. Countless decent hurdlers who havent made the transition to fences. The likes of Mikael D'Haguenet who you would have thought in the hands of a Nicholls would have been a top notch trainer.
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top notch chaser.
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Well Nicholls has about 200 of them in his hands so why is he not making some of them into top notch chasers?
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Top class hurdlers he doesnt have.
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That makes him very unlucky then.And Mullins must be just very lucky.
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Mikael D'Haguenet - Ballymore Hurdle winner
Fences - F53F4 Fell in the RSA, very talented horse could hardly jump a fence. |
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Is that it - Mikael D'haguenet?
What about Footpad, Un De Sceaux, Douvan, Min, Djakadam to name just some of his current chasers in training? |
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This pattern continues. Nicholls does extremely well with what he has. Won 2 King George's with Silviniaco Conti which is a tremendous training performance as the horse was not quite top class imo.
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Failed to win a Queen Mother with Douvan another example. Bad back from jumping issues?
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Nicholls not in Mullins class with hurdlers but the same other way around Mullins not in same class as Nicholls with chasers. This thread is about horses graduating to be champions over fences. Queen Mother and Gold Cup not the 2nd rate Ryanair.
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I accept that Nicholls was/is a great trainer. But I don't accept that, right now for whatever reason, he is doing well with what he has.Because the difference between Mullins/ Henderson and say Nicholls/King is that from similar numbers of horses and similar budgets, Mullins and Henderson(and Elliott) are leaving the rest behind when it comes to nurturing young talent into top class performers.
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Douvan failed to win because he dislocated his pelvis
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Perhaps he hasnt been taught to jump fences properly as with others in the past. It ties in with the higher proportion of fallers from the stable you noticed at the Festival though i am not saying that is the norm for the trainer at Cheltenham.
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Nicholls isnt getting the young talent now that he once had. If he gets it he, along with Henderson (and most recently Elliott) is highly likely to develop it very well to Championship level, Mullins isnt they tend to not graduate as with Douvan.
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I do remember watching Vautor winning the JLT and Ryanair and thinking to myself if only he was with a trainer who could teach horses to jump.
 And Florida Pearl was another who really struggled to get from one side of a fence to another. Maybe if his trainer had given him a season over hurdles first he might have done better.  |
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Some horses are just natural though Uncle.
The fact is he does seem to have had a fair few that have struggled at the fences. |
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^^another anti Mullins get over UN de sceaux not appearing in champion hurdle
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Eric, thats just nonsense. Nicholls has the owners who have the money, he has about 200 horses in training and doesn't appear to have a proper grade 1 horse in his yard, and hasn't had one for a few years now. Mullins has about 30 grade 1 horses from the same numbers. And yet you are trying to tell us that Mullins' owners would be better off giving their horses to Nicholls! In your world maybe.
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Personally think Mullins chasers would do just as well, maybe even better with Nicholls.
May even have won a Gold Cup or two or Queen Mum between them. |
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You can only laugh at the bitterness on here. Nicholls can't win anything more than egg and spoon races with 200 horses. Mullins is mopping up top races with his 200. So the conclusion some of you are drawing therefore has to be that Nicholls is doing really well with what he has, overachieving even, while Mullins is underachieving! Wonderful
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I'd love to see O'Learys chaser wins to runs percentage when with WM and then after departure ...
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Yet again lets remind ourselves this is about producing Championship chase winners, ie Champion Chase and Queen Mother from high quality top class hurdlers.
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Champion Chase and Gold Cup
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