Cheltenham Festival
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18 Feb 14
01:48
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28 Jun 10
It's a genuine question not designed to impugn his reputation but I ask sincerely. Of course he is a very talented trainer who makes a wonderful living from the game and he's a leader in the field but for me something seems to be missing. Call it love. Call it the romance of the game. Call it what you will but I think he must have lost that ability to see the game from a child's or indeed a casual viewers perspective. That simple joyful and joyous experience of the best taking on the best and one of them emerging victorious on that one day that really matters. Ali/Frazier, Grundy/Bustino, Coe/Ovett, Denman/Kauto, Borg/McEnroe. For the racing man or woman there are times when you say to hell with the bet I need to watch this race.
Not everybody is a pounds, shillings and pence man but it seems that Mullins does know about price but not value. Potentially we have a race for the ages coming upon us in three weeks time. A good case can be made for at least seven of the runners and yet two of the most intriguing of those are unlikely to be there. Imagine if you turned to a footballer after the cup final and asked how he got on and he turned around and said, Oh I didn't fancy it. I thought I'd give it another year. I might be a better player then.
There is no tomorrow. Only today and if you are already that close to touching greatness as these two undoubtedly are then only a blooody fool would deprive you of that chance. I'm a betting man but the time when I was bellowing loudest at the top of my voice was when Denman and Kauto came down that hill together in front slugging it out like prizefighters and yet I didn't have a bet.
You can't buy memories and you don't touch greatness unless you reach for it. If Mullins deprives Cheltenham of the spectacle of a front runner with the power of UDS and the top rated horse allowing for her mares allowance then even if he wins with The Fly he deserves to walk back to a silent grand stand. Of course he won't because racing people do know the value of some things.
Not everybody is a pounds, shillings and pence man but it seems that Mullins does know about price but not value. Potentially we have a race for the ages coming upon us in three weeks time. A good case can be made for at least seven of the runners and yet two of the most intriguing of those are unlikely to be there. Imagine if you turned to a footballer after the cup final and asked how he got on and he turned around and said, Oh I didn't fancy it. I thought I'd give it another year. I might be a better player then.
There is no tomorrow. Only today and if you are already that close to touching greatness as these two undoubtedly are then only a blooody fool would deprive you of that chance. I'm a betting man but the time when I was bellowing loudest at the top of my voice was when Denman and Kauto came down that hill together in front slugging it out like prizefighters and yet I didn't have a bet.
You can't buy memories and you don't touch greatness unless you reach for it. If Mullins deprives Cheltenham of the spectacle of a front runner with the power of UDS and the top rated horse allowing for her mares allowance then even if he wins with The Fly he deserves to walk back to a silent grand stand. Of course he won't because racing people do know the value of some things.
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Eeter,
The greatest speech in living memory.....and then you had to bring the mares allowance into it
The greatest speech in living memory.....and then you had to bring the mares allowance into it
I agree also. Denman v Kauto a point in fact, same trainer different ownership.
Big Bucks / Annie Power coming over the last will get the Cheltenham crowd roaring.
Cecil never raced Frankel outside of his comfort zone. Clearly another who had no love for his sport
Yeah Frankel skipped a bunch of Group 1s eh?
What was that reason he skipped the Guineas again?
Annie Power ain't good enough for the Champion Hurdle. Who has she actually beat over 2 miles?
Her ratings are all based on beating likes of Zarkandar etc who wouldn't be placed. The Aintree Hurdle is the perfect race for her.
Un De Sceaux on the other hand should be in the Champ as he is clearly good enough to compete
Her ratings are all based on beating likes of Zarkandar etc who wouldn't be placed. The Aintree Hurdle is the perfect race for her.
Un De Sceaux on the other hand should be in the Champ as he is clearly good enough to compete
His owners should remind him who pays his bills.
Feb 18, 2014 -- 11:25AM, Ballydoyle wrote:
Yeah Frankel skipped a bunch of Group 1s eh?What was that reason he skipped the Guineas again?
What was the reason he skipped the Arc?
Twice
Skipped Epsom too. Such a shame that Sir Henry had so little love for his sport
Yeah...his training of Frankel was really poor eh?
WALOFS
WALOFS
I'm not financially involved with either horse, but completely agree with the OP. If these two horses were trained elsewhere, they'd definitely both be running in the race.
yep.
I don't know exactly what his personal feelings are about the sport- love or whatever, but I do know his priority..........him!! well that's how it looks to me.
I don't know exactly what his personal feelings are about the sport- love or whatever, but I do know his priority..........him!! well that's how it looks to me.
To an extent there is a slight favour of the discussion relating to Frankel here but there is a crucial difference in that there was at least an issue which often raises it's head with the flat of stud value. There's none of that here and I'd argue that people like Mullins should look at the wider picture because there is nothing set in stone regarding the audience. Using another sport to illustrate the point MMA is building a large audience partly because it gives it's audience the match ups of the best taking on the best whereas boxing has suffered by the best often avoiding each other.
Just to clarify for those thinking I'm pocket talking I haven't had a bet and don't need to have a bet in this race to be looking forward to it more than any race for a long time.
Just to clarify for those thinking I'm pocket talking I haven't had a bet and don't need to have a bet in this race to be looking forward to it more than any race for a long time.
Sir Henry hardly mentioned the Derby or Arc once re Frankel. It's 3 weeks to go and this muppet still claims all options are open to Annie Power which is erm bollox. She sin't gonna run in the Champion Hurdle unless something happens to the Fly and she ain't gonna run in the Mares if something happens to Quevega. End of.
All things considered I'd guess that Mullins loves the sport.
I tend to agree with that view but I'd say good luck if you are betting on here if she gets as buzzy as she did at Doncaster. She's has an unusual stayers prep for sure.
There's none of that here and I'd argue that people like Mullins should look at the wider picture because there is nothing set in stone regarding the audience.
Absolutely spot on.
His jockey said the other week that he aint really bothered about us and what we think(or words to that effect)...mullins is the same.
He needs to think what his attitude within his monopoly is doing to the sport and the effect its having not only on the festival,but virtually every big race in Ireland throughout the season.
owners need to wise up too!!!
Absolutely spot on.
His jockey said the other week that he aint really bothered about us and what we think(or words to that effect)...mullins is the same.
He needs to think what his attitude within his monopoly is doing to the sport and the effect its having not only on the festival,but virtually every big race in Ireland throughout the season.
owners need to wise up too!!!
The real problem is with the owners. They really should have the final say. If they are quite happy for Mullins to make them look foolish he will continue unchecked.
Somehow I can't see him dictating to Rich Ricci in the way he seems to have done with the owner of Un De Sceaux.
Imagine if all the Ricci horses left, wouldn't be such a king pin would he?
Somehow I can't see him dictating to Rich Ricci in the way he seems to have done with the owner of Un De Sceaux.
Imagine if all the Ricci horses left, wouldn't be such a king pin would he?
Can see Annie Power going off at 6-4 in the Stayers and as a holder at 6-1 I would lay off.
Denman v Kauto comparison is totally different, they were the same age and could only run in the gold cup against each other.....HF and the other two are at completely different ends of their careers with way more options open to them......and in any case, going back to Kauto, nicholl's did get criticised for not giving him the chance to carry top weight in a hennessy...perhaps he never had any love for the sport either....after all, what a sight that would have been.
Does Mullins want to win the CH...Yes
If you fully subscribe to the notion that Mullins is keeping UDS and AP away from the CH to smooth the way for HF then you are accusing him of blatantly cheating his owners....let's see if those owners believe that also.
Does Mullins want to win the CH...Yes
If you fully subscribe to the notion that Mullins is keeping UDS and AP away from the CH to smooth the way for HF then you are accusing him of blatantly cheating his owners....let's see if those owners believe that also.
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Mr Mischief 18 Feb 14 11:52 Joined: 01 Nov 09 | Topic/replies: 2,301 | Blogger: Mr Mischief's blog
Feb 18, 2014 -- 11:25AM, Ballydoyle wrote:
Yeah Frankel skipped a bunch of Group 1s eh?What was that reason he skipped the Guineas again?
What was the reason he skipped the Arc?
Twice
Mr Mischief 18 Feb 14 11:55 Joined: 01 Nov 09 | Topic/replies: 2,301 | Blogger: Mr Mischief's blog
Skipped Epsom too. Such a shame that Sir Henry had so little love for his sport.
Sometimes its important to know facts about a horse before making ridiculous statements.
Anyone with the slightest knowledge of horse racing will know Frankel was a coiled spring as a three year old. Watch the Guineas again. His jockey had no chance in trying to settle him.
It was a great feat by the stable to get him to win what he did. There was no way in the world they could send him over a distance beyond a mile in his classic season.
As a four year old he was slightly easier to train but 12f would still be risky. Of course we want to see horses pushed to their limits but you have to appreciate what goes on behind the scenes.
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Mr Mischief 18 Feb 14 11:52 Joined: 01 Nov 09 | Topic/replies: 2,301 | Blogger: Mr Mischief's blog
Feb 18, 2014 -- 11:25AM, Ballydoyle wrote:
Yeah Frankel skipped a bunch of Group 1s eh?What was that reason he skipped the Guineas again?
What was the reason he skipped the Arc?
Twice
Mr Mischief 18 Feb 14 11:55 Joined: 01 Nov 09 | Topic/replies: 2,301 | Blogger: Mr Mischief's blog
Skipped Epsom too. Such a shame that Sir Henry had so little love for his sport.
Sometimes its important to know facts about a horse before making ridiculous statements.
Anyone with the slightest knowledge of horse racing will know Frankel was a coiled spring as a three year old. Watch the Guineas again. His jockey had no chance in trying to settle him.
It was a great feat by the stable to get him to win what he did. There was no way in the world they could send him over a distance beyond a mile in his classic season.
As a four year old he was slightly easier to train but 12f would still be risky. Of course we want to see horses pushed to their limits but you have to appreciate what goes on behind the scenes.
If you fully subscribe to the notion that Mullins is keeping UDS and AP away from the CH to smooth the way for HF then you are accusing him of blatantly cheating his owners....let's see if those owners believe that also.
Indeed
They pay the piper - they should call the tune but if he doesn't enter their charges in valuable races they're capable of winning, I hope they have the good grace to never whinge about prize money.
Indeed
They pay the piper - they should call the tune but if he doesn't enter their charges in valuable races they're capable of winning, I hope they have the good grace to never whinge about prize money.
Not the way he was Alleged no.
He would have been a spent force with 2f to go. He was impossible to settle and would never last 12f.
Before he set foot on a racecourse he was close to having the chop because they could not settle him.
If you read the trouble they had with him you will acknowledge the hard work team Cecil had to fulfil his potential.
He would have been a spent force with 2f to go. He was impossible to settle and would never last 12f.
Before he set foot on a racecourse he was close to having the chop because they could not settle him.
If you read the trouble they had with him you will acknowledge the hard work team Cecil had to fulfil his potential.
when he won by 11 lengths over a mile at ascot as a 2 yr old, in a group 2 was it, I thought he,d be a middle distance horse. 
Duffy
Denman v Kauto comparison is totally different, they were the same age and could only run in the gold cup against each other.....HF and the other two are at completely different ends of their careers with way more options open to them......and in any case, going back to Kauto, nicholl's did get criticised for not giving him the chance to carry top weight in a hennessy...perhaps he never had any love for the sport either....after all, what a sight that would have been.
As much history as the Hennessy has you can't compare it to a gold cup. My comment about Denman/Kauto was more though to do with the spectacle it created and the buzz of the race itself. If you had a young inexperienced horse you might hold off on a gold cup. That's fair enough. This isn't the case with either UDS or Annie though. Both at six are the ideal age for taking this race in and both have shown the kind of class which suggests that both would have excellent chances of carrying off the big one.
Denman v Kauto comparison is totally different, they were the same age and could only run in the gold cup against each other.....HF and the other two are at completely different ends of their careers with way more options open to them......and in any case, going back to Kauto, nicholl's did get criticised for not giving him the chance to carry top weight in a hennessy...perhaps he never had any love for the sport either....after all, what a sight that would have been.
As much history as the Hennessy has you can't compare it to a gold cup. My comment about Denman/Kauto was more though to do with the spectacle it created and the buzz of the race itself. If you had a young inexperienced horse you might hold off on a gold cup. That's fair enough. This isn't the case with either UDS or Annie though. Both at six are the ideal age for taking this race in and both have shown the kind of class which suggests that both would have excellent chances of carrying off the big one.
Feb 18, 2014 -- 12:23PM, Eeternaloptimist wrote:
To an extent there is a slight favour of the discussion relating to Frankel here but there is a crucial difference in that there was at least an issue which often raises it's head with the flat of stud value. There's none of that here and I'd argue that people like Mullins should look at the wider picture because there is nothing set in stone regarding the audience. Using another sport to illustrate the point MMA is building a large audience partly because it gives it's audience the match ups of the best taking on the best whereas boxing has suffered by the best often avoiding each other.Just to clarify for those thinking I'm pocket talking I haven't had a bet and don't need to have a bet in this race to be looking forward to it more than any race for a long time.
So stud value, the business of commerce in other words, is a mitigating factor here for some and not for others. This love of sport you allude to in your thread title must be a fine thing indeed
Compare Mullins to Nicholls who's happy to take on Big Bucks with Zarkandar and Celestial Halo. Salubrious and Saphir Du Rheu both possibles too. The first two very credible challengers to the favourite. I agree Mullins does not endear himself to the racing public. Un De Sceaux should race in the Champion Hurdle. The excuse for not running is not very believable.
I'd also agree that Frankel was not campaigned very aggressively. Whatever about running over 1m 4f, he should have raced in an Irish Champion or a Prix Du Moulin. His consistency and his eyecatching brilliance marked him out but it would have been nice had he been asked to prove his versatility both in terms of travel and race distance.
I'd also agree that Frankel was not campaigned very aggressively. Whatever about running over 1m 4f, he should have raced in an Irish Champion or a Prix Du Moulin. His consistency and his eyecatching brilliance marked him out but it would have been nice had he been asked to prove his versatility both in terms of travel and race distance.
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