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Thanks - excellent stuff - will compare with my assessment and see where we differ.
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this was my analysis using a similar method of statistics.
1st 4 last time out (16/20) Finished 1st, 2nd or 3rd in last 2 completed start (18/20) Aged 7 - 10 (26/29) Carried 11st or less (13/16) including last 11 winners Carried 11st 2lbs or less (26/29) Rated at least 127 (20/20) Rated 146 or less (18/20) the last 11 were 143 or less (11/11) Never won off a higher hcap mark than the one running off (18/20) RPR of at least 134+ this season (18/20) Ran in the last 66 days (18/20) Ran in a Graded / listed / Grade A (C1) chase (18/20) Won a chase over at least 2m4f (20/20) Won a chase over at least 2m7f (18/20) Won at least a class 3 chase (16/16) Ran in between 4 and 29 chases (19/20) Won between 2 and 9 chases (20/20) Won by a 1st - 4th season chaser (19/20) If ran at Cheltenham before had finished in the 1st 3 at least once (14/16) exeption was 4th in this race and 4th in cleeve hurdle Started career over jumps (19/20) Blazing bailey x18/20 or x26/29 weight x19/20 flat bred Rare bob x18/20 or x26/29 weight x14/16 chelt form Chief dan george x18/20 or x26/29 weight x26/29 age Great endeavour x18/20 or x26/29 weight x18/20 dist Fair along x18/20 or x26/29 weight x19/20 flat bred Tatenen x18/20 or x26/29 weight x16/20 last time Caroles leagacy x26/29 weight x11/11 or Exmoor ranger x11/11 or x16/20 last time x13/16 weight Bensalem x18/20 dist x20/20 chase wins x13/16 weight Crescent Island x16/20 last time x18/20 dist Reve De Sivola x16/20 last time x26/29 age x20/20 chase wins King Fontaine x19/20 last time Sunnyhillboy x18/20 dist x18/20 sr Ogee x18/20 form x19/20 flat bred Quantitiveeasing x26/29 age x14/16 chelt form x19/20 chase runs Far More Serious x26/29 age x14/16 chelt form x18/20 graded run Razor royale x16/20 last time x18/20 form x18/20 rpr The Sawyer x16/20 last time x26/29 age x19/20 chase runs Skippers Brig x13/16 weight Definity x20/20 chase wins x18/20 chase runs x18/20 dist Slippers percy x18/20 rpr x20/20 chase wins Swing Bill x18/20 dist x19/20 flat bred Den of iniquity x16/20 last time x14/16 chelt form x18/20 sr Adams Island Gentle Ranger x19/20 last time x18/20 rpr x18/20 sr The Rainbow Hunter x20/20 chase wins x18/20 dist x18/20 graded run Pomme Tiepy x16/20 last time x14/16 chelt form The Sliotar x19/20 last time x18/20 form x20/20 chase wins Safari Adventures x19/20 last time x18/20 dist Carrickmines x14/16 chelt form No panic x16/20 last time x18/20 form x18/20 rpr Amygayle x16/20 last time x14/16 chelt form Le burf x16/20 last time x18/20 form x18/20 dist Frankie anson x20/20 or x20/20 wins x18/20 dist Wolf moon x20/20 or x20/20 wins x18/20 grade ran Ballyvesey x20/20 or x20/20 wins x26/29 age Quattrocento x20/20 or x16/20 last time x18/20 graded run SHORTLIST Skippers brig Adams island Carrickmines |
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I made an error and eliminated Adams Island at the final stage for not having won a class 3 race (I checked again, and he has), so he's been re-instated as a selection alomg with Skippers Brig (following the defection of both Junior and Billie Magern).
Thanks! |
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I Like king Fontaine @ 40/1 how does he fit with the trends?
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stats stats stats..... after clouting every second fence Bensalem wins hard on the snaff and theyll be pullin birch out of his legs for the following week
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LOL ive spent 2 hours on this race and was gutted when i saw this thread but thankfully mines isnt fancied. Will post him tomo once ive got my wedge on.
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HI EC.....Historical trends for the 2009 fest W Hill,may be useful to compare against your own
Irish poor 2wins 2 places in 16 yrs 16/16 winners Official Rating between 127-150 15/16 won over at least 3 miles 14/17 max weight 10st 12lb 11/17 won h,cap from nov onwards Only one novice winner 2004 No fav since 1994 11/16 won handicap within last 3 starts 10/15 winners max 4 starts that season Prior to 2008 winner previous 11 no more than 66 days since last run Not had a good look yet.......keep up the good work EC and others,the winners in there just waiting,no screaming to be picked. |
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CV he was another one with Crescent Island I was going to mention as a maybe. Scores 13... but two of the four failures are down to his poor performance last time. If you forgive that run then he's definitely a contender and remains progressive.
When the market was initially reinstated this morning he was at 200 at one point! |
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Thanks EC, I am a huge believer in forgiving a horse one bad run, even started a thread on it which I might dig up now.
Think he was going fine until that mistake at the 6th last then pulled up before the last. |
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good luck next week ec and thanks for the previews, i have no doubt your hard work will be rewarded
you mentioned ogee on one of your recent blog posts, is he out of the equation now or still one to keep onside? |
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i wonder if "steve" (the guy who won the jackpot at exeter) wastes his time looking through stats
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i wonder if "steve" would find the time what with having his nads licked by assorted ladies of the night 24 hours a day for the next ten years.........
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Stats for Cheltenaham is the worst form of backfitting during the year. How can previous results indicate future winners? Adams Island needs 6 miles in a bog to be at this best. He might win a Midlands National but he won't get in the the first ten in this race. Had Bensaelm or The Package won last year would we have backfitted a different selection? Just look at the market the front four are exactly the type of horse that are best equipped to win this race not a plodder that Rebecca Curtis is laying out for a National.
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Great Endeavour for me (backed yesterday at 9/1)
Trusting the gut with this one ![]() |
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Can any horse really be handicapped to win back to back festival handicaps?
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depends what they do during the yr i suppose
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Cheers Tucho - I definitely wouldn't rule him out as they mentioned he would come on for the run on saturday. However, I think there's a doubt he'd run in the race as I believe he's a horse they've often said takes quite a lot out of him. Guessing they just left him in so they can take a view last minute as they've mentioned alternative entries Aintree/Ayr.
Thanks TradeFair for the constructive insight. The fact the winners of the handicaps at last years festival were 33/1, 25/1, 18/1, 16/1, 16/1, 14/1, 14/1, 12/1, 9/1 and 4/1 suggest it's not that easy. Surely the fact that Adams Island could run such a good race against Captain Chris last time over 20f rounds Kempton means that considering he's a 6 miler he'll find improvement at Cheltenham over 3 miles+. FFT of the ones at the top Great Endeavour would by my first choice and an idea of a possible saver with a few outsiders. Bensalem still needs to prove he can jump and there has to be a worry how he's be finishing his races after a serious bout of pneumonia over the summer. Sunnyhillboy is a ridiculous price and is merely what it is because he's been tipped up by Hugh Taylor and is owned by JP McManus. Reve De Sivola is a horrible price as well - not well handicapped, question marks over trip and can't jump well enough. Great Endeavour on the other hand is well thought of having a GC entry and clearly needs decent ground. Step up in trip should suit being a PTP winner but as I have said it's not ideal stepping up in trip in such a competitive race. Also its been said they're going to put some headgear on him and as Steeplechasings post showed David Pipe is the headgear king. Other horses I've got on a longlist for a bet are; Fair Along - Should improve for faster run race compared to last time, loves the course. Bit high in weights though for a usual winner? Carole's Legacy - Worried about weight though, Fair Along seems classier off a similar weight Crescent Island - as mentioned Ogee - as mentioned Great Endevour - as mentioned King Fontaine - If last run forgiven he's up there |
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It is the regard in which Pipe holds the horse that has largely led me to back him. Backed off the boards for the PP and disappointed (Timmy's frustration said it all imo given what he did up the run in) There was also talk of him going for the Paddy Power and Hennessey double at one point
Ok he received a lot of weight from Poq nto but he ran on well all the way to the line, which leads me to believe a step up will suit. |
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His run the last day was fine but it was a 3 runner race and Captain Chris could have won as far as he liked. Adams Island's jumping went to pieces in Ffos Las and a fast pace around Cheltenham in a big field will find him out. I'd much rather than ran the horse in the Midlands National in uttoxeter.
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BENSALEM is the bet of the festival for me!!im absolutely lumping on, on the day!!
gl |
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paddy power fallers insurance might be worth doin??????????
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haha hey rev!! i hear ya but im goin all or nothin! backed him last year and watched him go odds on , practically counting my winnings, was about to spread eagle the field imo! have to back him! always liked the horse but youre right he cant jump
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horse I like is Ogee(20s on the book).
ran well in this last year and would have been closer but for a couple of bad mistakes. GL |
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il show him what a "cant jump"er is when i get out
ah no id say he has a live chance alright. lovely horse. av u any antepost bets on |
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hold on, be holy divine and sufferin jeaysus what has reve at 12/1 4th fav? sum1 knows more van wharr i know me finks
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![]() well everyman and his dog knows about him im suppose but i really fancy him to win off 143 if he stays on his feet(which is unlikely )absolutely none rev, ive only bet once antepost in my life and that was on fame and glory in the irish derby after i heard sts wouldnt be goin[;)]........! just dont bother as i like to play i-r in a lot of races and basically dont wanna do my dough! how bout u? |
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not big on antepost either, did one the other day tho. 50 quid each way double on for non stop and zarkandar. pays 2k if both win. i wouldnt back ap yonks before a race tho. id be well pissed off if i didnt even back a horse that was runnin
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yeah for non stops form with grand crus lookin pretty good right now and zakan could be v good indeed, backed hendos horse that finished 2nd to him lto.
also decided im not gonna back binocular , gonna chance my arm with dunguib i think, hes unlikely to win i think but he shouldve won the supreme, he jumped better fto this season , has course form and is relatively fresh and still an unknown quantity of sorts, he'll need a pace and to settle form the off but he has A chance! just cant be @rsed backing a 7/2 shot in such a competitive race tbh. like i went thru it and id give oscar whisky a good chance too, khyber kim(even tho beat last year, if he repeats that run and bino doesnt fire he'll be there) .thats my the way im approaching it anyway! |
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yeah i like both binocular and menorah, original i know but theres no way id touch em t the prices. dnt tink il back anythin in it tbh
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yeah v competitive! i think menorah is most solid at top as in never puts in a bad run!loves the course to boot!
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yeah. ive never seen a horse hurdle as quick as binocular though. shud b a cracker, most trainers are bullish
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yeah bino prob the most talented but he might not show it! then theres the fly, he'll be last off the bridle imo, will he get up the hill faster than the others , i dont know! prob not worth a bet but i like to have an interest in the big races!
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yer. u like anythin tmrw. i like watergate, julia too and spear thistle, although i think it might be a little far for spear thistle
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havent even looked tbh reve, although just a had a glimpse at the spear thistle race, i think he'll stay but he seems to like cut which he is unlikely to get tomorrow. i think NEIL HARVEY most likely winner! gl if u play tho!hope u win!
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i dont think he does, and is more likely to stay if its good imo. ah sure il see, really like about 5 but all shorties. il figure it out tmrw if im not busy taking over the world. good night
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ALTHOUGH with daryl on board its a huge plus, and i love him on my horses from the front! id expect it to trade odds on in the race, hes a brilliant jock from the front imo.
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night matey!
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amazing that in all this thread the one horse,sunnyhill boy that has been backed with real money hasnt ben mentioned once?..strange
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yeah he most likely will trade odds on. the way he rides u often think the horse is going better than it is. peter toole is doin really well for charlie too isnt he
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