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Johnny_Mustang
11 Oct 19 08:36
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Date Joined: 18 Feb 07
| Topic/replies: 13,695 | Blogger: Johnny_Mustang's blog
Thought it's about time we started one. So OK, here's what we have so far:

Blue Point
Masar
Calyx
Too Darn Hot
City Light
Inns of Court
Eqtidaar
Le Brivido
Land Force
Study of Man

We can play 'guess the fees' as we go along.......

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Replies: 34
By:
Formtwist
When: 12 Oct 19 23:07
Thanks for kicking this off Johnny-M. Some odd-balls in this list that wandered under my radar and I'm particularly perplexed by the new home of Land Force, plus the only fee announced seems to me something of an insult to hard-pressed breeders. Full marks to Kirsten Rausing for again landing a left-field fascinating stallion, fee will be the big question mark here, but interesting to observe that the home team Archipenko mares lined up to meet him will be inbred to the mighty Miesque. Eqtidaar has to shoulder the problem of his elder half-brother already active at Mickley, for all that the stud is generous enough with the fees. Can't help hoping there is more in the pipeline, especially if they go to good studs like Cheveley Park, who seem to be making space for more than one. Sadly Qatar seem to have nothing significant to replace Roaring Lion, for all that he was beyond my budget he was a superb individual.
By:
Johnny_Mustang
When: 13 Oct 19 08:35
Soldier's Call to Ballyhane although he was never going to go anywhere else.
By:
potentialmillionaire
When: 13 Oct 19 10:45
Soldiers Call is the one that immediately jumped out. Connections deserve credit for keeping him in training at 3 (god, why do I even have to say that) and for me he is enhanced Because of it.

The deciples of Lord Charles Manson are going to be sorely challenged to sign up for Land Force but the pied piper might pull it off as Cable Bay  has done respectably. But, really?

Le Brivido appeals slightly and Study of Man also. No real thought given tough yet.

The initial mares covered Stats for 2019 was illuminating on the lack of interest shown in some of the cheaper intake this year and I don't see the market in 2020 being anything but weaker still at the cheap,and cheerful end.

Extreme care required.
By:
Wilycayote
When: 13 Oct 19 21:25
I get the feeling Land Force is just a “plan B” if CB can’t do the job.
By:
yer ma
When: 14 Oct 19 09:30
BUYANOM.com

Potentially very interesting development.  If its creating a bit more of a free market it will surely drive the noms down (everywhere except the very top end).  I'm sure some studs are unamused.
By:
truehoncho
When: 14 Oct 19 09:45
How? If nominations are private how will that send a signal to the market?
By:
Johnny_Mustang
When: 14 Oct 19 12:13
I might set up a rival company: webuyanynoms.com
By:
zygote
When: 22 Oct 19 23:44
For me, Blue Point and Too Darn Hot are the only standouts in 2020. On a slight tangent, Shamardal has had a superb year and I wonder whether Darley will allow a few choice "outside" mares onto his dance card next season?
By:
potentialmillionaire
When: 02 Nov 19 11:04
Are we liking Advertise?
I am guessing they are going to get a little spicy with the fee.
I haven't seen him but I am hoping that there is a bit more of him than the usual Showcasing thang.
Any chance the front wheels are a little stronger too?
By:
yer ma
When: 02 Nov 19 14:29
Do you think the National Stud is the place to be?  4 new stallions.  Two owned by a somewhat flacky operation.  Fees show now sign of being set in a smaller (any?) breeder or market reality so I'd guess they'll go for 30k.

I'm considering Calyx instead if the fee difference is significant.  Land Force would be interesting if cheap and Study of Man but if I fear the NS you can imagine my view on Lanwades!  (and they'll price him too high)
By:
truehoncho
When: 02 Nov 19 15:11
He is very good looking PotM. He should do well in Newmarket and probably good value compared to the likes of Blue Point.
By:
potentialmillionaire
When: 02 Nov 19 15:52
Jeez gentlemen!

I thought he'd be up to 20 and I considered that toppy!

Calyx looks likeable on the website but I am struggling with the Kingman fragility thing and a Coolmore book size.

I don't think I have a problem with the National Stud, but I must acknowledge that horse is always way more important than venue for me.
Although having said that, this 'pluck any one of 4 mobile numbers out of the air' to do the deal I consider amateurish in the extreme.
Study of Man is my guilty secret too yer ma, well that and Le Brivido!!!

I can't do Land Force I'm afraid.
By:
truehoncho
When: 02 Nov 19 17:45
I'm afraid he will be priced high, it seems to be going that way. I don't think I will get a chance with him even in his 3/4th season.Is Invincible Army racing on?
By:
yer ma
When: 02 Nov 19 18:23
Book size is a huge issue I agree but thats Ireland for you.  I'll be trying to check out the caravaggios at Tatts but massive first books makes it hard to work out what 'value' can be had in 3rd season.    Advertise fee might well have dropped 5k on news that Showcasing sticks at 55k (which is sill plenty!).   Do you have a view on Zoustar? International market and all that makes him 'seem' well priced....q a price rise.  Study of Man like horse/pedigree but the hard fact that ZERO Bobbys Kittens have made anyone a penny at sales is a significant issue.
By:
proxygene
When: 02 Nov 19 18:30
Message for TrueHoncho really, what was it you liked so much about Donjuan Triumphant, before I wait for Route Des Etalons. Ta
By:
potentialmillionaire
When: 02 Nov 19 19:05
Whilst on the National Stud subject, I had an Acclaim mishap but I think there will be some nice ones around so perhaps he'll be a 3/4 year gamble.
Zoustar does appear to be well priced. I wonder if he will reliably transmit his quality, which is undeniable, but so are his faults and I could do without those.
Caravaggio is interesting but the Holy Bull bit has me twitchy.
I suppose if you wind Lanwades back another year or so you get to Sea The Moon and they positively out performed commercially what we might have expected. Bobby's had plenty of his own idiosyncrasies which can take plenty of blame me thinks.
Anyone happy enough with Due Diligence to give it a go?
By:
truehoncho
When: 02 Nov 19 19:06
what was it you liked so much about Donjuan Triumphant? - I was talking about Advertise Proxy.
By:
potentialmillionaire
When: 02 Nov 19 19:08
P.s. Eqtidaar has a come and get me fee does he not?
By:
truehoncho
When: 02 Nov 19 19:10
Showcasing sticks at 55k (which is sill plenty!). - Yer Ma I thinks great value when see some of the others.
By:
proxygene
When: 02 Nov 19 19:14
Once upon a time he was on your radar? and he is a new sire.
By:
truehoncho
When: 02 Nov 19 19:26
I hadn't picked up he gone to stud. I have never seen him but a few years ago he beat a filly in France I was following and I may have mentioned him then. I do quite like Dream Ahead but I think I am in a minority.
By:
proxygene
When: 02 Nov 19 19:49
Thank you, after such a stunning 6yo Champions sprint success maybe I wont be able to afford him or his Dad anyway...
By:
Formtwist
When: 03 Nov 19 06:47
Advertise was unusual for a Showcasing in preferring a sound surface. Haven't seen him but Cheveley chose to sell him and not for that much as a yearling. Eqtidaar has indeed a very attractive fee and I think Masar is interesting on his juvenile form. Like others I wait more with hope than expectation the Lanwades fee for Study of Man. Can't take to Le Brivido, sire doesn't make up for dam stamina aspect and he seemed a bit tripless to me.
By:
truehoncho
When: 03 Nov 19 10:49
Due Diligence is good value at £8.5k for a young proven stallion in this market. Good Vibes could definitely improve his reputation further next year.
By:
Wilycayote
When: 03 Nov 19 14:07
Totally agree truehoncho, Due Diligence at 8.5k as a proven option will make some of the new questionable stallions look very unappealing. He’ll be ideal to get a young mare started.
By:
Formtwist
When: 03 Nov 19 16:12
Note of caution there. Due Diligence had 118 mares first season, 57 in his second, 59 in his third and 30 last year according to the Return of Mares. If his first crop don't train on, as his sire War Front's often didn't, and he doesn't back up this year's juvenile success from his next smaller crops he will go cold very quickly. There are more reliable proven sires out there than him.
By:
Wilycayote
When: 03 Nov 19 18:08
Think they’ve taken that into account with his fee. usually stallions that get 3 stakes winners in their first crop jump up to at least £15,000+.
Fair play to keep him at a reasonable level

What price Ten Sovereigns? Would love to use him if not too dear.
By:
truehoncho
When: 03 Nov 19 19:20
TS I would have said £25k but this year £35k is probably closer.  Brilliant at Newmarket and a good looker (but Advertise was  better looking - personal opinion obviously). I would have TS and A before Blue Point all day.
By:
potentialmillionaire
When: 03 Nov 19 22:06
I agree with you Wily. The fee for D.D. Is appropriate for all the problems he is about to encounter from wrong year/poor quality/limited numbers etc.
The sudden trebling of the high class sprinter options is interesting.
I think people might get to thinking a little more about 5f specialists with no page and their historical performance in the sire ranks.
I am not sure that 45k will be quite so appealing for one such prospect now the options are a little wider.
By:
Formtwist
When: 04 Nov 19 14:53
So, Study of Man £15,000
By:
truehoncho
When: 04 Nov 19 15:06
That seems a little high but he is very well bred.
By:
Wilycayote
When: 07 Nov 19 17:52
Flag of Honour

Is it April 1st already!!!?????

oh dear.
By:
yer ma
When: 25 Nov 19 15:03
yer ma
yer ma02 Nov 19 14:29Joined: 23 Oct 02 | Topic/replies: 1,177 | Blogger: yer ma's blog
Do you think the National Stud is the place to be?  4 new stallions.  Two owned by a somewhat flacky operation.  Fees show now sign of being set in a smaller (any?) breeder or market reality so I'd guess they'll go for 30k.

I'm considering Calyx instead if the fee difference is significant.  Land Force would be interesting if cheap and Study of Man but if I fear the NS you can imagine my view on Lanwades!  (and they'll price him too high)
By:
truehoncho
When: 25 Nov 19 15:24
Yes Yer Ma. You could turn up there with your mare and a couple of their stallions could be on the way out in a converted Black Maria!!
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