Bloodstock & Breeding
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hello
in his first season , FRock covered near 90 mares
how many mares did he covered in 2011?
thanks for your help
Will he be supported by Coolmore?
because they let down Duke of marmelade and HTN !!!
any opinions?
in his first season , FRock covered near 90 mares
how many mares did he covered in 2011?
thanks for your help
Will he be supported by Coolmore?
because they let down Duke of marmelade and HTN !!!
any opinions?
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Replies: 42
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Early days for The Duke and Henry, RJ.
I imagine they weren't a very special bunch at Deauville which is unfortunate as it has certainly got tongues wagging at an early stage. However if they are better at Keenland and Tatts then Demi will flap his catalogue I'm sure. If they like what they see with Fastnet Rock then they'll get busy there too but if they really can't get enthused about stock of their own stallions then they do let the market do it's worst. I don't think F R is a shoe in for success up here, but he obviously has the ability to get a good looking yearling so I suspect he will be alright to start with. |
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Fastnet Rock's Australain results, say he is a better sire than Exceed and Excel.
Whether that translates to Europe, who knows. |
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do you how many mares he covered this year, in 2011?
where can i get the information? thanks for your help[:)] |
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Roy
I'm in Australia. Someone on here must know where you get this sort of info. I do know The Aga Khan sent three of his mares, to FR. |
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hello
i know some french breeders send "good mares" to FR.........i would like to know the numbers? and did coolmore send some of their mares to F R because they don't support all their stallions........ did they support the stallion FR in Aus? |
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He is owned by the Magniers, so it is logical they would have supported him in both countries.
In Australia he covered 257 mares in 2007 and 248 in 2008. I hope that is some help. |
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that's huge numbers !!!
there will be a lot of winners in AUS in the next years ;-)) |
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what was his fee in australia?
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Not sure, but probably in the $50-70k range in those years.
His Aussie fee now is $120k plus 10% GST. |
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Lol and we think we have a problem with too many mares to stallions.
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I found where his 2008 service fee was $A75k
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Nearly £8-9m in fees is a single year - incredible
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Roy where did you get the first book of 90 figure from? doesnt seem right tbh
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Heard that he covered 85 mares in 2010 in ireland , 40% of which were coolmore mares!
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Good sire prospect over here gets good sorts I will be watching to see if his connections support him later this year but think they will,didn't appear to help Duke of Marmalade this week mind,but as I've said on here ages ago the Duke is a plain old boat,I guess connections will want one or two good sales in the next few months for him to remain commercial atm plenty will be panicking who paid that inflated fee of his.
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Looks as though he may have sired his first super star down here,
Smart Missile, two for two as a 2yo, made his 3yo debut with a sensenational win, in the group 3, Run For The Rose, yesterday at Rosehill. If you can find the vision, it's worth a look. He is now even money favourite for the 7f group one, Golden Rose in a fortnight. It has been reported this morning, negotiations have begun on a stud deal, valued upwards of 10 million dollars. |
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GUys if you see them at the sales in NH get on them - they generally are big awkward types but they develop like no other horse i have seen- he is a quality sire but alot of them are quite plain with ugly heads and from yearling to 2yr old stage they do a complete transformation
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Big, Akward, Plain, Ugly.
Mmm. Lukemur I think you're going to have to refine your comments a touch before you go for your interview with Coolmore  The adjectives sum up the stallion himself quite succinctly though. Given that we are accusyomed to a little more quality in the breed up here it will be interesting to if the buyers are keen to adjust. Slightly plain Duke of Marmalade will have some great looking yearlings later on - he had some great looking sales foals - but will there be enough of them? The usual fascinating wait and see! |
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potentialmillionaire 29 Aug 11 19:50
Big, Akward, Plain, Ugly. Can I assume you don't like Fastnet Rock Pot M?[;)] Slightly plain Duke of Marmalade  Slightly plain..........Slightly plain,he's a real stunner when I looked at him I was 'stunned into silence'don't think he will make it nothing from his sire producing family has done any good this side of the pond,but as ever we can only wait and see. |
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Prima, I am thinking that there are some on here - ofcourse mentioning no names - that might just have a Fastnet Rock or two running round their paddocks by now! Those unnamed have an advantage over me so I need to be careful right now
 The few photos of his foals I have seen have been impressive but by coolmore's standards they have not put out that many perhaps? I couldn't quite believe the horse when I saw him in the spring - how does he even lift that head off the floor?!! I imagine he will attract a lighter quality type of mare so I will be interested to see if that suits him and I will be interested to see if they follow Lukemur's view thast they are a bit coarse as yearlings. I worry about D of M because of a prejudice (mine and others) against staying Danehills. In the flesh I like him and he reminds me of Danehill Dancer to an extent. Yes he's plain but plenty are and i wonder if you would be a bit keener if he had had a slightly fuller 2yo career which he surely was capable of without the injury? |
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I couldn't quite believe the horse when I saw him in the spring - how does he even lift that head off the floor?!!
really you are talking of FR.......?? a french breeder who usually don't like southern hemispher stallion (he din't send a mare to E and E for example) was very impress with FR !! |
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Lukemur 29 Aug 11 09:50
GUys if you see them at the sales in NH get on them - they generally are big awkward types but they develop like no other horse i have seen- he is a quality sire but alot of them are quite plain with ugly heads and from yearling to 2yr old stage they do a complete transformation thanks for the information i will try to check that at the winter sales |
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roy,
F R is a massively clumsey type with a huge head. He really walks though and has a great shot if adding strength and 'receiving' quality in producing from a lighter type of mare. |
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roy,Pot M is right FR has a plain old bonce on him,but he has a massive backend and again like Pot M thought he does suit a light quality type of mare[;)]I have a nice foal of his here and atm I'm very pleased with it,unlike one of the Bushranger foals we have,its very overtopped and will need a miracle to get right
 ........one of the perils of using new sires you never know what sort they get! |
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Roy where did you get the first book of 90 figure from? doesnt seem right tbh
hello i send a mail to coolmore......(the answer is) the numbers are : 81 mares in 2010 150 mares in 2011 i was true sorry :-)) |
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thanks every body for all the information ;-)
do you plan to sell your foal ? |
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That's over 350 mares served in 12 months.
He must be one mean r00ting machine. |
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Prima, When I was at Donny yesterday I saw a very smart but enormously topped Kheleyf go through.
I forget who was selling it but it was a real commercial Doncaster looker but with your comments on Bushranger I was reminded. Presumably your overtopped foal is of concern to you because of the implications for the timber below? Yesterday's sort of yearling just reminded me that is there such a thing as an over topped yearling, PROVIDED the wheels are in place to support the chassis? What are you doing to support the troublesome foal at home? I have just had a bit of a scare with one of mine this morning and I am going to wean a bit quick and get him off foal creep and onto a high protein low carb balancer. I'm not a fan of shutting them in but it's nice to know other folks regimes. |
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Yes Pot M the foal is a concern,esp' the timber below in this case. Its been weaned at 160 days and is now shut in a stable on a deep litter bed and fed just hay along with Red Mills copper top-up,it will spend the next month shut in by which time I'm expecting some improvement.
I hate over topped foals they nearly always go the wrong way,saying that mind with the correct management you can get them back but you tread a very fine line with delight or disaster waiting either side ready to dash any hopes you have.It sounds the right thing to do as regards your foal weaning early and putting it on a balancer but for me I'd feed no more than 14% protein for now anyway. Foals tend to suffer from lack of copper intake at about 150 ish days that's always a danger time with foal joints as ours has shown,I remember telling you once about Red Mills feed they have cubes called 'copper top up' which we feed all mares 3 months off foaling and again when the foals at foot are 3 months and as a result we have found less problems with epiphysitis. Copper deficiency can be a big factor in angular limb deformities. Esp if a farm gets recurring incidences this is something to consider. Copper levels in mares milk drops of a cliff around 85-150 days after foaling and this is the prime time for getting foaly joints and horrible knees. Therefore we supplement cooper to counteract this. Cooper aids the development of strong dense bone and slows down quick developing new bone. So with the restraint of the copper diminished growth plates go mad putting up new weak bone growth, epiphysitis. Farrier, reducing concussion,not over-feeding all help as well as hopefully a big helping of good fortune! Let us know how you get on with yours Pot'M. What is your usual 'method'? Sire of foal at fault?I hope it is not the one that you had all the problems getting the mother to accept, you would probably feel like leaving that one to it's own devices if it is! |
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Thanks for that Prima. To be honest I am always quite lucky with my 'family' and whether it's good lucky land or whether it's genes (the vast majority make the track for a good few starts) I don't know.
I'm perhaps quite good at turning a blind eye too! Obviously intervention is in the eye of the beholder and frankly we know what happens in the States say, and then we know what happens amongst the barbed wire in Co. Kerry too! Which of them has it right? which get the results at the sales or the track? and where exactly does somewhere in the middle lie! You correctly guess the foal! and to be honest it's a good 1st effort from the mare as she has done it very well from the start, it is quite definitely not a 1st foal. Looking good in the joints so I hope I'm mithering over nothing but it can't afford to go the wrong way as confirmation faults currently bearable will become too obvious if the foal goes over topped. I shall do some looking in to copper supplementation so thanks for that, as I wonder if I've got another who wouldn't benefit from your description of it's benefits. I suspect the 'runners' families are always less troublesome than the 'sales' families for sure. Plenty make the track by this sire so I hope he is not too dodgy either, but another glaring hole in my 'folksy' 'small town' knowledge I'm afraid. I hope some of you beggers on here know what you're talking about as I fear I am becoming quite reliant |
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http://mro.massey.ac.nz/bitstream/handle/10179/1774/02_whole.pdf?sequence=1
Try this link Pot'M |
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Interesting stuff PD - we go with Calphormin but wouldnt be opposed to chelated copper too. U reckon not enough in a multi-vit like the TRM stuff?
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Yer ma, It all depends on your ground really as to whether copper is going to do the job(or causing the problem, depending on which way you look at it). Calphormin is a good all round supplement but we have found that a short sharp course of a high cooper diet does the trick.. That supplement does include cooper, as do all good quality complete feeds, but not at the level of a cooper specialist diet. Personally I am not a fan of adding balancers to complete feeds, to me that is a waste of time and undoes all the work of the research nutritionists that came up with the food in the first place. I see every point however in using a balancer with some alfalfa chaff for foals that are candidates to get over-topped but are not yet at the copper stage. The high copper diet we use is a complete balanced food in itself just with above normal copper content. It is fed for 4,6 or 8 weeks only and then they have to be off it for a time as too much copper is toxic. So we feed for the final 3 months of pregnancy,the 2 months prior to weaning and a month after and again as short yearlings.
We use this http://www.redmills.ie/ie/horse/products/product/?id=500 |
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Just been ploughing through the N Z research paper. Phew!
Interesting indeed, although plenty of it was way too complex for me. It does seem to back up my understanding that excessive protein levels are unlikely to be an issue. It has always seemed to me that in a time of excessive growth you have to support that with appropriate fuel but that digestible energy/carbohydrate may well be one of the villains (just as it continues the demise of my waistline) My foal ration is 25% higher in Copper than Red Mills as it happens, although nothing like as high as their Copper boosting ration. Like Prima Donna, I'm not a believer in tinkering with a trusted manufacturer's ration so never feed supplements. Interestingly D & H are of the opinion that all British Pasture is deficient in Copper backing up your concerns Prima. I'll continue to cogitate. . . |
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roy jones Joined: 24 Jan 03
Replies: 120 31 Aug 11 21:46 Roy where did you get the first book of 90 figure from? doesnt seem right tbh hello i send a mail to coolmore......(the answer is) the numbers are : 81 mares in 2010 150 mares in 2011 i was true sorry :-)) True story for Northern Hemisphere an important part you left out of your first post. |
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FR had a great day yesterday, quinellaing the important Group 1, Caulfield thousand Guineas, for 3yo fillies.
And he just may have produced his first superstar, with winner,the unbeaten filly Atlantic Jewel. if you can catch the vision of her win, it's worth taking a look. |
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Atlantic Jewel looks special!
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Sired the VRC Oaks winner today. His daughter, Mosheen, crushed the opposition with a 7 length win.
Thats the two Classics, for three year old fillies, this year. Not bad for a horse, that never won past 6f. |
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Not that many foals in sales......7 fillies & 5 colts !
didn't expect him to be siring classic winners over 12 furlongs most of the exceed and excels are best below 8 furlongs! |