Duke of marmalde

30k was a bit steep for this fella. Very lucky Horse to win all those races against poor opposition. I think that fee will drop over the next few years.

But as you say may well have no affect on his breeding potential

well we will probably have to argree to disagree there tiswallaceno7, 5 group1 races in a row as a 4 year old over 10f and 12f is a pretty solid effort! i would have to say his last 2 efforts were disappointing but that was down to the hard season he had, alot to ask of a horse to run in 7 group 1 races in a season! i really loved this horse, one of the toughest horses i have seen, always gave his all and u always knew u would get a good run for ur money!

As for his stallion prospects i think 30k is quite reasonable with his bloodlines, i can see his price inflating as soon as we see his first crop win some decent races (which they undoubtedly will). I will certainly be looking out for his 2 year olds when they start racing

andybeefy,You will have a long wait then if you think he is the sort to get 2 y'olds,as for his bloodlines his don't really do it over here in the US his 'lines' work best,I reckon his fee will drop a lot over the next few years,have you ever looked at him in the flesh?He is not the best looking sort,you could drive a bus under him add on his very plain head he is no star,as the poster above said a lucky horse not to meet very good ones a bit like Fame and Glory at 4.

I been very disappointed in Hurricane Run so far.

I know his Horse's will be big backward but what i seen so far( and i stress so far) has been quite disappointing.

We will have to wait and see regards Duke but 30k i think is quite steep. Obviously he beat a Derby Winner easily and Twice Over has proved himself to be no mug but i just feel the races fell for him very nicely.

well we each have our opinions, i have actualy seen this horse in the flesh, was quietly impressed, looked a very solid athletic sort who had a good presence about him to me! i have to agree that i think his crop will probably progress more as they age, but being a son of danehill it wouldnt suprise me in the least to see him produce some decent 2 year olds! maybe totaly wrong about him and i will be the first to admit if he flops at stud, i just think being from danehill and with his connections to A P indy and lemon drop kid he has an excellent chance to excel as a satllion

Your spot on Andy...Thats why they got the pins in as a 3yr old because they knew with his pedigree if they could get a few group 1's he have every chance of making it.

Just a wee bit pricey is my only complaint. Oratorio was a plain horse by Danehill and he has done alright[;)]

Well andybeefy,its right we all have opinions,mine is unchanged the fact is that stallions in his pedigree have done no good over here if he has any impact it will ALL come from his sire Danehill,I doubt he will get early sorts,Dylan Thomas imo would be a better choice of those two to get 2 y'olds,if you look into D of M pedigree can you name any stallion that has been any good over here,breeders will all know this,first foals later this year then we shall see how the industry takes to them,luke warm I guess.

Oratorio is not as plain as The Duke. He was very well supported by Coolmore last year so i was told by there representatives. I was offered a mare in foal to him and studied him alot but he didn't do enough for me. He comes from a top family in america that hasn't hit big heights over here. cant see him getting two year olds but could get many classic horses. He should do extremely well with Sadlers Wells mares and i heard he got quite a few. He is not the best looking but i have to say he did deserve to stand for what he did at the start because if they pitched him lower he would be at €15000 when his two year olds run and could be at €12000 or less by the time his first 3 year olds run. Could well turn out to be a top sire but he wouldn't be for me.

I would have covered a mare with Henrythenavigator if he stood over here though.

yeah this was my main point tiswallaceno, (although i think he was far better than an ordinary racehourse) i think he has always been destined to be a top sire! the coolmore team who are obviously no mugs when it comes to getting top sires, knew that with this horses pedrigree he was always going to be more valuable to them at stud! which you could say meant they placed him very well into group 1 races, but i personally think he beat a few good yardsticks on the way! i am by far and away no expert on this matter, and those on here are alot more qualified to give thier opinions than me, but we are all entitled to opinions, thats what i like about these forums. as for the comment earlier about fame and glory, i would consider him a top class racehorse, if it wasnt for the outstanding STS then this colt would have been a multiple group 1 hourse and dual derby winner, just unlucky to be around at the same time as a once in a lifetime horse! but looking at his pedigree and style i dont really see him as a top class sire, but ill probably be wrong on both counts, the duke will turn out to be a flop and **** will be the next sadlers wells lol

i will admit that his dam side do have alot of results on the other side of the pond! but to be fair danehill does have a big influence in his progeny and he alone has had some top racehorses, and some top class sires which are doing well quite recently!

andybeefy,imo Danehill get 2 sorts 1,early fast sorts like Rock of Gibraltar and Danehill Dancer along with George Washington 2,3&4 year olds who are a bit backward who want a trip sorts like North Light and the Duke,but I do agree Danehill is a great sire of sires.

i would be suprised if he didnt make a good sire, but time will only tell! i know its a D O M topic, but can i ask what people think of F A G chances when he goes to stud at the end of the season, (if he in fact does go)? although nobody can argue with the montjeu pedigree, i look at F A G full pedigree and running style and i struggle to see him making a top class sire! he looks best suited to a NH stallion (which they wont do with him) or maybe carry him on racing for a few seasons and have him try and emulate yeats? (especialy now of the unfortunate AGE OF AQUARIUS)

I too could see F&G ending up a jump sire he will never be commercial,breeders have him down as a staying plod without a turn of foot,It would be no surprise to see him sold to Mike de ****,some seem to think he is a sure fire Arc winner if he runs out of his skin he may be placed if they do keep him in training next year he may well contest the Gold Cup at the Royal meeting,then its off the the Granges as a jump sire high class one though.

i admit i have never seen the duke in person but from the ,many photos i have seen ( there is a lot) he seems atheltic with great muscle defination. no doubt he did contest weak group1s but he won 5 group1s in 5 consecitive months and his last 2 races were the arc and the BC classic. he is a tough horse and if he gets a few 2year olds out quick (ala HRE this year) he'll be a big hit.
the Duke v New Approach for the 1st season sire will be interesting.

**** is worth too much as a 4g jumps stallion than getting a few dinar for him to race in Dubai for me de...

Duke of Marmalade is my fav horse of all time. I really think he will be a success at stud as well.

Fame and Glory, Ascot Gold Cup? Coolmore might have this thread removedHe'd probably stay it though

Many operation would give their legs to have a Stallion for the future such as Fame and Glory. People really are hard on him. He is a Top Class 1m4f horse just like Hurricane Run(less the arc) obv

Tiswallaceno7     29 Aug 10 20:30 
Many operation would give their legs to have a Stallion for the future such as Fame and Glory.

Sure they would,but as it is at the moment only jumping breeders want a horse with his form,the plain fact is with this horse he does NOT have speed at all,that ingredient is vital for this sort of stallion,his connections have done their best to convince breeders he is a nice prospect, unfortunately for them no commercial flat breeder want this sort at all,if he wins the Arc he may find a slot but imo only really as a OB sire,look back plenty of horses like him have started off their stud lives standing as jump sires,even Galileo's full brother who was a multiple GR1 winner.

If F&G starts as a NH sire and does well at it,as I'd imagine he would do, is there any way back for him?

Someone get PM one of those Fame & Glory Coolmore hats for Christmas, and a Soldier of Fortune jacket

neill d     30 Aug 10 12:17 
If F&G starts as a NH sire and does well at it,as I'd imagine he would do, is there any way back for him?
Not really if that was the scenario,it can happen years ago High Line was a sort of jump sire who became a good flat sire,its possible but very unlikely.

Maybe Yeats will be the best marker as to whether the NH/FLAT scene can be covered by the same stallion? He seems likely to have had the best shot at a genuine dual purpose career that any horse has had in decades.
Duke of Marmalade is a likeable athletic type in my opinion but I wouldn't necessarily disagree with those that think he is tricky. There is plenty of daylight! Dylan Thomas and Oratorio have a coarseness about them that I am not fond of. Give me D of M's plain head over Dylan's ungenerous looking number any day!

Sorry meant PD with the hat thing

Well thanks neill d,Yeah I was thinking of replacing my Hawk Wing baseball cap,who better than the next Champion of Champions Fame & Glory............can't wait,I have asked Slick to get me all the regalia  going for that brilliant donkey sorry colt Soldier of Fortune,you read my mind!!!

Nothing wrong with Hawk Wing wrote all over a jacket it was the nicest one i ever got it had a horse with wings top class

Gee I bet you looked fantastic in it Rip Van!

Still do PD

I think you should post a picture on You Tube, Rip Van. Or should that be X tube. . .

No need Pot M I will look out for a man wearing a jacket with wings stitched onto the back come sales time,doubt he will be hard to spot

The Irish Derby needs a real good winner next year

The SOF jacket will be a horse dragging a plough through mud

sorry not 'be' 'feature'

I dredged this up from the past in reply to sammyfools request for opinions about Duke of Marmalade elsewhere. I daresay that there is plenty of comments on here that we might regret but I haven't re read it so as ever my ignorance shall remain blissfull.

I like D O M more than Dylan Thomas as for me he is a more athletic individual and he reminds me in some ways of Danehill Dancer. Obviously his pedigree is 'better' but you need to take a view on how successfully it translates to these shores.

These good sons of Danehill are always going to be out of my budget untill they are unfasionable (i.e failures), but I always end up hoping I can afford one just at the point it turns around and becomes a super sire. The reality is that the speedier ones do well and the stayers don't. There's no reason why DOM should buck the trend and I wouldn't have spent 40k to find out.

In a total change of topic are there others like me that hope Born to Sea can only muster a minor group win over 7 furlongs and sent to stand at stud for about 7k or am I being a selfish jerk not hoping he is a superstar like his bother. On that point would you rather use him or Frankels brother next season?