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Well - A start would be - NOT to make this article an ULTIMATE SUBSCRIPTION ONLY read.
NEWS ANALYSIS
How can racing broaden its appeal: the first instalment of a special report
Getting people engaged is major challenge for the sport
--------------
I am an ESSENTIAL Subscriber - but why should SUBSCRIBERS such as I be denied access to such a BROAD issue as this.
Racing Post, themselves, are killing the game with these petty ideas and restrictions.
NEWS ANALYSIS
How can racing broaden its appeal: the first instalment of a special report
Getting people engaged is major challenge for the sport
--------------
I am an ESSENTIAL Subscriber - but why should SUBSCRIBERS such as I be denied access to such a BROAD issue as this.
Racing Post, themselves, are killing the game with these petty ideas and restrictions.
Show More
yes racing post are a big part of the problem. ATR too. And possibly RUK because of the price.
How can racing broaden its appeal: the first instalment of a special report
Well - A start would be - NOT to make this article an ULTIMATE SUBSCRIPTION ONLY read.
Genuinely, you couldn't make it up...
Well - A start would be - NOT to make this article an ULTIMATE SUBSCRIPTION ONLY read.
Genuinely, you couldn't make it up...
Is there a Twenty20 bubbling underneath racing's surface? - asks Lee Mottershead.
YES there is it's called betting in-running but the channel YOU work for has kept pictures slow for ten years.
YES there is it's called betting in-running but the channel YOU work for has kept pictures slow for ten years.
They could broaden its appeal by letting people bet on it, novel idea I know but I think it would work
Olias, that's exactly the issue - the more you become interested in the sport, the more likely you are to be excluded, disenfranchised, discriminated against.
And at the bleeding heart of the problem is the totally complicit, thoroughly cynical, totally unreliable Racing Post, and spineless, back slapping head-cheerleaders like Mottershed...
And at the bleeding heart of the problem is the totally complicit, thoroughly cynical, totally unreliable Racing Post, and spineless, back slapping head-cheerleaders like Mottershed...
spot on Thefear, i fail to see how a next generation wouldnt be hooked on this during a saturday afternoon if they could get racing pics in say under a second of live
what the question should have said is:
How can racing broaden its appeal (whilst keeping our advertising bookmakers happy)?
what the question should have said is:
How can racing broaden its appeal (whilst keeping our advertising bookmakers happy)?
I have been full time horse racing betting since 2007, have to say at this point in time it has reached it's lowest ebb.
RP and bookmakers moaning about lack of interest in the sport, they have made it between them virtually impossible to get a bet on.
RP and bookmakers moaning about lack of interest in the sport, they have made it between them virtually impossible to get a bet on.
Yes and Simon Clare gets a lot of column inches in today's piece and he's absolutely guaranteed to give a one-sided, blinkered, biased opinion.
FOBTS down to £2 a spin may invigorate racing, as the ability to have a bet on the spectacle is the charm of it
I somehow doubt the dullard Millington will see the irony in such an article being placed behind a paywall......
this particular horse bolted years and years and years ago
its too late now
its too late now
bruce millington on talksport tomorrow 7-10pm giving his 'expert insight' 
What area of 'expert insight' would that be ? Clearing up excrement from dog kennels? His previous employment....
LBO's were all about racing, with a little support from the dogs and the 'novelty' fixed odds with a minimum of 5 on the long list.You now have a generation of adults who link betting with footy more than any other sport. Too them racing is in the pack with the rest of the other sports.As the survival of the sport on its present tier depends on betting revenue then you would think that the authorities would provide a free online form book up with the best of them with no sections unrestricted. A free online horses in training site would be another useful addition whereby trainers are obliged to detail their full strings for publication on the site. Might put a few publications out of business but so what.
Here's also what someone else wrote somewhere on the internet. Much of which I agree with.
For someone choosing a sport to follow a potential winning attribute for racing is that it escapes the omnipresent existence of football. Creating a false sameness between the sports will turn people off. The established racegoers have indeed boycotted these events for years.
'Another point is that a racing stable does not have a catchment area that it represents.There may be the infrequent occasion where a big race winner is paraded through a local village but the yard will not have a travelling support or believe the runners represent them. This may sound daft but for younger generations sports that offer a sense of belonging appeal most.
This brings me back to the colleague who lectured me on the status of 'my' sport. He is a long,long standing season ticket holder at a very famous English Premiership Club. Because he lives only three miles away from the stadium he believes he has more of a right to support 'his' club than what he terms 'glory seekers' who travel many miles to 'attach ' themselves to the club.
He is continually barred from forums for supporters of his club and it got to a point on one forum that his use of the term 'Out of Towners' had him immediately removed. He then reappeared under a different username and invented the wind up 'distancely challenged' which again had him chopped once they eventually caught on what the expression meant and interpreted it as an insult.
His posts caused some of the most nasty responses I have read on a forum that is intended for posters who are part of the same tribe. Whether people should get so infuriated by someone telling them that they should support a club nearer to them, or are less of a supporter than someone else is questionable. It does nevertheless demonstrate the importance of belonging and being part of a clan which many seek in following a sport.
Racing cannot offer them that. You never for example hear of someone who lives in Six Mile Bottom claiming because of location that they are a bigger John Gosden fan than someone residing in Newcastle Upon Tyne. This is because unlike in football, cricket or rugby, John Gosden is not representing the people of his local area.
Racing needs to drop this futile idea that it can gain lost ground on the big team sports by inventing non-existent comparisons and instead concentrate on the strengths of its own traditional format which never did need any real tampering with in the first place.'
Here's also what someone else wrote somewhere on the internet. Much of which I agree with.
For someone choosing a sport to follow a potential winning attribute for racing is that it escapes the omnipresent existence of football. Creating a false sameness between the sports will turn people off. The established racegoers have indeed boycotted these events for years.
'Another point is that a racing stable does not have a catchment area that it represents.There may be the infrequent occasion where a big race winner is paraded through a local village but the yard will not have a travelling support or believe the runners represent them. This may sound daft but for younger generations sports that offer a sense of belonging appeal most.
This brings me back to the colleague who lectured me on the status of 'my' sport. He is a long,long standing season ticket holder at a very famous English Premiership Club. Because he lives only three miles away from the stadium he believes he has more of a right to support 'his' club than what he terms 'glory seekers' who travel many miles to 'attach ' themselves to the club.
He is continually barred from forums for supporters of his club and it got to a point on one forum that his use of the term 'Out of Towners' had him immediately removed. He then reappeared under a different username and invented the wind up 'distancely challenged' which again had him chopped once they eventually caught on what the expression meant and interpreted it as an insult.
His posts caused some of the most nasty responses I have read on a forum that is intended for posters who are part of the same tribe. Whether people should get so infuriated by someone telling them that they should support a club nearer to them, or are less of a supporter than someone else is questionable. It does nevertheless demonstrate the importance of belonging and being part of a clan which many seek in following a sport.
Racing cannot offer them that. You never for example hear of someone who lives in Six Mile Bottom claiming because of location that they are a bigger John Gosden fan than someone residing in Newcastle Upon Tyne. This is because unlike in football, cricket or rugby, John Gosden is not representing the people of his local area.
Racing needs to drop this futile idea that it can gain lost ground on the big team sports by inventing non-existent comparisons and instead concentrate on the strengths of its own traditional format which never did need any real tampering with in the first place.'
^ That reminds me ... It will soon be the Shergar Cup 
- or, rather - the Pop Concert after the 'International racing' event.
- or, rather - the Pop Concert after the 'International racing' event.
It would help a little if the lottery and scatch cards
didnt have a two year advantage.By the time some kids turn
eighteen their already addicted to camalots crap.
didnt have a two year advantage.By the time some kids turn
eighteen their already addicted to camalots crap.
The Racing Post could start by cutting out racing cliches in its articles.
That would reduce articles to about 20% of their present size.
David Stevens, speaking for race sponsors Coral on Tuesday, said it would take something dramatic for Cliffs Of Moher not to be sent off favourite after they cut him to 9-4 (from 11-4).
Stevens said: "Cliffs Of Moher has been at the head of the betting since Aidan O'Brien said the race was the likely next target for the Derby runner-up,
and having been 3-1 for the race following the latest entry stage on Monday, Ballydoyle's main hope has been by far the best-backed contender in the last 24 hours."
= Corals have Cliff Of Moher favourite at 3/1
That would reduce articles to about 20% of their present size.
David Stevens, speaking for race sponsors Coral on Tuesday, said it would take something dramatic for Cliffs Of Moher not to be sent off favourite after they cut him to 9-4 (from 11-4).
Stevens said: "Cliffs Of Moher has been at the head of the betting since Aidan O'Brien said the race was the likely next target for the Derby runner-up,
and having been 3-1 for the race following the latest entry stage on Monday, Ballydoyle's main hope has been by far the best-backed contender in the last 24 hours."
= Corals have Cliff Of Moher favourite at 3/1
Bookmakers not allowing winning and those that are not profitable punters to bet has a negative affect on this subject.
Most are introduced to racing via parents and friends taking them racing and watching on TV/talking racing. However the bookmakers MO will also be discussed as it has been in the nationals and on the internet. The RP has decided not to touch this issue.
Most are introduced to racing via parents and friends taking them racing and watching on TV/talking racing. However the bookmakers MO will also be discussed as it has been in the nationals and on the internet. The RP has decided not to touch this issue.
anyone would think that Joke Orals want people to back the Aidan beast (anyone that still has a worthwhile account that is)
simple things like making replays free so anyone can do some research into form but ruk or the rancid post want to cash in on this.ruk and rp are making plenty from the bookmaking firms but theres a greed that is turning the punters away. as mentioned earlier the only people who regurly turn up and the ones who are there for the music.this was the main reason i switched to football betting. the atmosfere is long gone except for te major festivals.
As most everyone knows, UK and Irish thoroughbred racing is the best horse racing in the world.
However, it's the Sport Of Kings and it has always been run for the benefit of the Owner. That much should be obvious and it's the way it should be. In the UK the average punter is an annoying by-product of the Sport Of Kings and it would be more convenient if the average sports fan and punter was shut out and shut up completely. Allowing these punters to bet on the Sport Of Kings in the beginning was shortsighted to say the least. Money hungry bookmakers using all manner of mathematical trickery to entice uneducated mugs, low-lifes and dreamers to actually gamble on The Sport Of Kings. Really, what were they thinking? The working class have football to bet on. Dog racing. They can control those sports. Heck, LET them control those sports and they can make up whatever silly rules they want. But to let them bet on thoroughbred racing was a huge mistake and I say, and have always said, that the problems the sport is facing now are a direct result of allowing the lower classes to bet on the Sport Of Kings in the beginning.
Now, with all the jobs involved, it looks as though the Owners are going to have to work with these low life punters in order for The Sport Of Kings to continue, although to be honest I've half a mind to campaign for a completely closed sport, inaccessible to anybody who isn't a Member.
If the BHA is truly motivated and wants Thoroughbred Racing to continue and to flourish the following has to be done.
1. The BHA must take control of Parimutuel betting. This is what gives practically every other racing jurisdiction in the world a guaranteed revenue stream. This revenue must then be used to compensate the Owner (via prize money) for putting up with this mess. The peanuts they are currently paying is scandalous.
This parimutuel betting, using a machine called a "totaliser" I believe (let's just call it The Tote) would be marketed as a low takeout alternative to these money hungry mathematical tricksters called bookmakers who are anyway unwilling to take a bet. The exact rake taken from The Tote would be published and be there for all to see so that IF he was intelligent the punter could compare the various options available to him, be that Parimutuel wagering, traditional bookmakers, or betting exchanges. Obviously the Tote would have a low enough rake for it to be a favoured option for the punter, while being high enough to compensate the Owner and to employ the labour required to run the whole show.
New betting types could be invented that offer the unintelligent mugs, low life's and dreamers the opportunity of that "big win for a small outlay" that they seem to love so much.
With control of the Tote and a guaranteed income that doesn't rely on the traditional bookmaker's measly contribution, the BHA and other bodies could then educate potential new customers in horse race betting.
Things the racing bodies can do to BROADEN THE APPEAL OF RACING once they have the money to do so:
1. Produce detailed form guides and offer them to punters free of charge.
2. Implement sectional timing equipment at all Flat and AW tracks and educate the punter in its proper use.
3. Employ a panel of Professional Stipendiary Stewards.
4. Punish jockeys (with actual bans that deter them) for not riding their mounts to obtain the best possible position. Make it understood that jockeys doing such a thing affects the punter in countless ways.
5. Make it clear to the public and potential bettors that it will be the punter that will for the sport, not the owner, so THE PUNTER is to be respected.
Once control of the Tote is established DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES allow a money hungry bookmaker to use trickery to acquire it, because MARK MY WORDS, they will try to do so.
You're welcome.
However, it's the Sport Of Kings and it has always been run for the benefit of the Owner. That much should be obvious and it's the way it should be. In the UK the average punter is an annoying by-product of the Sport Of Kings and it would be more convenient if the average sports fan and punter was shut out and shut up completely. Allowing these punters to bet on the Sport Of Kings in the beginning was shortsighted to say the least. Money hungry bookmakers using all manner of mathematical trickery to entice uneducated mugs, low-lifes and dreamers to actually gamble on The Sport Of Kings. Really, what were they thinking? The working class have football to bet on. Dog racing. They can control those sports. Heck, LET them control those sports and they can make up whatever silly rules they want. But to let them bet on thoroughbred racing was a huge mistake and I say, and have always said, that the problems the sport is facing now are a direct result of allowing the lower classes to bet on the Sport Of Kings in the beginning.
Now, with all the jobs involved, it looks as though the Owners are going to have to work with these low life punters in order for The Sport Of Kings to continue, although to be honest I've half a mind to campaign for a completely closed sport, inaccessible to anybody who isn't a Member.
If the BHA is truly motivated and wants Thoroughbred Racing to continue and to flourish the following has to be done.
1. The BHA must take control of Parimutuel betting. This is what gives practically every other racing jurisdiction in the world a guaranteed revenue stream. This revenue must then be used to compensate the Owner (via prize money) for putting up with this mess. The peanuts they are currently paying is scandalous.
This parimutuel betting, using a machine called a "totaliser" I believe (let's just call it The Tote) would be marketed as a low takeout alternative to these money hungry mathematical tricksters called bookmakers who are anyway unwilling to take a bet. The exact rake taken from The Tote would be published and be there for all to see so that IF he was intelligent the punter could compare the various options available to him, be that Parimutuel wagering, traditional bookmakers, or betting exchanges. Obviously the Tote would have a low enough rake for it to be a favoured option for the punter, while being high enough to compensate the Owner and to employ the labour required to run the whole show.
New betting types could be invented that offer the unintelligent mugs, low life's and dreamers the opportunity of that "big win for a small outlay" that they seem to love so much.
With control of the Tote and a guaranteed income that doesn't rely on the traditional bookmaker's measly contribution, the BHA and other bodies could then educate potential new customers in horse race betting.
Things the racing bodies can do to BROADEN THE APPEAL OF RACING once they have the money to do so:
1. Produce detailed form guides and offer them to punters free of charge.
2. Implement sectional timing equipment at all Flat and AW tracks and educate the punter in its proper use.
3. Employ a panel of Professional Stipendiary Stewards.
4. Punish jockeys (with actual bans that deter them) for not riding their mounts to obtain the best possible position. Make it understood that jockeys doing such a thing affects the punter in countless ways.
5. Make it clear to the public and potential bettors that it will be the punter that will for the sport, not the owner, so THE PUNTER is to be respected.
Once control of the Tote is established DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES allow a money hungry bookmaker to use trickery to acquire it, because MARK MY WORDS, they will try to do so.
You're welcome.
Racecourses should tighten up on the booze -- brawls between well-lubricated coach parties are unsavoury and off-putting.
The problem for most newcomers though is it is no longer possible to serve your apprenticeship in a normal betting shop by talking to the old-timers. The latter group is now mainly sitting at home, punting online, and even if not, the incessant commentary of foreign races and cartoon races makes conversation impossible anyway. The betting shop chains have killed their long term prospects but while they are raking in tens of millions from FOBTs, that is probably the economically rational thing to do -- in the long run, we are all dead.
The problem for most newcomers though is it is no longer possible to serve your apprenticeship in a normal betting shop by talking to the old-timers. The latter group is now mainly sitting at home, punting online, and even if not, the incessant commentary of foreign races and cartoon races makes conversation impossible anyway. The betting shop chains have killed their long term prospects but while they are raking in tens of millions from FOBTs, that is probably the economically rational thing to do -- in the long run, we are all dead.
Betfair is to blame for the current situation in racing. Bookies have counteracted the exchange by offering early prices and BOG. There is no point in the traditional punter going to the races anymore. What advantage is there with betting with an on course bookie? Now you have this ridiculous situation where racing is tied in with music. It's pathetic.
How can you blame Betfair?
Nobody has a bet, or can get a bet, on Betfair until 10 minutes before a race, at the earliest.
3:00 Thirsk - Just over £700,000 Matched = £350,000 bet (including Trading and in-running)
If you say that there are still around 8,000 Betting Shops - then that equates to just £40 per shop.
That is hardly Betfair killing off Betting Shops.
Nobody has a bet, or can get a bet, on Betfair until 10 minutes before a race, at the earliest.
3:00 Thirsk - Just over £700,000 Matched = £350,000 bet (including Trading and in-running)
If you say that there are still around 8,000 Betting Shops - then that equates to just £40 per shop.
That is hardly Betfair killing off Betting Shops.
Didn't you read my post? Of course it's Betfair's fault. Why do you think BOG has come about? Do on course bookmakers offer BOG? Do they offer any incentive for a traditional punter to go to the races now?
Betfair is the only place that does not ban non losing punters, if you take away Betfair you have to say to newcomers to the sport that if they bet and fail to show signs of losing money (don't have to be winners) then they will be banned. How does this promote Racing ?
Before Betfair punters would go to the races to obtain better prices. After Betfair they don't. Can I put it anymore simpler? So now they have to find ways to draw a new breed of racegoer in. One that wants to get drunk out of their minds and listen to after race music - drunk out of their minds. Good luck with that one.
Betfair is the only place that does not ban non losing punters, if you take away Betfair you have to say to newcomers to the sport that if they bet and fail to show signs of losing money (don't have to be winners) then they will be banned. How does this promote Racing ?
The Tote just texted me and ... oh, finish the joke yourself.
Much of what is on here and the RP is about how to promote betting, not racing. Clearly they are very closely related but they are not the same.
The Tote just texted me and ... oh, finish the joke yourself.
Much of what is on here and the RP is about how to promote betting, not racing. Clearly they are very closely related but they are not the same.
The Racing Post has no interest whatsoever in promoting racing, Ramruma - as you identify, it's betting they are interested in encouraging.
It's raison d'etre is now to persuade unprofitable punters to hand over their cash to its commercial partners in the bookmaking industry.
Four of those it is in a joint venture with, through its website betting app.
That's not to mention the tipster ads throughout the paper, virtually all of which (including Thomo's), are run by a company called centurycomm - that company is also the Racing Post...
It's raison d'etre is now to persuade unprofitable punters to hand over their cash to its commercial partners in the bookmaking industry.
Four of those it is in a joint venture with, through its website betting app.
That's not to mention the tipster ads throughout the paper, virtually all of which (including Thomo's), are run by a company called centurycomm - that company is also the Racing Post...
the feature in the racing post is all about attracting more people to horse racing , whether that's betting, ownership , going to the races etc .
Racecourse attendances are not the main problem in fact they are up. Of course betting is the problem, it needs to increase
Da yoof are not interested in studying form. In running betting is the future.
McCoy Carp Joined: 02 Nov 05
Replies: 2673 05 Jul 17 17:01
Before Betfair punters would go to the races to obtain better prices. After Betfair they don't.
I blame betfair for bringing down bookmakers margins and we need to get back to the good old days with 130% markets.
Replies: 2673 05 Jul 17 17:01
Before Betfair punters would go to the races to obtain better prices. After Betfair they don't.
I blame betfair for bringing down bookmakers margins and we need to get back to the good old days with 130% markets.
yes wesdag , david carr says it correctly in todays RP.
along the line of : "if you want to grow interest in racing , you need to show those that play machines , casino , lottery, that racing has the best interactive betting experience "
and it does, but just not at the moment with time delays
along the line of : "if you want to grow interest in racing , you need to show those that play machines , casino , lottery, that racing has the best interactive betting experience "
and it does, but just not at the moment with time delays
The sport is absolutely riddled with non triers and deliberately poor rides. If the sport is to last long into the future it has to stamp out the cheating, without integrity, which is completely lacking at present, then there will be no future as punetrs will all wise up eventually and spend their betting and lesiure money elsewhere.
pablo
Racecourses switching from ATR to the other lot with hardly any subscribers is fantastic news for racing to broaden its appeal.
Hopefully atr lose all the others so we can speed up the death of the sport.
Hopefully atr lose all the others so we can speed up the death of the sport.
Has there been any further developments re in play betting since the article below?
https://www.sis.tv/news/time-horse-racing-wager-play-opportunity/
https://www.sis.tv/news/time-horse-racing-wager-play-opportunity/
McCoy Carp 05 Jul 17 11:14 Joined: 02 Nov 05 | Topic/replies: 2,681 | Blogger: McCoy Carp's blog
Betfair is to blame for the current situation in racing. Bookies have counteracted the exchange by offering early prices and BOG. There is no point in the traditional punter going to the races anymore. What advantage is there with betting with an on course bookie? Now you have this ridiculous situation where racing is tied in with music. It's pathetic.
Couldn't disagree more about going racing. Huge edge in seeing the horses to assess fitness/demeanour. Books do take a bet - it's up to me if I bet with on course books or here. Inevitably most of the longer priced ones are significantly bigger prices on here but at the front of the market prices near to or comparable to here allowing for commission especially if can secure fractions.
Agree re music!
Betfair is to blame for the current situation in racing. Bookies have counteracted the exchange by offering early prices and BOG. There is no point in the traditional punter going to the races anymore. What advantage is there with betting with an on course bookie? Now you have this ridiculous situation where racing is tied in with music. It's pathetic.
Couldn't disagree more about going racing. Huge edge in seeing the horses to assess fitness/demeanour. Books do take a bet - it's up to me if I bet with on course books or here. Inevitably most of the longer priced ones are significantly bigger prices on here but at the front of the market prices near to or comparable to here allowing for commission especially if can secure fractions.
Agree re music!
Parispike, what percentage of potential punters/racegoers can assess the fitness/demeanour of horses well enough to have a significant profitable impact on their betting, bearing in mind the additional costs they need to offset by going racing?
I don't know BB. I try to keep costs down as much as possible but understand your point!
where would you start?
entrance prices to racecourses for one
the tv coverage is either nerdy by not very good nerds who think they are very, very good or by cretins who, by their very nature, have no idea how cretinous they are. and both sets, the nerds and the cretins have tendency to think the sport their to promote them, rather than vice-versa.
i'd say the TV really does have big part to play and they'd do well to have a good look at some of the Aussie live racing shows. indeed perhaps TV has the biggest part to play given the way great coverage has turned around other sports
there are some excellent exceptions among the commentators such as hoiles and holt and comperes such as catts and luck or analysts such as mellish and lydia
the tote is a disgrace, scoop 6 not a good bet as the unit stake too high so no broad-base appeal, HK-type superbet like the Triple Trio much better
i do agree with onlooker re the irony of the article being members only, ffs, how dumb is that.
entrance prices to racecourses for one
the tv coverage is either nerdy by not very good nerds who think they are very, very good or by cretins who, by their very nature, have no idea how cretinous they are. and both sets, the nerds and the cretins have tendency to think the sport their to promote them, rather than vice-versa.
i'd say the TV really does have big part to play and they'd do well to have a good look at some of the Aussie live racing shows. indeed perhaps TV has the biggest part to play given the way great coverage has turned around other sports
there are some excellent exceptions among the commentators such as hoiles and holt and comperes such as catts and luck or analysts such as mellish and lydia
the tote is a disgrace, scoop 6 not a good bet as the unit stake too high so no broad-base appeal, HK-type superbet like the Triple Trio much better
i do agree with onlooker re the irony of the article being members only, ffs, how dumb is that.
If the Editor stopped blocking, on Twitter, everyone who has the temerity to disagree with him (however politely) it might help take away the perception that the only view that matters is his (and his paymasters of course).
Parispike, it's hard to believe that the Racing Post or its woeful editor can possibly see their customers as anything other than something to be served up to the bookmaking industry, imo...
The horseracing product does not appeal to the youth of today. Football has taken over massively. Advertising on tv by bookies usually focuses on the wide range of bets available on your phone in football matches.
On course, Betfair has ruined the market. Every book seems to offer the exact same prices. Rarely does a bookie take an opinion. Only the big meetings attract decent crowds. For the lesser meets, free entrance is a must.
The shops are only interested in FOBT's, and until these machines are banned, betting shops should be renamed arcades. Can't see a way forward tbh.
On course, Betfair has ruined the market. Every book seems to offer the exact same prices. Rarely does a bookie take an opinion. Only the big meetings attract decent crowds. For the lesser meets, free entrance is a must.
The shops are only interested in FOBT's, and until these machines are banned, betting shops should be renamed arcades. Can't see a way forward tbh.
betfair is just simply competition as a result of technology so its only an argument for Luddites and football is competition to racing and at the moment does it better because racing is being kept in the dark ages as much as possible, its far more popular and familiar to the next generation, i'd advice anyone looking to bet in the longer term to develop a second sport to bet on because you never know the rate of decay of this one with they way its run
racing just doesnt listen to its customers
racing just doesnt listen to its customers
racing is in the position it is, because they do not have control of everything, courses , picture rights, betting etc
so every faction is in it for themselves and not for the better of racing and its future .
so every faction is in it for themselves and not for the better of racing and its future .
unless there is a clause in the levy contract, i don't see why horse racing ( BHA or whoever ) doesn't start opening their own betting shops with all profits going to racing , and not just the 10.75% bookmakers pay on there profits now . could also make a killing from the fobts .
Today I had coffee with a friend of mine who still uses betting shops, he is a retired gentleman who I shall call Paddy. He placed a bet in a shop which advertised that if your horse came 2nd, 3rd or 4th to the fav in specific races you would get your money back as a free bet. He double checked that the race he was betting on was the one of two that qualified and was told yes. He backed two horses in the race to win and one of them came second to the fav. He went back to get his free bet and was told NO, only your first bet qualified which came nowhere. The advert which he has sent to IBAS said nothing about only one bet per race. He is not winning punter.
Now ask yourself, why is Racing losing customers
Now ask yourself, why is Racing losing customers
Olias, one of the most obscene parts of this deckchairs on the Titanic racing post feature, is that its own editor spends much of his time blocking his own consumers on Twitter, and telling the prime Racing Post target audience who use this forum that they're 'not safe to be let loose with a crayon' and that theirs are 'feeble, nasty, predictable, pocket-talking, barely regulated, anonymous viewpoints'
If racing has contempt for its own customers, then it's no surprise if those who care about the sport can no longer engage...
If racing has contempt for its own customers, then it's no surprise if those who care about the sport can no longer engage...
i am dubious as to big courses doing well, small courses/meetings poorly attended
i think the Arena/Northern Racing model to course ownership hasn't helped at all for one section of the racing stakeholders, but it certainly has paid off for themselves (whom i detest).
when i'm home i always go to fontwell, plumpton and brighton. the first two named are well attended and brighton gets loads of corporates, indeed fontwell is often packed yet has the most derisory prize money.
so i'd say racecourses are part of the problem, too, in terms of entrance fees (high) and prize money contributions (low)
i think the Arena/Northern Racing model to course ownership hasn't helped at all for one section of the racing stakeholders, but it certainly has paid off for themselves (whom i detest).
when i'm home i always go to fontwell, plumpton and brighton. the first two named are well attended and brighton gets loads of corporates, indeed fontwell is often packed yet has the most derisory prize money.
so i'd say racecourses are part of the problem, too, in terms of entrance fees (high) and prize money contributions (low)
i do agree race course entrance fees should be free or no more than £10 for non major meetings.
Mondays Ayr meeting is £15 in advance, which is one of the more reasonable priced tracks.
Mondays Ayr meeting is £15 in advance, which is one of the more reasonable priced tracks.
What racecourses should realise is they are offering about 15 minutes of action on a raceday.
About half of that action is out of range to spectators.
People can bet away from the racecourse, they can get better food away from the racecourse.
They have to spend money and time to get to racecourses, and pay to enter the racecourse.
About half the races are handicaps which are designed to be a lottery.
Racing needs to do a bit of thinking.
About half of that action is out of range to spectators.
People can bet away from the racecourse, they can get better food away from the racecourse.
They have to spend money and time to get to racecourses, and pay to enter the racecourse.
About half the races are handicaps which are designed to be a lottery.
Racing needs to do a bit of thinking.
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