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A_T
06 Jun 24 22:43
Joined:
Date Joined: 27 Jan 06
| Topic/replies: 21,364 | Blogger: A_T's blog
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/court-hears-arguments-whether-steve-bannon-begin-prison-sentence-rcna155209

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Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 4:48 PM BST
The falsification of other business records was one of three choices the jury were to choose from which elevated the misdemeanor falsification of business records to a felony.
Report edy June 7, 2024 4:49 PM BST
Hey, you paid attention for once. You feeling up for

edy • June 7, 2024 3:45 PM BST
Aha, and you are certain those were never mentioned until after the closing arguments had been made?

edy • June 7, 2024 3:46 PM BST
Or would you like to retract that statement before you are found guilty of having had lied?

now?
Report tobermory June 7, 2024 4:51 PM BST
Who did Trump rape?
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 4:54 PM BST
I am not buying a New York Times subscription for one transcript.
Report edy June 7, 2024 4:56 PM BST
You don't need to buy a subscription. Here they are from the court all officially then

https://pdfs.nycourts.gov/PeopleVs.DTrump-71543/transcripts/

.
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 4:58 PM BST
Which pdf and which page do I need to look at?
Report edy June 7, 2024 4:58 PM BST
It's your research
Report edy June 7, 2024 4:58 PM BST
The documents are searchable so you can ctrl+f them for keywords you deem suitable in your research.
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 4:59 PM BST
So you haven't got any supporting evidence. Just as I thought.
Report edy June 7, 2024 5:00 PM BST
I'd like an engagement on this so that I get to officially and with your approval get to call you a liar if you don't retract.

edy • June 7, 2024 3:45 PM BST
Aha, and you are certain those were never mentioned until after the closing arguments had been made?

edy • June 7, 2024 3:46 PM BST
Or would you like to retract that statement before you are found guilty of having had lied?
Report edy June 7, 2024 5:01 PM BST
I am now merely helping you make the correct decision by providing assistance to your research.
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 5:12 PM BST
I am not sure we agree about what we are disputing. It's obviously not enough for the government to vaguely reference the crimes they had in mind. They would need to be exactly defined for the defense to be able to contest it. The falsification of business records misdemeanor was talked about and known from the beginning which is not disputed, and that is a separate issue from the falsification of other business records. What is disputed is whether the 3 crimes were defined properly so that the defense knew what they were contesting before the closing arguments.
Report edy June 7, 2024 5:16 PM BST
That's not what you initially said. You said "prosecutor didn't reveal what crimes Trump was accused of until after the defense had made it's closing arguments"

Which means they did specify, but only after the closing arguments. What is it now?
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 5:25 PM BST
The 3 choices of crimes which elevated the misdemeanor were not defined until after the defense made closing arguments, so they were not revealed to the defense and the defense could not contest them.
Report edy June 7, 2024 5:30 PM BST
What are sentences like

The primary crime that we have alleged is New York State Election Law Section 17-152

from the transcript of April 23 all about?
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 5:36 PM BST
Is New York State Election Law a crime?
Report edy June 7, 2024 5:41 PM BST
Laws define crimes, yes. If they have adequate titles you can also say it like the prosecutor did.
Report edy June 7, 2024 5:51 PM BST
So what's a sentence like that doing in the transcript, Ronald?
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 5:58 PM BST
That's ridiculously vague. The New York State Election Law outlines provisions related to campaign contributions, such as limitations and regulations, so the defense would need to know which limitation or regulation was the problem for them to be able to address it. And you have still not provided any evidence they defined the 3 crimes before the defense's closing arguments which they said were the candidates for the unlawful means by which the election was influenced.
Report edy June 7, 2024 6:17 PM BST
edy • June 7, 2024 5:00 PM BST
I'd like an engagement on this so that I get to officially and with your approval get to call you a liar if you don't retract.

edy • June 7, 2024 3:45 PM BST
Aha, and you are certain those were never mentioned until after the closing arguments had been made?

edy • June 7, 2024 3:46 PM BST
Or would you like to retract that statement before you are found guilty of having had lied?
Report edy June 7, 2024 6:19 PM BST
I can help you some more in making the correct decision. I really don't want to trap you and be mean and stuff.

Like...can you imagine that court filings exist from months prior...like May 2023 or law blog entries from March 2024 where the court filings were picked up?
Report edy June 7, 2024 6:21 PM BST
Were then regarding e.g. the by you mentioned "Violations of tax laws." had been specified with...specific laws?
Report edy June 7, 2024 6:24 PM BST
*Where then
Report edy June 7, 2024 6:26 PM BST
Kids these days really need every bit of research skill hand fed to them. If they don't have it on their X timeline pre-chewed, they really are lost in finding information and documents.
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 6:31 PM BST
Law blog entries? What's that got to do with anything?
Are the 3 crimes I mentioned defined in the indictment? Or during the case?
Where are you saying they were officially defined?
Report edy June 7, 2024 6:32 PM BST
Law blog entries that cite the court filings are relevant because they take the information from...you know....court filings.
Report edy June 7, 2024 6:33 PM BST
And court filings are kind of relevant to court cases. Look, the first word of "court filings" and "court cases" is even the same - court!
Report edy June 7, 2024 6:33 PM BST

Jun 7, 2024 -- 6:31PM, Ronaldmcdonald wrote:


Law blog entries? What's that got to do with anything?Are the 3 crimes I mentioned defined in the indictment? Or during the case?Where are you saying they were officially defined?


Court filings from May 2023 is really not enough of a hint yet for you? It's even on X if it makes it easier for you.

Report edy June 7, 2024 6:34 PM BST
Kids and their research skills, man....
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 6:38 PM BST
I don't believe I said court filings were not relevant, but you were talking about law blogs.
So let's see it then, where's the evidence?
Report edy June 7, 2024 6:42 PM BST
Seriously dude, court filings from May 2023 is not enough of a hint for you? What if I tell you court filings in response to a request for a bill of particular from Trump and his team?
Report edy June 7, 2024 6:42 PM BST
That's enough to show off your research skills surely.
Report edy June 7, 2024 6:43 PM BST
particulars
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 7:17 PM BST
So you haven't go any evidence then?
Report edy June 7, 2024 7:22 PM BST
I do, but you and your development in regards to research and critical thinking are much more helped if you take my hints and do your own research based up on it. If you learn to exist without absolutely everything preing pre-chewed on X or here.

Which (potential) document(s) have you been able to identify so far?
Report edy June 7, 2024 7:23 PM BST
Or have you not been able to identify any candidates and need yet more assistance?
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 7:28 PM BST
If it's in the filings why did you send me on a wild goose chase searching through court transcripts?
Report tobermory June 7, 2024 7:39 PM BST
Edy's pedantry is off the scale Sad
Report edy June 7, 2024 7:41 PM BST
Why is it my pedantry and not Ronald's in this case, tobermory? It is him who is making the claim, possibly on some technicality, that "prosecutor didn't reveal what crimes Trump was accused of until after the defense had made it's closing arguments"
Report edy June 7, 2024 7:43 PM BST

Jun 7, 2024 -- 7:28PM, Ronaldmcdonald wrote:


If it's in the filings why did you send me on a wild goose chase searching through court transcripts?


Seemed a good opportunity to get my joke of

edy • June 7, 2024 4:38 PM BST
https://www.nytimes.com/article/trump-hush-money-trial-transcripts.html

You can do your research and read the transcripts there. As we know from Trump's Ukraine thing back in the day, it's very important to always read the transcripts. Don't be a sheep. Do your own research. It's very important.

in

Report edy June 7, 2024 7:44 PM BST
It's my favourite joke on here really and reminds me of you in some ways. It's based on a Jordan Klepper segment that once went like this

Trumper: Read the transcript
Klepper: Read the transcript
Trumper: Yeah
Klepper: Have you read the transcript?
Trumper: I don't have to *laughs* Everyone else has. I can read it if I need to, but...
Klepper: But it's important that everyone read the transcript?
Trumper: It is very important. Pay attention...and think for yourself
Klepper: Yes...but to be clear: You have not read the transcript?
Trumper: I haven't, right.
Klepper: Right...but it is just important?
Trumper: Yeah, don't be a sheep, think for yourself
Klepper: But again, just to be very clear: You have not read it?
Trumper: I have not read it.
Klepper: You just trusted somebody else who has?
Trumper: Yes
Klepper: What have you said about "Don't be a sheep, think for yourself"?
Trumper: *emphatically* Don't be a sheep! Think for yourself! Do your own research!
Report edy June 7, 2024 7:46 PM BST
So either way, Ronald, what candidate documents have you been able to identify?

Does middle of May help?
Report edy June 7, 2024 7:46 PM BST
2023
Report edy June 7, 2024 7:54 PM BST
Not? Does it help that Trump's request of bill of particulars that it was in response to, as mentioned earlier, was from the end of april 2023?
Report edy June 7, 2024 7:55 PM BST
You are so lost when things are chewed for you on X Laugh
Report edy June 7, 2024 7:57 PM BST
But again...I am here to help you. It will be very advantageous for your long-term development and for you becoming the best version of yourself.
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 7:58 PM BST
I don't suppose you are ever going to get to the point. What's your definition of a Trumper? Is that anyone who doesn't believe all the deranged nonsense deranged lefties believe?
Report edy June 7, 2024 8:02 PM BST
It was someone interviewed at a Trump rally wearing a hat that looked like Trump merchandise even if it wasn't directly a "Make America Great Again" hat. Might have been inofficial merchandise.
Report edy June 7, 2024 8:05 PM BST
Still not enough hints for you, Ronald, to find the court filing? Ok, then allow me to give you the law blog entry I talked about earlier. Surely with all the things mentioned and clues in there, along with the very many other tips I have given, you will be able to identify the correct court filing document with even your incredibly pedestrian research skills.

https://www.justsecurity.org/93916/guide-manhattan-trump-trial/
Report edy June 7, 2024 8:06 PM BST
Surely now...

Don't make me lose my faith in humanity here please.
Report edy June 7, 2024 8:13 PM BST
Though I have to say I am disappointed in your completely lacking resolve and intent to do your own research up to this point. Gotta do better.
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 8:26 PM BST
Another wild goose chase I suppose. I think you would have produced your evidence by now if you had any.
Report edy June 7, 2024 8:28 PM BST
It's not a wild goose chase. It's a matter of less than five minutes for anyone remotely competent with all the information I have given you now. The information to refute your claim of "prosecutor didn't reveal what crimes Trump was accused of until after the defense had made it's closing arguments" is already in the blog, but....really....do yourself and your abilities a favour and try to find the court filing.

Old Ronald will reflect back on it one day and be very thankful.
Report edy June 7, 2024 8:32 PM BST
But you see, that's so very characteristic of you yet again. I even give you the law blog that contains all the information, but you simply cannot be bothered to read anything that isn't chewed for you. You should know the keywords to look for, but you simply can't be bothered to do research even as simple as that.

It's so very characteristic. Just like with the Hitchens thing where you never read the actual interview with the Ukrainian general.
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 8:57 PM BST
I am not making any claim about what's in the court filings, you are. If there's no evidence in your next post I will assume it's because there is none. I can't be fairer than that.
Report edy June 7, 2024 9:11 PM BST
Fine, if you insist on really not doing any research at all yourself.....

https://www.justsecurity.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/manhattan-district-attorney-bill-of-particulars-response-may-16-2023.pdf

It really would not have been hard, mate. Old Ronald would have been thankful. Instead you will forever and ever after continue to be completely lost when you don't get people pre-chewing everything for you. Your choice, but it is not a good choice.

You will run time and time into situations where you will look like a liar because you just did not do any own research and verification.
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 9:23 PM BST
Are you referring to request no 2?
Report edy June 7, 2024 9:33 PM BST
That'd be the specification of the unlawful means, yes.
Report edy June 7, 2024 9:34 PM BST
Which you were claiming Trump and his lawyers had not been told about.
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 9:56 PM BST
That's not quite right.
Report edy June 7, 2024 9:56 PM BST
What's right?
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 10:00 PM BST
I do not think it means what you think it means.
Report edy June 7, 2024 10:02 PM BST
So what's right?
Report edy June 7, 2024 10:13 PM BST
You pasted, without any attribution like the commie at heart that you are, this in regards to your initial thing about the closing arguments:

Merchan said prosecutors have identified three alleged unlawful means used to influence the election: Violations of the Federal Election Campaign Act, The falsification of other business records, Violations of tax laws.

https://www.politico.com/live-updates/2024/05/29/trump-hush-money-criminal-trial/unlawful-means-00160377

And claimed that Trump had never been told what these e.g. tax laws are that he may have had broken.

The court filings have information for Trump's lawyers on which specific tax laws he may have broken.
Report edy June 7, 2024 10:15 PM BST
And claimed that Trump had never been told what these e.g. tax laws are that he may have had broken.

*until after the closing arguments
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 10:53 PM BST
May have.
Report edy June 7, 2024 11:11 PM BST
May have what?
Report edy June 7, 2024 11:13 PM BST
What are you trying to say with your latest post?
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 7, 2024 11:18 PM BST
Laws that may have been broken.
Report edy June 7, 2024 11:21 PM BST
Oh

Can you think of a possible reason why legal documents, pre-trial, use language of "may have" or "is alleged"?
Report cryoftruth June 8, 2024 6:14 AM BST
A nice long sentence for the anti semitic vile racist Bannon will bring great joy to decent people everywhere.
Report edy June 8, 2024 3:14 PM BST

Jun 7, 2024 -- 11:21PM, edy wrote:


OhCan you think of a possible reason why legal documents, pre-trial, use language of "may have" or "is alleged"?


No, Ronald? Sad

Report edy June 9, 2024 12:36 PM BST
No ideas at all, Ronald? Sad
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 9, 2024 2:08 PM BST
I need to get my people to look into this matter.
Report edy June 9, 2024 2:14 PM BST
Why not think real hard and tough for yourself?
Report edy June 10, 2024 3:11 PM BST
What has your team come back with as you are unable to think for yourself, Ronald?
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 10, 2024 4:32 PM BST
Don't worry edy it's all in hand. I have a large team trawling through piles of legal documents now as we speak and I will get back to you the minute they alert me to any developments.
Report edy June 10, 2024 4:57 PM BST
How large?
Report edy June 10, 2024 4:58 PM BST
I'd still prefer if you were not scared of thinking for yourself really. You can do it! I believe in you!
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 10, 2024 6:51 PM BST
Very large.
Report edy June 10, 2024 8:36 PM BST
They are taking a very long time. It's terribly hard to find quality personnell these days, is it not?
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 10, 2024 8:39 PM BST
You will have to bear with me. I am afraid they have a mountain of legal papers to trawl through. Rome wasn't built in a day you know.
Report edy June 10, 2024 9:19 PM BST
What specifically is the thought behind trawling through a mountain of legal papers in regards to the question? Should not be necessary. Some very basic understanding of the legal system and principles should be enough to develop ideas.
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 10, 2024 9:45 PM BST
Don't worry about it, it's all going to be sorted out once and for all. They have informed me they are making steady progress.
Report edy June 10, 2024 10:07 PM BST
I don't worry about it, but I am very curious about the thought process and reason to do it.
Report Ronaldmcdonald June 10, 2024 10:48 PM BST
Steady progress they said.
Report edy June 10, 2024 11:16 PM BST
I think they are cheating on you. Should demand to be given some first ideas.
Report edy June 14, 2024 11:33 AM BST
Any results yet from your team, Ronald`?
Report edy June 15, 2024 11:35 PM BST
Your team is totally taking advantage of your naivity, Ronald.
Report cryoftruth June 17, 2024 7:56 AM BST
A nice long sentence for the anti semitic vile racist Bannon will bring great joy to decent people everywhere.
Report A_T July 1, 2024 7:08 PM BST
bannon has reported to jail - he'll be fine with the protection of the aryan nation
Report Ronaldmcdonald July 1, 2024 7:41 PM BST
Trump will have to prosecute all the politicians, prosecutors and judges involved in the corrupt weaponisation of the legal system after the election. He will have no choice, if he doesn't they will only do it again.
Report A_T July 1, 2024 7:59 PM BST
bannon joins the long list of people jailed for doing the don's bidding
Report Ronaldmcdonald July 2, 2024 8:59 AM BST
Typical idiotic leftie nonsense. Without executive privilege presidents would be powerless.
Report A_T July 2, 2024 11:03 AM BST
bannon says he has a "maga army" to get the don re-elected
Report cryoftruth July 2, 2024 8:04 PM BST
Typical idiotic leftie nonsense. Without executive privilege presidents would be powerless.
Incredible trash even by timber’s low standards.
No USA President has been so obviously and actually a criminal before. No President found it difficult to be president without an exemption for criminality before.

It’s only an issue because the odious sex abuser Trump, the orange bozo who boasted on video about his tendency to grab young females by their privates, has already broken the law and plans to do more of it.
Report Ronaldmcdonald July 3, 2024 8:59 AM BST
No leftie has ever managed to explain to me what's wrong with consensual private grabbing.
Report cryoftruth July 4, 2024 10:14 AM BST
The grabbing of young women’s private parts that Trump boasted about was in the context of not just his worrying tendencies, but in the context of his misuse of fame and power.
Were the young women he “grabbed” really in a situation where refusing Trump’s most odious advances would have gone well for them?

Either way Trump is so dishonest and disgusting, such an anti American multiple bankrupt tax dodging oaf, he is clearly unfit for any public function other than occupying a prison cell alongside his antisemitic pal Bannon.

And the fact that timber keeps on giving his support to Trump tells you everything you need to know. If the plank likes you it’s got to be a worry.
Report Ronaldmcdonald July 4, 2024 5:22 PM BST
In the Access Hollywood leak he said they let you when you are famous. If they decided to let him there's not much you lefties can do about it for all your sanctimonious moralising.
But seriously COT, if you think Trump is beyond being acceptable because he once bragged about consensual private grabbing amongst adults, how do you explain your indifference about this?
https://x.com/DonaldJTrumpJr/status/1262028053162741763
.
Report edy July 4, 2024 5:33 PM BST

Jun 7, 2024 -- 11:21PM, edy wrote:


OhCan you think of a possible reason why legal documents, pre-trial, use language of "may have" or "is alleged"?


How is your team coming along on this, Ronald? It's been almost a month.

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