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shiny new shoes please
11 Oct 21 12:54
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Date Joined: 29 Sep 08
| Topic/replies: 28,509 | Blogger: shiny new shoes please's blog
China is going to dominate the world through its advances in AI and other emerging technologies, and the US has already missed out on a chance to prevent it, the Pentagon’s recently resigned software chief has said.
“We have no competing fighting chance against China in 10 to 20 years.  It is already over in my opinion,” Nicolas Chaillan told the Financial Times in his first interview since his shock resignation last month.
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Report lfc1971 October 11, 2021 2:25 PM BST
Won’t happen , there’s no such thing as AI
Report shiny new shoes please October 11, 2021 3:10 PM BST
It is already overExcitedLaugh
Report macarony October 11, 2021 3:14 PM BST
The West has been too preoccupied by things like racism to notice the Chinese have passed us by, it's going to be a very different future with a very different set of values.
Report Corky October 11, 2021 3:37 PM BST
Chinese laughing their wotsits off. Building a new power station every week while we debate whether to call a trans zhe she or oi you.
Report macarony October 11, 2021 4:30 PM BST
Under their road building policy they have influence everywhere including the EU. The Chinese are set to be the new dominant force, The West is in decline we took our eye off the ball got sidetracked along the way. We even willfully relocated key industries to China because we thought it was cheaper, greed and stupidity have got us to where we are today.
Report impossible123 October 11, 2021 4:58 PM BST
The Chinese with their economic and monetary dominance only need another ally eg their neighbour Russia, to rule the world as they wish. And, the West including USA can do zilch.

The Chinese are slowly, slowly catchy monkey; Hong Kong; South China Sea; Taiwan (soon). Next could be Africa given their economic and monetary dominance. Most Africa countries would be bankrupt if the Chinese stop buying their raw minerals and commodities.

I believe when the Chinese acquire military and technology/software IP (legally or not) they will rule the world for sure.
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 5:03 PM BST
"Under their road building policy they have influence everywhere including the EU."

their building your 5G network mate
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 5:05 PM BST
Chinese economy is built on sand

most of what they build (houses, tech, militray) is junk compared to Korea, jaoan and the west
Report macarony October 11, 2021 5:11 PM BST
You do know that copying IP and reverse engineering is the norm in the East, until they have surpassed the competition. Don't under estimate the Chinese or you could end up looking like a Western politician
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 5:13 PM BST
koreans and japanese duidn't build their tech and auto industries on stealing

only disfunctional societies like China, russia, soviet union do that
Report macarony October 11, 2021 5:20 PM BST
I take it you have never read the book stealing speed?
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 5:21 PM BST
no, what is it about?
Report peckerdunne October 11, 2021 5:24 PM BST
But Boris said in his speech that they were tackling China, so nothing

to worry about.
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 5:26 PM BST
and at some point china will have to transition to democracy, or get more and more oppressive

that could be very messy
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 5:27 PM BST
Russia tried that, lost a decade and basically went back to authoritarianism
Report macarony October 11, 2021 5:35 PM BST
Its about two Germans and the Japanese motorbike company Suzuki. Ernst Degner the highly talented motorcycle racer and his boss Walter Kaaden the brilliant WW2 rocket engineer who first to develop the expansion chamber to boost power of the 2stroke engine, he was fiercely loyal to DKW/MZ in Zschopau and to Germany while many of his contemporaries left Germany Like Von Brown to work for the US and Russia he stayed to rebuild a bombed out factory and revolutionise motor sport.  Degner on the other hand had other ideas not wanting to stay in East Germany he stole the plans to MZ's racing bikes and defected to the West midway through the Swedish GP and straight into the open arms of Suzuki.
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 5:41 PM BST
ok that's an interesting but the japanese had a whole suite of advanced tech: cars, tvs, motorbikes, consumer goods, toys, media etc.

it wasn't an economy that struggled to keep up and resorted to stealing

they overtook Britain, US and Italy in the motorcycle market in the 60s, that wasn't due to espionage, their products were better, cheaper, more reliable

is there anything the Chinese do better than Korea, Japan or the West?
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 5:43 PM BST
for a long time there were maybe a dozen areas where Japan was clearly better than the west
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 5:45 PM BST
the only advantage China has is cost, not quality
Report macarony October 11, 2021 5:58 PM BST
I think you need to do some research into how these economies developed after WW2. Back to my point the about Chinese future dominance this is something we will all have to get used to
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 6:03 PM BST
lol

are you suggesting the Japanese economic miracle was based on theft of IP?

they had tech the west didn't have, they developed it themselves

Japan has won 25 of the last 26 moto gp / 500cc world championships

when will China start winning?
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 6:04 PM BST
45 of the last 46
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 6:07 PM BST
By 1969 fully 50% of the US market for motorcycles more than 500 cc belonged to Triumph, but technological advances at Triumph had failed to match those of the foreign companies.

Triumphs lacked electric start mechanisms, relied on push-rods rather than overhead cams, vibrated noticeably, often leaked oil and had antiquated electrical systems; while Japanese marques such as Honda were building more advanced features into attractive new motorcycles that sold for less than their British competitors.

Triumph motorcycles, as a result, were nearly obsolete even when they were new.

Further, Triumph's manufacturing processes were very labour-intensive and largely inefficient.

Also disastrous, during the early 1970s the US government mandated that all motorcycle imports must have their gearshift and brake pedals in the Japanese configuration, which required expensive retooling of all the motorcycles for US sale.

Triumph and BSA were well aware of Honda's ability but while the Japanese were only making smaller engined models, the large engine market was considered safe.

When the first Honda 750 cc four cylinder was released for sale to the public, Triumph and BSA had trouble.

Despite developing and releasing a 3-cylinder 750 cc engined motorcycle prior to the Japanese fours—the BSA Rocket 3/Triumph Trident—the Japanese bikes were praised in the press for their modernity (disc brakes, 4-cylinder engines, leak-free engine casings, etc.).

The British triples outperformed the Japanese fours (top speed, acceleration and handling) but the Japanese fours required less maintenance and they did not leak.

The 1970 Tiger/Bonneville re-design and taller twin front downtube oil tank frame had a mixed reception from Triumph enthusiasts at the time, and was insufficient to win back those already riding the Japanese bikes that had been sold since 1969—the Honda 750 Four, and the Kawasaki 500 Mach 3.

The Triumph 350 cc Bandit received pre-publicity, but its development was quietly brought to an end.

Triumph was still making motorcycles, but they no longer looked like the motorcycles Triumph fans expected.

The Trident attracted its own market, but the Japanese motorcycles were improving more rapidly.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triumph_Engineering#Post-war_era
Report macarony October 11, 2021 6:08 PM BST
Have yo ever read Japans motorcycle wars by Jeff alexander brilliant book about the Japanese after WW2 and right up to the 70s
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 6:08 PM BST
the japanese gear was better, cheaper and more reliable than that made in the US and Europe
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 6:10 PM BST
their advantage in cost was down to superior production methods / economies of scale, not low wages like China
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 6:11 PM BST
might give that book a look
Report macarony October 11, 2021 6:12 PM BST
I have done quite a lot of research on the British motorcycle industry and can discuss the reasons behind its demise at length. My research also included the German and Japanese motorcycle industries
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 6:12 PM BST
if you watch US movies in the 50s, 60s and 70s the motorcycles are often Triumphs

Triumph was a huge British success story
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 6:13 PM BST
the factories weren't as large or modern as those in Japan, the tech wasn't as advanced and they were less reliable and more expensive
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 6:14 PM BST
BSA was bascially a cottage industry
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 6:16 PM BST
i don't know a lot about pre war german bikes

i don't think grand prix motorcycle racing was very common back then so difficult to gauge how they would hae fared v Italian and British bikes
Report macarony October 11, 2021 6:33 PM BST
BSA was a large engineering group of well respected companies often varied companies everything from cars to sintered products they were the world leader in the latter. BSA built more motorbikes in the bitter sweet year of 71 than they did in 61. 1971 been the year BSA/Triumph missed the all important but very short US selling season. Sales of BSA/Triumph had gone up by 40% in the US in the mid 60s due mainly to the time and money the Japanese had spent redeeming the image of motorcycles and their riders, from deathtraps ridden by hooligans to you meet the nicest people on a Honda. Eric Turner the then chairman of BSA decided to modernise Smallheath and introduce a range of both 4 stroke and 2 stroke machines and rotary engine bike for  1974/75. In addition to these bikes there would also be an update to the current line up of bikes these would known as the power set. BSA also spent untold millions on the titanium motorcross bike the most advanced bike ever built and the first bike to use disc brakes, they also spent more millions on the Areial 3 50cc trike. and about 10 million on the successful racing program that destroyed the Japanese in the production class racing.
BSA had expected to sell around 40 million pounds worth of bikes in the US in 71 but because of production delays they only sold around 26 million, if you consider that it would have cost BSA 38 million to build the bikes then its not hard to see they now have a big problem.
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 10:22 PM BST
"the titanium motorcross bike the most advanced bike ever built and the first bike to use disc brakes" Confused

what was this called? Italian and Japanese bikes were already using disc brakes in the 60s.

does this mean first disc brakes for a motocross bike? what happened to the bike?

"10 million on the successful racing program that destroyed the Japanese in the production class racing"

what series was this? i don't think there was a world production series or a production class at the TT by this stage
Report macarony October 11, 2021 10:32 PM BST
The production racing class is for modified production bikes that you and I can buy not the one off GP bikes, the production class racing was by far the bigger sport at this time. However old mood eyes beat Argo at Mallory park in 71 on his BSA rocket 3, Argo on his works GP MV 500.
The titanium bike frame did not work so was scrapped the irony was BSA already had the best scrambler and would have won if the big wigs had not got involved. This bike was built in 65 using an American disc brake that did not work very well, later BSA would use a cutdown Triumph Herald disc brake on the Trident/Rocket3 racing bikes with the superior Rob North frame.
Report Capt__F October 11, 2021 10:46 PM BST
used to live near small Heath Bham played on their sports pitches many a time
3 Big Buildings
BSA
Happy days

Demolished nowSad
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 10:51 PM BST
"the production class racing was by far the bigger sport at this time. "

maybe for clubmen

the prestige categories were grand prix and TT
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 10:54 PM BST
neither Triumph nor BSA ever won a 500cc world champonship or a TT race
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 10:59 PM BST
you think BSA scramblers in the early 70s were better than Suzuki and Maico?

Jeff Smith finished second in 1967 but this was before the Japanese started winning
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 11:03 PM BST
Norton won a few TT races in the 50s and early 60s and a grand prix chamionship in 1951
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 11:05 PM BST
why didn't Triumph and BSA compete in grand prix road racing?
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 11:09 PM BST
"However old mood eyes beat Argo at Mallory park in 71 on his BSA rocket 3, Argo on his works GP MV 500."

was that really a big upset? the rocket was 750cc
Report Giuseppe October 11, 2021 11:28 PM BST
correction BSA and Triump won production TT races

i'm not sure how prestigious those races were, the results are not even listed on wikipedia

why didn;t BSA and Triumph compete in 500cc grand prixs?

was it because their expertise and sales were mostly with the bigger bikes?
Report shiny new shoes please October 11, 2021 11:48 PM BST
Giuseppe • start learning Mandarin.
To the moon

请纸ExcitedLaugh
Report Giuseppe October 12, 2021 12:27 AM BST
can't afford to mate

maybe you could sub me the cost of a course at the dublin confucius insututute
Report macarony October 12, 2021 12:54 AM BST
Slippery Sam won 5 consecutive production class TT races
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_Sam

why didn't Triumph and BSA compete in grand prix road racing?

Because at the time it was considered not worth the expense, other forms of motorcycle racing attracted far bigger audiences Trials, Motorcross, and production class road racing flat track racing in the states , even speedway was/is a bigger sport than motorcycle GP. plus BSA could sell versions of their production class bikes to the general public, no such joy with a one off hand made GP bike. In the states there was the AMA racing flat track and road racing all in one series.
Report macarony October 12, 2021 12:59 AM BST
used to live near small Heath Bham played on their sports pitches many a time
3 Big Buildings
BSA
Happy days

Demolished.
Wish I had got to see it without BSA and Smallheath not only could we not have won the war but we could not have fought it. They developed at their own expense and initiative the weapons needed to fight the war.

Other firms would also do the same the government of the day had no intention of fighting Hitler.
Report Giuseppe October 12, 2021 2:24 AM BST
mac everything you are saying applies to the present too

manufacturers spend more money on grand prix racing than any of those categories you listed

the best riders earning the biggest money, the biggest crowds, all compete in GP, it has laways been like this

production class/ superbikes has never been bigger than formula racing

the TT was the biggest race in "Britain", the production class was a sideshow, the 500cc senior TT was the biggest race

if Triumph and BSA didn;t compete it was because they either didn;t have the tech or the money, to sugest they didnt want to mad, every other manufactrer was involved

the 500cc
Report Giuseppe October 12, 2021 2:27 AM BST
"other forms of motorcycle racing attracted far bigger audiences Trials, Motorcross, and production class road racing flat track racing in the states , even speedway was/is a bigger sport than motorcycle GP"

mac this is just a ridiculous thing to say

the TT was by far the biggest event on the calendar, and it was a round of the 500cc world championship

maybe motocross is bigger than moto GP in America but not in europe
Report Giuseppe October 12, 2021 2:28 AM BST
Ducati beat everyone in superbikes

grand prix racing is another level, they've only won it once
Report Giuseppe October 12, 2021 2:29 AM BST
the isle of man TT used to the biggest motorcycle race in the entire world, never mind Britain
Report Giuseppe October 12, 2021 2:30 AM BST
it was like daytona in nascar / indianapolis 500  in indycar / monaco in F1

it was the most prestigious round of the championship

it only lost that status due to safety issues
Report Giuseppe October 12, 2021 2:34 AM BST
to suggest Triumph didn't try to win the TT because they didnt want to is stretching credbility
Report macarony October 12, 2021 6:56 AM BST
Vincent never raced in the GP class either and they are generally regarded as been the best bikes ever built. The TT is a massive event it is more of a festival you go for the week. Other sports were more popular back in the 50s and 60s because they are accessible to both spectators and competitors, with motocross and trials events every weekend. GP racing was international the Belgium GP the German GP ect
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