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differentdrum
07 Feb 19 12:06
Joined:
Date Joined: 05 Oct 11
| Topic/replies: 34,215 | Blogger: differentdrum's blog
No wonder they are talking of breakaway groups. A good 30% can't be happy with him.

He now appears to be pandering to very MPs who voted with the government on the recent votes. People like Flint and Mann, the chap who appears quite happy with government bungs for votes. Hardly surprising there were no reprimands.

Now he has come up with his own master plan to see Brexit over the line. A soft Brexit which would make many wonder why we are actually bothering to leave. The other slight problem he may have noticed is that his plan would require yet another U-turn from the Prime Minister. That seems very unlikely so he is trying to make it look like he is doing something positive when in effect he is just moving no deal closer.
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Report unitedbiscuits February 8, 2019 8:31 PM GMT
You say Brexit will happen, put it doesn't have to. If Labour facilitate Brexit, they are gambling on an outcome only the Tory Party can manufacture.
Report enpassant February 8, 2019 9:30 PM GMT
Labour won't split on brexit grounds. They may not split as such at all but I sincerely hope the Blairite's f..k right off (or are deselected)and out of the party, bypass the LibDems and go straight to their centrist pals in the Tory party.
Report unitedbiscuits February 8, 2019 9:40 PM GMT
Really? 70% or Labour voters are Remain.
Report enpassant February 8, 2019 9:42 PM GMT
I'm remain but I'm Corbyn also.
Report unitedbiscuits February 8, 2019 9:48 PM GMT
But if Corbyn facilitates it, he has no input into how Brexit will play out before 2022.
Report n88uk February 8, 2019 10:52 PM GMT
Blair actually won elections, Corbyn doesn't look like he can beat the worst government ever, tells you all you need to know.
Report politicspunter February 8, 2019 10:54 PM GMT
I wouldn't be certain of that.
Report n88uk February 8, 2019 10:55 PM GMT
It's not certain, but it wouldn't be a landslide and it should be.
Report politicspunter February 8, 2019 10:57 PM GMT
Why would it be a landslide? Labour are miles behind Tories on seats held.
Report n88uk February 8, 2019 11:02 PM GMT
Because virtually everyone thinks the current government is a mess, they should be able to pick up virtually every marginal from Conservatives, yet you'd have many floaters still think Conservatives are a better option than Labour.
Report politicspunter February 8, 2019 11:03 PM GMT
If an election was held tomorrow imo the result would be too close to call.
Report n88uk February 8, 2019 11:50 PM GMT
Yes which is a terrible result from Corbyn's pov. A diff Labour leader and it would be polling very different.
Report thegiggilo February 9, 2019 12:12 AM GMT
Should be 20 points clear,but an outside chance of winning if momentum can get the young out to vote again and that's debateable plus we now have the bias of the BBC QT  one example expect more to come,relying now on complete tory collapse and brexit failiure...
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 7:25 AM GMT

Feb 8, 2019 -- 5:50PM, n88uk wrote:


Yes which is a terrible result from Corbyn's pov. A diff Labour leader and it would be polling very different.


General elections always have a core Labour and Conservative vote, roughly 30% or a bit higher. These folks will never vote for anyone else, irrespective of who is party leader. Elections are decided by floating voters, new voters, folks that don't normally vote and folks that always voted but have passed away.

Report enpassant February 9, 2019 8:25 AM GMT
Imo brexit is the ONLY thing keeping this government in power. They actually need this debacle to continue. Without it voters would vote on the dire straights the country is in and not on who is more likely to give them what they want in terms of the EU.
The point pp makes is a good one. Since the young vote more in favour of Corbyn than than the Tory party it would be reasonable to assume he has picked up (and will continue to do so)  more new voters than the tories. Corbyn proved he is a capable campaigner. I cannot see any of the potential tory leader candidates appealing to a wide base of voters.
With the media bias trying to tell people that Corbyn can't win, that Labour are behind in the polls, the Corbyn is unelectable it would be easy to think voting Labour would be of little use. Only all of that media slant was there before- it didn't work.
So again the assessment pp makes, that it would be too close to call is very sensible shout.
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 9:00 AM GMT
Perhaps the tories will be considering electing someone younger as leader, someone that is more likely to connect with young and new voters.
Report 1st time poster February 9, 2019 9:39 AM GMT
a different labour leader presumably would be standing on 2nd reff,remain tkt,and like the country ,reff it would be 50/50 whether labour would win most seats,they,d deffo lose seats in the narrth so had to see them been largest party that been the case
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 9:43 AM GMT
Why do you think they would lose seats in the north and who to?  Give me a couple of constituencies as examples please.
Report 1st time poster February 9, 2019 11:31 AM GMT
redcar and Cleveland,anna turley hated up here
maybe a few more as new local tory mayor houchen and local tory mp Clarke are loved by the lemmings at present
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 1:01 PM GMT
In Redcar, Anna Turley has a majority of 9485 and there is 0% chance of the tories taking this seat. There is no such seat as Cleveland.
Report donny osmond February 9, 2019 1:36 PM GMT
labour seem to struggle in cumbria these days, north yorks
and south durham seem to have some creep for tories

it wouldnt surprise me to see a few turnovers in an election
in these areas, but could be precise over where they may occur.

if 1tp suggests that seat, i will keep an eye on prices.

that area seems to have awoken to its politics because
of a series of governments shafting them...
Report donny osmond February 9, 2019 1:36 PM GMT
could not be precise
Report InsiderTrader February 9, 2019 1:38 PM GMT
If the MP for Don Valley was backing staying in the EU she could be kicked out next election.

No chance of that now she has done the right thing and is trying to uphold the will of the people she represents.

Last election when UKIP fell off the charts the Tories went up 16% and she went up 7% thanks to her stance on Brexit. Without taking the patriotic stance more of those UKIP votes would have gone Tory.

Many more MPs on both sides could learn from her.

Brexit should not even be an issue when you consider over 70% of MPs are supposed to represent leave majority constituencies.
Report donny osmond February 9, 2019 1:42 PM GMT
brexit done and dusted by next election

or next election caused by impasse


two different things
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 1:53 PM GMT
Some folks on here continuing to fall into the trap of assuming brexit will have a major contribution to play in where folks place their mark at the next election. It won't.
Report InsiderTrader February 9, 2019 1:57 PM GMT
4 million voted for UKIP in 2015 so it is strange to think it is a non-issue.
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 1:59 PM GMT
How many seats did UKIP win?
Report impossible123 February 9, 2019 2:03 PM GMT
God help us (the country) if a major political Party would have to rely on the young to win a General Election, why? Some of these (young citizens) were too lazy or care to get-off their butts to vote. And how many made their way to The EU to work or further their careers or education; they did not want the jobs some other EU citizens did here (agriculturally). All they had been renowned for was getting sloshed on cheap booze and holidays abroad; they would be more concerned about the possible inconvenience that could arise from Brexit', and delivery of their takeaways and car washes.

Hopefully, 'Brexit' will give them a kick-up their butts as this is long overdue, and required.
Report InsiderTrader February 9, 2019 2:03 PM GMT
Moving the goal post there.

I was responding to...



politicspunter
09 Feb 19 13:53
Joined: 20 Mar 18
| Topic/replies: 2,519 | Blogger: politicspunter's blog
Some folks on here continuing to fall into the trap of assuming brexit will have a major contribution to play in where folks place their mark at the next election.
Report donny osmond February 9, 2019 2:05 PM GMT
its not a non issue, but its effect will be much diluted by the agenda driven by the campaigns and
debates that arise after it and before votes are cast.
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 2:06 PM GMT
But it won't have a major contribution on the results.
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 2:08 PM GMT
UKIP were a single issue party. That issue has been achieved. Why vote for them ever again?
Report donny osmond February 9, 2019 2:12 PM GMT
its effect may be more noticed in remain voting seats than contented brexit voting seats
but even so there will be more important things like austerity and poverty and social care
and pensions and education issues...not to mention anomolies arising from our leaving.
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 2:17 PM GMT
Yes, but it's ludicrous for it to be suggested upthread that Labour seats with a near ten thousand majority are going to be lost because all these Labour voters are going to support a leave leaning Conservative.
Report donny osmond February 9, 2019 2:23 PM GMT
i think they are using a bit of wishful thinking pp
Report enpassant February 9, 2019 2:23 PM GMT

Feb 9, 2019 -- 8:03AM, impossible123 wrote:


God help us (the country) if a major political Party would have to rely on the young to win a General Election, why? Some of these (young citizens) were too lazy or care to get-off their butts to vote. And how many made their way to The EU to work or further their careers or education; they did not want the jobs some other EU citizens did here (agriculturally). All they had been renowned for was getting sloshed on cheap booze and holidays abroad; they would be more concerned about the possible inconvenience that could arise from Brexit', and delivery of their takeaways and car washes.Hopefully, 'Brexit' will give them a kick-up their butts as this is long overdue, and required.


Ffs

Report InsiderTrader February 9, 2019 2:25 PM GMT
politicspunter
09 Feb 19 14:08
Joined: 20 Mar 18
| Topic/replies: 2,522 | Blogger: politicspunter's blog
UKIP were a single issue party. That issue has been achieved. Why vote for them ever again?

^

You been asleep the last couple of years?
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 2:28 PM GMT
Well, give me a reason to vote for them and tell me how many seats they will win at the next general election?
Report InsiderTrader February 9, 2019 2:43 PM GMT
Back to the seats thing again.

Which is clearly not the issue.

Why would people vote for them (or a single issue party again)?

The answer is IF Article 50 is stalled or revoked. It will start with the Euro elections in May and go from there.

Why vote in a general election - the same reason as in 2015 - to force the current parties who run the broken system we live under to take notice and adjust policy.

Of course if Brexit goes through and happens as it should then you are right there will be no need.
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 2:47 PM GMT
You are living in the past. UKIP will have next to no effect at the next general election. They never won any seats in 2015 and they won't ever.
Report thegiggilo February 9, 2019 2:52 PM GMT
The labour loyalist impossible 123 thinks the young drink loads and just want to go on holidays,wrong again, the young are considerably drinking less and are far more political now than at any othertime,my daughter is 17 she has no interest in drinking or even going out..Like her friends she stays in most nights studying,never eats takeaways reads books and like most in her age group doesn't believe any of the propaganda revolved around corbyn...these new voters of they get the chance to vote will be in droves voting labour,i've already got her to watch question time with me and show how corrupt its been.It's almost inevitable there will be a labout government,even if its not at the next election as the young all over the country have no connection with conservstuve values whatsoever,britain is changing big time so the babby bookers better get used to it..
Report thegiggilo February 9, 2019 2:54 PM GMT
Boomers*
Report InsiderTrader February 9, 2019 2:59 PM GMT
politicspunter
09 Feb 19 14:47
Joined: 20 Mar 18
| Topic/replies: 2,524 | Blogger: politicspunter's blog
You are living in the past. UKIP will have next to no effect at the next general election. They never won any seats in 2015 and they won't ever.

^

Again you are confusing yourself with seats and votes.
Report lfc1971 February 9, 2019 3:03 PM GMT
Deary me the country is almost bankrupt and people are worried about a labour or torie government
It won’t matter , doesn’t matter who is in power unless the country changes  ,
That’s the fundamentals , and of course we need young people to be working and not dreaming , sorry
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 3:04 PM GMT
If you think the number of VOTES UKIP received in the 2015 general election is somehow going to influence the result of the next general election, you are living in cloud cuckoo land.
Report lfc1971 February 9, 2019 3:06 PM GMT
The Conservative party of course is in decline , that’s because the country is changing
Not in a good way
Report lfc1971 February 9, 2019 3:10 PM GMT
The tories won the last 3 elections mainly by chance , a few lucky occurances
That is not going to happen forever
Report lfc1971 February 9, 2019 3:13 PM GMT
The country has to produce wealth , without that it doesn’t matter if it is a labour or Tory government
There’s no difference really , and we are not actually producing anything very much
That’s the general direction of travel
Report InsiderTrader February 9, 2019 3:35 PM GMT
politicspunter
09 Feb 19 15:04
Joined: 20 Mar 18
| Topic/replies: 2,526 | Blogger: politicspunter's blog
If you think the number of VOTES UKIP received in the 2015 general election is somehow going to influence the result of the next general election, you are living in cloud cuckoo land.

^

Again you are confusing yourself.

Your statement was 'Some folks on here continuing to fall into the trap of assuming brexit will have a major contribution to play in where folks place their mark at the next election. '

Nothing to do with seats and in many ways be nothing to do with UKIP with the route they have taken.

But to say the Brexit policy of parties old and new will have no affect on how people vote will only be correct if:
1. Brexit is 100% sorted by then.
2. Both main parties have the same policy.
3. There is no anti-Brexit party that people are comfortable voting for.
Report lfc1971 February 9, 2019 3:39 PM GMT
It’s a mistake to think the party in power produces the country , that’s back to front
The Conservative party has been the most successful political party in history in any country in the world
That’s because Britain was the most successful country stable and secure in the world for 300 years or however long
That’s how it works and that’s what is changing
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 3:47 PM GMT
Are you saying we are going to have another general election before we leave the EU?
Report 1st time poster February 9, 2019 3:55 PM GMT
labour campaigned on honouring brtexit at last election,turley still getting brownie points for fighting steel works closure,if turley fights on her remain,2ndreff views in asnap election she,ll struggle to win, it was a libdem seat before her and tories doing well promising all sorts on ex ssi land whilst labour council is hated, don't be surprised to be surprised might be worth a bet
Report InsiderTrader February 9, 2019 3:56 PM GMT
I don't know and nor does the market. You can back at 3.15 or lay at 3.6.

Even if we do 'leave' the issue is still not over.

The policy parties put forward for the future relationship could potentially affect how people vote.
Report InsiderTrader February 9, 2019 3:58 PM GMT
For instance if one party went down the route of maintaining free movement of cheap labour and another did not it could affect the votes.
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 4:01 PM GMT
It won't affect the overall result in any major way.
Report impossible123 February 9, 2019 4:03 PM GMT
'thegiggilo', apology if I tarnished your daughter with my opinion about the British youngsters - she'd be one in 10,000. A huge majority of those I know eg students, lawyers and other white collar professions except medics care little about politics of this country; the majority wanted 'Brexit', and do not buy broadsheets or read the political section. But they do exercise their duty and vote at every election, but none has worked in The EU ever though.
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 4:06 PM GMT
The next general election policy battles will be the same as usual, the economy, NHS, education etc.
Report 1st time poster February 9, 2019 4:08 PM GMT
theres weekly saturtday town hall type meeting of working class people who have a facebook page engaging in getting rid of turley who,s a southerner parachuted in for her Brexit views,opposing the new loved [ for some reason tory mayor ] and the next door constituency held by erg brexiter simon Clarke is pairing up with new tory mayor seducing labour voters,ben houchen tory mayor is the number 1 spending political person on facebook advertising this year in the whole country, 18 grand bombarding facebook and has just won the backing to bring back the local loss making airport into public ownership,blackmailed 5 labour councils into backing it against their better judgement, Corbyn,remain ,2ndreff have absolutely zilch traction in redcar and Cleveland, if it wasn't for farages new party possibly splitting vote I,d go for a tory surprise at a nice price
Report InsiderTrader February 9, 2019 4:08 PM GMT
politicspunter
09 Feb 19 16:01
Joined: 20 Mar 18
| Topic/replies: 2,530 | Blogger: politicspunter's blog
It won't affect the overall result in any major way.

Nice backtracking. That is completely different to saying:

'Some folks on here continuing to fall into the trap of assuming brexit will have a major contribution to play in where folks place their mark at the next election.'
Report thegiggilo February 9, 2019 4:09 PM GMT
You are talking utter nonsene the young are massively remain always have been,they are a huge majority..
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 4:12 PM GMT
Insider, there is no backtracking. Some folks on here are obsessed with brexit and the impact it may have in future general election voting.
Report thegiggilo February 9, 2019 4:14 PM GMT
Latest polling on 18-24 year olds 80% would vote remain..
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 4:14 PM GMT
I don't think I can make it any clearer that's it's impact (if any) will be limited.
Report InsiderTrader February 9, 2019 4:32 PM GMT
So to be clear punter you think Brexit issues will have no affect on how people vote is future elections?

Not talking about seats or any other way you try to backtrack. I am merely talking about 'where people place their mark' (as you put it).
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 4:35 PM GMT
I don't know how many times you wish me to repeat it.
Report InsiderTrader February 9, 2019 4:40 PM GMT
To be fair you are not being clear.

You starting talking about how people might vote than switched into talking about seats won.

Do you still think it will have no effect on how people vote?

Simple enough question.
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 4:44 PM GMT
Dearie me. I don't think brexit will have any major effect on how folks vote at the next general election. Is that clear enough?
Report InsiderTrader February 9, 2019 4:53 PM GMT
Crystal.
Report politicspunter February 9, 2019 4:55 PM GMT
Thank you
Report n88uk February 11, 2019 2:35 AM GMT

Feb 9, 2019 -- 2:25AM, enpassant wrote:


Imo brexit is the ONLY thing keeping this government in power. They actually need this debacle to continue. Without it voters would vote on the dire straights the country is in and not on who is more likely to give them what they want in terms of the EU. The point pp makes is a good one. Since the young vote more in favour of Corbyn than than the Tory party it would be reasonable to assume he has picked up (and will continue to do so)  more new voters than the tories. Corbyn proved he is a capable campaigner. I cannot see any of the potential tory leader candidates appealing to a wide base of voters. With the media bias trying to tell people that Corbyn can't win, that Labour are behind in the polls, the Corbyn is unelectable it would be easy to think voting Labour would be of little use. Only all of that media slant was there before- it didn't work. So again the assessment pp makes, that it would be too close to call is very sensible shout.


The idea Brexit is the only thing keeping this government in power is farcical to me, at least for the reasons you cite (as arguably Corbyn's position is helping them not weaken further).

Brexit has weakened the government massively. You've got a massively divided party which as yet as not come up with any solution. They are currently pissing off remainers and leavers alike, pretty much no-one thinks they're doing a good job with Brexit. All the votes they gained for offering the referendum in the first place will be go back to UKIP/new Farage party as those types want a hard Brexit. They will be haemorrhaging votes all over the place, whether Labour are the beneficiaries atm is another thing due to Corbyn's stance.

Report n88uk February 11, 2019 2:46 AM GMT
A lot of people vote the same every election no matter what, but Brexit will defo have a major effect on how floaters vote next general election. Whether that has any real effect in real terms depends what happens with Brexit and the oppositions stance on what is happening, which is not at all clear atm.

Brexit will be going on right up to the next election if we actually leave with a deal of some kind for starters.

You wouldn't necessarily see it have a huge influence on seats if the consequence is a lot more votes for UKIP/new Farage party as they would likely be scattered leading to them picking up no real seats anyway, but that won't necessarily be the consequence, and like I say it's impossible to predict the consequences until we know what is actually happening with Brexit.
Report n88uk February 11, 2019 2:52 AM GMT

Feb 9, 2019 -- 10:06AM, politicspunter wrote:


The next general election policy battles will be the same as usual, the economy, NHS, education etc.


See, the thing is I actually agree with what you are saying here. But the economy and NHS will get linked back to Brexit. However the economy is doing is going to be written as a consequence of Brexit.

Report politicspunter February 11, 2019 6:58 AM GMT
No matter when the next general election is or how the economy is doing you will still get some folks who will say it is really good/bad and the sole reason is brexit.
No one is going to flock to UKIP or similar party once we leave the EU.
Report yajyaj February 11, 2019 9:24 AM GMT
The main driver for Brexit was Immigration... fact, if Immigration does not fall in to "tens of thousands" I will certainly be looking for a new Party
Report thegiggilo February 11, 2019 9:31 AM GMT
Get your tommy robinson badge on and vote for UKIP...
Report thegiggilo February 11, 2019 9:31 AM GMT
Get your tommy robinson badge on and vote for UKIP...
Report yajyaj February 11, 2019 9:43 AM GMT
If that's the only option to achieve a sustainable level of immigration, I will thanks
Report politicspunter February 11, 2019 11:59 AM GMT
UKIp is a totally wasted vote.
Report thegiggilo February 11, 2019 12:09 PM GMT
Ssshhh told tell him that..
Report yajyaj February 11, 2019 12:17 PM GMT
Possibly, I will judge come the time, however I am hoping alternatives to UKIP to be available
Report lfc1971 February 11, 2019 12:18 PM GMT
you should always vote for the party which best represents your viewpoint on immigration
That’s much more important than voting Tory or labour , they are largely meaningless votes
Report politicspunter February 11, 2019 12:26 PM GMT

Feb 11, 2019 -- 6:17AM, yajyaj wrote:


Possibly, I will judge come the time, however I am hoping alternatives to UKIP to be available


What sort of alternative do you mean? You could try the EDL.

Report yajyaj February 11, 2019 12:28 PM GMT
Very true lfc
Report lfc1971 February 11, 2019 12:31 PM GMT
Events can change and do change , if we don’t leave the EU then a new party is needed
Of course people will have to vote that way but it can happen , the SNP in Scotland is an example of how quickly change can happen and the old parties be overthrown
Report yajyaj February 11, 2019 12:31 PM GMT
The Brexit party, The new Tory party (without the Liberals), The Labour party (without the Blairites), I dont have a crystal ball but I am sure things need to change
Report politicspunter February 11, 2019 12:34 PM GMT
I must admit that I haven't studied anything relating to the "brexit party" but what exactly would be the point of them, and UKIP for that matter, after we have left the EU?  They are never going to win a single seat in Westminster.
Report yajyaj February 11, 2019 12:44 PM GMT
"after we have left", I certainly hope thats correct. This isnt about ukip, its about our choices in the future,given what we have learnt about our democracy over the last couple of years
Report politicspunter February 11, 2019 12:50 PM GMT
We will always have choices of political parties in our democracy, but what point would there be of voting for the United Kingdom Independence Party or similar if we have left the EU ? Their sole policy has been achieved.
Report yajyaj February 11, 2019 12:55 PM GMT
Of course, but if they are on the ballot paper in 2022, I'm guessing they will have a new manifesto surely, if not they will lose the deposit.
Report politicspunter February 11, 2019 1:00 PM GMT
Some of the former members of UKIp may be on the ballot but doubtful if the party will still exist.
Report yajyaj February 11, 2019 1:05 PM GMT
Probably
Report n88uk February 11, 2019 3:36 PM GMT

Feb 11, 2019 -- 12:58AM, politicspunter wrote:


No matter when the next general election is or how the economy is doing you will still get some folks who will say it is really good/bad and the sole reason is brexit.No one is going to flock to UKIP or similar party once we leave the EU.


It won't be UKIP though. Hyothetically say the economy is tanking post-Brexit, you'd expect votes to flock to Labour. This is only theoretically because with Corbyn not necessarily offering much better it won't necessarily go exactly like this, but it will cost Conservative votes.

The UKIP gain would be in the event that either Brexit doesn't happen or the Brexit that doesn't happen doesn't fit what people wanted. I agree it won't be so much a flock, as I said it likely wouldn't leaning to gain them actual seats. The sorta numbers they had in 2015 you'd likely see those flock back to UKIP/Farage's new party, however of course this isn't likely to really lead to a lot as even though it's quite a lot of votes it doesn't tend to lead to actual seats in the UK system.

Report politicspunter February 11, 2019 3:46 PM GMT
Brexit probably won't be a consideration come the next election.
Report Dr Crippen February 11, 2019 4:00 PM GMT
What sort of alternative do you mean? You could try the EDL.

The EDL are not a political party, they're simply a protest organisation.

Hope that helps.
Report differentdrum February 11, 2019 4:02 PM GMT
I find that very, very hard to believe although other factors will also influence what I expect will be a disaster for Corbyn.

If Labour MPs themselves are seriously thinking of escaping the sinking ship then it follows that voters will be doing exactly the same thing. As I said before the Liberals will be the most obvious beneficiaries. When they cosied up to the Tories votes would have gone in the opposite direction. That will reverse.
Report thegiggilo February 11, 2019 4:12 PM GMT
Absolutely no chance people will go to liberals to keep the torys in,the only way labour are going to ever win an electiion is with the liberals helping,still not sure most perople hace figiven them for not siding with labour last time..
Report thegiggilo February 11, 2019 4:12 PM GMT
Absolutely no chance people will go to liberals to keep the torys in,the only way labour are going to ever win an electiion is with the liberals helping,still not sure most perople hace figiven them for not siding with labour last time..
Report differentdrum February 12, 2019 1:01 PM GMT
As was entirely obvious to both parties Corbyn's idea of a customs union has been kicked into the long grass.

He now has the option of a no deal Brexit (which he wants) or a second referendum (which he doesn't).

So we will effectively get more of Corbyn doing absolutely nothing. Had he been true to the manifesto he would now be backing the second referendum.
Report unitedbiscuits February 12, 2019 1:17 PM GMT
Corbyn earning praise from both Theresa May and Nigel Farage - three arch-Brexiters.
Report differentdrum February 12, 2019 8:13 PM GMT
https://twitter.com/BenPBradshaw?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

The weasel's face when Bradshaw challenges him to honour the manifesto says everything.
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