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montgomery brewster
30 Oct 10 11:07
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Date Joined: 04 Aug 03
| Topic/replies: 126 | Blogger: montgomery brewster's blog
obviously a great driver but so many people seem to throw around the title as best ever without  a thought. i remember his first world title where he was only champion due to a very strange points system and his team mate scored considerably more , also same team mate beat him the  following year. i remember senna as  a great overtaker and very fast driver who'd bully his way past people. the fact he was tragically killed  did elevate him in lots of peoples minds above prost and piquet and even mansell but is this correct. for me he was  great driver in a great and exciting age but not necessarily the best.
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Report worcesterwilly October 30, 2010 4:51 PM BST
Prost,Piquet and Mansell...pmsl about Mansell...simply were'nt on the same lap as Senna let alone comparaible.

Imho only 2 drivers could be talked about in the same breath but neither were imho as good Jimmy Clark and Fangio - I never saw Fangio obviously but his legend precedes him and I did'nt actually see Clark in the flesh but I recall him as a kid and he was awesome...

In the next tranche I would have Jackie Stewart and Schmacher and the best of th rest in the third category...
Report Taylor's world October 31, 2010 9:44 AM GMT
I was only about 10 years of age in the senna days, could the older generation on the forum tell my if senna had a quicker car than the feild?  However even so he would still have had to beat his team mate in the same car.
Report bb66 October 31, 2010 9:50 AM GMT
When Senna drove the Lotus it was far from being the best car, later with McLaren he had the best car, the Williams then was maybe par with the other leading cars.
Report worcesterwilly October 31, 2010 10:36 AM GMT
Senna was blindingly fast in anything and consistently blindingly fast....

In my lifetime - been watching since around 1970 and a bit before as a young kid and I can name 3 drivers who were as fast as Senna but neither were as consistently as fast and neither really ever had the right car consistently.....its all opinion of course but I've never seen anyone drive an F1 car as blindingly fast and consistently as Senna,Jimmy Clarke,Keke Rosberg and Ronnie Petersen......

Then you have quick and consistent drivers but not with quite the blinding pace of the aforementined and in to that category I'd place...Stewart,Villeneuve,Prost,Schumacher,Lauda,Hakkinen and Alonso
Report ocukstinky October 31, 2010 3:52 PM GMT
I think his fearlessness and general disregard for anyone else made him stand out. He was born to win, simple as that. He was so incredibly ruthless and showed no fear, people got out of his way - he basically put them in a situation of "move, or i'm taking you out". I wouldn't say he was overly respected in that sense, but people understood his motif and never put themselves at risk. He just didn't care, because he understood just how quick he could be.
Report montgomery brewster October 31, 2010 5:33 PM GMT
if  prost wasnt on the  same lap  as senna?  why didnt senna  beat him in the  same  car?  just  saying something doesnt make  it  true.  you need to back up your  argument.
Report worcesterwilly November 1, 2010 1:42 PM GMT
montgomery....Prost would take less risks and drive more slowly when they had the same car....he only ever beat Snna if Senna had a mishap....

I'd put Prost,and have done in the 2nd echelon,but for speed and risk taking he was a poor second imho....and thats all it can be someones opinon...which we are all entitled to - to Senna...

I personally think if you asked any 100 F1 officianados at any time 80% would always say Senna over Prost or Schumacher or certainly anyone now....

The only guy imho comparible with Senna ever was Jimmy Clark....
Report Taylor's world November 1, 2010 5:18 PM GMT
Senna and prost. Sounds like Lewis and Jenson.
Report worcesterwilly November 1, 2010 5:34 PM GMT
taylor....nothing could be further from the truth in actual fact...

Hamilton is certainly not senna.....he might be Hamiltons idol but he is a poor imitation...

Button may drive in the risk adverse way that Prost did but as a bloke he is altogether more friendly and charismatic than the wingeing frog....

In fairness to Hamilton and Button they also do appear to get on whereas Senna and Prost basically could'nt stand each other.....

I'd say Alonso and Hamilton at McLaren a few years ago was personality wise a better comparison..
Report Taylor's world November 1, 2010 9:10 PM GMT
Hyperthetically talking if Lewis was to win another 4 World Titles would we all still be saying Lewis is as good as Senna?
Report worcesterwilly November 2, 2010 8:23 AM GMT
No...

Senna would have won 4 world titles in the 4 years Hamilton has won one - Hamilton has thrown 3 titles away with mistakes and not making the most of the dominant car in 3 out of 4 years he has driven in F1....
Report GPT November 2, 2010 8:37 AM GMT
LaughLaughLaugh^^^
Report brentford November 2, 2010 1:50 PM GMT
No...

Senna would have won 4 world titles in the 4 years Hamilton has won one - Hamilton has thrown 3 titles away with mistakes and not making the most of the dominant car in 3 out of 4 years he has driven in F1....


Can't agree with that,
McLaren was the best car in 2007 and probably 2008 but was a dog last year and only 3rd best this year overall - Ferrari mid season updates in my view put it ahead of the McLaren.
So you could argue 2007 was certainly a missed opportunity but for the most part it was a pretty impresssive effort for a rookie amidst the pressure of being a front runner all season and the only other clear cut chance at the title he took.
Report brentford November 2, 2010 1:52 PM GMT
I tend to view Senna as clearly the best I've seen but I do think there is a tendancy to over rate drivers of the past (particuarly if they meet a premature demise) and under rate drives of the present.
Report GPT November 2, 2010 2:03 PM GMT
Rose tinted spectacles,not a couple of years ago Schumi was the greatest driver in some eyes now look what happens when he doesn't have everything his own way,a team mate with equal footing and his team doesn't blatantly cheat as Benneton did.Senna was good in the wet but no faster than Prost and Mansell,anyway if he was so good he wouldn't have crashed head long into a wall.
Report baracouda30 November 2, 2010 2:58 PM GMT
What a moronic end to that last post.

So if the car bottomed out, or if the steering column broke, that was his fault?
Report worcesterwilly November 2, 2010 3:48 PM GMT
GPT..

That was a moronic statement to make....especially in the light of the amateur work undertaken under the auspices of Frank Williams and Patrick Head which indirectly resulted in the death of Senna..

Try driving a car towards a brick wall at 200mph and when you turn left basically nothing happens....thats what happened to Senna....becuase of the negligence of the people who lengthened the steering column on the car....

I hope that you will have the good grace to apologise for the oversight as I normally find your views very balanced.....and personally I never want anyone to experience again the shock and horror that Senna must have experienced in those final split seconds...
Report GPT November 2, 2010 4:09 PM GMT
Nice bit of libel there willy.
Report worcesterwilly November 2, 2010 5:30 PM GMT
I would'nt go as far as the Italians did - which was to accuse them of manslaughter - but clearly and its not just urban myth - there was some shall we say "bodged" work done to the car at the request of Senna I would stress to be fair to the team,and there is strong documentary evidence that a poor weld breaking did contribute to the steering failure that led to the accident....

God knows Frank Williams has had enough to put up with in life and I dont for one minute believe he or head or anyone in the team did anything other than what they were asked to do by Senna...

Given what happened to Ratzenburger,Barichello and Senna that wekend I think it was just fated to be...tragically!
Report beersexchipsngravy November 3, 2010 8:28 AM GMT
Far and away the best over a single lap, would destroy people in qualifying.
IMO he is the greatest ever, there is some awesome onboard footage around on the net
Report Taylor's world November 4, 2010 8:35 PM GMT
gpt you are a disgrace.
Report bernardwhat November 5, 2010 12:23 AM GMT
Overated, was good but not as good as some people say. Schumacher lots better
Report fisico November 5, 2010 2:07 PM GMT
Senna was the quickest driver of the last 30 or so years, but Schumacher was the best. IMO.
As has been alluded to, Senna's qualifying pace was incredible. I remember a qualifying session at Monaco were he was a second a lap quicker than Prost in the same car and 2 seconds quicker than everyone else. It was the same in the race....until he stuck it in a barrier and Prost, as was usually the case, would take the role of the tortoise and come past him.
Report worcesterwilly November 5, 2010 2:13 PM GMT
fisico....I have to agree...the only guy I saw qualify a car anywhere near the Senna level was Keke Rosberg....but he did'nt have Sennas ability to drive in the wet nor did he have his ability to drive so quickly for as long as Senna could...

Its interesting to read the views on Schumacher,I think he was second best in the modern era i.e since 1980 behind Senna....not far behind him and its a crying shame we did'nt see the 2 really race tot to toe at their peaks....feck me that would have been something else!...

My ALL time top 3 would be Senna,Jimmy Clarke,Schumacher with the rest a considerable way behind....and other than Schumacher (not this vintage! his prev life in F1) I'd find it impossible to put any of todays crop in the top 10 ever......maybe Alonso top 15 ever at a push.....may be an age/generation thing I dont know?
Report ocukstinky November 5, 2010 9:26 PM GMT
GPT you are an utter disgrace to these forums.

Also - not as fast as Prost in the wet? Err.. Monaco 84?
Report GPT November 6, 2010 8:42 AM GMT
Coming form a racist like you fqmstinky that's rich and i didn't say he wasn't faster than Prost in the wet,I know reading is not your strong point thoughLaugh[;)]
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