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Jumping
28 Oct 13 18:48
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Date Joined: 03 Apr 12
| Topic/replies: 18,108 | Blogger: Jumping's blog
Does anyone know what his injury was??
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Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 5:53 PM GMT
pelvis fracture
Report dj876 October 28, 2013 5:59 PM GMT
Not a heading any ante-post RTW Punters would like to see.
I was sure that a problem had arisen after the race today.
Report Jumping October 28, 2013 6:04 PM GMT
Sorry didn't mean tht to be. I'm trading world hurdle market. Market I trade most yrs. don't think I need him on side
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 6:09 PM GMT
Grin, were ya getting nervous dj
Report dj876 October 28, 2013 6:20 PM GMT
No,no bet yet Toby but one to keep on the right side off during the winter on soft ground.
He wouldn't be without a chance if the ground is soft(would suit at Fishers cross too) on the Thursday.
You couldn't rule out Big Bucks but very rarely they come back from a year off as good at his age.
The french horse that beat Solwhit could be interesting(Geminix I think)if this is his target??Anyone any trainer quote??
At fishera cross looks a worthy fav at this stage??
Any early views on the race lads??
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 6:24 PM GMT
agree the fav is worthy at this stage as def target dj , but extremely early days yet !
Report callitasucit October 28, 2013 6:51 PM GMT
I would make Big Bucks slight fav at this stage. AFC beat The New One at Chelt last year, but TNO got a very poor ride that day, with the gun being put to his head far too early, and resulted in him being a sitting duck late on. The form of AFC win at the festival would need huge improving on, with there having been very little strength in depth in that contest. He was very impressive, but he had his ground, and in truth, what did he beat? And its unlikely he will get ground as soft next year. Maybe he doesn't need it, but he has that to prove aswell, and its certainly no harm to him.
As dj says, its hard for them to come back from serious injury at Big Bucks age, but they have been ultra careful with him, I get the feeling he could have been back a lot earlier if rushed. He now has every opportunity of benefitting from that extra TLC. If he comes through his prep run unscathed he is the one they will have to beat. One things for sure, there wont be a dry eye in the house if Ruby(he will surely ride him??) cajoles him home again.
Zarkander would have to have a chance if improving for the trip, and he always seemed like he was crying out for more than 2 miles, but could just be slightly tripless, he may still hit a flat spot over the 3 miles.
Solwhit won a below par renewal last year, and it was set up for him with the slow gallop, and Dickie Johnson riding Reve de Sivola for a turn of foot!!
An intriguing contest at this stage, lets hope all the main protagonists, especially Big bucks and At Fishers Cross make the tape.
Report dj876 October 28, 2013 6:55 PM GMT
Gemix(18.0)-is the french horse I was thinking off but he has only had 2 runs over hurdles.I know nothing about him so not sure if the stayers is even a target and the ground was heavy at Autueil so not sure if he's ground dependent.If anyone has anymore info about possible runs etc-it would be much appreciated.

Rule the world is 24 on here after today.
I wonder will Zarkander be aimed at the race if Bucks is back to his best(different owners but still records etc)

It's months off anyway but like building ante-post books.
Report dj876 October 28, 2013 7:02 PM GMT
I didn't see your post Calitasucit.
Is it still the plan for Big Bucks to go straight to the festival or have I dreamed that??

It would definitely be interesting to see if Ruby got the ride-wasn't there a bit of banter going on at one of the preview nights when Ruby was going to ride a Mullins horse instead of a Stewart horse in one of the novice chases?? Stewart apparently said(via Nicholls) if you don't ride him you don't ride Bucks either.

It's  odds on that WPM and probably Ricci will have a runner though-Powers were doing a market on whether he would ride Bucks?
Report dj876 October 28, 2013 7:28 PM GMT
Big Bucks will more than likely have a prep run in January.
Silv..Conti-Betfair Chase
Al Ferof-Prep run at Ascot for King George.
Report wildmanfromborneo October 28, 2013 7:32 PM GMT
Tobywong wrong as usual,he didnt fracture his pelvis.
Report dj876 October 28, 2013 7:34 PM GMT
I think you're wrong there Wildman
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 7:52 PM GMT
http://www.setanta.com/africa/Articles/2013/10/16/Rule-The-World-to-stick-to-hurdles/gnid-162534/

I hope forum retard can read , I don't expect an apology from him given he is mentally retarded !
Report wildmanfromborneo October 28, 2013 7:57 PM GMT
Davy Russell thought he injured himself so pulled him up in Punchestown but he found he was only slightly injured,no fracture of his pelvis.

No chance of a horse recovering from a fractured pelvis in six months.
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 7:57 PM GMT
read the link ar s eh ole
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 7:59 PM GMT
" Rule The World will remain over timber with Mouse Morris targeting the Lismullen Hurdle at Navan for the six-year-old.


Rule the World won three times last season before going on to finish second to The New One in the Neptune Investment Management Novices' Hurdle at Cheltenham.

He went to Punchestown looking to end the season on a winning note, but he was pulled up after the third obstacle and was later found to have fractured his pelvis in the Grade 1 event.

Having recovered from the injury, Rule The World returned to training and is being readied for a run in the Lismullen Hurdle at Navan on November 10.

"I'm really looking forward to Rule The World. He'll stay over hurdles this year - he won't go chasing just yet - and we'll take him to Navan for the Lismullen, a Grade Two," Morris reported.

"Unfortunately he fractured his pelvis when he ran at Punchestown but he recovered from that unbelievably quickly and we just need some nice ground."

Stable companion First Lieutenant is due to make his seasonal bow in Thursday's Star Best For Racing Coverage Chase at Punchestown. "
Report callitasucit October 28, 2013 8:08 PM GMT
Yeah, Big Bucks expected to be out in Jan dj. Ruby thinks he can do what he wants, and on a lot of occasions he can. I would have thought that he would agreed with Mullins that if Big Bucks comes back that he will be riding him. From Stewarts point of view, it would make absolutely no sense to not have Ruby on board. Would be an extreme case of cutting off ones nose to spite ones face. He takes an awful lot knowing, and may have thought up a few more tricks during his enforced absence!
When Inglis Drever won his third World Hurdle he got an unbelievable reception (for an English horse), despite the weather. If Bucks pulls this off it will be quite a scene.
Report dj876 October 28, 2013 8:17 PM GMT
All Valid points about the Bucks/Ruby situation.
I was there the day Drever won his third stayers-there was 12 races or someth the same day.The day before had been postponed due to high winds.
I can remember I was in absolute pieces because we had spent the day on a mystery bus tour around all the country pubs and back in by the Plough inn(next to Jackdaws)
Report callitasucit October 28, 2013 8:42 PM GMT
I was there myself dj. Though when news filtered through the previous morning about the postponement, I retreated to the leaba, and got up about 4pm! I think it was the only time in 11 years of going to the festival, that a hangover actually had time to kick in!! I stay near enough to Jackdaws myself, just down the bottom of Cleeve Hill.
Report paulie wallnuts October 28, 2013 8:47 PM GMT
he will be some horse when his pelvis heals......as there is no chance a horses pelvis could heal in 6 months.......isn't that right blackadder.......I see baldrick is on another thread spouting some other nonsense.......
and after all that.......not a hint of an apology.......ya should be down on yer hands and knees seeking forgiveness from tobywong......
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 9:04 PM GMT
Not to worry Paulie , what would you expect from a pig only a grunt!
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 9:06 PM GMT
Toby Wong should c0ck slap him imo.
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 9:25 PM GMT
^^^^ ha ha  yr some fkn clown alright !
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 9:25 PM GMT
pure and utter slime ba ll Laugh
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 9:31 PM GMT
complete T0ss pot.  never knowingly wrong
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 9:35 PM GMT
Report wildmanfromborneo October 28, 2013 9:37 PM GMT
Another amazing aspect of this forum is when the poor posters try to argue their corner they nearly always make the case against them.
Report wildmanfromborneo October 28, 2013 9:38 PM GMT
themselves.
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 9:40 PM GMT
You are a pure and utter sli meb all , keep it up , I am thoroughly enjoying you make a complete fool of yourself !
Report wildmanfromborneo October 28, 2013 9:46 PM GMT
Are you capable of making a post without name calling or swearing,just count your juvenile insults.

Disagree if you like but must you always lose your temper.

Any rational person reading this will know who is making a fool of themselves irrespective of who's right.
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 9:49 PM GMT
A minor stress fracture of the pelvis can be dealt with and recovered from within 6 months.

Now get down on your knees in front of of Mr Wong and brace yourself for a good c0ck slapping.
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 9:49 PM GMT
ha ha ! squirm like the slimeba ll you are , absolutely pathetic, keep it up Laugh
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 9:52 PM GMT
Lose my temper ? I am absolutely pmsl at you making a complete clown of yourself Laugh
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 9:53 PM GMT
From this:

Tobywong wrong as usual,he didnt fracture his pelvis.

to this

irrespective of who's right

Yes i think we can all spot the fool.
Report wildmanfromborneo October 28, 2013 9:59 PM GMT
Once again it happens Ozymandius with his fascination for c0ck slapping posts something that makes my case.

The fractured pelvis has now changed to a minor stress fracture and he even acknowledges this too is serious by stating " can be dealt with and recovered from within six months "  can here is the important word.
Ozymandius uses a best case scenario for a minor stress fracture of the pelvis and fails to mention the horse may have recovered but would not be ready to race.

Thanks Ozymandius you never let me down.
Report dj876 October 28, 2013 9:59 PM GMT
wildmanfromborneo • October 28, 2013 9:37 PM GMT
"Another amazing aspect of this forum is when the poor posters try to argue their corner they nearly always make the case against them."

This point is extremely relevant to the Paddock judge's reports but you will back him up no matter what and are blinded by loyalty.
Giving him Kudos for Our Conor is encouraging the nonsense -Dessie Hughes said he'd need the run and he'd a 75% chance of being correct.

A couple of weeks ago he gave a paddock report on Top Madam - a 7yo mare who was having her 23rd racecourse start and her 6th recent run(form book would suffice?) but we received a glowing report none the less before she was tailed off.

Now he may well be a nice man and I'm sure he's harmless but his paddock reports are worthless.I have no axe to grind with the man but that is my objective opinion.
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 10:00 PM GMT
LaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaugh
Report wildmanfromborneo October 28, 2013 10:03 PM GMT
DJ876 that post is unworthy of you for two reasons,its not relevant to this discussion and you posted it for the benefit of two foul mouthed Vulgarians who like to hassle Workrider.

I expect some retribution for those remarks but would genuinely like to hear your views on the respective arguments.
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 10:06 PM GMT
A minor stress fracture of the pelvis is a form of a fractured pelvis.

Were you thinking that his pelvis had been shattered in peices?

And yes, recovered and ready to race withing 6 months.
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 10:06 PM GMT
Report dj876 October 28, 2013 10:15 PM GMT
I didn't post it for the benefit of them.As far as I can see WR started the argument on the other thread with Tobywong but Toby's insults are uncalled for even if they were provoked.
As you know,I take no sides in yer battles and try to remain objective.
REf.Ozymandius's after timing thread.

I genuinely find it bizarre that you refer to Richters as a decent poster when all he contributes is overt name calling without a shred of wit or humour and how you can value and encourage the paddock reporter is absolutely beyond comprehension.

As for this matter with very limited knowledge on the subject-I have to say that your argument/theory is credible.(even though it contradicts every article online,it's easier for connections not to clarify if the injury turned out not to be as severe as first thought)
Report wildmanfromborneo October 28, 2013 10:16 PM GMT
What do you think the word minor means,if it was as you now state just a minor stress fracture that is different from what the juvenile hothead Tobywong stated,the statement I challenged.
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 10:22 PM GMT
You don't turn around to someone and say ...'you're wrong'..when all you are dong is theorising and the official diagnosis is on record.

Why not say.....given the relatively rapid recovery its possible that the pelvic injury was misdiagnosed.  Or, it must have been a very minor stress fracture given the speed of the recovery.

Internet articles I have read suggest that racehorses can get over minor stress fracture within three month and then be ready to be reintroduced to training.
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 10:24 PM GMT
I stated what the horses trainer stated , simple as that you clown.

Dj876 , no quarrel with you , i have a long history with wr on here , and he insulted my occupational professionalism which is completely out of order , he gets what he deserves and he can take it , he is a big boy now!
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 10:26 PM GMT
A minor stress fracture of the pelvis is still a form of fractured pelvis.  Neither Toby nor Mouse alluded to the degree of fracture.
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 10:29 PM GMT
And here is a statistical view on the importance of teachers.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/freeexchange/2013/10/education
Report richters October 28, 2013 10:33 PM GMT
Tracksuit DJ sticking his FAT nose in again after tellin us all he was in a pub near jackdaws castle...werent we all........ffs who gives a flying phuck......T0S SIR........your pin lands on a couple of odds on shot winners that on paper derek thompson cuda picked and you think that your the voice of wisdom on here......do what ye said and go on that sabbatical.....ye clearly cant live without this place.....bitter fat man......
Report dj876 October 28, 2013 10:35 PM GMT
2 recent points proven instantaneously.
Report wildmanfromborneo October 28, 2013 10:36 PM GMT
Hark at the backtracking,so all the name calling all the swearing and you are now saying you only regurgitated what the trainer said but didn't know yourself.

'twas ye were saying I was a laughing stock for saying a horse will not recover from a fractured pelvis in such a short time but slowly there is a grim realisation that I've done you once again and you can't handle that.

I have already stated that your only knowledge is google knowledge,you have no personal experience of anything except your new found skill of printing juvenile pictures.

As for Tobywong,his claim that Workrider insulted his " occupational professionalism " is completely untrue but typical of this poster,the fact tis he that insults himself with every post he makes,his name calling and swearing which mark his every post speaks volumes about the man.
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 10:40 PM GMT
^^^^ ha ha you are some go bshi te , i'm loving this, keep it up he he
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 10:41 PM GMT
you are now saying you only regurgitated what the trainer said but didn't know yourself.

I don't follow, do you expect us to know more about the medical condition of this horse than it's trainer?  Obviously, you think you do..

I was a laughing stock for saying a horse will not recover from a fractured pelvis in such a short time

Correct, as detailed above, it is possible.
Report wildmanfromborneo October 28, 2013 10:48 PM GMT
Its not that hard to follow,I will refer you to my misuse of the English language thread.

I will state again it is not possible for a horse to recover from a fractured pelvis in that time,you may try and twist it by adding minor or hairline but that was not what was stated.

Rule The World did not fracture his pelvis in Punchestown.
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 10:50 PM GMT
Cry
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 10:51 PM GMT
Are you denying that a minor stress fracture is not a form of fractured pelvis?  It is, you dullard.

At the risk of being repeditive, no one is suggesting that he shattered his pelvis.

I hope this helps.
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 10:52 PM GMT
Really, why do I bother?
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 10:55 PM GMT
mouse and his vet are liars now apparently Laugh
Report freddiek October 28, 2013 10:56 PM GMT
why is Ozy getting involved in a subject he has no interest in, just to bait Wildman?

pitiful..
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 10:59 PM GMT
I can't view Freddie's posts but if the above is a contribution relevant to the debate at hand, rather than a personal insult, it will be a first.
Report richters October 28, 2013 11:00 PM GMT
your a boy to talk dj,when your not tipping odds on shots on here or boring the t1ts off people about ground conditions all you do on here is have cowardly digs.......taking after kingrat and ozy in these cowardly little digs......lapping up the praise from ozy and jumping on the bandwagon to slag workrider,workrider has forgot more about horseracing than you will ever know.....
Report wildmanfromborneo October 28, 2013 11:05 PM GMT
The old if you don't agree with me ye are calling me a liar line much loved by Tobywong.

Tobywongs last post is deserving of praise as it contains no name calling or swearing.a first for him on threads where I post.

A hairline or minor fracture are not the same as a fracture but even if we gave you that when they said fracture they really meant a minor stress fracture it still wouldn't heal in that timeline.

That's why I say when you exaggerate as in the Bert Trautmann case you are misusing language.
Report tobywong. October 28, 2013 11:09 PM GMT
Laugh loving it , maybe you should write to mouse and tell him he should have run rule the world after punchestown cos the vet was talking sheeeet and the horse was fine Laugh
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 11:10 PM GMT
but even if we gave you that

thank you, I will accept that climb down.

The internet suggests it can heal fully within 3 months, it even describes it as a 'minor injury'
Report richters October 28, 2013 11:12 PM GMT
how would you survive without the internet oz?in the real world?
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 11:15 PM GMT
I don't know Dickie, I would probably be driving a Transit Van, yourself?
Report wildmanfromborneo October 28, 2013 11:17 PM GMT
A fractured pelvis is most certainly not a minor injury.

Can you not even follow the argument " but even if we gave you that " is not a climbdown its stating that were I to concede your false point you would still be wrong,that's how wide of the mark you are.

That google knowledge will let you down because you are starting with no knowledge and end up bluffing.
Report richters October 28, 2013 11:19 PM GMT
oz ye need to leave the flat to drive a van so somehow i think that isnt a runner for ye mate......
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 11:26 PM GMT
A fractured pelvis is most certainly not a minor injury.

"Pelvic fractures can vary from a minor setback to a fatal injury"..according to the NHBA.

I think I will take their word for it rather than yours, if that's ok?
Report wildmanfromborneo October 28, 2013 11:41 PM GMT
Maybe vets differ but I know of no one vet or otherwise that would describe a fractured pelvis as a minor setback.

Who are the NHBA?
Report Ozymandius October 28, 2013 11:48 PM GMT
http://www.hbpa.org/
Report Ozymandius October 29, 2013 12:02 AM GMT
I remain at your disposal to further your knowledge of the thoroughbred.
Report callitasucit October 29, 2013 8:57 PM GMT
Early tester for At Fishers Cross on Saturday, with Dynaste looking likely to fulfil his engagement.
Report J.R.Hartley November 1, 2013 11:44 AM GMT
The problem with stress fractures of any bone is that they can be very difficult to diagnose....quite often if no fracture is apparent on an x-ray then the vet will put it down as a

stress fracture in order to error on the side of caution, obviously a horse can recover from a stress fracture fairly quickly..............if the horse hasn't had one....Crazy
Report wildmanfromborneo November 1, 2013 5:51 PM GMT
I think you have hit on exactly what happened.

There is no way Rule The World fractured her pelvis.
Report Ozymandius November 1, 2013 5:53 PM GMT
Cry
Report Ozymandius November 1, 2013 6:00 PM GMT
I won't comment again on this one because we have been round the houses, other than to say based on what I have read, it is possible.

There are ways of establishing if its a stress facture, even if none appears on an xray ...anyway we don't know, for all we know it was visible on an xray, hence the diagnosis.  There may not even have been an xray.  Somebody pigeonhole Mouse while he is having a cigarette.
Report J.R.Hartley November 2, 2013 1:55 PM GMT
The only other way of determining a stress fracture that doesn't show up on an x-ray that i know of is a nuclear bone scan which is rarely used even if you can find a vet that has one.

Whatever the x-ray doesn't show is not worth looking for tbh,the treatment is going to be the same anyway...rest.

If there are any other ways of establishing a stress fracture please let me know Ozzie.....Happy

Btw my initial point was that both parties on this subject may be right.....Laugh
Report Ozymandius November 2, 2013 2:15 PM GMT
yes, JR, there is.

It involves the horses anus. I joke not.  I read about it during my extensive research on this subject.  Can't remember the details.
Report J.R.Hartley November 2, 2013 2:20 PM GMT
Fook off.....Laugh
Report Ozymandius November 2, 2013 2:29 PM GMT
Indeed.

Apparently the tail and anus should be assessed for tone as fractures of the pelvis can cause paralysis of these structures.  Rectal examination allows assessment of the pubis, internal surface of the wing of the ilium, and the underside of the sacroiliac joint.
Report Ozymandius November 2, 2013 2:37 PM GMT
When a pelvic fracture is suspected, a veterinarian will conduct limb flexion tests, sacroiliac joint blocks, and rectal palpations to assess pelvic motion.

A rectal ultrasound probe has proven to be the best diagnostic tool for pelvic fractures. The dense bone and tissue mass in the pelvic region make it nearly impossible to examine the area by a surface scan, but even though the ultrasound cannot penetrate bone, it reflects its surface, and any fracture or callus formation can clearly be seen.

It's all about the anus Plain
Report J.R.Hartley November 2, 2013 2:42 PM GMT
Laugh.....a triumph for research Ozy......is it a reliable tool for diagnosing stress fractures though?
Report Ozymandius November 2, 2013 2:56 PM GMT
That's beyond my pay grade, JR. 

One imagines it helps.
Report tobywong. November 4, 2013 5:43 PM GMT
Wink
Report winsamsoon November 9, 2013 6:48 PM GMT
Rule The World will be a notable absentee from the ****.com Download Our App Lismullen Hurdle at Navan tomorrow.
Trainer Mouse Morris reported at Naas this afternoon that the exciting six-year-old is lame and will not run in the Grade 2 event in which he was an odds-on chance.
Report tobywong. November 9, 2013 7:02 PM GMT
mouse' opinion is not important , Wildman will decide instead Laugh
Report wildmanfromborneo November 9, 2013 9:34 PM GMT
J R Hartley explained it well,the horse did not fracture it's pelvis,merely a case of a Fethard vet claiming some extra praise.
Report Ozymandius November 9, 2013 9:37 PM GMT
Sounds to me like a chronic problem now that's going to reoccur.
Report Ozymandius November 9, 2013 9:41 PM GMT
Seems to me like they are going to have to palpitate the horse's anus again.

To try and get to the bottom of the problem, so to speak.
Report pa lapsy November 9, 2013 9:43 PM GMT
They might be looking at his feet if as Winsamsoon says he is lame.
Report The Naked Man November 10, 2013 12:55 AM GMT
mouse morris couldnt train a rocking horse.. :-)
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