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wildmanfromborneo
30 Oct 12 12:58
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Date Joined: 30 Nov 10
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Cops And Robbers ran in the first race in Fairyhouse on Tuesday he drifted from 1.44 to I think around 1.9 a massive drift this was followed by a huge punt on Sizing Rio,result Cops And Robbers beaten 18 lengths by Sizing Rio.
The same Cops And Robbers reemerges in Wexford and is fluctuating around evens in the morning but come the race he is heavily punted into 1/2 some turnaround.I have already stated elsewhere he is no good but the Meade punters have been spectacularly right.
At Galway yesterday another horse I have posted against here when some were calling her the second coming Fickle Finger who won an all aged bumper was now reverting to her own age group,she was around 1.44 in the morning again a massive drift this time out to around 2.3 and again job done.
I don't think either horse was stopped but there were heavy gamblers in the know and they cleaned up,if you fancy a Meade horse be very worried if there is a huge drift.

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Replies: 190
By:
lapsy pa
When: 30 Oct 12 14:03
Did you not think War correspondent in the very next race that day at Fairyhouse followed the same pattern as cops and robbers? Both drifted alarmingly while all the money was for the two winners,think you might have the right idea but pointing the finger at the wrong person imo.
Fickle Finger drifted badly alright,fact is he touched at the very least 1.2 i/r and was only headed a few strides before the line,a bizarre race which developed into a 3f sprint,i won,t take too much notice of that race.
By:
KittyWells
When: 30 Oct 12 14:06
It seems those on the inside are doing their own quantitative easing!  Makes it hard for the ordinary punter to have any real chance of success.  Who are these so-called faces anyhow who get the inside track all the time?
By:
wildmanfromborneo
When: 30 Oct 12 14:18
War Correspondent was similar but he was never odds on and as he had failed to win a point to point looked vulnerable to me.One other huge difference is there are no big punters attached to Mouse Morris horse and for good reason but there are some huge punters attached to the Meade stable and they are layers.
By:
Ozymandius
When: 30 Oct 12 14:48
Do you know that for a fact Borneo, or are you surmising?  Its important to be clear with such a statement, I believe.
By:
one last chance
When: 30 Oct 12 15:11
what a load of bollocks
By:
tobywong.
When: 30 Oct 12 15:16
fickle finger pulled and chawed on the bit the whole way round until nina finally had to go for it , to insinuate that the horse wasn't trying is ridiculous and i backed it.
By:
dj876
When: 30 Oct 12 15:29
Agreed Tobywong.
Nothing suspicious about cops and robbers either,drifted because most were aware that Sizing rio was highly regarded and Cops and Robbers ran a perfectly acceptable race,finishing 18 lengths clear of the third and then ran to a similar mark in justifying his odds on price in an Ordinary Wexford maiden.
By:
wildmanfromborneo
When: 30 Oct 12 17:48
It is depressing that the last three responders failed to read the opening post properly and then naturally failed to grasp the thread. The last paragraph of the opening post states I thought both horses tried but that's not the point,the point is a betting trend for ye to follow.I posted some time back about a pattern in Ballydoyle gambles yet some took it as a criticism when it wasn't just an observation about betting trends.
I also stated that the gamblers in the Meade stable got it spectacularly right which they tend to do and if you are not in the loop in that stable you can't back their horses blind.The punters that backed Cops And Robbers at 1.44 are entitled to be sore,I don't accept for one minute that Sizing Rio was backed off the boards on the basis he was highly regarded,he was backed because his punters knew all about Cops And Robbers,similarly punters that backed Fickle Fortune at 1.47 are equally entitled to moan as the drift is so spectacular.These are not drifts caused by a horse being fractious coltish or unfit,these drifts were caused by sustained laying and a snapping up of anything that appeared.I don't deny that Fickle Finger fought Nina all way round but that's not the point,the point to me is these guys are playing with a marked deck and it is perfectly reasonable of me to point it out.
Beware of massive drifters from the Meade stable,I backed neither by the way.
By:
tobywong.
When: 30 Oct 12 17:59
what a load of horse**** ^^^
By:
wildmanfromborneo
When: 30 Oct 12 18:03
Good to see you have retained your eloquence,I hope you got the in the loop reference this time.
By:
dj876
When: 30 Oct 12 18:32
Wildman,
You had no problem speaking about and naming the East Cork crew that allegedly attain information from our champion jockey and others.
So who are the big layers that you speak about that are aligned with the Noel Meade stable??Straight answer please!
By:
wildmanfromborneo
When: 30 Oct 12 18:50
Is it not self evident they are big layers by the spectacular drifts,these drifts involved huge sums.
I never named anyone from East Cork much to your chagrin,I know who you want me to name but can't oblige unfortunately,again you wanting me to name the punters shows you are missing the point of the thread
This is a betting warning nothing more nothing less but would have a sporting bet with you that Sizing Rio is no champion and Cops And Robbers will probably never win again.
By:
dj876
When: 30 Oct 12 19:02
HA ha,you possess many of the qualities needed to run for the dáil.
By:
Ozymandius
When: 30 Oct 12 19:07
Laugh
By:
ChildOfMine2
When: 30 Oct 12 19:09
Hope Sword Of Destiny doesn't drift tomorrow Shocked
By:
richters
When: 30 Oct 12 19:24
anyone that thinks cops and robbers run at fairyhouse last week wasnt rancid should just look at the way it was ridden and subsequently winning at galway on sunday.....i think wmfbs assumption here re the meade drifters  is not far off the mark imo....
By:
Pre-Fat-Low-Fat-Foods
When: 30 Oct 12 19:25
Fickle Fortune, not Fickle Finger
By:
misslimerick85
When: 30 Oct 12 22:17
fickle original poster
By:
JayTrumpOldTomDubbl
When: 30 Oct 12 22:25
Thanks wildman for pointing that out. That Galway bumper was puzzling, and the drifter was given one of the most shock, atrocious rides that I have ever witnessed in any bumper, this year, last year, or any year.
It is not really acceptable to think that she couldn't set a proper pace in a Galway bumper where she was on the best in the race. Even in todays Post they are critical of the ride. An absolute shocker, and very very suspect into the bargain.
By:
tobywong.
When: 30 Oct 12 22:32
horse pulled like a train , if she went on earlier she would have been beat a long way out imo , nina done extremely well to go so close and i backed it Cry
By:
JayTrumpOldTomDubbl
When: 30 Oct 12 22:44
Oh sorry I thought Ficle had won over 2miles on heavy ground
Non stayer so,a winner in against maidens, had to hold it up and choke it all the way around so, oh thats ok then, if it set off at a sensible pace it wouldn't have got home so, and sher the jockey is only a learner. Oh write got that wrong so..........
A good job we have wildman to open 'eyes' to whats going on........ despicable
By:
tobywong.
When: 30 Oct 12 23:01
Jay in my long long time watching racing if a horse pulls hard you can usually throw your docket away as it just wont get home , the only notable exception i can recall is glencove marina under katie walsh in thurles one day , nina's horse was pulling like feck as is noted in race comments in rp and atr sites ( doing its best to bite through the bit)  , as i said if she had really wanted to get the horse beat all she had to do was go on earlier as having pulled that hard it would not have got home.
By:
RicksonG
When: 31 Oct 12 14:21
I layed Cops and Robbers against Sizing Rio and backed him at Wexford when he was turned out quickly in a much weaker race,I'm sure I wasn't the only person, does this mean I am one of the in the know ''gamblers in the Meade stable''?

If you try hard enough to find something you generally will in the end, but does it mean that you realise A is A and you have a genuine insight?
By:
richters
When: 31 Oct 12 19:29
rickson you are not getting the point....look at the way davy rode cops and robbers so far off the pace at fairyhouse,he gifted the very talented sizing rio the race by dropping the horse way way off the front 2....while at wexford he was more to the fore....
By:
one last chance
When: 31 Oct 12 20:01
carberry rode hom the last dat
By:
RicksonG
When: 31 Oct 12 20:06
1)jockey change 2) change of ground conditions 3)different track 4)benefit of seasonal reappearance 5) weaker race. There is 5 reasons to explain a change in tactics and contraction in price for you richters.
By:
wildmanfromborneo
When: 31 Oct 12 20:23
Fair points RicksonG but why did you lay him in Fairyhouse and at what price.
By:
RicksonG
When: 31 Oct 12 21:01
C+R also had a tongue tie added at wexford. Layed between 1.65 and 1.7. Promising horse but got a good ride to win his maiden on the flat and only really scrambled home at 8/11, hammered in a handicap off 88 for his next + final start before being sold so that OR might be questionable. Sizing Rio offered decent opposition and he had to give it 5 lb on the first run of the season. C+R's first time running on ground that bad also, by pivotal so it may not have been an issue, the subsequent tongue tie suggests it could have been though. Taking 60% of the market potentially a little too much, Carberry booked for de Bromheads indicated they meant business also and there were good vibes for Sizing Rio as a few people have said
By:
DECALEC
When: 31 Oct 12 21:03
RicksonG Joined: 03 Jun 06
Replies: 58 31 Oct 12 19:06 
4)benefit of seasonal reappearance
SURELY TO HAVE A BENEFIT HORSE WOULD NEED TO TAKE A GOOD BLOW AND THEN REST AFTER TO RECOVER NOT RUN ANOTHER 2MILE OR SO A FEW DAYS LATERConfused
By:
RicksonG
When: 31 Oct 12 21:10
He's an inexperienced horse, he only had one run over hurdles in a grade 3 which was a bit steep at the back end last season so the run may have helped tune his mind into the game. They obviously felt he was okay to turn him out so quickly.
By:
wildmanfromborneo
When: 31 Oct 12 21:36
RicksonG fair play that is an impressive list of reasons,however on what basis did Sizing Rio offer decent opposition,on his only racecourse run in Punchestoen he shamed himself and was beaten a furlong.Cops And Robbers hurdling debut came in a Grade 3 race at Fairyhouse and to me it was a sensational run,he was ridden out the back and was ridden on the extreme outside he picked up nicely passing the consistent One Cool Shabra(3 time hurdle winner 10 times placed)I would say he went into many a notebook.
The bookies were also impressed as they put him in at 2/5 for the Fairyhouse race,he was around 1.47 on here not a word from the Meade stable.First came the morning punt on Sizing Rio not from the De Bromhead stable but from the Meade stable then came the dramatic drift here and that took plenty of money,Sizing Rio then backed on course from 3/1 into 13/8 again by Meade punters,I actually think he was run of his feet early by the front runner and think he tried but his layers knew something and acted accordingly.
Fickle Fortunes drift was even more dramatic again a 2/5 shot in the morning around 1.46 here,her drift was so spectacular she went out to 6/4 and again the Meade men backed two to beat her and this time may have had luck on their side.
It is very rare for horses to drift so spectacularly that they came from the same stable makes it rarer that they were both beaten not so rare.
By:
workrider
When: 31 Oct 12 21:55
i thought ff was a little unlucky , and i backed the winner btw....this filly pulled most of the way round and gave nina a horrid time of it ...it was a very slowly run race , the winner got fist run and was about 10 lths up as the tape went up..yet he waited for nina to catch up then slowed to a crawl...this unsettled the filly imo ,who was keen to get on with it , at the bottom of the hill the winner looked as if it was going to drop away , yet ran on with such purpose he always looked as if he would get back up..i think the point we are missing is the jockey on the winner rode a fine race if truth be told...mr jj king ,  seemed to know what he was about ...wildmanfromborneo , you have created 2 fine threads , this one and the coolmore one ....instead of been praised , it seems some on here only see what they want to see , and continue to nitpick...such is life...
By:
one last chance
When: 31 Oct 12 22:30
wildman who are these meade punters ????
By:
wildmanfromborneo
When: 31 Oct 12 22:44
I can't really name them.
Dj876 got upset and all precious when I wouldn't name a punter he had some vendetta against but wanted to attack him by proxy.
All stables have punters but the bigger ones would have known ones,the same would apply to bookies some have marked cards from certain stables and their prices can be a dead giveaway.
I am surprised at no one commenting on the massive drifts and to me they overdid it,am also surprised there are no questions being asked.
By:
RicksonG
When: 31 Oct 12 22:48
SR ran a bad race in his bumper but had won a p2p before and was a promising enough type that day apparently, whether he turns out to be anything is another question. He's a half brother to sizing mexico + his bumper told you he had scope physically if nothing else. Of the 22 four yr olds who won last Spring in p2ps and had run on track by 23rd of Oct when SR ran against Cops+Robbers 19 had either won or been placed.
C+R ran okay in the grade 3 but for me he ran past horses who had run there race, One Cool Shabra was on the pace the whole way until he faded late on for instance and the first two were along way clear of the rest

Cops + Robbers opened 4/7 and went off 8/11. I'm not sure about 2/5 or how much liquidity was available to back it at that price.

Who are the ''Meade punters'' ?

Horse                 On-course prices
   
Cops And Robbers     4/7 8/13 4/6 8/11
Sizing Rio          2/1 15/8 7/4 13/8
By:
one last chance
When: 31 Oct 12 22:51
there was very  good word for the winner also word for hourgians horse the money was all for hughes that is why fickle drifted and i backed ficle at 4/6 and went again at 11/10 the drift was caused by the money for the other 2 imo
By:
wildmanfromborneo
When: 31 Oct 12 23:02
RicksonG. The betting you show is just wrong as I know two punters who backed Sizing Rio at 3/1 you also have to take into account that some shows are put in late and plenty of betting has gone on before that.
One Last Chance twas the Meade punters were backing the other two and laying Fickle Fortune.
Can anyone remember two such spectacular drifts in Irish racing I certainly can't.
By:
RicksonG
When: 31 Oct 12 23:04
How much did they get at 3/1?
By:
wildmanfromborneo
When: 31 Oct 12 23:07
They were only small punters but told me they backed because they saw a Meade punter having a grand on at 3/1.
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