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Having just gone through this process I thought I’d give you lads a heads-up on what you might face. I first received a bizarre e-mail telling me I was banned from promotions (I was already) and that I should contact any other gambling firms I use to ask them to bar me too. It went downhill from there.
I noticed (rather than been told) that I’d been limited to £500 per month net deposits but was invited to increase this by contacting the helpdesk. Naively, I thought that by confirming I make steady money on the site, mainly bet on long-term markets, have paid PC frequently since it began and have not changed my betting patterns might end things quickly, but the bloke who rang me seemed to have no clue about gambling never mind Betfair or how serious exchange players might operate. Instead I was asked repeatedly from a script how comfortable I was with various aspects of my betting including how much I was betting at night (answer: zero), why I used the exchange rather than the Sportsbook, whether I used a strategy (doesn’t everyone?), whether I bet with other bookmakers, did I have trouble with the cost of living crisis and so on.
This raised my limit to £2,000pm but I want the flexibility to deposit more at certain times so agreed to a second interview. The second bloke seemed similarly clueless about gambling and was certainly not prepared to accept that making profits on the site was evidence of source of funds or affordability, so this was much more invasive than anti money-laundering checks would be. Having been quizzed again about my betting patterns, strategy and other income I sent in screen grabs of my bank account and some investments but this seems to have failed as I have not been contacted in the week since.
I was in a relaxed frame of mind for the interviews, but most people would have resorted to some industrial-strength language and hung-up. If quite wealthy, profitable clients are being prevented from spending their own money what about others? How much damage will be done to racing (in particular) if people just give up? And would this process really pick-up the true problem gamblers anyway if those doing the checks are just reading scripts?
I noticed (rather than been told) that I’d been limited to £500 per month net deposits but was invited to increase this by contacting the helpdesk. Naively, I thought that by confirming I make steady money on the site, mainly bet on long-term markets, have paid PC frequently since it began and have not changed my betting patterns might end things quickly, but the bloke who rang me seemed to have no clue about gambling never mind Betfair or how serious exchange players might operate. Instead I was asked repeatedly from a script how comfortable I was with various aspects of my betting including how much I was betting at night (answer: zero), why I used the exchange rather than the Sportsbook, whether I used a strategy (doesn’t everyone?), whether I bet with other bookmakers, did I have trouble with the cost of living crisis and so on.
This raised my limit to £2,000pm but I want the flexibility to deposit more at certain times so agreed to a second interview. The second bloke seemed similarly clueless about gambling and was certainly not prepared to accept that making profits on the site was evidence of source of funds or affordability, so this was much more invasive than anti money-laundering checks would be. Having been quizzed again about my betting patterns, strategy and other income I sent in screen grabs of my bank account and some investments but this seems to have failed as I have not been contacted in the week since.
I was in a relaxed frame of mind for the interviews, but most people would have resorted to some industrial-strength language and hung-up. If quite wealthy, profitable clients are being prevented from spending their own money what about others? How much damage will be done to racing (in particular) if people just give up? And would this process really pick-up the true problem gamblers anyway if those doing the checks are just reading scripts?
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From OP: and that I should contact any other gambling firms I use to ask them to bar me too.
That is not affordability. It sounds like you have somehow stumbled into self-exclusion. Did your mates from the pub send the email on 1st April? |
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ramruna, I think you are seriously underestimating the garbage that will emanate from a CS rep who is entirely ignorant on the subject at hand and pushes buttons on his "help" system.
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Just looked at my deposit page which has my (unchanged for years) limit and it states a review on May 1st. Should that be a cause or concern or does everyone have something similar?
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Sparrow - I suspect your position is unchanged. I used to have no limit but my a/c now has a system that limits net deposits (i.e. deposits minus withdrawals) each calendar month.
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dave1357, yes, it might well have been the Betfair chap who wandered off onto the wrong script.
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No review on mine thankfully. I tend to think, like Fangsy, I'm quite safe as a small but consistent winner whose last deposit was in 2022 (and only 1 that year) but it seems you never know.
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It wasn't that, Ram. I had an automatic looking e-mail saying "...we have decided you will no longer be eligible for promotional offers... We recommend that you contact and request the same from [others].". It stressed that my account would remain active. It's in a picture format I can't post here easily.
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Brian 16 Apr 24 08:51
No review on mine thankfully. You have looked on your deposit page and not noticed it under the limit figure? Deposit Limit: A helping hand to do the counting - Active Current Limit: |
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Yes Sparrow, my current limit is £1500 per day. No mention of review.
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Thanks Brian, although my limit is a four figure monthly sum which varies depending on my withdrawals.
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Apologies, five figure monthly sum it should say.
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Sparrow- isn't that just the reset on 1st of every month?
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I don't really know, carla. Just haven't taken notice before.
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Fangsy -- I had an automatic looking e-mail saying "...we have decided you will no longer be eligible for promotional offers... We recommend that you contact and request the same from [others].". It stressed that my account would remain active. It's in a picture format I can't post here easily.
That is the part that sounds wrong. It sounds like a spoof by your mates or some sort of scam to get you to phone the number in the email and tell them your passwords, or just possibly something to do with self-exclusion. You could save the image, or snapshot the email, and upload it to the forum with the "insert photo" button. But if I were you, I'd contact Betfair via its website -- not using any details from that email -- and check you were in fact talking to them. |
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Fangsy -- the reasons it sounds odd are:-
1) the non-text format 2) why on earth would Betfair want you to stop getting bonuses from other firms? |
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Presumably Betfair have somehow decided that fangsy is a problem gambler and at-risk, hence he shouldn't be encouraged to gamble via promotions. And for his own safety he should not allow himself to be tempted by similar offerings from other firms.
I'm not questioning the stupidity of this - just pointing out why it's probably legitimate. The Gambling Commission might be insisting on such action for punters identified as being at-risk. |
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screaming fbtw -- if Betfair think OP is a problem gambler, then presumably Betfair would block him but they have not done. As previously discussed, it is vaguely possible someone has got their scripts mixed up.
But safety first and Fangsy should urgently contact Betfair to check he has not been scammed. |
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again ramruna you are really underestimating BF CS incompetence
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Isn't there a grey area as to what to do about punters identified as problem gamblers though? Somewhere between blocking them completely and letting them carry on regardless. That's the whole point of affordability checks: a punter is losing and/or depositing regularly, so his deposits are restricted and the bookie is obliged to stop enticing him with promotions, but he's not barred from punting completely.
It's mad, I know, but it's where we are. |
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screaming fbtw -- lots of grey areas but also a complete mess foisted on us by punter complaints, bookmakers and the Racing Post's incompetent reporting that conflate different issues:-
Compulsive or addictive gambling, affordability checks, anti-money laundering and KYC are different things covered by different rules or laws, and that is without bookmakers removing or restricting unprofitable punters. Affordability checks could disappear tomorrow and hardly anyone would notice because of all the other checks. |
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I used to leave quite a large amount on deposit. I can now get 5.2% on savings, which means it's silly to do that anymore.
I had the review last year, and got £1000 a month, after being able to do whatever I wanted before. I emailed a couple of days ago asking for an annual limit. In essence I want to be able to pay in, but also take out. The monthly deposit limits don't really fit with anyone who puts in and takes out. I wonder based on the comments, whether an annual limit is even a thing, as everyone is talking about monthly deposit limits, which seem a bit inflexible really. |
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It's definitely a genuine e-mail - they followed it up with another mail and swung fully into action when I did the online chat. I'm sure screaming is correct that the GC might be behind the advice to get myself barred from others' offers. I took a photo of part of the mail (to make sure my name and username were not visible) and it may come through soon: it is currently "pending approval".
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I'm in exactly the same position, Kevin
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Why monthly limits are the norm makes no sense at all. I could lose £12,000 in a year, yet I'd be happy with a £10,000, or even £5,000 annual limit, if that was all they could approve.
No wonder volumes are going down and down. |
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kevinglass 16 Apr 24 12:08
I emailed a couple of days ago asking for an annual limit. In essence I want to be able to pay in, but also take out. The monthly deposit limits don't really fit with anyone who puts in and takes out. If you withdraw an amount ie. £100 then your deposit limit should be credited for that figure. |
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Cheers Sparrow.
But my problem is, it's monthly. I took £7000 out in March, but could only pay £1000 back in, in April. So would now have to pay a thousand in for 7 months, and if I take it out, I'm back to where I started. I only bet for fun, but like to trade a bit at the big festivals/races, and the thousand limit, means you can't really do a lot on the lay side. Shame really. I lose a hobby, and Betfair lose my trade. |
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kevinglass, did your review come after you stopped keeping a large balance in your account and do you think that was the cause? (i.e. while betfair are getting the interest on the money instead of yourself they'll happily let AC stuff slide). FWIW I am similar to you, I need a large balance at certain points in the year and it only became expensive to do this in the past couple of years - so far I've not withdrawn / foregone the interest I could get elsewhere and so far I haven't run into AC issues.
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I thought it said above the deposit was NET?
I.e. a deposit limit plus anything already withdrawn within that month? So a 100 quid deposit having withdrawn 500 would amount to a limit of 600 for the month, no? If it is this way then anyone affected would be best depositing at the end on each month wether required or not, then withdraw again turn of new month That’s similar to what I do for ISA each tax year. |
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That is correct, dusty.
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Re GoBallistic commment: are Betfair allowed to invest ring-fenced money for the gain of interest? I presume it would have to be left untouched in any way... though it wouldn't be a complete surprise if they did otherwise.
Personally though like you i've just built up a bank big enough to not have to make further deposits, and the loss of interest for me is effectively now just a business cost of having the account. With things the way they are, it's not worth the risk of doing otherwise. |
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"are Betfair allowed to invest ring-fenced money for the gain of interest"
I see no reason why not - it's the captal that is ring-fenced/protected. And if they have millions on deposit on our behalf with a bank, they'd be mad not to. |
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Although, when interest rates were very low, they would have been primarily concerned with the solvency of the bank, but now with substantial amounts to be made, they might not be so cautious.
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It seems The system discourages you now from withdrawals. Which is counterintuitive. Essentially as long as you are winning at gambling and the company wants to lay the bets you should be able to at the very least bet that. Which now you cant at many firms. Its rules made by idiots.
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My Affordability Check problems started, or so I was told, because I was betting late at night/early morning. This was just on the Sunday of The Masters last year, and I was only really checking my final positions. I had about £10k on deposit then, and left it. Withdrew about £3k for holidays and stuff over the next year, so was left with £7.5k or so.
So the intervention of a £1000 a month limit wasn't so problematic. The point is though, I only bet on Saturdays & the big Festivals on the TV, so why leave so much in there all the time when it's not being used? The phone call was obviously scripted, and there was no chance to have a conversation. The advisor I suspect had no leeway from the script. I do like to add big lumps for Politics betting, and would be doing so for the US & UK election. Anyway, if my limit stays at £1k a month, Betfair will lose out on commission, ad I'll miss out on some fun. Shame, and bonkers really. |
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That would be laughable if it was genuinely the case that betting outside "normal" UK hours could trigger AC issues (i.e. if you bet on sports occuring in USA, Australia etc). So stupid I'd not even considered it a possibility.
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Gambling in 'unsociable hours' is one of the big red flags that bookmakers have to look out for and consider as part of a review.
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hence stewyb awol
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Is UK racing unsociable doon under
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