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Has Gosden lost confidence in his ability or his integrity ?
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It looks as though they are calling it a day. A shame for things to end like that. Still I imagine Frankie will get plenty of offers especially from the TV.
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If its happened the way Dettoris agent says, without them even telling him or Dettori, then that is a Disgrace.
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By David Milnes, Newmarket correspondent
UPDATED 6:59PM, JUN 23 2022 Frankie Dettori's business manager said on Thursday the rider would "have to move on with whatever John and Thady Gosden have done" after he lost rides on the yard's runners at Newmarket on Saturday. Peter Burrell said he and Dettori were "in the dark as much as anyone else" after James Doyle and Robert Havlin were chosen to ride for the Gosdens, despite the three-time champion jockey being available to take the mounts. The move came a week after John Gosden strongly criticised his number one jockey for his riding at Royal Ascot, chiefly when beaten in the Gold Cup on Stradivarius. 'We're in the dark' The shock news prompted speculation over whether last week's high-profile criticism marked the end of their hugely successful partnership, with Betfair installing Hollie Doyle as 4-11 favourite to take over as the primary rider at Clarehaven Stables. Burrell said: "Frankie rang up the Gosden office this morning to discuss riding plans for the weekend, as he usually does, but didn't get a call back. We're in the dark as much as anyone else, which is a strange position to be in. "We only have questions, not answers. We know absolutely nothing, so we'll have to put the jigsaw together ourselves. Whatever John and Thady have done, we'll all have to move on with." James Doyle takes over on favourite Sunray Major – who has been ridden in all bar one of his races by Dettori – in the House of Cavani Criterion Stakes, while Havlin, second jockey at Clarehaven Stables, rides Stowell in the House of Cavani Fred Archer Stakes, and Mimikyu in the 1m4f fillies' handicap. Dettori, who has been on holiday in Sardinia this week, has one ride at Newmarket on Saturday, partnering Lezoo in the Listed Maureen Brittain Memorial Empress Fillies' Stakes for trainer Ralph Beckett and owner Marc Chan. The absence of Dettori on any Gosden-trained runners comes a week after a public outburst by John Gosden following the defeat of Stradivarius in the Gold Cup at Royal Ascot. |
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I agree 1830. Very shabby but then so were his Ascot failed rides. However, at the end of the day that;s racing. Gosden and son don't have to explain themselves to anyone but their owners.
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I was looking for opinions on the reason.. His current ability or his integrity.. ?
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Personally i think it is a disgrace the way big john has handled this.Dettori is one of the best Jockeys in the history of the sport and yes a couple of bad rides at Royal Ascot but to be dumped like this is shocking behaviour by Gosden.
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Big John has always been a ruthless fooker though, he got Mace Roberts the boot from the Sheik Mo job as he didn't think he was good enough,Jimmy Fortune didn't even see it coming and i still dont think he ever got over it now it's Frankie's turn and being one of the greatest of all time counts for nothing.
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just smack the tall stuck up prik in the face and be done with it
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All great partnerships come to an end, don't know the in and outs of their relationship so can't comment but must of been a very strong one with the achievements they did. Whatever happens in the now and present, the past will always be re-run, that's what greats do.
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All we need is a repeat of this
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Miss me?
Piggott to the Coolmore team, his former employers, after his replacement Pat Eddery was beaten on El Gran Senor by Secreto in the 1984 Derby |
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??? Why would Coolmore want Dettori? Could see one of the up-and-comers maybe taking him for half a season to see how it goes. Archie Watson. George Boughey. Tom Clover. Any of these three would love his experience. Maybe even Rafe Beckett because even at 50 Frankie is way, way better than Hornby.
But I think part of the problem with Frankie is physical. He doesn;t ride regularly enough now and just got too cozy and comfortable with the plum rides and easy life of riding Gosden's group horses. He looked as weak as hell on everything at Ascot. He's been absolutely brilliant. Let's see if he can bounce back from this very shoddy treatment. |
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Didn't Gosden give Frankie a career back after the coke ban?
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Frankie has a lot to thank Gosden for. There seems to have been tensions building for a while, Stradivarius in Gold Cup and Palace Pier in Elizabeth 11 a couple of examples from last year I can remember. The ride on Stradivarius in this years Gold Cup looked like blind panic in the straight and was poor by Dettori standards. But the ride on Saga was worse as he chose to hold him up so far off the pace and being the Queens horse probably upset far Gosden more.
If the reports are true then not handled well by Gosden. I just hope Dettori deals with it with aplomb and gracefully. |
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GOSDEN is a typical privileged chinless wonder with no bottle.
Regardless of the merits of the current form of DETTORI even if he’s correct (which I thinks is debatable to say the least) he should have the balls and the grace to tell him face to face like a man. |
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Probably fed up with Dettori's attitude riding these days, seems to only ride at weekends or big meetings. On holiday in Sardinia this week ffs
Get a stable jockey in that wants to put the hard work in and a team player. Dettori is always keen to make it about him when he wins and doesn't seem to like the criticism of his crappy riding |
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Whatever the rights or wrongs regarding the ride in the Gold Cup and other matters relating to the working relationship .....one party in this saga has imo lost a lot of credibility in speaking to the media on it ,rather than in private.
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The boss is always right. You have to take what he says and not sulk about it. Gosden mentioned his attitude as much as the riding. I would guess if he had admitted mistakes and kept a smile on his face we wouldn't be here.
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It appears that there was a lot going on behind the scenes that Johnny G wasn't happy with, and ascot wasthe final straw.
Dettori at ascot was woeful, stradivarius saga and even inspiral was a poor ride but the horse had about 4 stone in hand, not forgetting Emily in the oaks. Any other jockey would have been hounded out of the spirt for their misdemeanours over the years. |
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I do think though that the Gold Cup horse wouldn't have won whatever the jockey had done. Past his best and also never as good as Gosden made out ( v. **** , Le Moss , Ardross etc )
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y e a t s
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Agreed strad wouldn't have won but still a poor ride.
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Gosden said on Friday morning that Dettori had been in Italy for a wedding in the week before Royal Ascot, at a time when he could have been in to ride work on some of his potential mounts.
and this week on holiday, thats not good By David Milnes, Newmarket correspondent UPDATED 9:13AM, JUN 24 2022 John Gosden is planning to have a face-to-face meeting with Frankie Dettori on Friday to discuss their future together as speculation rumbles on about the jockey's position as number one rider at Clarehaven Stables in Newmarket. The summit comes a day after it was revealed Dettori was not booked for key rides for the John and Thady Gosden yard at Newmarket on Saturday despite being available. The move comes in the wake of some strong criticism he received from Gosden snr for his riding at Royal Ascot last week, including on Stradivarius in the Gold Cup. Dettori has only one ride at Newmarket on Saturday, Lezoo for Ralph Beckett in a Listed race. His regular Gosden mounts Sunray Major (James Doyle) and Stowell (Rab Havlin) have gone to other riders. Gosden said on Friday morning that Dettori had been in Italy for a wedding in the week before Royal Ascot, at a time when he could have been in to ride work on some of his potential mounts. Speaking on the Newmarket gallops, Gosden said: "Frankie was in Italy for a wedding in the week before Royal Ascot. Obviously he was at Ascot all last week and he then went to Sardinia after racing on the Saturday. I assume he will be back in the UK today when I will be able to see him for a meeting." |
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know all 24 Jun 22 09:58
Gosden said on Friday morning that Dettori had been in Italy for a wedding in the week before Royal Ascot, at a time when he could have been in to ride work on some of his potential mounts. .................... Some press mischief going on as always, his quote was measured and never mentioned that he could have been riding work. |
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They are both good at their jobs but both equally unlikeable for different reasons.
Nearing the end of their careers the lack of class is showing |
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frankie taken eye off the ball, royal ascot and he is not in to ride work ffs maybe a week on the hiss who knows and turns up cold no wonder he wasnt at his best, punters knowing that would have second thoughts backing his mounts imo
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I was surprised that Gosden was critical post race, his normally perfect manners have always covered any annoyance on camera. Something been brewing for sure.
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Dettori could have a year off and still be better than Rab Havlin.
Let him keep riding your hosses Johnboy, see how you get on. YSC |
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Well we seen that at ascot didn't we
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I'm not sure top jockeys always ride their potential mounts work at home. Many a time a jockey will say at the races that it was the first time they had sat on the horse since it ran last. I remember O'Brien saying he didn't like Lester on his horses before their races because he would be asking them too much. Sounds like a bit of backtracking to me. I also think JG is the old school, subservience and all that. Not easily take any answering back.
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Frankie is in his fifties of course he's not getting any better, he can't get his son in to help him in the saddle like old Johnboy can in his job
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Even more reason why this is grotesque. JG and Nielsen should know better.
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^^Even if they are right, but I don't think they are.
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IF AND ONLY IF IT IS A PARTING OF THE WAYS.............JG HAS THE RIGHT TO MAKE THE BEST DECISIONS FOR HIS OWNERS OR HE COULD LOSE THEM.......HOWEVER
If they are parting........this could have been done privately rather than JG handling it like this IMHO things have not got better since Thady joined in the stable. If and thats if STRAD was the point of no return, they need to wake up and smell the coffee.......STRAD is not the horse he was, some tactical speed has gone IMHO Strad now will only win races in small fields, other jockeys know Strads strengths and can box him in easier with fields of 7 or more. |
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Dettori blamed Stradivarius - not a nice thing to do when you rode it like an apprentice
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JG has lacked class in what has become a tedious saga.
It needs resolving so everyone can move on. Good punting today all  |
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SHROPSHIRELAD Joined: 12 Mar 21
Replies: 23824 Jun 22 08:51 GOSDEN is a typical privileged chinless wonder with no bottle. Regardless of the merits of the current form of DETTORI even if he’s correct (which I thinks is debatable to say the least) he should have the balls and the grace to tell him face to face like a man. https://www.racingpost.com/news/potential-split/frankie-dettori-and-john-gosden-the-highs-and-lows/564272 'Dettori is beaten on Stradivarius in the Gold Cup, again finding trouble in running, and is seen exchanging strong words with Gosden, who is also critical of the rider once again to the media.' According to people who were actually there, he did. |
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Apparently, straight from the horse's mouth, Stradivarius will not allow Dettori on his back again having been disrespected. He wishes his fans to know there's life in the old dog yet and will prove it at Goodwood given half a chance. He certainly considers that he has more life in him than Dettori who he thinks is on the slide. "I was telling Dettori to hold track position before Swinley Bottom but he thought he knew best and got me into a right pickle. It was downright embarrassing. Have faith that I will put right all wrongs in the Goodwood Cup and make Ryan Moore eat his words when he suggested post race that the young whippersnapper Kyprios was much the best at Ascot."
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Dettori's attitude stinks at times in my opinion & he's been found wanting way to many times this season. If he had the grace to come out and admit he made a mistake then fair enough everybody makes mistakes. As mentioned above the blame the horse after riding a stinker pretty much sums him up. Lost a lot of respect for him earlier in the season (France maybe?) Cant remember - he blamed a younger jockey anyway I thought that was poor form.
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