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Thelastfling
01 Apr 21 16:34
Joined:
Date Joined: 17 Jun 03
| Topic/replies: 221 | Blogger: Thelastfling's blog
Been a customer here for 10+ years. In that time have gone through various checks etc etc (1 just only 18 months ago) Last October I was asked to provide more ID details which I did. After being told they were fine my account was then closed "pending a review." No explanation was ever given. It stayed like that for 5 months with me having to chase them every week asking what's going on and them basically fobbing me off and refusing to talk to me. Then in February they told me it was open again and I could log in. I then discovered they had limited me to £100 deposits without saying anything. Asked them why and I was told the review was ongoing still and that I would have to keep depositing £100 a day in the meantime till it was finished. 6 days later they suspended my account again pending responsible gambling team and 4/5 weeks later I am still waiting for a call from them despite numerous promises that they'll ring in the next couple of days. I've never known anything like it. Anyone else experienced a similar scenario?
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Report The Management April 1, 2021 4:57 PM BST
It's a good job they have live chat - they will have this sorted out for you in no time! Laugh
Report The Management April 1, 2021 5:02 PM BST
Sorry - that was a bit flippant - still bitter about waiting 7 months for a call back.

Sorry to hear about your issue - But the bottom line is you are fecked - you have more chance of winning the lottery than getting hold of anybody at BF that will understand your issue, let alone resolve it. Good luck.
Report onlooker April 1, 2021 5:05 PM BST
".... they suspended my account again pending responsible gambling team"
----------

That appears to be the salient sentence.

If we may ask ... What were you Betting on? .... or was it everything - including Arcade, Games etc - although, from your Profile of - Been here since 2003 - that, admittedly, does not look like 'a fit'

Strange one, this - If you are just a Joe Punter on the Horses and Footy  ..

On the other hand - If you are ... Can we all now expect our Accounts to be Suspended indeterminately?

I have to doubt that.
Report The Management April 1, 2021 5:10 PM BST
Onlooker - yeah it's a strange one. If only there was somebody he could contact to sort it out!
Report Thelastfling April 1, 2021 5:12 PM BST
I'm just a weekend and big festival punter on horses, occasional football but that's it. No arcade, gaming, nothing else. The amount of angst this has caused trying to get any sense out of anyone is ridiculous. I've had managers refusing to call me, people on the phone saying they won't speak to me as they're trained not to be, spent 11 hours on Twitter one day getting nowhere and the amount of time on the live chat I would hate to think. Perfectly normal account until last Oct. I just thought it was another round of ID checks.
Report howard April 1, 2021 5:15 PM BST
Why has he been on the forum so rarely is a bigger question.Devil
Report shady69 April 1, 2021 5:16 PM BST
April 1st ...
Report howard April 1, 2021 5:17 PM BST
Let's cut to the chase. How much lifetime loss on Betfair ?
Report The Management April 1, 2021 5:21 PM BST
I got that "security message" the other week asking me to check/update my phone number and my e-mail address.

I thought to myself WTF are they gonna do with those - if they haven't got an e-mail address or any phones ay BF HQ. Laugh

Thelastfling - it sounds like they have you down as a PC avoider or money launderer. Obviously you will never know if there is no way of making (meaningful) contact with them. Cry
Report Thelastfling April 1, 2021 5:23 PM BST
Honestly fellas I don't have the will right now to justify all this, I really don't. I just wanted to put the feelers out to see if this was just me or whether others were going through a similar thing. To answer the questions above (1) I haven't been on the forum much as I don't really like it, I@'m a viewer rather than a contributor. (2) Lifetime loss on Betfair. I couldn't honestly tell you. The last time I went through all this 18 months ago they did show me a profit/loss record for the last 5 years and I was averaging a profit of £10k a year which would be about right. I would say I've gone occasionally north, occasionally south of this figure but not changed too much.
Report 11kv April 1, 2021 5:27 PM BST
Had a password problem a few weeks ago and they were very helpful on live chat ,had to jump through a couple of hoops but it was sorted in 3 days and account opened again.....


(Problem was an old account laying dormant)
Report howard April 1, 2021 5:30 PM BST
You don't like the forum well don't post another word ydc     Lifetime profit/loss can be found by anyone on this site on their own.  And some have even posted it.  Shady spot-on imo.
Report Thelastfling April 1, 2021 5:31 PM BST
If someone would actually tell me what the problem was I would at least understand. 6 months of people ignoring you and refusing to answer questions is just as infuriating as hell. I feel sorry for the guys on live chat, I really do but the attitude of the company as a whole stinks.
Report shady69 April 1, 2021 5:33 PM BST
Been a while since I did the Betfair KYC stuff but as far as I remember I wasn't required to make £100 deposits every day until their review was completed ...
Report Thelastfling April 1, 2021 5:41 PM BST
Just something not quite right with it. For 4 months + it was closed and they wouldn't open it at all. Then it was reopened but still pending review (which begs the question why it couldn't have been opened earlier.) Then this with the responsible gambling team now and 4/5 weeks of them not calling to sort it out. Then I read an article on the RP website saying that industrywide there were becoming a lot of these £100 max deposits put on accounts by responsible gambling teams so I thought it may be affecting others. They also always say there's a queue but this queue must be a mile long judging by my 6 month exclusion yet others on here seemingly not having the same issue.
Report Thelastfling April 1, 2021 5:46 PM BST
"You don't like the forum well don't post another word ydc     Lifetime profit/loss can be found by anyone on this site on their own.  And some have even posted it.  Shady spot-on imo."

Small-minded posts like this are exactly why I don't tend to bother on here. If you don't want to add anything constructive that's fine but not quite sure why you feel the need to come on and start being abusive. I was asked why I didn't post, I gave an honest answer.
Report onlooker April 1, 2021 6:01 PM BST
How do you know about - (Betfair's) "the responsible gambling team" ...

When you post that they will neither correspond nor speak to you?
Report howard April 1, 2021 6:02 PM BST
Well don't just come on to tell us your problems. I notice you haven't asked how to access lifetime/profit loss. Why's that ? It's all bull that's why. Even if it were true it's your problem. Bet somewhere else. 5 years around 10k profit each year and barred for losing too much. WALOFS.
Report Thelastfling April 1, 2021 6:09 PM BST
I never mentioned barred for losing too much, I was just asking if anyone else was going through a similar thing. The whole point of posting the issue was for people to say yes/no I've had similar issues. I would like to see my lifetime profit/loss figure actually so fire away I'm all ears.
Report howard April 1, 2021 6:11 PM BST
I don't believe you would post it. Ask someone else.
Report Thelastfling April 1, 2021 6:12 PM BST
How do you know about - (Betfair's) "the responsible gambling team" ...

My account was reopened for about 6 days and when I enquired as to why it was suspended again they told me it was a different department this time and that I needed to speak to the responsible gambling team. I spoke to someone today on live chat with people from that team but they say they cannot make "the call" and that I have to await a call from a member of the team who can. All very confusing, makes little sense to me.
Report Thelastfling April 1, 2021 6:13 PM BST
"I don't believe you would post it. Ask someone else."

Don't give it the big uns and call me out for bullshit if you're not prepared to follow through. I'll see if I can suss it out myself.
Report GEORGE.B April 1, 2021 6:14 PM BST
There was a similar post recently, albeit about a large deposit, but the poster seemed genuine enough.

If someone can remind me of the person's name, I'll bring it back to the top.
Report GEORGE.B April 1, 2021 6:15 PM BST
cantthinkofaclevername?
Report 11kv April 1, 2021 6:15 PM BST
3 months only , if you want life time contact Betfair (if you can)
Report GEORGE.B April 1, 2021 6:18 PM BST
apologies, not cantthinkofaclevername, that was about an account hack.
Report Thelastfling April 1, 2021 6:21 PM BST
Thank you George, I really don't feel the need to dick people around and was just wondering if others were suffering too. Also noticed that liquidity in markets in the am seems to be very low and I thought it may be that a lot of people like myself were now on the outside looking in. Had a look but can't suss out lifetime profit/loss at this point but I do remember them showing me it as I was quite surprised.
Report greenteethnarrabacktroutmoy April 1, 2021 6:22 PM BST
my mates acc got recently restricted to £100 a day out of the blue.
Report GEORGE.B April 1, 2021 6:22 PM BST
actually, it was a newspaper article, by Lee Mottershead
Report Thelastfling April 1, 2021 6:26 PM BST
Sussed out how to find lifetime. That feels right to me as the first few years I was sussing it all out and low stakes.

Lifetime summaryApplies across 8,613 Exchange markets
Gross profit & loss

£75,897.38

Commission

Other charges

Premium Charges

Total charges (33.73%)

Maximum possible premium charge

£25,601.44

+

£0    
+

£0

=

£25,601.44

£0
Report Thelastfling April 1, 2021 6:27 PM BST
@green Did he ever resolve it or did they ever give him a reason?
Report GEORGE.B April 1, 2021 6:31 PM BST
Thelastfling, this was LM's tweet about it and the link is there for the column if you're a RP member

https://twitter.com/leemottershead/status/1358709897702100992
Report Brian April 1, 2021 6:32 PM BST
Betfair customer services are ridiculously poor and it's no surprise when something goes wrong that it takes an age to sort (if ever). Don't understand the animosity to OP, we could all get into that situation.

TM summed it up  earlier in the thread " the bottom line is you are fecked - you have more chance of winning the lottery than getting hold of anybody at BF that will understand your issue, let alone resolve it. Good luck. "
Report s.kenbo April 1, 2021 6:33 PM BST
A nice healthy profit there, TLF. Cool
Report frames April 1, 2021 6:34 PM BST
Similar experience here.Last summer I was asked to supply KYC info and given until 16/11/20 to supply info or my account would be suspended.I thought the request strange after nearly 20 years on the site and queried it early November.
I received reply around 2 weeks later and was told no more information was needed.Ok fair enough I thought.

I only trade on golf tournaments , on 16/11/20 I started betting on the Joburg Open , some of my early plays were to place lays for the 1000 pokes for £25 and press the keep bet box for when the tournament goes in-play.I had several other lays in as well.Early evening on the 16/11 my account was suspended despite being told I was not required to send any KYC info in.

Most of that evening was spent on the phone/web chat trying to resolve the issue , they said amongst other things they could not find an email where I was told no more information was needed.I ended up sending the KYC info the next morning along with a copy of the email sent to me telling me no more info was needed.

I requested all bets on the golf be cancelled ,cannot be done but don't worry one web chat host told me ,they will all be cancelled when the tournament goes in play Thursday.Trying to explain that I had ticked the keep bet box was completely pointless.

Probably 20 emails and 20 visits to the web chat followed with no joy , I probably layed 10 of the 1000 pokes in-play ,unable to do much about it was not a nice feeling.Ok they don't win often but McGowan had obliged a few weeks earlier at 1000.It was a horrible few days.

My account remained suspended until 27/12/20 , no apology for wrongly telling me no info was required.I no longer trust the company and will not be depositing funds again.

And on the depositing funds theme , I think 3 times I deposited in 2020 , each time I was phoned by the " problem gambler" crew , had never been phoned before in 20 years.The once I did not answer my account was suspended within the hour.I am/was a PC payer , not sure how many problem gamblers pay the charge but I suppose it looks good for them to boost their " look how many problem gamblers we phoned this week".
Report Thelastfling April 1, 2021 6:35 PM BST
Thanks Brian. I think I am fekked tbh I just wish someone would at least communicate with me and let me know why, it's the not knowing and dragging it on for months that kills. I thought when they reopened it that I was back in business but seemingly I'm back almost at the start again. Thanks for the link George, I'll take a look.
Report 11kv April 1, 2021 6:35 PM BST
Answers a few questions if your on the portal.

Betfair dont like it up em.
Report Thelastfling April 1, 2021 6:40 PM BST
Thanks for sharing that frames, I think some of our circumstances have been very similar. I get the verification checks every so often and have always obliged. The last time it happened I was back up again within a week. The regulatory things you get, what you don't get is why Betfair have to act like the mafia and not communicate with customers about what is happening. The sheer arrogance of the firm beggars belief. It's the hope that kills, I still hang in there thinking one day I will get the call and it may all get resolved but then we're living in a world where I can't transfer money within my own online bank account without having to check 3 boxes first confirming that i've not been pressured into it and I am aware of what I am doing.
Report GEORGE.B April 1, 2021 6:42 PM BST
This was another strange story, about the guy who deposited a large amount to bet with on the US election, but the money didn't turn up in his BF account.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jan/22/betfair-apologise-after
-keeping-punter-100000-pounds-out-of-pocket-for-months
Report GEORGE.B April 1, 2021 6:49 PM BST
"His frustration increased as the election came and went with the money still missing from his exchange account. He then asked Betfair to return the money to the same bank account from which it had been transferred but again, despite “multiple requests and inquiries” to Betfair’s customer relations and escalations departments, the money remained somewhere in the exchange’s coffers."
Report Thelastfling April 1, 2021 6:54 PM BST
The more I think about it now the more I wonder whether it is a PC issue as The Management mentioned and they're just being dicks about it because they actually do want me just to f off. Back when I started, in the first couple of years, I'd back some horses but I also laid some off on here if I thought I could get out (the concept of greening out was beyond me at that point before the days of cash out.) Hence I occasionally lost on here and this I think kept me below the PC level. I haven't done this for a while now but have never really paid PC other than just my 4-5%.
Report Brian April 1, 2021 7:54 PM BST
What a depressing read this thread is. If something like the stories on here happens to me, I'm out of here. Particularly concerning as I've never gone thru KYC process.
Report Rico-Dangleflaps April 1, 2021 9:28 PM BST
Thelastfling 01 Apr 21 17:40 
Thanks for sharing that frames, I think some of our circumstances have been very similar. I get the verification checks every so often and have always obliged. The last time it happened I was back up again within a week. The regulatory things you get, what you don't get is why Betfair have to act like the mafia and not communicate with customers about what is happening. The sheer arrogance of the firm beggars belief. It's the hope that kills, I still hang in there thinking one day I will get the call and it may all get resolved but then we're living in a world where I can't transfer money within my own online bank account without having to check 3 boxes first confirming that i've not been pressured into it and I am aware of what I am doing.

concur with middle part of 4th line...and it really does .
Report smirnoff2therescue April 1, 2021 11:02 PM BST
got all the cake aint they - unbelievable 20 yrs on especially wiv **** being "owned " by laddiesLaughLaughShockedShocked
Report smirnoff2therescue April 1, 2021 11:03 PM BST
b dak
Report dustybin April 2, 2021 8:15 AM BST
I’m not a believer that being a PC payer makes for a bad customer (since they are working partly for bf)
But it’s not too much of a stretch to think some people just might not be all round good for business and have a too good a record.
Maybe the OP could have churned a bit and kept under the radar?
Report Brian April 2, 2021 9:51 AM BST
Dustybin- That suggests some commercial logic. I don't give that much credit, their main drive seems to be keep customer service costs to a bare minimum.
Report brassneck April 2, 2021 11:10 AM BST
if people gamble too much and waste their money other people try to restrict them ............................
well.Women spend a lot more money on make up and beauty operations every week to make them younger than gamblers spend trying to get rich,yet nobody restricts the women that will never get younger,but at least the gambler has a chance of getting rich.
one rule for some,and no rule for another.Laugh
Report Rico-Dangleflaps April 2, 2021 11:16 AM BST
do you 'churn' to avoid pc dusty? i must be naive to be missing out on this windfall.
Report unclepuncle April 2, 2021 12:00 PM BST
I feel for you TLF- and the people thread crapping need to get a life.

What I don't get is that the Betfair Exchange is not a bookmaker. It is no different to the stock exchange and people may well deposit and invest large sums just to trade out again to make tiny profits, or close loses. By suspending an account it removes this option and people could lose a fortune through no fault of their own.

Imagine if you bought £50k ofTesco shares through your bank / stockbroker and then the next day want to cash them in (whether for a profit or a loss is irrelevant) but are told your account is suspended and you can't do anything or get your money back until they say so.

I have no problem with the money laundering thing and proving where the funds have come from but other than that people should be able to trade as much on the exchange as they like with no limits - that is what 'makes a market'.

I had a major issue with the US Election and they suspended my account several times. Firstly after I had deposited £30k and I had to speak to one of their gambling care people. I then got my deposit limit increased to £60k and maxed that out.
Then I got the money laundering enquiry saying I had a month to provide the info. Despite sending all the info they could want straight away and asking them several times if they needed anything else with zeror eply, a month later and my account was suspended.
Impossible to contact anyone and the Twitter and live chat are a joke with nobody able to help. No way of contacting them on the phone - so total limbo.

Finally went through a few betting forums looking for advice and someone suggested emailing the CEO of Flutter (Betfairs parent company). Did this at about 8.30am on a Saturday morning and about an hour later I got a call on my mobile from someone from his team saying they would get it sorted. About an hour later got another email from Betfair fraud team asking for a bit more info, sent that in and got account unfrozen within 24 hours, though my deposit limit was reduced to £5k a day.

Good luck getting it sorted TLF
Report doorman99 April 2, 2021 12:09 PM BST
Nice one uncle.
Report Regbutler April 2, 2021 12:26 PM BST
Agree with uncle regarding sending email to the CEO to get things moving..
My problems started when I updated some personal details and they realised I had had 2 accounts, one in Euro one in Sterling for 18 years. So, they closed the older, now unused Euro one.
No problem, except that had my regvarney forum name attached to it.
All I wanted was to get a new forum membership with my current Sterling account so I could start posting again.
So, not as big a problem as the OP but still amazed at the lack of knowledge on the live chat. Nobody had a clue.
Sent email to CEO and within an hour got a personal email from a Customer Services person who was assigned to sort out my problem. Took a week of emails going back and forth between us, every one saying "try again now, we think it's fixed", before it was sorted.
Report The Management April 2, 2021 12:30 PM BST
unclepuncle02 Apr 21 11:00Joined: 16 Feb 03 | Topic/replies: 6,347 | Blogger: unclepuncle's blog
Impossible to contact anyone and the Twitter and live chat are a joke with nobody able to help. No way of contacting them on the phone - so total limbo.


Spot on - This is the reality that could face anybody on here that has an issue - be it over £2 or £30k.
Report pablo-fanque April 2, 2021 12:53 PM BST
someone suggested emailing the CEO of Flutter (Betfairs parent company)

may be we need to email him to get the forum clock fixed ,,,,,,,,,,,it is a very serious matter that will only be fixed by going to the head honcho as no one else can do it Crazy
Report dustybin April 2, 2021 1:06 PM BST
Rico

It’s quite conceivable that his little interaction with the site has meant he has had a high win to loss ratio and bf have flagged him up as being counter productive.

Nobody here full time would be able to avoid losing naturally.
Report dustybin April 2, 2021 1:29 PM BST
Hang on...
Ive only just looked at the figures

How can there be a highest possible PC amount of £25k when his lifetime is just 75k infront?

He isnt even eligable to pay Higher Rate until hes 250k infront
Report dustybin April 2, 2021 1:38 PM BST
Hes only posted part of the portal, from the top half of the page.
Looks to my eye hes had a big win and bf smell a rat.
Report BARROWBOY April 2, 2021 1:45 PM BST
A mate had a similar problem on his PP a/c ,the last fling.after weeks being fobbed off he finally sent a strong email to the CEO of flutter.someone rang him back within 24 hours,sorted him out & awarded him a lumpy free bet.maybe something like that may be in order,don’t think the live chat monkeys are trained to resolve anything just there to provide a wall of evasion
Report dustybin April 2, 2021 1:46 PM BST
Did I read hes been here for 18 years...bet on 8000 markets and got a niminal PC bill for 25k?

That means hes here for around 3 weeks a year, just had an almighty win in a week and bf can only take 20% of it

Case closed
Report dustybin April 2, 2021 1:48 PM BST
nominal and superflous since he couldnt be billed that much
Report Brian April 2, 2021 2:11 PM BST
I think the cut and paste of LF messes up the figures. Looking at it (with mine which I never normally look at), it look to me he's paid over 33% of his profit in commission (very similar percentages to my own figures) so Betfair have got their pound of flesh.
Report dustybin April 2, 2021 2:14 PM BST
...unless hes just won 160k region
And if he did that would mean he either has massive usual wins and losses (and why he didnt post his commision details)... and is now a high risk punter that bf need to flag up

Or hes a small time user whos just hit the jackpot and the flag has gone up based on that fact alone.
Report dave1357 April 2, 2021 2:21 PM BST
surely the 75k figure is the gross profit and the charges (commission) are 33% of the 75k ie the 25k figure quoted?
Report dustybin April 2, 2021 2:23 PM BST
Only the OP can clarify that matter
Report The Management April 2, 2021 2:27 PM BST
I read it the same way Dave1357 reads it. Also agree with Brian, for some reason it gets distorted if you try to c&p from that page.
Report greenteethnarrabacktroutmoy April 2, 2021 2:36 PM BST
Lifetime summaryApplies across 8,613 Exchange markets
Gross profit & loss

£75,897.38
Report greenteethnarrabacktroutmoy April 2, 2021 2:46 PM BST
cant see how you play on bf making any diff..they get paid on turnover.
Report commander April 2, 2021 4:06 PM BST
I've had the same problem, and have just taken some of the advice mentioned in the discussion.
Report 11kv April 2, 2021 4:08 PM BST
Its called customer profiling.Will be a lot more having problems in the next couple of months.
Report matso April 3, 2021 12:12 AM BST
Someone I know as had this recently happen to him .. he is a terrible compulsive gambler who literally cannot win , I think the only reason they are doing it to him is to try to stop him continually being a total nutjob , sadly they should have done it years ago
Report The Management April 3, 2021 10:52 AM BST
That sounds like a very vague and completely unrelated story matso.

It doesn't really alter the fact that the OP (regardless of what he has or has not done) and quite a few other contributors to the thread - have found themselves frozen out, left in the dark or hanging in limbo due to the inadequacies of BF's Customer Service offering.
Report howard April 3, 2021 11:45 AM BST
"cant see how you play on bf making any diff..they get paid on turnover."
Isn't it possible IN THEORY for all customers IF THEY PLAYED IN A CERTAIN WAY to avoid PC ?  And isn't the OP in not paying PC  likely making winning bets at the expense of people that do pay it therefore costing Betfair money ?
Report commander April 3, 2021 12:04 PM BST
email sent to CEO at 3pm yesterday, phonecall received within 20 hours, saying that this will be taken care of either today or tomorrow at the latest.
Report dustybin April 3, 2021 12:14 PM BST
Howard
The portal suggests he’s paying commission at levels greater than what his PC level would be, on fewer than 9k markets.
If he really wants the issue scrutinising he has to post a proper portal.
Report howard April 3, 2021 12:40 PM BST
Dusty
Here's an example where Betfair don't make much but the punter still has a large percentage of his winnings taken ( still good value compared to the old bookies tax days )

102 bets £100 each at evens   50 win 52 lose  You would lose £200  without commission. With it ( 50 x £2  ) you lose £300.  If these bets were mixed in with a big PC players bets he would not just pay the 2%. Correct ?
Report commander April 3, 2021 2:10 PM BST
Thanks unclepuncle for the advice. All sorted now, though deposit limit has been halved.
Report greenteethnarrabacktroutmoy April 3, 2021 3:19 PM BST
Isn't it possible IN THEORY for all customers IF THEY PLAYED IN A CERTAIN WAY to avoid PC ?

other than a martingale cistern i'd say no..but 10 reds in a row happens.
Report howard April 3, 2021 3:28 PM BST
HF said he would never pay it.
Report Thelastfling May 19, 2021 6:17 PM BST
Finally, this issue has been resolved today! Nigh on 8 months of procrastinating and ignoring emails but i am indebted to those people who suggested emailing the CEO of Flutter. I followed this advice and to be fair he was brilliant. He tweeted me back within 24 hours, said he would look into it and lo and behold within 24 hours the Responsible Gambling team rang me when previously I had been waiting 3 months for that call. He then told me any problems and he would follow it up. Since then they've been in regular touch and today they have finally sorted it and the account is back up and running.

I would suggest to anyone else who is having issues to follow suit and contact the CEO of Flutter via Twitter. Thanks to all those who offered support in the meantime.
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