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john42
09 Feb 19 17:56
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Date Joined: 27 Dec 02
| Topic/replies: 307 | Blogger: john42's blog
have tried all the other main online bookies and basically they are all crap,offer you less than your stake the second you are on regardless of any price movement.
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Report Ramruma February 9, 2019 7:54 PM GMT
I've not studied the matter but my impression is that Bet365's offers are fairer than others I've seen.

But if you wish to make use of this facility on a regular basis, why not just structure your bets differently?
Report impossible123 February 9, 2019 8:13 PM GMT
I like 365. I've been offered 150% of my stake on Battleoverdoyen (20/1), and almost 100% on Angels Breath (12/1); they are the best compare to 'sly and billies' - they've offered nothing.
Report Latalomne February 9, 2019 9:03 PM GMT
You should really balance your book manually.  They cream off more than their (already excessive) over-round if you use the cash-out facility.
Report Latalomne February 9, 2019 9:04 PM GMT
*NB that applies to two-way markets.  Not sure what the situation is with horse racing.
Report themightymac February 10, 2019 12:34 AM GMT
Anybody that uses the cash out option from bookies need to see a "piechiatrist" - they are all rip off merchants.
Report impossible123 February 10, 2019 7:42 AM GMT
Sometimes, esp if one is quick, on a probable non-runner eg Grand National/Lincoln one could still cashout with 365. Here all cashout will be suspended a few days (even months eg 2000G) before event happening or only a fraction of running-on amount; the advantage with a cashout is one does not need to lay out capital (here) to achieve the near/same result.

So far can never have a cashout with 'sly or billies'.
Report twizzle22 February 10, 2019 9:33 AM GMT
I can confirm 365 are the Rolls Royce of cash out offers.That said the mighty mac is correct on his analysis of the cash out function.
Report john42 February 10, 2019 11:26 AM GMT
RAMRUNA...sadly they have restricted me to £1 or £2 bets..
Report john42 February 10, 2019 11:29 AM GMT
LATOLMNE...theres no way b365 can be fauted in my view,ive tried all the others and thyre rubbish,i think paddy power actually offered me less money despite the price dropping and even when it didnt drop they still offered me less...I had a great second income going i just need to find somewhere that does a fair cash out.
Report john42 February 10, 2019 11:30 AM GMT
THEMIGHTYMAC..why lol i can only go by the way i was using it and i was making between £30 and £100 a day and that was mainly because b365 offers on their cash out.
Report john42 February 10, 2019 11:33 AM GMT
twizzle you may be correctbut as i said for what i was doing it was amazing,i couldnt actually believe i could do it,but now im ****e* im trying to adapt things but its not quite as straight forward and a bit more risk involved.
Report liberator of the oppressed February 10, 2019 11:33 AM GMT
Not that I would usually cash out however Wullies are a joke like their web site. How do they keep customers? Page flicks from old to new looks like it is on overload.
Report Latalomne February 10, 2019 11:38 AM GMT

Feb 10, 2019 -- 11:29AM, john42 wrote:


LATOLMNE...theres no way b365 can be fauted in my view,ive tried all the others and thyre rubbish,i think paddy power actually offered me less money despite the price dropping and even when it didnt drop they still offered me less...I had a great second income going i just need to find somewhere that does a fair cash out.


You need to work out the maths to do it yourself.  From what I can see, 365 takes an extra 5% above and beyond their current market value of the bet (ie what you would get if you placed the opposite bet to your original one - again, in a two-way market) when you hit the cashout button. 

Cashout is an absolute LICENCE TO PRINT for the bookies.

Report john42 February 10, 2019 1:11 PM GMT
yeh i am trying to adapt it latalomne,im glad to say it was a license to print money for me,but the bookies dont like that so they reastricted me to peanuts.
Report Latalomne February 10, 2019 1:18 PM GMT
That's not because of Cashout, John.  That's because you're finding value to begin with. 

By cashing out, you are giving a load of that value away.
Report Nonaynever February 10, 2019 1:25 PM GMT
This is slightly off subject, but I've had poker issues with Betfair and B365 over the last couple of days. If anyone on here is a poker player you'll know that for 3 days now it's been impossible to move money to your poker wallet. I've been on to Betfair about it numerous times and they're responses have been poor at best. I had a problem with the downloading of the B365 poker software and to say they were brilliant would be an understatement.

B365 service 11/10
Betfair service 1/10
Report john42 February 10, 2019 1:32 PM GMT
LAT i would normally totally agree but with the strategy i was using it was very very good,as i say i am trying to adapt it,im just finding it frustrating lookingat whats happenning in the market on b365 thinking how much money i could be making.
Report john42 February 10, 2019 1:33 PM GMT
i can t give b365 any good ratings for customer service im afraid the B******s restricted me to peanuts.
Report fife February 10, 2019 2:38 PM GMT
I know this is a slightly different scenario but twice last year I overstaked fcs with b365 when my keyboard got stuck Blush once for £44 instead of £4 and both times I managed to get through to customer services who agreed to cancel the bet without any quibbleLove. Both times the bet went down thankfully though I know someone is going to say how did I manage to get a £44 bet on with them in the 1st place Blush
Report dambuster February 10, 2019 3:04 PM GMT
I've backed the wrong horse twice with 365, and each time i cashed out for the same stake, other firms keep between 10-20%
Report Senyatta February 10, 2019 4:53 PM GMT
bet365 reserves the right to remove all or part of the Cash Out feature for any customer or group of customers where it has reasonable grounds to believe that the customer or group of customers is misusing Cash Out by frequently using the feature to take advantage of pre-event price movements and closing their bets through the Cash Out feature before the event has started.
Report john42 February 10, 2019 5:05 PM GMT
obviously im not going to stick up for them as theyve restricted me,but ive looked around all the main bookies,and they are the only firm worth betting with on cash out,paddy power and ladbrokes did it,but especially ladbrokes the second your bet is on they offer you less than your stake even if the price stays the same.
Report john42 February 10, 2019 5:07 PM GMT
if you back something with b365 and the price comes in they are really good at offering you more than your stake,although i can only talk about the market iwas backing im not sure about other sports.
Report dambuster February 10, 2019 5:11 PM GMT
Shame they don't hold there prices anymore from 8.30am, hopefully they will bring it back for cheltenham
Report Senyatta February 10, 2019 5:18 PM GMT
William hill offer 95% of your stake back. if you have 100 euro on something the offer will always be 95 euro unless the odds change against you

i had a 365 account closed after 2 bets after using a friend's name. new ip address new everyhting(excpet laptop)after i was restricted for winning on a particular casino game that pays generously and still does.  they are ruthless with spotting linked accounts or betting patterns. ig anyone is able to run a b365 multiple account for more than 3 weeks they are very clever indeed.
Report dambuster February 10, 2019 5:24 PM GMT
365 have a purge every now and then,me and a few mates had accs with them, we all got closed within 48 hours after having our accs for a few months. and none of us backed the same horses, we all made a profit tho
Report dambuster February 10, 2019 5:26 PM GMT
i genuine believe, if you had 365,sporting bet 888 and unibet accounts that were never closed or restricted, you could make a living
Report chavman February 10, 2019 5:44 PM GMT
likewise,if you could unicycle with 50 bricks on your head,365 would pay you 500 quid a week each for you and your mates
Report mouse muldoon February 10, 2019 5:45 PM GMT
Stewy can only do 10 bricks.
Report chavman February 10, 2019 5:46 PM GMT
in fact theyre that determined to operate a negative business model theyll buy you and your mates a house in hawaii each
Report freddiewilliams February 10, 2019 6:22 PM GMT
Dam......I've got 2 of all them...show me the way
Report TheGoddess February 10, 2019 8:19 PM GMT
Cash Out - Invented by bookmakers for the benefit of bookmakers!!

Preys on the vulnerable - end of!!
Report ItsMeSwaddle February 10, 2019 8:34 PM GMT

Feb 10, 2019 -- 8:19PM, TheGoddess wrote:


Cash Out - Invented by bookmakers for the benefit of bookmakers!!Preys on the vulnerable - end of!!


Couldn't of summed it up any better,

If they were making cash in the first place, they aint gunna give any back.

Im heavily involved in 3-4 industries... and gambling by far is the most straight forward but the public just dont see it "its a mugs game" - well yeah it is, because anyone with a clue cant get a bean on with these mugs its laughable.

Report john42 February 10, 2019 10:11 PM GMT
tell me how do the pros get money on or is it all BS
Report ItsMeSwaddle February 10, 2019 10:21 PM GMT

Feb 10, 2019 -- 10:11PM, john42 wrote:


tell me how do the pros get money on or is it all BS


John i'm not someone who is going to make something up but we all have presumptions.

Im saying the only way that a "pro" can get something on is with a special arrangement, applying to the gambling stables too.

For instance feed them with info and they will lay you a bet to x liability, because a) it might not win b)i tll save them money long term in the market.

If the event is big enough id believe within reason you can pretty much get what you like on @ the course.

Sorry to use a forumite as an example but if you see Burkey posting £300 here and there with the likes of PP, i dont know how much he is losing, but its not a presumption, its a FACT he isnt winning.

Report john42 February 10, 2019 10:48 PM GMT
ok fair enough itsmeswaddle,seems ive wsated 40 years of my life trying to find something to make a living from,when i finally do it,the bookies just turn ound and say,sorry its a traders decision and your restricted.
Report ItsMeSwaddle February 10, 2019 11:12 PM GMT

Feb 10, 2019 -- 10:48PM, john42 wrote:


ok fair enough itsmeswaddle,seems ive wsated 40 years of my life trying to find something to make a living from,when i finally do it,the bookies just turn ound and say,sorry its a traders decision and your restricted.


Theres no easy solution to be fair mate, the exchange offers easy arbitrage opportunity, so for example people grinding away at low stakes poker for a living, can just arb on the bookies instead, hence the banning, in surprised their isn't more arbing between your every day none punter, but GAMBLING must still be seen as a dirty word.

Ill be interested to see how gambling evolves post FOBT ban or amendment, probably very minimal change but we will see.

I feel your pain though, best advice that i can give is, every account you get closed, give yourself a pat on the back, its obvious you've got a clue, see it as a minor win.

Report john42 February 10, 2019 11:50 PM GMT
thanks itsmeswaddle,yeh inside im pretty pleased that i have them beat.even if it dosent make me much money lol
Report bettysboy February 11, 2019 11:24 AM GMT
Last year B365 estimated that cash outs had increased their net profits by 15% for the 2017 financial year
Report john42 February 11, 2019 1:01 PM GMT
bettysboy lol well b365 cash out increased my profits by a lot more than that last month.
Report bettysboy February 11, 2019 6:21 PM GMT
I also use cash out to good effect, decision making is key however you try to make profit
Report bettysboy February 11, 2019 6:23 PM GMT
but you have to use it selectively and timing is key - I don't use it before the action has started and tend to use it on smaller stake multiples
Report liberator of the oppressed February 11, 2019 8:29 PM GMT
B365 are simply light years ahead of everybody site is ding dong i'm appreciative they look after me might be losing account who cares I like abet like most on here contrast that to PP Laddies and Wullies goodness me. Had lucky bet Lads cannot get on nicked price dogs Paddies £0.00 and Wullies site is for intellectual stragglers with space goggles man.
Report john42 February 11, 2019 9:03 PM GMT
everything i did on cash out was pre race...a knowledge of the market helps but to be honest i have never made easier money in my life,pretty much no risk of any losses,if there was no such thing as restrictions or bans i would have been able to give up my job and earn a pretty good wage,and i never thought id say that as ive always preferred the security of a job.
Report glentoby February 11, 2019 9:18 PM GMT
Is this an episode of One Flew Over The Cuckoos Nest,the new game show on Rai 2? A cross between Fantasy Island and Pricewise,the script being written in Jaywick jointly between Fraudy and Zodiac?

Swaddle is the only one who has posted any sense or have I missed something?
Report glentoby February 11, 2019 9:19 PM GMT
i.e.....you place a bet say £!0.....you cash out and get your £10 back or less?Surprised
Report Hibore February 11, 2019 9:21 PM GMT
365 are by far the best bookie for cash outs. But only when you want to remove horses from your portfolio.

I’ve cashed out on likely non runners ( Lah Ti Dar) springs to mind when drifting to 10/1 + on here and cashed out four figures. Recently cashed out Mengli Khan at 14/1 only losing small percentage. It’s 33/1 on here so no brainer.
Report glentoby February 11, 2019 9:27 PM GMT
Even moneytree could not make any sense out of this. NAP
Report john42 February 11, 2019 9:33 PM GMT
glentoby yes with every other bookie ive tried thtas what happens,but if you make the correct selection b365 give you a profit or stays the same 99% of bets.
Report john42 February 11, 2019 9:35 PM GMT
as i say hibore obviously this is not on every selection i have been doing it in one particular market,made £750 in 1 month and theyve restricted me to £1 and £2 bets.
Report glentoby February 11, 2019 9:41 PM GMT
I must be thick if I do not see the profit in cash out with B363,forget the rest.The strategy seems back to lay i.e arbing?
Report Hibore February 11, 2019 9:52 PM GMT
I’ve over £1500 tied up in 364. I won’t cash out my Too Darn Hot or Native River bets but cash out horses I don’t want anymore. That is the point of cash out. If the odds on Betfair are 33/1 I and I’m on at 14/1 and can cash out even for a small loss then it makes sense.

Hills and Betfair have restricted me in the last year and I’ve won triple with 364. Doesn’t make sense really.
Report glentoby February 11, 2019 10:08 PM GMT
£1,500 liability to them hibore or £1,500 you have invested?
Report ribero1 February 11, 2019 10:23 PM GMT
Few months ago rang my pal to back a horse with them the night before,we had 75 ew 16/1 he rang me in the morning to say its now 25/1 but I can cash out for a tenner,so we did and had the bet at 25s,horse finished unplaced at 9/2,couple of weeks later we took advantage of their place offer on the Cambridgeshire backing Mordin at 25s I think finished 2nd.
Couple of weeks later they closed his account although he will comfortably have been a loser with them.
Report Hibore February 11, 2019 10:26 PM GMT
Liability / profit. Too Darn Hot @ 20/1 is a 3.2 /1 cash out so not an option but lots at Cheltenham that I’ll drop before the first race.
Report glentoby February 11, 2019 10:30 PM GMT
My thoughts exactly ribero,I have 23 accounts with them among people I use currently,in total 167 over a couple of years.Same with most books and majority are closed a soon as a profit is obtained,over as short a period as 2 weeks,with 363 they do not close the accounts but restrict to a max 10p or 50p.
Report mouse muldoon February 11, 2019 10:31 PM GMT
Knowing that they're going to be giving themselves plenty of extra juice with their cash out offers, why wouldn't you just lay off on the exchange instead?
Report ribero1 February 11, 2019 10:33 PM GMT
Think they are far and away the best but they make you these very good offers and if you take advantage they close you unfortunately.
Report ItsMeSwaddle February 11, 2019 10:35 PM GMT
Glen nice work with the amount of accounts.

Shows you how silly the industry can be.

Mouse you’d think wouldn’t you, but a friend proved to me that their cash out more or less always beats the 5 percent commission or implied loser commission. It makes no sense I’d agree.
Report glentoby February 11, 2019 10:36 PM GMT
So what is your original stake hibore? I have cashed out over £50 k on multiples in 2 years but original stakes are less than £1k spread accross many accounts,their liabilities only £600k in total and twice had I left it to run would have netted far more.

Those i did not cash out restricted to 50p max and some 10p so do not see your logic yet?
Report glentoby February 11, 2019 10:41 PM GMT
Many may have forgotten but Skinto used to regularly put a horse up the night before,invariably with 363 being out of line by a few points.9 times out of 10 the price collapsed within a few hours of the forum sticking on £5 and £10s?
Report Hibore February 11, 2019 11:00 PM GMT
My investment is £6k currently with £5k for Cheltenham (£5.5k cash out on all selections) had some big hits with Summerville Boy and Samcro before NRNB.

My flat portfolio is a bit healthier with Too Darn Hot at 20/1 the main standout.

Cashing out Mengli Khan, Pym, Might Bite, Vision Dhonneur for a small loss when backed at shorter odds and they have blown out in trials is a great option for me.
Report glentoby February 12, 2019 12:27 AM GMT
Hibore you said you had £1,500 tied up with them?
Report Hibore February 12, 2019 7:35 AM GMT
£1500 cashout profit/margin tied up in cashout if I cashed out everything. Paisley Park at 10/1, City Island 25/1 and Native River 9/1. But pointless cashing out as cashout offer isn’t worth considering.

Too Darn Hot 20/1 is offering 3.2/1 cashout so again just have sit and wait.
Report Burkey1885 February 12, 2019 9:12 AM GMT

Feb 10, 2019 -- 5:05PM, john42 wrote:


obviously im not going to stick up for them as theyve restricted me,but ive looked around all the main bookies,and they are the only firm worth betting with on cash out,paddy power and ladbrokes did it,but especially ladbrokes the second your bet is on they offer you less than your stake even if the price stays the same.


100 % correct  I had a bet £400 at 2-1
Horse went 6/4. Cheekie bar stewards offering
£385 cash out before race !  One good thing about
Bet 365 u get bog on American racing very few do this

Report impossible123 February 12, 2019 9:46 AM GMT
365 are offering 86% and 133% more on Angels Breath (12/1) and Battleoverdoyen (20/1) respectively - a partial cashout is available too. How can that be bad if one fancies that?

On the other hand 'sports' are only offering 20% more on Lalor (8/1) and Sir Erec (5/2), and suspended cashout on Too Darn Hot (4/1) for the 2000G; regards Sly, Billies and others I've never been offered a cashout at all.
Report Hibore February 12, 2019 10:13 AM GMT
I used to lay on here if I want to "take a position" on a horse and cover my stake rather than use their cashout. The problem is that ties up lots of cash for weeks or months. You make more money that way but having hundreds of pounds sitting idle is not my cup of tea.
Report impossible123 February 12, 2019 10:17 AM GMT
Indeed. It ties up capital unnecessarily for some time. I do not bet with 365 to arb, but their cashout is a useful facility/tool if needed, esp if there is an uncertainty about their participation.
Report john42 February 12, 2019 11:07 AM GMT
glentoby,no need to arb with b365 cash out,i started doing that then realised i didnt need to touch my betfair account.
Burkey spot on mate.
Some big amounts being mentioned on here dont know how you get away with it,my £750 a month is peanuts,makes me even more pissed off to be honest.
i didnt think they would restrict me on the amount i was betting,i did think theyd block my cash out option though or start offering me less like lads,i can tell you 100% if you know what to look for and where to look for it you can make a lot of money,its just how long they let you get away with it.
Report Ramruma February 12, 2019 6:25 PM GMT
No criticism of anyone intended but this is why we can't have nice things.

Or rather, it is why the £10 Saturday punter can't have nice things. Any concession the bookies make, any generosity, is immediately exploited by the sharks for much larger sums than intended. To be clear, I'm not blaming people, or shedding tears for bookies making billions. But it's a thing.
Report john42 February 12, 2019 6:32 PM GMT
dont think thats fair,im not saying the everyday punter shouldnt have nice things,everyone should be able to look forward to a nice win,and i wouldnt stop you,But they are stopping me,i wasnt in any way making a fortune,just a nice monthly amount,i work nights and would have been nice to earn a bit extra monthly so i can afford a nice car,or take the wife out now and again,i would be quite happy if they set a reasonable limit i could win, even a a couple of hundred a month.
what was i supposed to do think oh no i cant win that much,poor b365,its not a concession,they offer this cash out to everyone,yourself included,its just i new the right selections to back to take advantage of it.
Report Ramruma February 12, 2019 6:35 PM GMT
I'm not blaming you or anyone else. Just saying it's a fact of life.
Report john42 February 12, 2019 6:37 PM GMT
ok fair enough ramruna sorry.
Report themightymac February 12, 2019 7:35 PM GMT
THEMIGHTYMAC..why lol i can only go by the way i was using it and i was making between £30 and £100 a day and that was mainly because b365 offers on their cash out.

John42 - I am not doubting your word but if you are making between £30 and £100 a day using "Cash Out" then you would be making £150 to £500 a day laying off winning bets on BF instead.

I`ll give you an example: 4 teams up on Saturday afternoon and waiting on Man Utd (at home) in the evening match for a £50 accum which pays £600. Utd go one up, go 1/14 in play and you are offered a £500 cash out. On BF you can lay them at 1/10 so who in their right mind would sacrifice £100 of their winnings giving the bookie 1/5 on a 1/14 shot when they could lay Utd at 1/10 for £600 costing them £60 of their potential win instead of £100?

It is really Simple Arithmetic. Cash Out is a complete rip off and the only people who get value are the said bookies that are offering Cash Out. Lay off on BF if your last team are winning.

365 may indeed be the best of the bunch but they are all rip off merchants. A guy in the pub on Sunday had a tenner on 12 teams with 356. 10 had won and he was waiting on Benfica 1/8 and Seville 4/6 for a return of £220 for his tenner. Guess how much he was offered by 653 when Benfica were up 4-0 and Seville 0-0 early first half?

...... £19.80p LaughLaugh
Report 11kv February 12, 2019 7:57 PM GMT
Did he take it ?
Report john42 February 12, 2019 8:09 PM GMT
themightymac...i really dont need to get into it that deep..what i do is very simple to be honest,i was making between £30 and £100 a day,dont need to make it up lol,it dosent matter hat anyone thinks anyway,i only came on here and asked about cash out.
Report john42 February 12, 2019 8:14 PM GMT
i startedusing betfair in conjunction with cash out but in the end i didnt really need to.
Report themightymac February 12, 2019 9:02 PM GMT
11kv - He was going to but I said to him let it go and if they don`t win I`ll give you £19.80 but if they win, you buy the drink the rest of the night LaughLaugh

John42 - I believe you. Good luck whatever you do.
Report john42 February 12, 2019 9:08 PM GMT
thanks themightymac,i do understand what you mean,and you are correct,basically im just trying to say that by knowing the correct selection to back you can simply use b365 cashout on its own and wina decent sum,thats until they restrict you of course.
Report john42 February 13, 2019 6:22 PM GMT
some nice profits on b365 cash out to be made tonight,made some peanuts on my restricted today as i was sitting at home trying to find a way round it.
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