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workrider
19 Feb 17 18:38
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Date Joined: 29 Jun 02
| Topic/replies: 31,736 | Blogger: workrider's blog
The jockeys in the 4.10 today should have they're riding fee given to a Charity,a absolute disgraceful sight in any race never mind a G2 . I was watching from the stands and counted that doing into the last fence in the back straight the other runners were 12 secs at least behind the winner . Now you don't have to have a clock in your head to know you're WAY out of your ground, what happened today @ Navan put a slur on Irish racing imo. I left the track having made my opinion know to a steward. I'll find it hard to place a bet on Irish racing or even to defend it the next time someone mentions that Irish racing is not clean.

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Replies: 124
By:
Thegamestraightlol
When: 19 Feb 17 18:47
Agree was not pretty watching even from a novice - sad for racing.
By:
CheltenhamRoar
When: 19 Feb 17 18:49
Don't know why we even bother, it will be swept under the carpet and forgotten about after 2 days as usual
By:
1st time poster
When: 19 Feb 17 19:00
easily solved ban all the horses behind from running for 60 days ,trainers ,owners will make sure it doesnt happen in future
By:
sparrow
When: 19 Feb 17 19:06
19/02/2017    Navan    030E Ten Up Novice S'chase
B.J. Geraghty, rider of Anibale Fly (FR) trained by A.J.Martin, reported to the Clerk of Scales that his mount made mistakes and struggled from 5 out.
By:
onlooker
When: 19 Feb 17 19:07
Navan (IRE) Result
19 Feb 2017
« 4:10 » Ten Up Novice Chase (Grade 2)

   
HORSE/SP     AGE     WGT     TRAINER/JOCKEY     OR     TS     RPR     RATED     

«     1         Acapella Bourgeois (FR) 7/2     7     11-3      Ms Sandra Hughes     143     —     —     —    
    Roger Loughran
     
Made all, well clear after 4th, still going well and in command before 3 out, very easily (op 4/1)
    

8 ran TIME 6m 37.30s (slow by 50.30s)
    ANALYSIS
 
Opinions will be mixed about how impressive the winner was and whether he was just afforded too long a lead, but one would have to be impressed by the way he galloped and jumped.

ACAPELLA BOURGEOIS set out in front, gradually extended his lead to unassailable proportions, and was further clear at the line than at any other point in the race.
If you take it at face value it was a spectacular performance, and it is probably safe to take it that way more than the other.
He had more or less everything off the bridle before the end of the back straight, nothing made any impression.
The way his ears were pricked coming to the final fence showed how much he had left.
Conditions were perfect for him and this was a telling example of what he can do. He is going to be interesting as times goes on.


QUOTES The ground is a big key to him; he just goes on really testing ground and his jumping was superb. After that we will travel to Cheltenham for the RSA and if the ground came up soft he will take his chance - Sandra Hughes, trainer of Acapella Bourgeois.
---------------

However - By Racing Post STANDARD TIME comparisons ...

This WAS the Slowest run race of the meeting.

Make of that what you will.
By:
1st time poster
When: 19 Feb 17 19:10
he did make mistakes but was 50lgth behind at the time,they,ll probably all want dropping in the handicap as well, Laugh
By:
blackbarn
When: 19 Feb 17 19:23
Onlooker - Re the RP times. Are you sure?  I make this race some 11% slower than standard, with race 3 nearly 12% slower and race 1 just over 14% slower.  Did I miscalculate?, or misunderstand the data.
By:
blackbarn
When: 19 Feb 17 19:25
I know, I miscalculatedBlushBlush
By:
onlooker
When: 19 Feb 17 19:40
blackbarn - What's a few  percentage points - over 3 miles, run in 6 minutes 37 seconds - between friends? Grin

Seriously, though - I both understand and appreciate your point of taking the Race comparisons further, by breaking them down into race distance percentages.

I merely posted the Standard times (Total race time) comparison - in order to show that, contrary to the visual impression, the impressive winner did not, necessarily, run the other runners off their feet' - by comparison to the other races.

However - Racing Post Standard Time comparisons do, I agree, only paint a basic picture.

- and, as you will well know from my posts over the years, I am far from being a fan of 'the clock' - most especially over the Jumps, and also when academic thinking types like Willo try to convert such fractions into minutiae, and then make inflated 'form' claims, based upon their intricate analysis.... which then rarely  work out when forwarded to the real world of punting.
By:
differentdrum
When: 19 Feb 17 20:48
Workrider, did the Steward reply?

1st Time Poster, why would you penalise the horses? Isn't that just a cop out? It is jocks who didn't bother to put the horses in the race. Ban them for a month. I think missing Cheltenham might make them think twice about totally ignoring a runaway leader.

Can't believe people are actually discussing the merit of the race. It wasn't a race, it was just a solo.
By:
lewisham ranger
When: 19 Feb 17 20:50
everyone will be piling this into cheltenham like it's the biggest certainty since pegasus, when it gets lapped there will be a few heads being scratched Laugh
By:
workrider
When: 19 Feb 17 21:17
Barry made the mistake imo not the horse, I was thinking to myself, surely they have to go after this lad,but one by one they don't let him get on with it.No doubt the same people will be telling us how wonderful the jockeys are come Cheltenham. I left the track straight after that race fuming,I had 150e on the fav @ 6/4 so not a huge bet by any standards,but I'd have been better off putting a match to it and kept myself warm for a couple of seconds.I am seriously thinking of not having another bet on Irish racing . I was embarrassed by what I saw today,and I'll be unable too defend Irish racing after that shambles. I'm even hoping Smith puts Irish horses UP a few pounds more.
By:
Captain Christy
When: 19 Feb 17 21:48
It certainly didnt look unexpected, there was plenty of money for the winner pre race, went off 2nd fav, but not in top 3 on timeform
By:
workrider
When: 19 Feb 17 21:53
C.C. The winner was sure to improve for the step up in trip,also loves the ground so I have no qualms about him winning ,it was what went on behind that shames Irish racing.I won't be investing my money in it for awhile and if others did the same they might do something about it .
By:
TheFear
When: 19 Feb 17 22:13
once the winner got away it was very hard to peg him back because he was in a great rhythym
By:
Bigwillystyle
When: 19 Feb 17 22:13
Wonks would you ever cop yourself on! winner got an easy lead on ground he loves. If it were my horse in the chasing pack I would have shot the jockey if he had tried to close the gap from 5 out when they had no chance of doing so and giving it a hard race. With the exception of Road to Respect the rest finished legless.
As for the Fav, you are around long enough to know not to back one of Tony's in that sort of a race. Not because it wasn't off but the way he trains his horses they need to be brought into the race gradually and as such as much more suited to handicaps.
By:
Steamship
When: 19 Feb 17 22:19
I'm just watching the racing now and saw the headline of the thread without opening it. After a few fences I knew it would be this race. How have these jockeys not got a ban?
By:
workrider
When: 19 Feb 17 22:26
Wille, ffs cope on yourself, the winner won a 7,000 beginners race the last day, A.Fly won a G3. He has won on soft and heavy,was proven over the distance, yet today he couldn't lay up at any stage . What happened today was a blight on Irish racing,we deserve all the slagging the English give us after that debacle .
By:
Breedingmad
When: 19 Feb 17 22:29
Didn't look that bad to me, the winner got into a rhythm the others thought it would come back it didn't..
By:
workrider
When: 19 Feb 17 22:39
Breeding,the winner would have enjoyed the step up in trip no doubt.Every horse behind was also in a rhythm,its called reverse.Fly had won over the trip on similar going, he had no problem keeping tabs on horses in a better class race the last day, yet today he was 20 lts off the winner having jumped 2 fences.
By:
bigmart
When: 19 Feb 17 22:45
must be the worst advertisement for the integrity  irish racing
make no mistake no other country in the world  would let this happen
they made zero attempt to close this leader lets face it it was the 2nd fav not some 50s chance
it was gifted the race it had dodgy written all over it the untouchables
clear up again !
By:
Breedingmad
When: 19 Feb 17 22:53
"He's got loads of options. We'll sit down, get over today and have a think about where we're going to go."

Asked if she could have a potential Gold Cup horse on her hands, Hughes added: "Possibly. He's very, very good. We knew that when he went chasing he'd show how good he was. Whatever he did last year was going to be a bonus.

"He's from a real staying pedigree and his run in the three-miler at Punchestown last year was a very good run.

"He stays all day."

Perhaps youre not giving the winner enough credit.Wink
By:
bigmart
When: 19 Feb 17 22:57
Anabale fly the 6/4 fav beat 124 len  winner ran to its standard form on my calculations the fly has ran some 30 stone below its ave form LaughLaughLaugh
By:
bigmart
When: 19 Feb 17 22:58
gold cup LaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaugh
a could run faster than that breeding
By:
bigmart
When: 19 Feb 17 23:06
on a serious note breeding that family line seam to thrive on heavy going


Sire comment 1m3f German Group 2 winner as 3yo; sires high-class NH horses; sire of Sprinter Sacre
By:
Breedingmad
When: 19 Feb 17 23:10
Anabale fly the 6/4 fav beat 124 lenLaugh Try 48 1/2 lemgthsLaugh
By:
bigmart
When: 19 Feb 17 23:14
a let me explain i had calculated its race times and in my opinion it ran 124 len below form
slowest time of the day lets be honest looked like a few where in on this scam
By:
Breedingmad
When: 19 Feb 17 23:16
So if it had run to form it would have won by 75 1/2 lengthsLaugh
By:
bigmart
When: 19 Feb 17 23:20
am messing if u look at form it is about on a par with the winner on a line through bellshill
but jockey made zero attempt on the fav you get a dour stayer put it to the front and just sit back and do nothing easy money that about sums up what happend here today
By:
bigmart
When: 19 Feb 17 23:24
no wander work rider was angry if they are getting away with this in grade 2 races, god help   the rest of irish racing this horse was not just afforded an easy lead it looked arranged to me as the rest sat motionless
By:
Breedingmad
When: 19 Feb 17 23:29
If you look at the time of previous races in the same race on heavy it was pretty fast faster than anything in 10 years.
By:
everton1978
When: 19 Feb 17 23:36
Where in it's previous form does it confirm this horse is a 'dour stayer'? As far as I can see it had run once over 3 miles, weakening slightly on the run in.  We see front runners like this all the time and the majority of them come back. Yes, we found this horses optimum conditions today and it may turn out we've got a grand national winner on our hands, but there was no guarantee he was staying there today. The only horse to remotely go after it finished legless and the second pretty much confirmed their hurdles form.
By:
bigmart
When: 19 Feb 17 23:37
and why is it over 50 sec slower than standard even accounting for heavy ground that's not graded class times , i personally think given soft of heavy ground it cd be a grand national type but the h. capper will murder it now
By:
firstimevisor
When: 19 Feb 17 23:44
Everton is spot on here. Haymount, the first horse to come under a ride, was legless from some way out yet still held on for third having looked like being completely swallowed up by the pack. If they had gone after the winner from the outset then most of them would have pulled up and we'd have the same runaway winner.
By:
bigmart
When: 19 Feb 17 23:49
i never said anything wd have beat the winner its a not got a turn of foot it jumps well and gallops beat mostly not staying types today form is nothing special
By:
cloone river
When: 19 Feb 17 23:51
7.94 secs faster on todays going.
By:
bigmart
When: 19 Feb 17 23:55
but they seam to have found the key to it ,front running and plenty cut suits just gallops and gallops
but not a grade 1 horse imo
By:
bigmart
When: 19 Feb 17 23:56
cloone river 19 Feb 17 23:51 Joined: 23 Dec 04 | Topic/replies: 198 | Blogger: cloone river's blog
7.94 secs faster on todays going. faster than what ?
By:
bigmart
When: 20 Feb 17 00:04
horse has not peaked give it another year it might but long way to go cant take anything away from its win but most horses never stayed and the fav did not lift a leg  , ran of a mark of 157  it cd well progress but its not a fast horse deffo much better when mud is flying
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