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02 Sep 12 08:20
Date Joined: 25 Sep 02
| Topic/replies: 2,598 | Blogger: seaside's blog
% that Betfair take is to high to beat
I used to play poker years and years ago where they would take money out of the pot every hand.
The only people who had any money at the end of the game was the house.
Betfair do every thing they can to get turnover up, its all up hill as you can see very little money in markets early
It takes time but punters get there in the end when they see they are backing winners but there balance is not going up.
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Report wee eck September 2, 2012 10:11 AM BST
seaside the law of diminishing returns must eventually prevail,

the house finish up as the only winners, one must have a decided

edge to last on here. Commission should be no higher than 1% and

layers,who really are a million, should pay nothing.
Report salmon spray September 2, 2012 10:51 AM BST
You can't expect Betfair to run the site for nothing. Actually we know some people must have won a lot on here as the PC Pt2 only applies to people who have won £250k. Assuming something like roulette isn't **** then if you play often enough you will inevitably lose as there is no skill involved.
Report salmon spray September 2, 2012 10:52 AM BST
Oh ffs. r igg ed
Report wee eck September 2, 2012 10:58 AM BST
salmon, let me assure you this is from betfair themselves "most of the pc payers are

lifetime winners of between £12000 and £15000"
Report salmon spray September 2, 2012 11:07 AM BST
There are two levels wee eck. The 20% which they introduced first was always a bit vague as to how it worked. It`s possible the figure is true for that. They then introduced a further charge between 40 and 60% which they DEFINITELY said would only apply to winners of £250k and I am sure I saw somewhere that affected a number in 3 figures. Personally I would settle for winning £250k but I have other income. I can see the problem if you really are a PRO as obviously £250k would hardly give a living wage over 20 years say.
Report wee eck September 2, 2012 11:15 AM BST
salmon, agreed, but the pc for these small winners is outrageous and shows

what a greedy grasping outfit this firm has turned out to be.
Report salmon spray September 2, 2012 11:34 AM BST
Tbh wee eck I am definitely a recreational punter and not that good a one,but my lifetime winnings are getting close to the figure you have quoted. I have never payed the PC but I still pay 4.8% commission. I have never been below 4.7%. That has something to do with the way I bet but not that much.
I obviously would be quite happy to pay 4% on whatever I made and see the PC abolished. I thought Betfair floated that idea and some of the big players seem to have said they didxn't like that at all.
Report judorick September 2, 2012 11:57 AM BST
my net lifetime is +£96k approx

but I am mainly a backer so I have paid £38k in commission and that means my commission paid is high enough to avoid PC

so it is possible to win and not pay the charge
Report wee eck September 2, 2012 12:04 PM BST
judorick you have paid I believe 39.5 % of you winnings in commission and charges

which is with the perimeters that betfair have set.
Report wee eck September 2, 2012 12:07 PM BST
judorick just noticed your joining date so imo you are as safe as houses in not paying pc in the forceeable future
Report salmon spray September 2, 2012 12:09 PM BST
I`m really not sure how it works tbh. I know you can make a HUGE profit and not pay PC as long as your turnover is much much HUGER. I`ve never really worked out whether it is better to be a backer or a layer or whether it makes no difference.
I am sure you CAN win on here at 5% commission or nearly that. I have managed it overall ( I`ve had my ups and downs but I've always been up after the first 6 weeks ) despite a terrible lack of discipline at times. The point is you are using skill not only to pick what you bet on but also to get the best price you can. If I started having to pay PC I would consider my position as I doubt I could stay in profit,but I'm sure some people do.
Report wee eck September 2, 2012 12:10 PM BST
salmon if you have never paid earlier you are safe. The new rule is that you must

have won £250000 nett to qualify, it is those who caught caught in the 60 week

rolling period who are suffering.
Report salmon spray September 2, 2012 12:12 PM BST
Oh right. I don't think I am in much danger then         Grin
Report zipper September 2, 2012 12:24 PM BST
Years ago it was 10% on all winning bets  on and off course
the Pros  still made big money so todays 5% is a walk in the park and that is made up of  you can get bigger prices on here backing  any horse .. go outside the front 3 or 4  in the betting  and you can get much  much  bigger prices .
Report wee eck September 2, 2012 12:25 PM BST
zipper as far as I am aware the tax on course was never ever 10%.
Report onlooker September 2, 2012 12:33 PM BST
zipper     02 Sep 12 12:24 
Years ago it was 10% on all winning bets  on and off course

But how many were betting 'tax free' with 'moodys' -

and 'Privately' - three strides away from the Rails.
Report tinkler September 2, 2012 3:46 PM BST
Surely some company is going to offer a better product than Betfair. To take 5% for offering very little leaves them wide open long time. Somehing thats not been thought of will come along offering 1-2 % commission within the next 10 years imo.
Possibly bets being left on twitter pages  ,with a simple intermediary closing the deal.
Report seaside September 2, 2012 3:59 PM BST

Betfair shares will keep on going down in spite of all there efforts to go into lots of markets and get new punters

They came up with the P.C charge thinking it would make them a lot of money.

This was not thought through.

It puts a cap on big players playing because they will not play if they think they might have to pay the P.C

I am not going to tell Betfair what to do because when ever I have told people what they need to do I have never been thanked.
Report gravytrain September 2, 2012 8:53 PM BST
It is easily possible to win with 5% comission, if you have a 10% edge and enough volume it is inevitable..
Report GT-MOLE September 2, 2012 8:57 PM BST
Seaside,Dave Nevison says you were the worst poker player he ever met,reckoned the only card game you ever won was playing snap against a bloke with a bad stutter.Laugh
Report racingstar September 2, 2012 9:05 PM BST
How many people have been driven from this Site by PC ?
Report GT-MOLE September 2, 2012 9:23 PM BST
The only PC seaside ever had to worry about came with a Sergeant as a sidekick.Tongue Out
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