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bazzar
29 Aug 11 10:16
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Date Joined: 17 Mar 05
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Anybody know when weights are published, please?

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Replies: 211
By:
ForceMajeure
When: 29 Aug 11 12:44
........NOPE.

Hope that helps! Grin
By:
Anaglogs Daughter
When: 29 Aug 11 12:59
Nominations close Thursday(Wednesday night here) So they should be out by friday
By:
bazzar
When: 29 Aug 11 13:29
Thank you Anaglogs, up yours FORCE IMBECILE.
By:
rhinestone
When: 29 Aug 11 14:47
Anyone heard anything on Rite of Passage? On at huge odds but not seen anything about him. Confused
By:
The Big O
When: 30 Aug 11 03:25
Weights for the Caulfield Cup are out, Melb Cup not till mid September
By:
Mooono
When: 30 Aug 11 05:08
This time last year i was feeling jiggy about my bets on Linton & So You Think both at big prices..That all ended in tears Cry..Whos everyone backing this year...Ive had a long shot punt on both Ellison runners at mahooosive prices..There both 100% being aimed at the race and heading out on sept22 alot worse bets than to back these to beautys at 120/1 +...Hes had sick sick luck in the past with his runners so hope this year can be a change...Also backing Linton again because im a mug and always follow this horse Love
By:
ForceMajeure
When: 30 Aug 11 10:58
The big money has come for Lucas Cranach if your talking about the European horses.

Im interested in the Japanese horses but many of them are in France for the ARC ATM so im not sure they will be coming this year.
By:
Anaglogs Daughter
When: 30 Aug 11 13:46
racingpost.com


REIGNING Melbourne Cup champion Americain could have a lead-up run in the Caulfield Cup after he received top weight for that race.

Racing Victoria's chief handicapper Greg Carpenter gave the French star 58kg (9st 2lb), up 3.5kg (7lb) for his Melbourne Cup victory, when weights were released on Tuesday for the $2.5 million Caulfield Cup on October 15.

"The intention is for Americain to have one lead-up race in Australia on the way to the Melbourne Cup and it is up to the Melbourne Racing Club to convince connections that he should be in the Caulfield Cup," Carpenter said.

"The other race Americain could contest is the Cox Plate, but the advantage of running in the Caulfield Cup is that he would have an extra week to recover before running in the Melbourne Cup 17 days later."

The Cox Plate is run on October 22 and the Melbourne Cup onNovember 1.

Carpenter said if Americain won the Caulfield Cup, connections could expect a Melbourne Cup penalty of around a kilogram (2lb).

Prepared by Alain de Royer-Dupre, seven-year-old Americain is the second-highest rated stayer in the world in 2011.

Viewed was the most recent Melbourne Cup winner to return the following year and win the Caulfield Cup.

He did so in 2009 with 57kg (8st 13lb) having been penalised four kilograms (9lb) for his Melbourne Cup victory.

Americain, who arrives in Australia on September 24, will need to emulate West Australian star Northerly who was the last horse to carry 58kg (9st 2lb) to victory in the Caulfield Cup in 2002.

Defending Caulfield Cup champion Descarado, one of 12 Gai Waterhouse-trained entries in this year's race, received 56kg (8st 12lb) having carried 52.5kg (8st 4lb) to victory in the race last year.

"I have effectively penalised Descarado two kilograms (4lb) for his victory in last year's race," Carpenter said.

"The other 1.5kg (3lb) increase is for his progression on the weight-for-age scale from a four to five-year-old."

History, as well as an increased weight, will test Descarado if he pursues a title defence, with Rising Fast (1954-55) and Poseidon (1906-07) the only horses toclaim successive Caulfield Cups.

Completing the top five weighted horses are the Brian Meehan-trained US Breeders' Cup winner Dangerous Midge (57.5kg) (9st 1lb), 2007 Melbourne Cup winner Efficient (57kg) (8st 13lb) and Japanese stayer Meiner Kitz (56kg) (8st 12lb) who is unlikely to make the trip.

German horse Lucas Cranach, who has been well supported in both the Caulfield and Melbourne Cups and will be trained by Anthony Freedman, received 53.5kg (8st 6lb).

Tactician, owned by The Queen and trained in the UK by Michael Bell, received 53kg (8st 5lb) - the same weight as another Ebor Handicap runner-up, Carte Diamond, did in 2005.

Melbourne Cup entries close on Thursday with weights released on September 13
By:
bazzar
When: 30 Aug 11 13:58
Thank you both big o and anaglogs, used to back anaglogs daughter when she was in her pomp, happy memories.
By:
Anaglogs Daughter
When: 01 Sep 11 10:26
Godophin has entered Lost In The Moment and Cavalryman in Australia’s biggest race, the Group One Emirates Melbourne Cup.

The two-mile contest is the world’s richest handicap with total prize money of AUS$ 6.175 million and this year’s race takes place at Flemington racecourse on Tuesday, November 1.

Both Godolphin contenders are trained by Saeed bin Suroor and consistent four-year-old Lost In The Moment has produced a string of excellent efforts this term, including when going down by a head to Opinion Poll in the Group Two Artemis Goodwood Cup over two miles at Glorious Goodwood at the end of July.

Five-year-old Cavalryman, a Group One winner over a mile and a half in France in 2009, made seven consecutive appearances in Group One company last term and was third in both the Gran Premio del Jockey Club and the Grosser Mercedes-Benz Preis Von Baden.

Godolphin has been second in the Emirates Melbourne Cup on three occasions with Central Park (1999), Give The Slip (2001) and Crime Scene (2009).
By:
bazzar
When: 01 Sep 11 10:46
A VERY bad ride in the Ebor by Dettori, could be explained by the CUP entry.
By:
Anaglogs Daughter
When: 01 Sep 11 13:21
racingpost.com

Luca Cumani holds four entries in a bid to win the Melbourne Cup for the first time as a list of 163 acceptors for the great race was published on Thursday.
 
Cumani has gone agonisingly close in the Group 1 contest in the past with Purple Moon and Bauer, who both tasted narrow defeats in 2007 and 2008 respectively, and he could rely on Glorious Goodwood winner Drunken Sailor to end his hoodoo.

Manighar, who was seventh in the race last year, Bauer and four-year-old Sahara Sun could also represent Cumani in the line-up.

Three-time runner-up Saeed Bin Suroor could run Lost In The Moment, who was beaten a head by stablemate Opinion Poll in the Goodwood Cup in July, and former Group 1 winner Cavalryman as owners Godolphin chase their first win in Aus$6.2million contest.

Moyenne Corniche, winner of the Betfred Ebor at York last month, could again lock horns with stablemate and Ebor fifth Saptapadi as trainer Brian Ellison plans a joint raid down under.

Other notable entries from Britain are Modun, trained by Sir Michael Stoute and a gallant fourth in the Ebor, and Group 3 winner Meeznah, who could be trainer David Lanigan's first runner in the race.

The Mark Johnston-trained pair Jukebox Jury and Fox Hunt have also been given entries, as have Breeders' Cup Turf winner Dangerous Midge and the Ed Dunlop-trained Red Cadeaux.

Ireland could be represented by the Jessica Harrington-trained Bob Le Beau as well as Galileo's Choice and Sense Of Purpose, both trained by Dermot Weld who won the race in 2002 with Media Puzzle.

Last season's winner Americain also features in the list of entries in his bid for a repeat success and trainer Bart Cummins is responsible for five entries as he chases his 13th win in 'the race that stops a nation'.

The weights for the race, which takes place at Flemington on November 2, will be declared on September 13.
By:
Anaglogs Daughter
When: 04 Sep 11 14:48
BAUER, the 2008 Melbourne Cup runner-up, has earned yet another shot at the world's richest handicap race after registering his first victory in nearly three years with a boilover win at Haydock in Britain at the weekend.
Bauer, now a nine-year-old by Australian time, earned a spot in the quarantine yard alongside fellow Melbourne-bound horses from the Luca Cumani stable in Manighar, Drunken Sailor and former Chilean galloper Sahara Sun when he powered home late to win over 2800 metres.
Terry Henderson's syndicate OTI Racing is a part-owner of the grey galloper, who missed winning the 2008 Melbourne Cup by a nose when Viewed beat him.

He said Bauer was booked to join his stablemates in quarantine on Friday and then on the Melbourne-bound plane on September 22.
But he conceded the horse still had much to do. ''That form from 2008 has all lapsed now so he has to re-qualify for the Melbourne Cup and unfortunately last night's race did not do that,'' Henderson said. ''That means we'll have to go back to the Geelong Cup (which Bauer won in 2008) to try to earn his spot.
''We were delighted with his effort. He looked like the Bauer of old the way he ran home.''
Henderson said Manighar and Drunken Sailor were likely to run in the Caulfield Cup on their way to the Melbourne Cup while emerging former Chilean horse Sahara Sun gets his chance to earn a trip when he makes his debut for the Cumani stable at Doncaster in England on Wednesday night.
''He's shaping along quite well and if he shows us his class, then the Cox Plate might come into focus for him,'' he said.
Also over the weekend in Europe, Melbourne Cup entrant Modun might have attracted the eyes of influential Australian owners with his win, for trainer Michael Stoute, at group 3 level over 2400 metres at Kempton.
It is understood a sale of the horse could be completed at the weekend with the son of King's Best likely to be flown to Australia later this month.


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/sport/horseracing/oldtimer-bauer-earns-another-shot-at-cup-20110904-1js9e.html#ixzz1Wzlp8wsX
By:
johnnyrant
When: 04 Sep 11 16:11
Great find Anaglogs - this goes further than RP quotes at Haydock yesterday in which the owner did not confirm Bauer would be travelling back to Oz for another tilt at the MC.
Surprised he has to re-qualify. I backed Bauer to win the Geelong Cup in 2008, and then e/w in the MC. I'll be doing the same again. On good ground or faster, Bauer is tailor-made for the MC, and has the potential to go very close in the race again - off the potential GB contenders for MC, Bauer is the horse I would give the strongest chance to.
Don't forget, that was only his 2nd race back, and that was a v. competitive staying handicap yesterday. He's still quite lightly raced. I don't see his age as any sort of disadvantage.
By:
EastLower Gooner
When: 04 Sep 11 16:23
whose this galileo's choice I'm hearing about now????

I've heard this will go close.

cavalryman - LOOOOOOL.
By:
bazzar
When: 05 Sep 11 08:26
What's the story about DECEMBER DRAW, last ran at Goodwood 2010,
yet favourite for the cup?
By:
DoesntMatter
When: 05 Sep 11 11:43
December Draw has run three times in Aus for three wins and a 2nd, showing progressive form.

On Saturday he won a 2000m h'cap @ Caulfield in undeniably impressive fashion.

But ... weighted as he is on 50Kg for the C Cup, realistically he needs to win one of the races which exempt the winner from any qualification/ballotting clause(s). To that end D Draw will run in the G3 Naturalism Stakes @ Caulfield in a fortnight (2000m h'cap).

Accordingly, if you are betting him to win the C Cup, you are effectively betting the Naturalism x Cup double. Which at about 12/1 on here is not for me.
By:
DoesntMatter
When: 05 Sep 11 11:44
four times, sorry (!)

+ first Caulfield reference should read Flemington
By:
bazzar
When: 05 Sep 11 11:53
I made the mistake of expecting the RACING POST site to keep results up to date, but  I remember a few years ago I corrected a time for an American horse race, whereby I e-mailed the racecourse involved and they informed me that the clock had broken down with a furlong to go, the horse had done a 10 furlong time equivalent to 9 furlongs and would have been a WORLD record for that distance.
To give the Racing Post their due they thanked me for the correction.
By:
bazzar
When: 05 Sep 11 12:42
A belated thanks DOESEN'TMATTER, forgetting my manners.
By:
Anaglogs Daughter
When: 06 Sep 11 18:54
GALILEO'S CHOICE is "highly unlikely" to try to qualify for the Emirates Melbourne Cup according to Dermot Weld after the trainer learnt on Tuesday that the five-year-old would not pass the first ballot for the race. 
Owned by Michael Smurfit, Galileo's Choice wonthe Group 3 Kilternan Stakes at Leopardstown on Saturday but the race distance of 1m2f was not sufficient to ensure automatic inclusion in the Melbourne Cup field, for which weights will be published on Monday for the November 1 contest.

To survive the first ballot for the race, requirements are for a horse to have won a Listed race or be placed in the first three in a Group 2/Group 3 or to have finished in the first five of a Group 1 over a distance of 1m3½f or further in all three cases.

Weld, who has trained two Melbourne Cup winners in Vintage Crop and Media Puzzle, said: "It looks as if we are pretty well stymied.

"The Melbourne Cup conditions are extremely complex and I've been informed that Galileo's Choice, despite winning a conditions race over an extended two miles and a Group 3 over 1m2f in recent weeks, will not survive the first ballot.

"It's very frustrating. It is about time they had a good look at the qualifying conditions for the race and simplified things a bit. It makes little sense that a Listed-race winner over just short of 1m4f is guaranteed a run whereas a Group winner over 1m2f is not."

Galileo's Choice's Leopardstown win renders him ineligible for the Listed Ladbrokes Listowel Stakes on September 14 as that 1m4f event excludes Group winners.

"It is highly unlikely that we will try and qualify Galileo's Choice at this stage as it doesn't really look practical to do so, " Weld said.
By:
johnnyrant
When: 06 Sep 11 20:42
Can someone please clarify the MC rules regarding qualification for the race? I've read Bauer will have to run in the Geelong Cup, again, to qualify. Does that mean he will have to win the Geelong Cup to get into the MC, or finish in the first 3 in the Geelong Cup, or what?
And if you back Bauer for the MC and he fails to qualify for the race, by failing to win or be placed in the Geelong Cup (or whatever he needs to do there), would that make him a void bet (ie, AP stake returned) or would you lose your stake?
MC qualification seems very convoluted and not sure if it's the equivalent of being balloted out when horses do not reach qualification criteria...?
Thanks in advance.
By:
Anaglogs Daughter
When: 06 Sep 11 21:00
Qualifying and race conditions

The race is a quality handicap for horses 3 years old and over, run over a distance of 3,200 metres, on the first Tuesday in November at Flemington Racecourse. The minimum handicap weight is 49 kg. There is no maximum weight, but the top allocated weight must not be less than 57 kg. The weight allocated to each horse is declared by the VRC Handicapper in early September.

The Melbourne Cup race is a handicap contest in which the weight of the jockey and riding gear is adjusted with ballast to a nominated figure. Older horses carry more weight than younger ones, and weights are adjusted further according to the horse's previous results.

Weight were theoretically calculated to give each horse an equal winning chance in the past, but in recent years the rules were adjusted to a "quality handicap" formula where superior horses are given less severe weight penalties than under pure handicap rules.

[edit] Weight penalties

After the declaration of weights for the Melbourne Cup, the winner of any handicap flat race of the advertised value of A$55,000 or over to the winner, or an internationally recognised Listed, Group, or Graded handicap flat race, shall carry such additional weight (if any), for each win, as the VRC Handicapper shall determine.

[edit] Fees

Entries for the Melbourne Cup usually close during the first week of August. The initial entry fee is $600 per horse. Around 300 to 400 horses are nominated each year, but the final field is limited to 24 starters. Following the allocation of weights, the owner of each horse must on four occasions before the race in November, declare the horse as an acceptor and pay a fee. First acceptance is $960, second acceptance is $1,450 and third acceptance is $2,420. The final acceptance fee, on the Saturday prior to the race, is $45,375. Should a horse be balloted out of the final field, the final declaration fee is refunded.

[edit] Balloting conditions

The race Directors retain the absolute discretion to exclude any horse from the race, or exempt any horse from the ballot on the race, but in order to reduce the field to the safety limit of 24, horses are balloted out based on a number of factors which include:
prizemoney earned in the previous two years,
wins or placings in certain lead-up races
allocated handicap weight

The winner of the following races are exempt from any ballot:[1][2]
Lexus Stakes (formerly Saab Quality and registered as The Hotham Handicap)
Victoria Derby
LKS Mackinnon Stakes
Cox Plate
Caulfield Cup
Doncaster Cup (UK)
Irish St. Leger (IRE)
Tenno Sho (Spring) (JPN)
Sankei Sho All Comers (JPN)
Arlington Million (USA)
San Juan Capistrano Handicap (USA)
Australian Stayers Challenge[3]
By:
johnnyrant
When: 06 Sep 11 21:35
Thanks Anaglogs but still don't get the whole Geelong Cup scenario re. Bauer.
By:
Far From Trouble
When: 06 Sep 11 23:30
SAHARA SUN, one of Cumani's entries out Doncaster 4.20 today

Chilean import, group 2 winner down there and second in a group 1 on his last start

Not sure about the quality of their racing though Laugh

Interesting entry nonetheless, giving weight all round
By:
DoesntMatter
When: 07 Sep 11 04:17
johnnyrant - if you back Bauer and he doesn't get in the race, you won't get your money back.

The Cup conditions are comparatively complex, but not to the extent that should have confused D Weld as to what was required to pass the first elimination clause (ie form over 2300m or further) ...

The excerpt pasted above seems to be from the 2010 conditions.

A complete current version can be found here http://www.racingvictoria.net.au/asset/cms/pdf/Melbourne%20Cup%202011%20all%20conditions.pdf
By:
johnnyrant
When: 07 Sep 11 10:01
But does Bauer have to win the Geelong Cup to qualify for the race? Or can he finish first 3? Is it purely cos he needs to get extra weight from winning the GC to get into the MC?
By:
EastLower Gooner
When: 07 Sep 11 18:20
Ive located the winner and backed accordingly.

MIDAS TOUCH.

Now owned in a syndicate led by the great Lloyd Williams (won the Melbourne Cup 3 times in the past....last time with the Derby winner Efficient in 2007). Think this is significant. also he's being trained accordingly...very smart run last time when stepped up to 1mile. These guys know whats required. I think he will be trained to the minute for Flemington and have the required class and stamina on the day.
By:
DoesntMatter
When: 08 Sep 11 02:42
What Bauer needs to do to qualify for the Melbourne Cup is:
either:-
win won of the races which exempts its winner from any ballot (Irish St Leger, Caulfield Cup, Cox Plate, Mackinnon, Lexus), none of which seem on the radar
or:-
pass what is described as the first elimination clause by, for example, winning or finishing 2nd or 3rd, in a group race over 2300M or further (such as the Geelong Cup, a 2400M G3), and then survive the ballot which, broadly, eliminates the lowest weighted horses as in the UK, until the final field of 24 is set.
By:
SergeantMarcel
When: 08 Sep 11 14:14
Any hope of Meeznah being sent over for the cup? was an impressive win
By:
johnnyrant
When: 09 Sep 11 15:20
Thanks DoesntMatter
By:
johnnyrant
When: 09 Sep 11 15:33
Surely if Bauer is placed in the Geelong Cup but still does not get into the race because he isn't high enough in the handicap, that would be the equivalent of being balloted out, and as such the bet would be void...?
By:
Untitled
When: 09 Sep 11 15:42
basically any bet on any horse that doesn't make the final field of 24 is lost
By:
ta1
When: 10 Sep 11 12:32
why would anyone lay in the market johnnyrant. if thats what you think???
everyhorse that doesnt qualify bet void.. there would not be antepost on this event............
By:
ta1
When: 11 Sep 11 10:17
anyone know if Modun has been purchashed yet by Australian interests?

Also Jukebox is possibly purchashed aswell??
By:
johnnyrant
When: 11 Sep 11 12:06
Like any other race, here in the UK. Horses don't run for various reasons but when they are entered in a handicap, and are declared, but don't get into the race because they are below the last spot in a maximum field, the bet is declared void.
By:
Anaglogs Daughter
When: 12 Sep 11 11:14
Ed Dunlop been interviewed on Australian's Sport Nation at midnight tonight. http://www.radiosportnat.com.au/
By:
ta1
When: 12 Sep 11 22:30
some of Jukebox has been purchased.
By:
bazzar
When: 13 Sep 11 04:51
How can we view the weights for cup, tried to have bet yesterday,
but betting suspended until weights published?
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