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14 Apr 16 11:00
Date Joined: 12 Apr 04
| Topic/replies: 10,341 | Blogger: kincsem's blog
Spieth and his playing partners in the US Masters

Round 1: Spieth 66; Casey 69; DeChambeau 72
Round 2: Spieth 74; Casey 77; DeChambeau 72
Round 2: Spieth 73; McIlroy 77
Round 4: Spieth 73; Kaufman 81

Are his playing partners affected by his slow play?
Should they send him out with a marker so pros do not have to suffer his painfully slow routines?
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Report callitasucit April 14, 2016 11:28 AM BST
The above could hardly act as any sort of evidence though.

Kaufman was always likely to struggle in the circumstances.

Rory has never ever had a good round at Augusta under pressure, when it really counted.

His two partners for the first two rounds, were a 66-1 shot and a 300-1 shot who were both very much un contention after them two rounds.
Report kincsem April 14, 2016 12:10 PM BST
I might do a bit of analysis on this.
You point out that Spieth was lower odds / high partners were higher odds.
That is probably because Spieth is a better player and likely to score lower.
But if he is causing six players to play worse than they would normally would I would like to know.
I'll try to replace opinions with facts (yes/no).
He did upset Paul Casey on the 14th (?) in round 3 by swinging a club when Casey was playing, and by standing in front of him (further up the course in his line of sight).
Report Knight Rider April 14, 2016 2:30 PM BST
Casey shot the fourth best score of the day in R1.  DeChambeau's two rounds of level par were surely better than expected from an amateur!  So out of the 6 rounds, three were better than expected and three were worse than expected.
Report Total Bosman April 14, 2016 3:42 PM BST
I think a bit much is being made of the slow play thing right now.  It's probably down to the advent of all the featured group bonus coverage, meaning we get to see the whole routines of some guys, and how laborious they can be, but I'm sure it's nothing new for their playing partners, who are pros, and should be able to handle it. 

And the featured group thing disproportionately emphasises the big names and how long they take - does, say, Daniel Summerhays take ages?  No idea, because at most we'll see him hit a few shots if he ever gets in contention.

And, to be honest, even if Spieth and Day take a bit longer to figure out each shot, you can't deny the results- it's a game of thinking and we all want to see great shots.  Rory never gets accused of slow play, but he does get accused of poor course management and making big mistakes through a lack of focus, so maybe sometimes he plays too quickly.  If the guys who take their time end up hitting fewer shots than the guys who try to race round it'll surely balance out anyway.
Report donny osmond April 14, 2016 4:40 PM BST
cameras dont need to show all of the preparation to hit shot
its not as if they dont have facilities to edit stuff

as long as they stride out between shots then taking a couple of minutes is fine
Report geordie1956 April 14, 2016 7:03 PM BST
shouldn't take 5 hours+ to play a round of golf & tv companies do have schedules - they piper pays the money so calls the tune

players have to be penalised in terms of shots if this continues as fines of 2, 5 or even 10K and more are irrelevant
Report callitasucit April 14, 2016 7:19 PM BST
Kingscem, Spieths relative talent or SP had nothing to do with my comment.

You suggested his slow play hindered his playing partners at Augusta.

You wanted facts. Well the fact is Casey had a cracking first round. For one of his SP, it can be upgraded. Likewise Dechambeau. Casey had a poor second round, but history would suggest this had far more to with Casey **** himself from an elevated position, rather than laying the blame at the door of a plating partner he had played so well with 24 hours earlier.

Dechambeau again produced.

Look through all of Rory's rounds at Augusta. Find one where he is really in d mix, and he produced. Not his typical running on 67s when it's all over. Rory performed to type on Saturday. Nothing to do with Jordan pace of play. His putting maybe, his pace of play, no.

Kaufman has never been in that position before. No doubt it will stand him in good stead. Watching Jordan down the back 9 of a major should also help.

It wouldn't see the courtroom King, and that's a fact
Report Mighty Whites 2008 April 14, 2016 9:00 PM BST
I tend to agree with TB here. It is a bigger issue if a player is constantly out of place but generally they are not.
Report Total Bosman April 14, 2016 9:14 PM BST
This nonsense with Villegas is backing the whole field up, same with Zach earlier.  Surely a bigger contribution to the length of round than individual players pre-shot routines.
Report Mighty Whites 2008 April 14, 2016 9:15 PM BST
dont think villegas understood what they were saying
Report kincsem April 15, 2016 4:16 AM BST
I said "I might do a bit of analysis on this".
A few scores in the Masters is not enough.
It is enough for an idea, not for a conclusion.

The PGA Tour website keeps scores for past events and also the tee times.
I only checked one tournament for tee times.  I hope they keep them for all tournaments.
A big file of scores and tee times would be needed to see if there is anything in the idea.
I'm not just talking about Spieth.
It would be interesting to me to see if there is a relationship between pairings and better than expected scores / worse than expected.
This is not a stat I expect the PGA Tour will produce. Plain

The variance might not be down to slow play.  Some players might not do well paired with big hitters, players who draw / fade the ball.
In the back of my mind is something about Matt Kucher's father being a bit of a pain at tournaments years ago.  He may have caddied for a while. 
I think he was a very vocal cheerleader for his son (as caddy or spectator) and that may have put players off their game.
Report trebor April 15, 2016 10:03 AM BST
You can get the pairings info from Tour Tips, plus how the weather can have an influence on different players.
Type of course in regards to hilly or flat I don't think is on there but does make a difference, but nowadays if a player does not like a course they just miss the tournament more than they used too, unless it is a big event.

Kind of on this topic there has only ever been one type of match bet that I have ever done, that was to back a player the week or sometimes the next round (would normally be the 4th round) after he had been paired with Tiger for the first time, very often a player playing with Tiger would not do too good in that game, but the feel good factor of playing with the best player in the world would seem to elevate their game for a while.
Report El Bandido April 15, 2016 10:14 AM BST
Has Spieth always been a slow player? I seem to remember at the Open last year, Alliss was praising him for playing at a good pace.

As for the analysis you're planning, kincsem, good luck with that! I'd be very surprised if there was any significant effect there.
Report bigH April 15, 2016 1:33 PM BST
Slow play????

Have you ever watched womens golf? an absolute pisstake

90%  of then can't even line themselves up - need caddie to check everything
Report crystalhunt April 15, 2016 11:06 PM BST
Given that Speith is a robot he has no control over the speed of play.
Report padlock April 18, 2016 3:47 PM BST
Should ban caddy help on putts imo
Report Joconnor April 18, 2016 4:19 PM BST
I've just written this blog about slow play in both pro and amateur golf:
Report NORTH BERWICK April 18, 2016 8:30 PM BST
Its very tricky. I hate it when i feel im being pressured from behind on the golf course and feel im having to rush. You like to play at a certain pace and you get stressed out if your rushing and youve got virtually  no chance of playing anywhere near your best. Also you get wound up if your waiting on every shot and again your golf will suffer. I imagine its the same for the Pros.
Report brain dead jockeys April 18, 2016 8:36 PM BST
speith has developed a twitchy pre shot routine........he reaches for the towel now like the tennis players before every shot.
Report NORTH BERWICK April 18, 2016 9:16 PM BST
The twitchiest pre shot routine ever has to be Howard Clark. He would grab his trousers near his kneecap about 10 times before every shot !
Report sickoflayinwinners April 25, 2016 9:04 PM BST
ken brown took an age to play bless him.
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 10, 2019 4:11 PM BST
Would it be a good idea for the MASTERS COMPETITION Committee to put all the slow players out last.....NA (if playing), Day, JB, Spieth, Furyk (if playing), Bradley, Langer, etc... might show them up !
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