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brain dead jockeys
01 Apr 16 20:45
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Date Joined: 14 Jun 05
| Topic/replies: 4,832 | Blogger: brain dead jockeys's blog
his pre shot routine where he stands a few meters behind the ball and stares straight ahead nearly closing his eyes is time consuming and patethic. he does this for every tee and approach shot. he takes forever on the greens as well. i dont see too many tv and paper journalists talk about this but that murray guy from sky did say last week "its very difficult to watch"................why is this tolerated? his self indulgence and sense of self importance is beyond the pale. this is an entertainment business and we should not have to put up with it. of course the media in golf never want to rattle the cage since they want to get the interviews afterwards. he is a great player but i wonder about him. all these dramas on the course with slight injuries makes one suspect what kind of guy he really is. he could talk all day about himself...............reminds me of padraig. he is a very slow player also. obsessed about everything.
any thoughts?
Pause Switch to Standard View JASON DAY & slow play
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Report xmoneyx April 1, 2016 9:14 PM BST
slow replys
Report Mighty Whites 2008 April 1, 2016 9:30 PM BST
Day is certainly methodical and into visualisation. He also wears a gadget in his hat that measures his brain activity throughout the round.

It would be better if he was quicker but he is not keegan bradley. As for entertainment value he has provided plenty on was way to winning 6 of his last 13 starts
Report Mighty Whites 2008 April 1, 2016 9:36 PM BST
I think Day comes across well personally. He is overcome adversity and if the story is to be believed was very close to going off the rails. His rise to the top of the game is an uplifting story in my opinion.

I think he is the best player out there he has similar ability to the best attributes of rory and spieth. If any player pulls away from the rest i suspect it will be Day and wouldn't be surprised to see him retain top spot in the rankings for a while.
Report lewisham ranger April 1, 2016 10:46 PM BST
just wonder with Day that it seems like all hard work.

mentally he's ahead of spieth and mcilroy at the moment but I doubt he will dominate over the next few years.

that's because if you look at Spieth he's 22 and has two majors- day is 28 and has one major. Yes Day has improved a lot of late but you'd think Spieth has far from peaked.

I also think with Day it's all hard work and he's flat out all the way- he doesn't back off on any shot. He only has one gear which admittedly is a very good one.

Mcilroy you feel keeps a little bit back for himself and has a bit more natural talent. They both lash at the ball which rather curtailed Tiger's career and you wonder if the same might happen to Day- of course it could happen to Rory also- The fact that Day is already experiencing problems with his back while still in his twenties isn't a good sign. Still he could make hay while the sun shines

Still what Day has done of late is extraordinary. He's striping it down the fairway 330 yards and holing everything. Considering that before this run he was considered one of the nearly men of golf, he's proved his potential and then some.
Report Mighty Whites 2008 April 1, 2016 11:13 PM BST
Im not sure Spieth can get much better than last year His short game was amazing and it is hard to see how it gets better. It is hard to see him adding much distance to improve his game. Last year spieth had a spell where he was putting amazingly well especially in the 20 ft region. When that slips it is impossible to score as well. Putting is ultimately the key. For all of Tiger's great play what separated him from the rest was his putting especially when it mattered.

Day is currently putting well but his big improvement has been his wedge game - he is hitting it close a lot.

McIlroy is great when he is on but his putting is very average for a top player his short game is inferior to both spieth and day. He is also prone to the hook left. I think McIlroy is in some ways similar to the way mickleson was in his prime.
Report brain dead jockeys April 1, 2016 11:26 PM BST
jason day is the 3rd best player i have seen in last 20 years.............tiger the best and rory the second...........day is a much better player than mickelson for example............phil won a lot of pga events but only has 5 majors..........day will get past that no problem.......any of u guys concerned about his slow play?...........its not something that can be glossed over.........he takes forever.
Report xmoneyx April 1, 2016 11:47 PM BST
todays world-----3/4 majors is pretty good?mickleson
Report brain dead jockeys April 1, 2016 11:51 PM BST
mcilroy and day are special players. i fully expect rory to get to 10...........day 7 or 8..............i think day is that good. us masters and british open will be a formality for him next few years the ways hes playing.
Report Mighty Whites 2008 April 2, 2016 8:02 AM BST
Inthe history of the game only 3 players have won more than 9 majors and only 5 have won more than 7.

I doubt Mcilroy and Day will both reach those numbers.
Report Mighty Whites 2008 April 2, 2016 8:06 AM BST
only 13 players have more major wins than phil, only 8 players have more pga tour wins. Considering phil has played through the tiger era his record is very impressive.
Report lewisham ranger April 2, 2016 10:12 AM BST
I agree, won't say I'll be amazed if Rory and Day get to those sort of numbers but I would be surprised

you've got to remember that there's only four majors a year and some very good golfers are going for them

then there's time off, injuries etc. who knows who might emerge in the next four or five years, two years ago we hadn't heard of spieth

speaking of spieth, mighty you say he can't improve much, and his putting can only go downhill. thing is with spieth is he's a big tournament player, his record in the majors last year was fantastic

doubt that will be repeated this year either, doesn't seem in the same form (as yet) but wouldn't be surprised. he just seems different gravy to me in the big ones.

people predicting day will win 7 or 8 majors, come on he's already 28 with back issues and only got 1! if anyone is going to reach double figures in majors out of those three I'd go for spieth

my guess is

spieth 10 majors

rory 7

day 4
Report lewisham ranger April 2, 2016 10:15 AM BST
yeah also to say that day is far better player than philly mick in the last twenty years is a gross exaggeration. people just have short memories and go with what is happening now. day is flavour of the month which is understandable but how long will it last?

saw an interview with spieth before the shell houston and he said that everyone on the tour regards rory as being higher level and phil also- at least with what they've achieved. obviously tiger would come into that category too but out injured
Report therhino April 2, 2016 10:51 AM BST

Apr 1, 2016 -- 3:36PM, Mighty Whites 2008 wrote:


I think Day comes across well personally. He is overcome adversity and if the story is to be believed was very close to going off the rails. His rise to the top of the game is an uplifting story in my opinion. I think he is the best player out there he has similar ability to the best attributes of rory and spieth. If any player pulls away from the rest i suspect it will be Day and wouldn't be surprised to see him retain top spot in the rankings for a while.


Agree Mighty. The biggest obstacle between him and domination is not Rory or Spieth, he is better than both as you say he is a combination of both. His body is the main issue, seems to get sick/injured at the drop of a hat. If he stays healthy there is no one who can go with him in full flight.

Fantastic price for The Masters in my opinion.

Report donny osmond April 2, 2016 12:20 PM BST
tennis has developed an elite group that have farmed their majors
djok, nadal, fed, ( murray)

it could happen in golf and there does appear to be an elite forming

of course tennis is matchplay week on week whereas golf majors are not
Report therhino April 2, 2016 12:55 PM BST
No big major shocks since 2011 Donny. It is happening in golf, though to keep it to such a small group for as long as the big guys in tennis unlikely as you say. Though the big 3 have won 5 of the last 6 between them and weren't far off in the other one as well with Day and Spieth a shot away.

Just seen we have a 24 hour Masters channel in Oz starting Monday. We can relive the final round from 1996 on Monday if we are feeling masochistic CryCrazy
Report donny osmond April 2, 2016 12:59 PM BST
if i got on the plane this afternoon i might just make it in time .....
Report therhino April 2, 2016 1:00 PM BST
Cry
Report Mighty Whites 2008 April 2, 2016 2:23 PM BST
Spieth had a spell last year of a couple of months where he was holing 30% of 15 - 20 footers a round the average was 8% quite simply it is impossible to keep that up. He is obviously a talent but that spell coincided with the majors last year he only has a couple of years playing in them so it will be interesting to see how that pans out over a period of time.

Oosthuizen could easily have won both opens last year remember he started with 77 at chambers bay.

Winning majors is difficult as shown by how few have 5 or more.

The big 3 hype is loved by the media but there many who have a great chance bubba, fowler, scott, D Johnson, Rose, Stenson, Reed, Oosthuizen, before you get to the next tier down not to mention the possibility of an outsider winning, Cabrera, Immelman, Zach Johnson,schwartzel have all won when not particularly fancied. Perry, Campbell, Mattice, Clark, Sneedeker have all had chances as well.
Report Total Bosman April 2, 2016 4:44 PM BST
I tend to agree with MW on most of the above.  Golf is improving at a huge rate - now the Tiger era is over there seems to be a new generation coming through who are talented and unafraid, unlike the old guard who were too used to playing for second place.  Couple of years ago Rory looked set to dominate but now he's playing third fiddle, and on the evidence of the last year deservedly so.  And the next Spieth could come along just as suddenly.  It's going to get harder and harder to win anything and some of the wilder predictions for the current "Big Three" could- a handful of majors is going to be an incredible achievement.  There are going to be so many brilliant players out there that the definition of a brilliant career might need to change.
Report lfc1971 April 2, 2016 5:18 PM BST
Vardon trophy for best average score in a season:

1950 - Sam Snead 69.23
1960 - Billy Casper 69.82
1970 - Lee Trevino 70.64
1980 - Lee Trevino 69.73
1990 - Greg Norman - 69.10
2000 - Tiger Woods - 67.79
2010 - Matt Kuchar - 69.61
2015 - Jordan Spieth - 68.91

This is what golfers scored in 1950, and what they score today. A golfer needed to go round in 70 in 1950 to win majors, and a golfer needs to go round in 70 to win majors in 2016

Thats all, you may feel the depth of players is greater today but the figures tell us they are not better than 50 years ago.
Now, just as then, if you can average 70 in the Masters, or the British Open, or The US Open, or PGA you will win majors.
And the depth of the competition cannot effect that.
Report lfc1971 April 2, 2016 6:44 PM BST
Then again, was Sam Snead a better golfer than Mcilroy or Day or Spieth?
Yes i would say so.
Report lewisham ranger April 2, 2016 7:33 PM BST
Hard to believe that golfers now aren't better than they were 50 years ago- standards go up exponentially in every sport. to say otherwise is just wrong in my opinion.

Mcilroy rather reminds me of O'Sullivan in snooker- prodigiously talented, but doesn't always put it in. However when he's on he's unstoppable.

There have been signs in recent weeks that he has been coming to the boil. could just explode at the masters.
Report lfc1971 April 3, 2016 1:20 AM BST
Golf is different from other sports, it cannot get better. There is one main reason for this, maybe two. The golf swing, and the golf club.

The problem with the golf swing is that it is completely unnatural, and this is magnified by the nature of the golf club itself.

Until someone finds a new way nothing will be revealed, and golfers will continue to fail to master this beautiful game.

That is why no one will ever play better golf than Sam Snead...what exactly do you think Tiger was trying to discover all these years.
Report johnnythebull April 3, 2016 10:27 AM BST
i must concur vis-a-vis Day and his lack of alacrity
was catching up on the World m/play at 6 times speed last w/e and he was STILL taking forever to play
was really annoying me..should be docked shots imho but of course the powers that be won't do that to the top guys
they'll just harp on about how play should be quicker and do sweet FA about the solution which is in their hands
also going to play devil's advocate here and state that the 'big 3's' major haul in,say,the next 3 years will be paltry
Report lewisham ranger April 3, 2016 11:33 AM BST
I'm sorry but all this "it can't get any better" than it was in the 1930's is just a load of old sentimental bull.

all sports improve vastly over the years. In golf they have all kinds of advantages that players from that era didn't have.

I'm not disputing that players like Ben Hogan or Sam Snead didn't have a similar talent level to what the players of today have, what I am saying is that they didn't have access to a huge back up staff, of physios, trainers

they didn't have the equipment that they have today, they don't have all these computers and spreadsheets to help them hit a better shot, it all adds up to a better level of performance.

Add to that knowledge of what has gone before, for example players like Jack, Sevvy and Tiger have added to the knowledge of the game (were players in the 1930s playing the sort of recovery shots from the rough that Tiger did)

And I'm afraid your argument falls flat.

In fact I read a biography of Jack a while back, even from his era standards have improved immensely. He'd be talking about some tournament where he played and shot 74 in the first round, but he'd still be one or two shots back, these days you'd get run over if you posted the sort of numbers they were shooting back then.
Report donny osmond April 3, 2016 12:10 PM BST
golf does improve, theyve had to add length to negate the advantage

as for jack shooting 74 in first round...didnt oosty shoot 77 and nearly win a major last year ?

some things never change
Report Mighty Whites 2008 April 3, 2016 1:49 PM BST
It is impossible to compare the different eras of golf.

You could argue the first players in the 1800s were the most taleneted playing with hickery shafts balls that weren't even round with bunkers that weren't raked and greens cut by sheep grazing!

The vardon scores only show that the average score per year hasn't changed not that the level of difficulty is the same. Last years majors saw record low scores in 2 and that may well have been 3 had they not had to put on a ploughed field at Chambers Bay. Ironically scoring only held up at St Andrews a course that many expected to be destroyed

As Donny says courses have been lengthened but the increase in length probably hasn't kept up with distance.  Augusta for example is only 500 yards longer than it was in 1950. The course was changed after Tiger won in 1997 the so called Tiger proofing.I wonder how often players hit wedges these days compared to say the 50s 60s70s or 80s?

The game has changed in many ways over recent years. The advance in technology in clubs manufacturing has helped players with distance and more forgiving clubs. Players also all have custom fitted equipment and balls aimed at making sure every player gets the most out of their equipment. When Jack Nicklaus used to play abroad he would pick up a different set of clubs each time he traveled.

In some ways courses are harder. Greens are faster and more undulating.

The modern game seems to benefit the big hitters - there ability to take shorter lines and longer forced carries but it is worth noting in 1950s there were big concerns about how far Sam Snead hit the ball.

Whether today's top players are better than in the past is harder to gauge. Has anyone ever had a swing as good as Ben Hogan? Personally i think the greats from each era would have risen to the top whenever they played. None of the current bunch come to close to Tiger, I doubt many will match Vijay or Phil for tour wins. I think the depth in game is deeper now than in the past. Just look at how the gap between the cut and 36 hole leaders has reduced over the years.

Golf is an incredibly difficult sport to retain a consistently high standard there are so many aspects to golf and weakness in one can ruin your game.
Report sewter lives again April 3, 2016 2:40 PM BST
the champions of each era would have been champions whenever.

the old champions with today's equipment and fitness regimes would still be "champions" today

the greatest ever?-Woods for me-a shame we probably wont see if he could have been a champ in his 40s.

As for Jason Day his nickname is "all Day" for a reason
Report JML April 3, 2016 9:29 PM BST
Vardon trophy for best average score in a season:

1950 - Sam Snead 69.23
1960 - Billy Casper 69.82
1970 - Lee Trevino 70.64
1980 - Lee Trevino 69.73
1990 - Greg Norman - 69.10
2000 - Tiger Woods - 67.79
2010 - Matt Kuchar - 69.61
2015 - Jordan Spieth - 68.91

This is what golfers scored in 1950, and what they score today. A golfer needed to go round in 70 in 1950 to win majors, and a golfer needs to go round in 70 to win majors in 2016

Thats all, you may feel the depth of players is greater today but the figures tell us they are not better than 50 years ago.
Now, just as then, if you can average 70 in the Masters, or the British Open, or The US Open, or PGA you will win majors.
And the depth of the competition cannot effect that.


Must be one of the most stupid posts ever,totally ignoring the fact that the courses today are completely different to
what they were in 1950s.
The only thing it proves is how skillful the course designers have been in how they have increased the difficulty of courses over
the years.
Report JML April 3, 2016 9:42 PM BST
Golf is different from other sports, it cannot get better. There is one main reason for this, maybe two. The golf swing, and the golf club.

The problem with the golf swing is that it is completely unnatural, and this is magnified by the nature of the golf club itself.

Until someone finds a new way nothing will be revealed, and golfers will continue to fail to master this beautiful game.

That is why no one will ever play better golf than Sam Snead...what exactly do you think Tiger was trying to discover all these years.



Sam Snead wasn't even the best player of his generation.
Report donny osmond April 3, 2016 9:55 PM BST
snead won a few tournaments and had a wonderful swing, i doubt anybody will ever beat his -12
round of 60 aged 71

his records will take some beating even if some golfers were better than him for a time
Report lfc1971 April 4, 2016 9:56 AM BST
Let me explain the difference between sports that `might` inevitably improve with time and  those that might not.

If a sport relies almost completely on physical strength and fitness and speed, such as running then as the human race becomes fitter and stronger,(this in itself is not inevitable) running times should decrease.

Many sports however require not just physical strength or speed but other attributes more subtle but equally and in some sports of greater importance.

Golf is like this. Because of its high degree of difficulty it is more like an art form than a sport.
None of us would say that the musicians of today are greater than those of the 60s or 70s. Mainly because they are not. It might be more true to say that people can no longer write songs.

This is why it is wrong to assume that golf, and some other of the greatest sports, are inevitable in their progress.
Report lewisham ranger April 4, 2016 10:24 AM BST
it's not more like an art form than a sport though is it. an art form is purely about creating, about giving pleasure to the audience, and it's also an objective thing where people can decide what they think is the best.

in sport it's more about results. and to say that speed and fitness is irrelevant to golf, is clearly wrong based on past events.

for example someone like tiger came along and started ripping it past the opposition. his power enabled him to get himself out of difficult spots with ease.

a lot of his edge was his greater power and strength over the opposition, you'd be wrong to dismiss that.
Report lfc1971 April 4, 2016 10:33 AM BST
In regard to art lewisham, no art is not an objective thing although of course people have different tastes but that is not the same thing.

A masterpiece by Van Gogh will remain a masterpiece even if everyone in the world say it is not. Even if Van Gogh himslfelf said it was not he would be wrong ant the painting would remain a masterpiece.

I agree that speed and power and fitness are important are important in golf. But the problem also with golf is that it is very difficult, and complicated.
So much so that no one really understands it.

It was this quest to understand it that meant that Tiger only won 14 majors instead of maybe 25 that he could have won had he changed nothing after the age of 19.
Report donny osmond April 4, 2016 10:34 AM BST
chess players are still getting better, as outlined above they learn from those that have gone before

standing on the shoulders of giants

there is still plenty of room for innovation in golf
Report lfc1971 April 4, 2016 10:38 AM BST
there has been no greater scientist than Newton.
Report donny osmond April 4, 2016 10:53 AM BST
but newton couldnt work out relativity, nor ring home on his mobile phone
Report lewisham ranger April 4, 2016 11:15 AM BST
if everyone in the whole world says it's not a masterpiece, then how did we come to the conclusion that it was a masterpiece in the first place?

just because it "is"?

you sound like you are just picking an argument for the sake of having an argument.
Report lfc1971 April 4, 2016 2:46 PM BST
lewisham you see to think it matters whether you or i think the painting is a masterpiece or not, and that whether we do or not has any effect on the painting.
It dosn`t.

Just as with a formula by Einstein, a very few people would be able to discover such a thing. Some more on seeing it would be able to understand. Many would be able to understand once it was explained to them. And many would never be able to understand, not really.
Report lewisham ranger April 4, 2016 5:09 PM BST
But a scientific fact is something you can prove definitely or not, whereas whether a painting is a masterpiece or not is purely a subjective opinion.

Anyway I don't even know how I'm getting into this argument on a golf forum! Laugh
Report johnnythebull April 4, 2016 5:09 PM BST
one thing's for sure
as the field's have got more competitive
choking has been taken to the next level
and become,one could argue,an art form
with some peerless exponents vying for the no.1 spotWink
Report lfc1971 April 4, 2016 7:23 PM BST
Back to the OPHappy As regards slow play and annoying mannerisms would it be possible in professional comp. for players to be sent out singly. And to allow overtaking?

Perhaps they could trial this at the Masters, or next years if this is too soon.
Report charwell. April 4, 2016 9:11 PM BST
Jim Furyk must be the most infuriating player to be paired with. Also Ben Crane is like a snail with a bad back.

J Day not too bad speed wise in actual fact.
Report throwthetellyoutawindow April 5, 2016 11:16 PM BST
Modern golf at the elite level is a slow game,get used to it,we want to see the best playing their best so chillax peeps Laugh

However is Furyk still doing that routine on the greens where he sets up and then backs off every putt?? that is annoying.
Report blueton April 6, 2016 8:32 AM BST
if jason day wasnt winning the golfing public would be up in arms...but because he is the best atm he is getting away with it....who remembers sergio 6-7 years back?
Report blueton April 6, 2016 8:33 AM BST
by the way i play golf reglarly...love watching it...jason day is very slow and only a matter of time before something happens about it...imo
Report twizzle22 April 6, 2016 8:58 AM BST
As long as he wins this years Masters the guy and take as looooooooooooooong as he likesGrin
Report blueton April 6, 2016 8:59 AM BST
agreed twizzle...actually think he could do a spieth and runaway witrh it
Report lewisham ranger April 6, 2016 11:11 AM BST
even the darling of the media is ponderously slow at time, often takes an age chatting with his caddie

actually I think with Day eventually he will fade, at the moment he is making hay but it just comes across as tremendous hard work, all this sizing up a shot before playing it also must wear at you mentally overtime, will he have the patience to stick to that routine for the next ten years, I somehow doubt it

Rory more gears
Report lewisham ranger April 6, 2016 11:12 AM BST
should have read even the darling of the media rickie fowler Excited
Report Mighty Whites 2008 April 6, 2016 4:27 PM BST
kevin na and ben crane haven't improved with time.

Think Day is the real deal and will be at the top for a while.

Rory has to sort his putting out if you can't put you won't win. First getting lazer eye surgery was going to sort it then it was cross handed next it will be claw. As Garcia and Westwood have shown it doesn't matter how great you are tee to green you drive for show and putt for dough.
Report lewisham ranger April 6, 2016 6:48 PM BST
yeah but rory too good a player to go the garcia and westwood winless route

he'll be back
Report Mighty Whites 2008 April 10, 2016 6:19 PM BST
Spieth made Day look fast last night. I suspect it did Rory's head in approaching shots backing off deliberating with his caddy it was painful at times.

Could be a long evening with Spieth in the final group and Langer in front of him.

As for Rory and the wind - it blew he back peddled.
Report Injera April 10, 2016 8:36 PM BST
Golf majors remain unique in that there is no draw, unlike tennis or indeed international football.

The latter are dominated by seeding. The competition in golf is ferocious. The fact that Langer can mix it with guys 30 years his junior is extraordinary. Then there's someone like Kaufman (1000s into 15s).

It will be increasingly difficult for the top lads to dominate. Tiger was a freak. Day and Rory are not. Spieth is quite extraordinary though. I wouldn't like to say he will get 10+ majors but I'd be a fool to oppose him at such a young age.

Then there's the other 100 or so who are very gifted and from that number will come many major winners.
Report Catch Me ifyoucan January 5, 2017 7:25 PM GMT
BACK in the news again
Report brain dead jockeys January 5, 2017 7:32 PM GMT
i read some quotes he made this week.............theres an article on the pga website.........." i need to do whats best for me"............which means he thinks he can take as long as he wants
Report lewisham ranger January 5, 2017 8:59 PM GMT
i think spieth is the most likely of those playing now to reach double figures in terms of majors, maybe rory as well

a lot depends on who comes along in the future. over the next 20 years, a significant amount of majors will presumably be won by people we haven't heard of yet.

if a dominant tiger like player comes along that might significantly shorten the number of majors speith/mcilroy/dj/day can win.
Report Mighty Whites 2008 January 5, 2017 10:49 PM GMT
I would be surprised if Spieth won more than Rory, its hard to imagine his putting staying at the level it has been over the last few years. He is currently 2 behind.

Whilst streaky McILroy is for me the most talented player of this generation the two issues for me are his putting and whether he retains the hunger to be the best.
Report lewisham ranger January 5, 2017 10:53 PM GMT
yeah but spieth is also four years younger,

people saying spieth won't win this season before it's even started and putting the boot in. kids a sensation for me, and winning stat not far off tiger at the same age.
Report brain dead jockeys January 5, 2017 11:04 PM GMT
if dustin johnson had speiths commitment he would win two majors a year for next 10 years............the guy can blow courses apart.........there is no one like him in ball striking.......every time a major investor builds a new course hes thinking of dustin
Report lewisham ranger January 6, 2017 4:21 PM GMT
clearly you don't rate spieth... we get it.
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 8, 2017 2:03 PM BST
THE MASTERS - due to the odd number of players making the cut - it means Jason DAY is going out with Augusta member Jeff Knox, who has already beaten McIlroy and Sergio as a marker !
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 11, 2019 11:01 PM BST
NO PLACE FOR Augusta member Jeff Knox this year (with 29 three balls)
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 11, 2019 11:31 PM BST
Pace of play. 4 hours 20 for 14 holes. ........extended TV coverage needed Shocked
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