If the best professional gamblers hope to make 4-6% a year

I think you'll find it's 4-6% of turnover, not of bank.
The more turnover, the greater the total profit.

turnover of 100 million would see you ok, not too hard to achieve

I agree with buzzer.

4/6% where does this figure come from? Veitch claims 16%, Harry F reckons no more than 8%

horse for courses, I am sure there are different ways

But essentially, people who make big money already have big money?

Or is the idea that you land a big acca and take it from there?

I want to be inspired!

I typed out a lovely long reply to this but when I press submit it just goes green and freezes for some reason.  So you'll never hear my fascinating comments on this subject.

Of course, I'm probably wasting my time typing this as it will go green and freeze again won't it...

no, apparently not!  bloody forum.  Is there some sort of character that stops posts going through?  I did use some percentage signs...

copy it in word before you post so at least its still there when this **** forum messes up

Brimson Joined: 09 Jun 04
Replies: 9 15 Jun 10 15:13   
But essentially, people who make big money already have big money?

Or is the idea that you land a big acca and take it from there?

I want to be inspired! 


Start small and build it up. If you're good, it'll build.

Certainly not the second option.

I did copy it at least.  One last try without the per cent signs...

------------------------

Depends what you are backing really doesn't it.  Findlay (as far as I know) is a fan of lumping on short prices, which makes a large ROI pretty much impossible. 

Veitch, according to the part of his book I read before I got bored and shelved it, uses dodgy inside info from trainers etc to back horses in from 33/1 to 11/2 or something ridiculous.  So at prices like that a larger ROI is possible.

I'm sure I could have an ROI of over 10 per cent if I just stuck to backing, say, Golfers over 50/1.  But that would cut out an enormous amount of profitable bets.  Far better to have an ROI of say 6 per cent on turnover of 5m GBP, than an ROI of 12 per cent on turnover of 1m GBP.

As an extreme example, you could be a fast pic merchant hoovering up 1.01 on all the Tennis/Golf/Football etc.  You would never have a losing bet and make a fantastic living from it, but your ROI would only be 1 per cent.

Success!  It was the Pound signs that were the problem I think.  Changed the per cents and it still wouldn't go through, then did one last try changing the pound signs to GBP and it worked.

Thank you Knight Rider.

I had a similar problem with the forum

Lots of articles about Findlay refer to a big break - where he won 11 grand about 20 years ago.

I guess I just always dreamed of being a high roller.

I have a solid-ish job which will never make me rich, but which is quite secure.

I just have to resign myself to another 30 plus years of work and then death.

how much is your bank Brimson?  If you are good enough it doesn't matter where you start.  For example a 500 euro bank, if you could manage 0.5% on average per day it would take around 5 year to hit a million.

I know it sounds impossible but I am just pointing out that the size of your bank shouldn't be an obstacle if your in for the long haul!!!!

I only punt to small stakes.  My bank is 200GBP.

start with that

well to go from 200 euro to 100,000 would take you 1,247 days at an average of 0.5%.

The problem with alot of people is the come on betfair looking for the get rich quick schemce.  It doesn't work like that, its a tough hard slog and then you still might not make it

starting off low lets you make your mistakes without costing you a bomb as well

I read somewhere that only 3% of people on betfair are net winners.

God only knows if that includes me!

if you don't even know whether you are a winner or not, I would suggest you are on the wrong site

Surely a delusion that you're a winner is much more dangerous?

Brimson Joined: 09 Jun 04
Replies: 12 15 Jun 10 16:37 

I just have to resign myself to another 30 plus years of work and then death.


That depressing comment did make me laugh.

You do have the option of stepping out of the dominant culture of resignation and mediocrity.

Brimson will you cry yourself to sleep again tonight?

Possibly, after I get off your mum.

Thanks for your contribution.

How does one step out of a culture?

Brimson:

How does one step out of a culture? 

Free choice?

No, that is why you might choose to do it.

I asked how.

Just get a job Brimson you lazy parasite.

Surely only you can answer that? I was just pointing out that we can make choices. We don't always have to follow what we think is the right thing to do based on previous experiences and outside influences.

I have a job, I just dislike it.

You are a very antagonistic avocado.

Do you think Sport owes you a living?

No, I don't.  What an odd question.

By the way, I don't understand your aggression, but do carry on if you're enjoying yourself.

I know who you are, you're Richard Brimson, the millionaire businessman and owner of Virgin company. You're just pretending to be poor.

I have spent a bit of his money in the past, but he wants it back.  If I don't stump up, I get charged about 18% per month.

Horse Racing is the place to make small, regualr returns.

Not backing them either.

Fixed to kingdom come, the great beauty in BF is the ability to learn the tricks of the trade from certain patters.

I dont just mean drifters, too obvious, and overall... laying drifters and backing steamers does not provide profits either.

There are distinct patterns that can lead to profits if you know what you are doing.

So, I need to watch racing markets and search for patterns?

they're in every market

watch them and try and understand what is happening and why

not sure if they are in every market, but horse racing is a dream.

the most liquid market, and the most bent market.

wonderful.

but it took me nearly 8 years to get a grip of it.

dont expect miracles overnight, i lost close to 200 grand before i got a grip hold.

in pounds?

Jesus.

Those are soe big balls and deep pockets you have.

thats stretched over a few years.

i earnt reasonably well working in the city.

Did you think you knew what you were doing or were you just spraying cash around?

i'm saying the patterns are in every market

Do you watch the event itself or just the market?

I have heard different theories on this.

not interested in the game. not really interested in who's playing either.


only time i get involved in play is when i fancy a punt and thats when im drunk or bored.

i was earning good money, and in my mid reckless 20's, thought i knew it all

and made the cardinal sin of BACKING nags!!!

big mistake, i did not lose money to the market, overall i was robbed by the bent market of horse racing, belive me, dont belive me, but since those silly days, i have done well enough to schmooze with certain smaller type owners and my worst fears about the insustry have always been 100% confirmed. 

we all know it, its not a myth, so i then realised where i was goign wrong, thinking i could spend hours reading form etc, only for a horse running its last maiden before a handicap rating etc etc far more examples around...

then i started to sod the studying of formlines, and begin the studying of market movements, and having a background in trading FX certainly helped.

i profit from theft bascially.

i will back the odd horse in a big race, big prize money, at least you will get a run.

today i had a little nibble on the hannon runner up in the st james, did not win, but i got my run.

who were you before you got banned?

not reg'd a forum name on main account, never really got into the whole banter of this place.

read plenty of threads mind you, back in the days of jonjo and warrack hunt et al

this is a new account i opened just to punt a little on footy and get involved with the pissh taking banter.

we believe you

rocket, i see the patterns, in the horse racing markets, due to the bentness of the game, and they are clever how they usually do it day to day, until a mug gets hold of a tip and takes out a price from 5's to 10's inside 15 mins.

not sure if the same BENT patterns could be seen in all markets.

that would mean all sports are bent.

rocket - that's cool fella, far too relaxed to bite, we can all pretend to be whoever we want on a forum, and we can all choose to belive whoever we want.

no great shakes really, cos when we all log off, the real world kicks in and reality bites[:x]

So, you're suggesting that the smaller races are bent?  Surely not the bigger races?

use your common sense mate.

why fix to do feck all with a decent horse you have entered in the Derby?

comprende?

Yes, sorry.

One last question - and I'm being sincere - do you enjoy winning now?  Or do you wish you had never not involved?

that is actually a wonderful question.

i am honestly not sure yet... if i can keep my edge paying out for another 5 years, it will have definately of been worth it.

but you just never know when things change.

so far so good.

there are still patterns valero, bent or not

Valero
Joined: 06 May 10
Replies: 614 15 Jun 10 21:12   
rocket - that's cool fella, far too relaxed to bite, we can all pretend to be whoever we want on a forum, and we can all choose to belive whoever we want.

no great shakes really, cos when we all log off, the real world kicks in and reality bites 


true

cool, good luck to you rocket, hope those patterns pay you.

I feel more comfortable losing generally.  Winning makes me feel at best cold, and at worst annoyed that my initial position wasn't more aggressive.

I am a Sunderland fan.  There was a fanzine a while back - I hope it is still going - called "It's the hope I can't stand".

I feel that about gambling, really.

wouldnt take it any further then if thats how you feel

100000% STOP betfair if that is your true feelings, you will bankrupt yourself with such limiting beliefs.

you have geared your brain to make you lose at all costs... because like all humans.. you want to feel good... and you feel good when you lose.

just stop it mate.

I would rather change the beliefs!

Perhaps I need a break though.

seek out NLP training, you may thank me one day.

what sports do you play?

brimson, sorry

HE'S A SNIDE, HE'S A GRASS, HE'S AN INSIDER!

evening, kieron

valero can i have your msn please

Valero Joined: 06 May 10
Replies: 621 15 Jun 10 21:08   
not reg'd a forum name on main account, never really got into the whole banter of this place.



So, who are you?

not on MSN, and chill, i wont be saying anymore.

rocket - i'm honestly not anybody known off the forum.

give me your msn or i will report you to police

ok report me, the number is 999.

good luck.

thread ruined. thread over.


too many idiots on this site now. and they all seem to have multiple usernames.

yes rocket , its true, can't get one decent discussion going anymore with all the ego's and multiple username's in this kip

muppets

stare at markets for hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours

and after a bit it starts making sense, if your not an imbecile by then