Forums
There is currently 1 person viewing this thread.
The Dragon
22 Jun 23 23:39
Joined:
Date Joined: 12 Mar 05
| Topic/replies: 48,414 | Blogger: The Dragon's blog
tory **** up

get back in and restore what we used to have with our European friends

Post your reply

Text Format: Table: Smilies:
Forum does not support HTML
Insert Photo
Cancel
Page 1 of 2  •  Previous 1 | 2 | Next
sort by:
Show
per page
Replies: 65
By:
The Dragon
When: 22 Jun 23 23:40
question time from clacton on sea -red hot toriesDevil
By:
mesmerised
When: 22 Jun 23 23:46
tbh it's like we've never left.
By:
The Dragon
When: 22 Jun 23 23:51
you ask any fruit tree growers, haulage driver owners, hospitality industry  or farmers its defo changed

ficked up the lot of em

let down by the knob tories
By:
mesmerised
When: 22 Jun 23 23:57
was referring to immigration, at an all time net high, they haven't taken back control, the French escort the migrants to English waters and tell them to call 999, whilst the British government pays the French to stop them coming in the first place, you couldn't make it up.
By:
The Dragon
When: 23 Jun 23 00:41
only fools tought brexit was about immigration

it was about right wing Tories getting controlDevil
By:
mesmerised
When: 23 Jun 23 00:59
The whole debate completely centered around immigration, that's what UKIP was all about, that's what forced Cameron's hand, that's what led to Brexit, talk of trade deals and whatnot were lost in the ether. Not all Pro Brexiteers were Tories, some prominent Labour politicians were too including Dennis Skinner, Kate Hoey and life long sceptic Corbyn, even if he said he voted the other way. The sole reason why Farage, Rees-Mogg etc wanted to leave was purely for ideological reasons, self-governance, straight bananas, or for want of a better phrase, little Englanders with Island mentalities. Nobody on the Leave side had any real idea of whether we'd be better off in the long run, they thought they'd deal with that later whilst hoping to get through the exit door as quick as possible providing as much smoke and mirrors in the meantime, what helped them was the incessant doom and gloom merchants on the Remain side, the we can't cope without the EU mantra which just served to play on nationalistic heartstrings as it was always going to be met with 'yes we can'. I'd hazard a guess in the long run, economically, neither side will be much better or worse off, we're still joined at the hip. The upside of leaving is not every single commons debate is saturated with EU talk, if we'd stayed the question will always have been there, the Anti EU sentiment, the division, at least now we'll know, and if we are fkd in the long run, we could re-apply, chances are however it'll be too politically toxic for even Labour to go there meaning the horse has bolted, it aint coming back, Kind Regards.
By:
shut up
When: 23 Jun 23 03:19
Should never have gone in in the first place , so funny listening to the loser Remoaners who do not believe in Democracy
By:
second again
When: 23 Jun 23 05:19
The funny thing was boris and rees mogg ect going on for years about how undemocratic the EU was,unelected EU bureaucrats telling us what to do ,the Westminster parliament was soveriegn take back control ect.Now that the Westminster privileges committee says that boris is a compulsive liar it is a kangaroo court undemocratic ect,this is them with an 80 seat majority they could not take back control of a nursery.
By:
sparrow
When: 23 Jun 23 07:38
The Dragon 23 Jun 23 00:41 
only fools tought brexit was about immigration

it was about right wing Tories getting control




Spot on.
By:
Tiger Tiger
When: 23 Jun 23 11:01
WALOFS.

The areas in England and Wales that voted strongest for Brexit were traditional Labour working class areas, it was the working class man that carried Brexit, not the tories, most tory strongholds voted remain.

Socialist Workers Party:

Brexit vote was a revolt against the rich

The central feature of the referendum result was a revolt against the establishment. People who are generally forgotten, ignored or sneered at delivered a stunning blow against the people at the top of society.

The reasons for that rebellion are contradictory, but that does not change the essential character of what has taken place.

Labour MP Diane Abbott was right to say it was a “roar of defiance against the Westminster elite”. Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn said, “One clear message from last Thursday’s vote is that millions of people feel shut out of a political and economic system that has let them down.”

Labour left group Momentum, which backed Remain, said, “Much of this vote reflected anger in communities which have experienced many years of industrial decline with the subsequent loss of secure employment.

“Many such working class communities have been utterly neglected for years by those in power”.

Remain had the support of the Tories, Labour, the Scottish National Party, Plaid Cymru, the Lib Dems, the Greens and Sinn Fein.

Practically every bosses’ organisation and international finance body, thousands of “top executives” and the leaders of dozens of states, including the US, backed Remain.

Yet 52 percent of people voting backed Leave.


Class

There was a strong class element. A detailed poll by Lord Ashcroft showed the AB social group (professionals, managers, lecturers and teachers) were the only social group where a majority, 57 percent, voted to Remain.

C1s (most white collar workers) divided fairly evenly. But nearly two thirds of C2s (skilled manual workers) Ds (other manual workers) and Es (pensioners, unemployed, people on benefits) voted Leave.

Around two thirds of council and housing association tenants voted to leave.

The Daily Mirror newspaper’s analysis showed that the areas voting Leave had an average weekly wage of £410.47 compared with £459.52 for Remain.

Some people voiced their anger against the system in a racist way, scapegoating immigrants and refugees. This was undoubtedly a factor.

Ukip took 3.8 million votes at the general election just over a year ago. And the mainstream Leave campaign was headed by racists and horrible right wing forces.

But it doesn’t explain the vote, and it is a terrible mistake to see all Leave voters as racists.

There is an insurgent feeling with a strong anti-elitist element at the base of society. Socialists and anti-racists need to direct and shape this, not sniffily condemn it.

The sense of a revolt against the establishment penetrated even the bosses’ heads. Nigel Wilson, chief executive of Legal & General, said the electorate was “fed up of the rich and the elite shouting at them, telling them how to vote”.

Sir Richard Lambert, former Financial Times editor, said, “This vote represents in part the frustration of those who have not benefited from economic growth in recent decades.”

Jean-Pierre Mustier of the asset management group Tikehau said, “This is a massive repudiation by the electorate of the near unanimous view of our economic/financial/business elites.”

London was the only region to vote for Remain, although even in the capital over 1.5 million people voted Leave.

Every other English region backed Leave—by 58 percent in Yorkshire and Humberside, 54 percent in the North West, 59 percent in the West Midlands and the East Midlands, and more than 50 percent in both the South East and South West.

Wales voted by 53 percent for Leave, Scotland voted by 62 percent for Remain.


Just as in many other parts of the world, there is a revolt going on against the people at the top of society.

It can be dragged left or right.

The deep pools of bitterness and frustration across Britain fuelled the Leave vote.

There is a particularly marked association between areas blighted by 30 years of desolation after Thatcherism and a Leave vote.

Almost 70 percent of people in Doncaster voted Leave, and 57 percent in the steel and former mining area of Neath Port Talbot also voted Leave.

In Hartlepool 70 percent voted Leave along with 61 percent in Sunderland.


This revolt against the rich and powerful must be built on.
By:
PorcupineorPineapple
When: 23 Jun 23 11:07
The great irony of it all was that brexit was a trojan horse for the rich and powerful to gather yet more and more wealth. Taking back control, sovereignty etc etc were nothing but campaign slogans for the gullible. The real control was handed over to the establishment who would no longer have to deal with pesky EU regulations and laws.
By:
brigust1
When: 23 Jun 23 11:37
We should never go back. Even before the vote the EU were abusing us while taking our money. When Cameron went to ask for help with his plans for dealing with immigration and the benefit system they told him to sling his hook so he had no alternative but to put it to the people. Ever since then EU has treated the UK disgustingly doing everything in their power to overturn the vote and make everything more difficult for us. Phuk em.
I go to France a lot and where it used to be cheap fuel and low food prices because of subsidies now it is far more expensive than over here.

We should never go back they have zero respect for us and that has always been the case.
By:
Llamedos
When: 23 Jun 23 12:02
Everything RoseIE in the EU, Ye right
Euro PMI data released today

Eurozone Factory Activity Contracts the Most in 3-Years
The HCOB Eurozone Manufacturing PMI fell by 1.2 points from the previous month to 43.6 in June of 2023, missing market expectations of 44.8 to reflect the eleventh straight contraction in the bloc’s factory activity and the sharpest in three years, as the sector continued to feel the impact of soaring borrowing costs. Output sank for the third consecutive month, driven by the worst decline in new orders since October while backlogs of work have already been cleared. Tough business conditions drove manufacturers to cut employment levels for the first time since January 2021 and reduce the purchase of inputs. On the price front, falling demand drove input prices to fall for the fourth consecutive month, translating to a second consecutive decline in output charges. Looking ahead, business expectations fell to a seventh-month low as higher interest rates pressed demand concerns

Uk is slightly down but nowhere near as much as this.

German Economy
Germany fell into recession in the first quarter of 2023, putting Europe's largest economy out of step with the rest of the continent. The seasonally adjusted figures from the national statistics institute, Destatis, meet the technical definition of a recession: two consecutive quarters of economic contraction.

Trouble with Poland and Hungary

Both countries refuse to accept EU imposed policy on immigration, Poland may have a referendum on it
By:
rothko
When: 23 Jun 23 12:40
Totally agree Llamedos

the EU needs to be considerably reformed before any consideration of rejoining. Seems to be stuck in the ideals of the 20th century
What didnt help the vote was the sight of Cameron going around Europe with his tail between his legs begging the likes of Merkel for some give on free movement - it was a pathetic sight and turned a lot of people to vote for Brexit imho
By:
barstool
When: 23 Jun 23 13:53
Covid and the War in Ukrain/energy crises upset all of Europe. North African migration just as bad in Greece and Italy as it is here. Europe full of "refugees" and more to come.

In or out it would have been the same.

World War Three is on the horizon too.Sad
By:
Llamedos
When: 23 Jun 23 14:07
Covid and the War in Ukrain/energy crises upset all of Europe. North African migration just as bad in Greece and Italy as it is here. Europe full of "refugees" and more to come.

In or out it would have been the same.

World War Three is on the horizon too.

Appreciate what you are trying to say but in or out would not be the same.
The EU as from the 8th of June will now be the allocator as to the destination of asylum seekers throughout the EU, hence the forthcoming problems with Poland and Hungary who believe it their sovereign right to decide who comes into there country. If they do not accept their allocation they will be fined for every refugee they decline.
This is not the case for the UK, no matter how badly the UK is dealing with asylum seekers.

https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/policies/eu-migration-policy/
By:
JPSER
When: 23 Jun 23 14:11
this is the football forum, p1ss off to the politics forum with this inane drivel
By:
Llamedos
When: 23 Jun 23 14:30
JPSER23 Jun 23 14:11Joined: 23 Apr 22 | Topic/replies: 431 | Blogger: JPSER's blog
this is the football forum, p1ss off to the politics forum with this inane drivel

True really, a bit like posting inane drivel on the horse racing forum about submarines.

JPSER • June 22, 2023 11:27 AM BST
did anyone see the video floating about of the CEO Stockton Rush saying he didnt want to hire 50 year old white guys, and instead wanted a team who were younger and more inspirational.

what a faulty way of thinking

JPSER • June 22, 2023 12:31 PM BST
it baffles me in this day and age of technology that there cant be some kind of device saying exactly where it is, instead of being totally lost. or at least have some chord inside that when pulled would inflate and bring it to the surface.

JPSER • June 22, 2023 2:05 PM BST
what happens if someone farts down there? does it just linger the whole time with nowhere to go?
By:
JPSER
When: 23 Jun 23 14:38
the left wing and the right wing are the same people, like bald men fighting over a comb
By:
The Dragon
When: 23 Jun 23 14:50
fick off jpser this is a good space to explore views
By:
flukes
When: 23 Jun 23 20:30
Another predictable thread from forum's biggest bell*nd and serial loser The Dragon.
By:
Tiger Tiger
When: 24 Jun 23 12:21
FRANKFURT ― Not so long ago, Germany was Europe's powerhouse: wealthy, booming, politically strong. But the mighty have fallen.

And it's not hard to see why this is giving the rest of the eurozone a bad case of the jitters. After all, if its largest member is struggling, it risks dragging the whole lot of them down with it.

Germany is by far the eurozone's biggest economy, accounting for almost 30 percent of the bloc's economic output. It is the largest trading partner of more than half of the EU's 27 countries. Politically too, that has enabled Berlin to call a lot of the shots within the European Union.

But Thursday's data, which showed that Germany has fallen into recession, didn't come out of the blue. It was already among the last in Europe to return to pre-COVID levels when economies started to rebound after the pandemic. And it's that very drawn-out nature of Germany's malaise — as well as an absence of the surefootedness of the past from the government in Berlin — that's convincing experts this isn't a blip.

"A fundamental improvement is not in sight,” Commerzbank economist Jörg Krämer said. All important leading indicators in the manufacturing sector were now falling, he added.

The latest first-quarter growth estimate showed the German economy contracting by 0.3 percent. That followed a shrinking of 0.5 percent in the final quarter of 2022.



Dont tell the romoaners at BBC though who cant seem to admit what is happening in Germany.
By:
thelatarps
When: 26 Jun 23 10:03
Brexit was a protest vote, pure and simple.
To put it in Mick McCarthy language..

'The Establishment put its backside on display in Burtons shop window'

And the British people gave them a right good slap.
Going back to the EU would be a massive mistake.

According to Philip Hammond, former chancellor under Teresa May, the current UK inflation crisis is down to the inflexibility of the Labour market.
i.e. too few people and too many vacancies. Leading to wage rises.

The big problem with Brexit is that it meant all the Poles and Romanians went back home, vacating the sort of jobs.. fruit pickers etc... that Dragon mentioned.

Seems to me we have a ready made supply of replacements with all these refugees lining up on the Normandy coast....
An obvious solution but one which is unpalatable given the political climate right now.
Cant think of any politico brave enough to do anything about it.
By:
DIE LINKE
When: 26 Jun 23 10:37
The great unwashed who voted for Brexit were expected to replace the EU workers in crappy jobs. Quite an ask for some of the "biggest idlers in the world."
By:
lfc1971
When: 26 Jun 23 11:03
If jobs are ‘ crappy ‘ and employers cannot
find workers then they will have to increase pay and conditions etc
and the jobs won’t seem so crappy … stop whining
By:
sparrow
When: 26 Jun 23 13:21
In 1975 I voted to leave but the difference is I wasn't afraid to admit my stupid mistake.
By:
Tiger Tiger
When: 26 Jun 23 15:39
Only and idiot whould think that you had made a stupid mistake.Mischief
By:
sparrow
When: 26 Jun 23 15:40
Glad you agree tiger.
By:
mesmerised
When: 26 Jun 23 15:54
Most people's lives are not going to change that much in or out. The EU are actually better off without Britain, we were a thorn in their sides vetoing this, that and the other (though mostly voting yes, voting No was more than most nations), they'll miss our financial input but they wont collapse and neither would we. We had 4 opt outs which was more than any other EU country, we were always half in and half out. I remember Cameron, backed up by Clegg, a Pro Remainer, vetoing changes to the Lisbon treaty about a year into his leadership at 2.30 in the morning, they ignored Britain and made amendments to the the act anyway.  Give it 25 years and then you'll really have a sense of how the land lies, not in it's infancy. No political party is going to go there with a Return vote, it'd be far too toxic and risky to build a election campaign on that. We'd have to be really in the mire for that to be a consideration, as it is, the economy is generally ok with no recession expected in the near future according to the IMF.
By:
DIE LINKE
When: 26 Jun 23 16:26
No recession expected in the near future?! Laugh
By:
SirNorbertClarke
When: 28 Jun 23 22:29
Chickens coming home to roost.

Thames Water 14 billion in debt

Woking borough council 1.2 billion in debt

food inflation over 14%

broadband inflation 17.3%

13 years of Tories feathering their own nests has ruined the UK.
By:
breadnbutter
When: 30 Jun 23 17:41
Zzzzzzz
By:
The Dragon
When: 30 Jun 23 17:44
spot on nobby
By:
Tiger Tiger
When: 30 Jun 23 18:08
Nobby - then ferk of to Germany and enjoy the recession, or to France and enjoy the riots.
By:
breadnbutter
When: 30 Jun 23 21:26
Laugh
By:
SirNorbertClarke
When: 02 Jul 23 22:09
It always amuses me when people refuse to take their head out of the sand.

Brexiteers were sold a dream but the reality is crippling the country.

Pity is virtually no British politician has the guts to call for rejoining the Single Market.
By:
sparrow
When: 03 Jul 23 08:05
There will be a call for the single market by the next election, its just a matter of time.
By:
G Hall
When: 03 Jul 23 09:54
Looking at what is happening in France at the moment it's a case of be careful what you wish for.
By:
sparrow
When: 03 Jul 23 12:32
Too late to be careful now after the last vote.
Page 1 of 2  •  Previous 1 | 2 | Next
sort by:
Show
per page

Post your reply

Text Format: Table: Smilies:
Forum does not support HTML
Insert Photo
Cancel
‹ back to topics
www.betfair.com