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The Spinmaster
10 Sep 21 08:59
Date Joined: 08 Feb 08
| Topic/replies: 17,201 | Blogger: The Spinmaster's blog
IPL rules?
Pause Switch to Standard View 5th test England India
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Report wroughtironronn September 10, 2021 9:09 AM BST
This is interesting
Report BESTMATE44 September 10, 2021 9:23 AM BST
Report barstool September 10, 2021 10:35 AM BST
None of the Indian players have tested positive.

So the situation is exactly as it was before the start of the fourth test which was played.

Only this time the IPL is just nine days away.

It does make you wonder. As spinmaster puts it above IPL (money) rules.
Report barstool September 10, 2021 10:36 AM BST
As for the fans and the paying public.

Yes of course.

They don't matter.
Report brentford September 10, 2021 10:40 AM BST
well that goes both ways to be fair barstool,

ECB didn't want the 100 launch being overshadowed by a test match...which is why this one ends up so close to the IPL...
Report Whisperingdeath September 10, 2021 10:54 AM BST
Look don’t tell me Kohli or Sharma saw this as a good way to ensure a series win. They were chasing greatness and glory, both of ,which, money cannot buy. To beat England and Australia away consecutively is almost unheard of.

As for The IPL I think we showed the World Might is Right. Jus5 because we no longer rule it we cannot cry about the rule we established.

Wtf plays in the middle of September anyway. If anything it is good that this has come back to bite The ECB in the Jacksy. They deserve it. They take of us fans at will. £100 to watch a day of Test Cricket? Yes it is worth that to me but they take the Michael.

Can’t blame the Indian players. What did we do to South Africa?

It is all just terribly disappointing
Report barstool September 10, 2021 11:07 AM BST
To call it off just two hours before start of play is a joke.

If they did not like the schedule when it came out they should have said so and played a three or for match series instead.
Report brentford September 10, 2021 11:11 AM BST
well if they hadn't had various members of their staff test positive they would have still fulfilled the game in all likelihood, the fixture negotiations were just that and obviously the ecb and Bcci wanted 5 matches from a revenue perspective.
Report elisjohn September 10, 2021 11:12 AM BST
chap on tms now , said he was on the phone all night trying to get the indian board to play, so ecb  must have known last night
Report brentford September 10, 2021 11:12 AM BST
Ravi's book signing session may have a bit to answer for...not the brightest move to spend an hour or so signing books with a few hundred different people breathing directly over you Shocked
Report spyker September 10, 2021 11:47 AM BST
Does anybody seriously think if India were 2-1 down this match wouldn't be being played (ignoring the fact that India never wanted this match this late and so close to the IPL)? Simple to resolve - if it is cancelled and not forfeited then the Indian players can't play in the IPL (or any other cricket obv) until they've had 14 days of quarantine here and whatever the rules are in India. if they go straight in to the IPL then it's pretty obvious they have gamed  the system.
Report elisjohn September 10, 2021 11:52 AM BST
wish i knew what bookmakers and betfair are doing with series score/ result ?
Report Whisperingdeath September 10, 2021 11:56 AM BST
Don’t think so spyker

The RSPCA would have been called in. We were going to get walloped on a fast dry pitch.
Report Fatslogger September 10, 2021 12:48 PM BST
I’m very disappointed by this, despite having laid the draw heavily to a near £10k red for £5.5k green results, so with a break even point well above the prices that were there before it was called off. Still, I thought the forecast gave excellent chances of enough play for a result and was expecting a profit. I don’t think it’s rained so far either. I reckon draw would at least have got up above 3s with a start on time. I might not have taken much red off below 3.5. It’s also very sad for test cricket and a really exciting series between a very flawed but quite enjoyable England side and the excellent Indian tourists.

On the technicalities of the Covid risk, depends a bit on how vaccinated everyone involved was, which isn’t info I’m aware of being available (nor should it be, necessarily). Does have to be said that negative tests, presumably LFTs this morning, which aren’t amazingly sensitive, 3-4 days after close contact exposure wouldn’t be all that reassuring. Given that it was several players exposed I completely understand the call made. Yes, the IPL may have factored in but that would only matter if there were spread between the players during the game and if you’re considering those scenarios as the important ones, err clearly you want the game called off leaving the IPL aside then anyway. Does that make sense? The bad outcomes don’t need to disrupt the IPL to be considered bad enough to pull the game.
Report Whisperingdeath September 10, 2021 1:45 PM BST
I was laying the draw too! So much so that I factored in the wind and chances of the pitch drying out. I also had a lean on India because I thought Ashwin might play. I would find it hard to think that Kohli could leave out Bumrah but Shami would be a good replacement.

Butler weakened England. Would have been so interesting to find out which XL’s were selected. We really have been robbed by this!
Report Fatslogger September 10, 2021 1:56 PM BST
Which 40 players both teams were picking? That seems like a lot of Covid subs.

Seriously, I was well up for this test and also feel robbed. I might manage to lose a little bit of money backing he Banglas to compensate but it’s not the same. In fact, might even be able to go plus there with them recovering in the chase.
Report Fatslogger September 10, 2021 1:57 PM BST
I think India would have stuck with same side. Ashwin is an absolutely amazing cricketer to be leaving out for a whole series but with the overheads, I think they’d have wanted to keep the 4 quick bowlers. I thought it would be drawn about 1 time in 5!
Report Whisperingdeath September 10, 2021 2:14 PM BST
Ashwin for Siraj. Vihare for Rahane. Maybe even Shami comes back. But yeah Kohli goes unchanged!

Wood comes in for Overton. Butler for YJB. I would have Leach for either Robinson or Anderson.
Report elisjohn September 10, 2021 3:24 PM BST
if this test has been cancelled then i presume that betfair will void correct score and series winner markets, but bookmakers will pay on 2-1  scoreline , if its forfeit then it will go down as drawn and 2-2, but what im reading between the lines its been cancelled with agreement of both boards so 2-1 score should remain ,   but who knows!
Report Whisperingdeath September 10, 2021 3:40 PM BST
It’s 2-1 Dude.
Report Whisperingdeath September 10, 2021 5:28 PM BST

I have just read about ICC adjudication!

Lawyers involved and Insurance is the issue. I suspect this might go to court. Forfeiture v Covid

No insurance against covid so ECB May have to pick up the loss!

India will not swallow a forfeit so a money spinning test next summer that will mean little to India may be played to save face and generate some cash.
Report brentford September 10, 2021 5:49 PM BST
yep, they were talking about shoe horning it in to next summer as India are due here for white ball tour...probably get rained out Cry
Report geordie1956 September 10, 2021 6:48 PM BST
the demands of the game now are ridiculous ... the british summer is short enough as it is but we are attempting to shoehorn ever more fixtures into it because finance demands it ... domestic county cricket which should be the feeder for the international team is now seemingly superfluous and is cast aside to april / early may & september where conditions are often inhospitable for the livelihood of decent county cricket  ... the format we have now ... created as a result of covid but likely to remain is contrived & doesn't work (the championship decider) will go into October which is a sorry state of affairs  ... at least hold it in Dubai or somewhere warm & beam it live to the UK via the BBC to create an interest & stimulate some interest
there should be some sort of rejig by the ecb but i fear that the line of current thinking has moved the goalposts (an oxymoron perhaps!) to such an extent that the one day game and even more so T20 & now the hundred has created a monster which will destroy the game as many of us old uns have grown up to love  ...
money of course is the root of the problem but how do we turn the tide of reason ... perhaps its too late
Report brentford September 10, 2021 6:56 PM BST
I agree with a lot of that post geordie ... (especially liked the idea of the Dubai game though I guess county members and supporters of the competing teams might find reasonable grounds for disapproval)

but would observe that cricket's responsibilities extend well beyond traditionalists and for the game to continue to flourish it has to work as hard at serving the younger market which typically prioritises white ball cricket...
Report geordie1956 September 10, 2021 7:01 PM BST
don't disagree with your points brentford & i understand that the young favour the white ball game so the tradionalists have to change to the times but just attemting to offer some balance ... i appreciate there is likelihood no answer which offers complete satisfaction
Report brentford September 10, 2021 7:06 PM BST
Hopefully at least the domestic programme will get better structured than it is currently...does feel a bit of a mess
Report spyker September 10, 2021 7:13 PM BST
The silence from the team. bcci and the whole of India speaks volumes. It smacks of 'this was always the plan' (hence the silence) and the way it's been done is terrible and shockingly bad publicity - imagine if this was any team in India, the team hotel would have been  burnt down by now!
They could have done this earlier in the week - the stuff about the physio seems plausible  hence not until now but there must be loads of physios that various people from the team know etc who could cover and be passed covid ok. I don't know how many but covid subs can be used if anyone got it during the game i stand by the above that if this was 1-2, 1-1 etc the match would be on.
Report Whisperingdeath September 10, 2021 7:37 PM BST

This is a cricket forum. We love cricket and sport in general. We do not hate people. If you have a beef or maybe even do not like people with darker skin we really do not care but take it to the toilet where you belong, pleaseWink
Report Whisperingdeath September 10, 2021 7:40 PM BST
I do not like to bring politics into cricket or this forum, which, is quite ironic but GB News are reporting that India have forfeited the fixture!

I am looking forward to seeing what the economic and legal ramifications of today and any fudge produced by the authorities of both countries are.
Report windsor knot September 10, 2021 7:49 PM BST
any way you look at this year in cricket , with the introduction of the 100 and the ' planning ' of matches,  county cricket is dead  and buried.... and test cricket is in the hearse behind .
Report twizzle22 September 10, 2021 9:20 PM BST
Where exactly has Spyker spouted anything racist WD? Get off YOUR political high horse FFS!
Report mafeking September 11, 2021 12:31 AM BST
apparently this was meant to be the first test but that would have meant clashing with the start of the ECB's precious 100 so it was switched to mid september where the short gap to the resumption of the IPL always left little room for manoeuvre
Report Whisperingdeath September 11, 2021 9:00 AM BST
Have you got anything to say about the cricket twizzle?
Report Whisperingdeath September 11, 2021 9:36 AM BST
“If it was someone else, someone working in logistics, they wouldn’t be this afraid. But when this person got it, that’s when they got the jitters.” There are echoes of England’s decision to postpone three ODIs against South Africa last December after a positive result for a member of staff at their hotel – someone who had been serving them – sent a surge of collective anxiety through the camp regarding their ability to join family at home or overseas for Christmas.

Back then players were not vaccinated (as is the case now), the matches were being played behind closed doors and South Africa’s squad had already experienced three positives in the preceding weeks. But it still set a precedent which has ultimately left the ECB scant room for complaint now a repeat of this situation has occurred on their doorstep.
Report twizzle22 September 11, 2021 12:02 PM BST
You're the one who bought race into the thread Wd. I dislike you and your views, I'll leave it at that.
Report sir rufus September 11, 2021 1:05 PM BST
When will these bookmakers make their minds up, and betfair as well.  Are we being paid out on 2-1 series win? What is so difficult about making a decision?
Report peckerdunne September 11, 2021 1:37 PM BST
I P L. Just about to get bigger and longer, just need a T20 super league and you have no test matches at all, which is already very very thin on the ground
Report elisjohn September 11, 2021 1:39 PM BST
bookmakers surely cant void correct score series, or theyll have to pay back all losing bets,
Report kallisking September 11, 2021 3:28 PM BST
If series is settled as 2-1 with final test cancelled rather than forfeited then will bookies pay out on India series winner even though it’s effectively a 4 test series rather than 5. Or voided?
Report elisjohn September 11, 2021 3:32 PM BST
if series is settled 2-1 , then india will be confirmed series winners
Report elisjohn September 11, 2021 3:34 PM BST
no reason for bookies not to pay out on 2-1 and perhaps void on 2-2, the most popular bets i presume would have been 3-2 either way, so theyve already cleaned up on them as well as 5-0 ,
Report peckerdunne September 11, 2021 5:15 PM BST
Report kallisking September 11, 2021 5:34 PM BST
Thanks elisjohn, hoping for a decision in the next few days one way or another but who knows given what’s at stake
Report elisjohn September 11, 2021 5:37 PM BST

ECB ask ICC to start adjudication process on cancelled Test
by  Rob Johnston  •  Last updated on Sat, Sep 11, 2021, 03:48 PM
2-2 or 1-2: The adjudication process will clarify the final series result.

The process for deciding the outcome of the called-off fifth Test at Old Trafford and the fate of the series between England and India has begun. The ECB have written to the ICC to ask them to start the adjudication process with the hope of a swift decision.

The fifth Test was cancelled around three hours before the start of the game on Friday (September 10) because of fears in the Indian camp about the outbreak of COVID within their team environment. On Wednesday, a fourth member of the backroom staff, Yogesh Parmar, tested positive following three earlier cases that had come to light during the Oval Test.

While there are hopes of rescheduling the match, perhaps for next summer, Tom Harrison, the ECB chief executive, indicated on Friday that such a fixture would likely be viewed as a standalone Test rather than as a continuation of this summer's series. If that is the case, the game would not form part of the World Test Championship and the fate of this summer's series would need to be decided, something the ECB are putting in the ICC's court.

There are two possible outcomes. If the match is deemed by the ICC's Dispute Resolution Committee (DRC) to have been cancelled for acceptable reasons under the COVID allowances in the ICC rules, the result will be declared null and void and the series considered a four-match affair, with India winning 2-1 and World Test Championship points awarded on a percentage of available points basis. The other option is that the DRC consider India forfeited the match and award it to England, squaring the series at 2-2.

The playing conditions for the WTC allow teams not to play matches in certain circumstances. The conditions state: "Any matches that do not take place due to the Acceptable Non-Compliance of one or both Parties (as defined in the World Test Championship Competition Terms) shall not be taken into account in the calculation of the Points Percentage."

The ICC's decision will come down to how the DRC interpret what 'acceptable non-compliance' means in a COVID situation. There are provisions within the WTC competition terms that allow a side not to play a Test if COVID impacts on their ability to field a side. The BCCI are adamant that these provisions apply to this situation.

However, Harrison was clear on Friday that the home board do not regard the called-off game at Old Trafford as COVID cancellation. In the ECB's view, there was no outbreak within India's 20-strong playing group which meant they could not field a team. Instead, Harrison cited mental health and well-being as the reason for the cancellation of the Test.

"This is not a COVID cancellation," Harrison said on Friday. "The match was cancelled because of serious concerns over the mental health and well-being of one of the teams and there is a difference... We have the ICC adjudicate over whether this series is completed now, whether that fifth match is null and void or whether it's actually regarded as a forfeiture or something else."

The ECB do not want the uncertainty to drag on and so have written the ICC to get the process started. Once the proceedings have been initiated, the ICC will commission an independent report on what transpired in Manchester. That will then be presented to the Dispute Resolution Committee, chaired by Michael Beloff QC, who will decide if this scenario falls into the acceptable non-compliance compliance category. The DRC's decision will be final which means their ruling would not have to go to the ICC Board for ratification and there is no appeal process.

The decision is important for financial reasons as well as in relation to the matter of WTC points. A COVID cancellation would see the ECB faced with a GBP 40million loss. If India were decided to have forfeited, the ECB would be able to claw some of that back, including around GBP 10million in ticket sales, hospitality and food costs through their insurance. That insurance does not cover a COVID cancellation.

While the wrangling over the outcome of the series is set to go on for a while yet, there is no doubt that the cancellation of the fifth Test was a hugely disappointing end to what had been a superb series.

There has long been an acceptance from the ECB that the respective international series this summer could not be played in strict bio-secure bubbles out of concern for the mental well-being of all the squads involved. But clear standards had been communicated to all teams about the requirements of what the ECB term 'managed environments' to reduce the risk of infections.

The Daily Mail first reported that a number of India's tour party attended a book launch for Ravi Shashtri at a London hotel with 150 people in attendance and few, if any, COVID protocols in place. A few days later, Shastri tested positive for COVID-19. There are also reports of some of India's players being seen out and about in Manchester on Thursday, the day before the Test match. Less than 24 hours later, the game was off.

© Cricbuzz
England India India tour of England, 2021, 5th Test India tour of England, 2021
why-india-are-winning-overseas-and-whats-their-final-frontierWhy India are winning overseas (and what's their final frontier?)
senior-players-play-key-role-in-indias-strong-standSenior players play key role in India's strong stand
ecb-bcci-differ-on-interpretation-of-covid-enforced-match-cancellationECB, BCCI differ on interpretation of Covid-enforced match cancellation
any-rescheduled-match-would-be-a-standalone-match-ecb-chiefAny rescheduled match would be a standalone match: ECB Chief
manchester-test-cancelled-after-india-express-apprehensionManchester Test cancelled after India express apprehension
all-india-players-test-negative-enhance-likelihood-of-manchester-testAll India players test negative; enhance likelihood of Manchester Test
Report VardonVoo. September 11, 2021 5:47 PM BST

Sep 11, 2021 -- 5:15PM, peckerdunne wrote:


I can't remember which year I first recoiled in disbelief at the tangentially blame-obfuscating expression "unplanned outage" but its now at least twenty years ago that such newspeak became commonplace. Doubleplusungood it is too.

Fortunately there are only two obscure matches on today anyway.

Report Whisperingdeath September 11, 2021 5:56 PM BST
twizzle22 11 Sep 21 11:02

You're the one who bought race into the thread Wd. I dislike you and your views, I'll leave it at that.

I am not surprised you will leave it at that. You have nothing to say about the cricket. The feeling is mutual btw. I despise people like you and spyker and your ignorance. So let’s leave it at that unless of course you wish to talk about cricket on a Cricket forum.
Report elisjohn September 11, 2021 6:38 PM BST
Coral and Ladbrokes will pay out punters who backed either India to win the series, a drawn series, a 2-1 India win or a 2-2 correct score while other bookmakers are waiting for an official decision over whether the final Test will be played at a later date.

just come across this from r post
Report geordie1956 September 11, 2021 9:00 PM BST
The ICC whilst the arbiter of the result will be influenced by the power of the BCCI ... we are in unusual times because of Covid & I have no doubt that tenuous excuse will be used to excuse the failure by India to comply with their obligations to play the final test ... verdict 2-1 to the visitors even though most right minded folk know the reality is that the continuation of the IPL has been the primary factor in their actions.
The one off test next year will simply be an exercise in jiggery pokery to balance the books of the ECB
Report elisjohn September 11, 2021 10:43 PM BST
so now it seems ECB CEO HARRISON ATTENDED  shastri book launch
Report elisjohn September 11, 2021 10:45 PM BST
the match was cancelled at 9.00 in the morning when harrison himself stated he was on the phome all night trying to get  india to play, therefore ecb had plenty of time to say the match was very  doubtful night before .
Report kallisking September 12, 2021 4:43 PM BST
Any chance Betfair will settle as Ladbrokes and Coral have done do we think? The process to determine the series winner could take weeks.
Report elisjohn September 12, 2021 5:15 PM BST
no , i reckon betfair will void the marketsSeries Betting
When the full number of scheduled matches is not played then we reserve the right to void any speciality markets which relate to the series as a whole.

now i dont know if they will void it from scratch(hope not for me as ive already won a few hundred by laying 5-0 3-2 etcetc), but they might do ,  hope they just void the remaining market if thats the case ,
Report elisjohn September 12, 2021 5:17 PM BST
there is absolutely zero chance on betfair doing 2-1 and 2-2, indian win and drawn series imo
Report elisjohn September 12, 2021 5:20 PM BST
im not on twitter etc , dont know if anyone on here would be kind enough to ask bet fred if hes folowing suit with corals/ lads, would be appreciated
Report kallisking September 12, 2021 5:56 PM BST
Void. FFS. Anyway hopefully ICC come to the conclusion it’s a 4 match series relatively quickly so Betfair will void and release funds so we can move on. Hoping to god we don’t have the 5th test next year and funds tied up til then. Can’t see this playing out given what we’ve heard so far
Report VardonVoo. October 22, 2021 1:14 PM BST
Re-scheduled for July next year at Edgbaston.
Report VardonVoo. October 22, 2021 1:16 PM BST
The series markets are currently suspended with totals matched still showing so presumably those bets are all still live.
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