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trader pj
30 Dec 09 12:50
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Date Joined: 13 Nov 02
| Topic/replies: 7,066 | Blogger: trader pj's blog
Personally I think SA are in a state of collapse. Poor body language and performances. Meanwhile momentum England. With no threat of rain I see only one result
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Report H99 December 30, 2009 12:51 PM GMT
having repeatedly tipped the draw in Durban
Report Lies, DamnLies, and Statistics December 30, 2009 12:56 PM GMT
until i saw 'thread' in the title, i thought mort was back...
Report Innocent Bystander December 30, 2009 1:06 PM GMT
Surely we are getting close to the day when people realise 'MOMENTUM' in cricket is total bs? How many times have we heard coaches and skippers (and pundits) say momentum is with a side, only for them to get humiliated

Its one of those buzz words which will be replaced by something else in 2010. My guess? Inertia ;)
Report cdog December 30, 2009 2:04 PM GMT
It's our worst ground, statistically, in the last 15 years, worldwide.
Report mafeking December 30, 2009 2:33 PM GMT
correct IB. can think of loads of recent occasions where england alone have been annihilated and won the next test.
Report riccardo December 30, 2009 2:48 PM GMT
Headingly and the Oval this year?

That didn't take long, did it...
Report ramone December 30, 2009 3:04 PM GMT
Cast your mind back to the 2004/5 Saffer series......

We had a better team then and went to CT off the back of 11 wins out of 13 tests (Antigua feather bed/Lara and bad light in Durban draws). IIRC, Eng got humped at CT 2005.
Report positively4thsteet December 30, 2009 3:38 PM GMT
England always used to win just at the point when I was about to divorce them, just had it with them, never watching stupid test cricket ever again. England from 1992 to 2005 consistently went 2 steps forward 1 step back. or maybe it was 15 steps forward 14 steps back. It was a v.long and slow ascent to our ashes win in 2005 and defo 2nd best team in the world. Since then it has been the sae in reverse, though hopefully the windies loss earlier this year was our nadir. Whenever we build up momentum (up or down) we seemed to go the other way asap.

1993 - 4-0 or 3-0 down trounced by aussies then win the last (or was it penultimate) one giving us some hope for our tour of windies in 1994 when we got trounced 3-0 culminating in the nadir to end all nadirs (imo) 46ao. We have no momentum whatsoever. Can't bat, can't bowl. Then we unbelievably won at barbados, first team to do that (other than windies of course) for 59 years. This actually continued to a home win over nz and then a devon malcolm inspird draw against saffers, again we go to aus with hope and momentum, before getting thrashed 4-1 I think. We might have won the last one again. Momentum down, we're rubbish, no good, gonna get thrashed by the windies(1995), except we didn't, got a nice 2-2 draw against a very competent windies side - off on tour with some hope to saffers where we drew the first 4 games then some silly run out or something fked up the last one and we lose the series 0-1. d'oh. Momentum against us. Rght lets pick ourselves up - india at home 2-0 win(1996). Come on England we're good again. Let's go and beat the pak.is. No think we lost it 2-0, iirc correctlywe through the first and third tests away right at the end - then we manage to draw 0-0 against p.issiing zimbabwe. We're useles momentum against us. Then give nz a pasting then thrash the aussies in the onedayers and slaughter them at edgbaston(1997). England have the momentum again we're finally gonna win the ashes boom boom boom 3-1 down ashes gone. England are useless threw it all away chokers etc. What next? create a false dawn with a tuffers inspired win at the oval. We may have lost the ashes, but we proved something at least. What exactly, are we gonna go to the windies and win. Are we b.ollox. 3-1 to windies. useless. Getting thrashed by the saffers too. momentum against us. out of the blue we save a game and win two and for the first time in my memory time england win a proper 5 test series(1998). I didn't believe these things happened. Right we're brilliant again, got the momentum for australia (forget the little misdemeanour at home to SL) we can actually win the ashes can't we? WRONG. 4-1 (or was it 3-1) Another world cup disaster and the 2-1 home defeat to NZ.(1999) What happened in 12 months, how did we go from a really encouraging win against saffers to abject failure, bottom of the test championship? Well it certainly wasn't p.ssing momentum. Off to saffers where we pretty much get trounced before cronje gifts us a win in the last test - which at those desperate times probably constituted momentum. Which we took to a victorious home series over a fading windies side.(2000) then we went to pakistan and won. Then we went to sl and won. Good christ, in 18 months we've gone fro abject failures toworld beaters. The momentum is back. We're gonna win the ashes (can u see a pattern emerging here?) First stop pakistan at home. Comprehensively trounce them in the first match of summer 2001 before throwing away the 2nd match, i think stupidly in the last session of the match so we only draw 1-1 momentum gone, before the customary 4-1 thrashing meted out by the rampant aussies, sole victory courtesy of another remarkable victory totally against the momentum thanks to mark butcher playing out of his skin. So we're sh.te again despite being world beaters just a few months previous. Momentum didn't help us overcome an awesome aussie team there. next stop nz where i think we drew and india where we did v.well wth a young team but somewhat unluckily lost 1-0 i think. So not a great winter. 2002 brings the sri lankans who are on a run they are despatched easiy and we are 1-0 up against the indians, a bit of momentum with us, building up a head of steam.. Wham - we fk up the last test and it is 1-1. Off to Australia with a 3 series unbeaten run behind us. Can we win the ashes? No. 4-0 down, but thankfully i'dlearned my lesson by now and had 40 quid on us to win the last one at 14-1. See the bookies fall for this momentum thing too. They thought we had no chance. I thought we had no chance, which means we have tobe worth a punt. and it worked. Again we claim that as momentum despie it being a drubbing overall. 2003 Saffers at home - 2-1 down I think going into the last. Again I backed us at 10-3 I think. we were 40-1 stumps on day 1. Freddie growing as a player and others ensure we pull off another backs to the wall miracle and we win and therefore draw the series. Momentum. Then we lose in sri lanka which was to be our last sore memory for a while. Momentum gone. Then we win in windies (i thought we had no chance) Then we thrash NZ then we thrash Windies, then we go to Saffers and win, a mighty achievement, what a yar. Bangladesh are sent home swiftly and easily. Can we finally win the ashes? We haveall the momentum. boom thrashed at Lords. Boycott railing at us, we're all useless, Aussies gloating, can't believe we had the temerity to actually believe we could win. It's all over before it has even started. Then came 4 of the most extraordinary test matches of all time. It was worth the wait - but a bit of a roller coaster wait.

Well that is from memory, hopefully not too many errors.
Report positively4thsteet December 30, 2009 3:38 PM GMT
England always used to win just at the point when I was about to divorce them, just had it with them, never watching stupid test cricket ever again. England from 1992 to 2005 consistently went 2 steps forward 1 step back. or maybe it was 15steps forward 14 steps back. It was a v.long and slow ascent to our ashes win in 2005 and defo 2nd best team in the world. Since then it has been the sae in reverse, though hopefully the windies loss earlier this year was our nadir. Whenever we build up momentum (up or down) we seemed to go the other way asap.

1993 - 4-0 or 3-0 down trounced by aussies then win the last (or was it penultimate) one giving us some hope for our tour of windies in 1994 when we got trounced 3-0 culminating in the nadir to end all nadirs (imo) 46ao. Then we unbelievably won at barbados, first team to do that (other than windies of course) for 59 years. This actually continued to a home win over nz and then a devon malcolm inspird draw against saffers, again we go to aus with hope and momentum, before getting thrashed 4-1 I think. We might have won the last one again. Momentum down, we're rubbish, no good, gonna get thrashed by the windies(1995), except we didn't, got a nice 2-2 draw against a very competent windies side - off on tour with some hope to saffers where we drew the first 4 games then some silly run out or something fked up the last one and we lose the series 0-1. d'oh. Momentum against us. Rght lets pick ourselves up - india at home 2-0 win(1996). Come on England we're good again. Let's go and beat the pak.is. No think we lost it 2-0, iirc correctlywe through the first and third tests away right at the end - then we manage to draw 0-0 against p.issiing zimbabwe. We're useles momentum against us. Then give nz a pasting then thrash the aussies in the onedayers and slaughter them at edgbaston(1997). England have the momentum again we're finally gonna win the ashes boom boom boom 3-1 down ashes gone. England are useless threw it all away chokers etc. What next? create a false dawn with a tuffers inspired win at the oval. We may have lost the ashes, but we proved something at least. What exactly, are we gonna go to the windies and win. Are we b.ollox. 3-1 to windies. useless. Getting thrashed by the saffers too. momentum against us. out of the blue we save a game and win two and for the first time in my memory time england win a proper 5 test series(1998). I didn't believe these things happened. Right we're brilliant again, got the momentum for australia (forget the little misdemeanour at home to SL) we can actually win the ashes can't we? WRONG. 4-1 (or was it 3-1) Another world cup disaster and the 2-1 home defeat to NZ.(1999) What happened in 12 months, how did we go from a really encouraging win against saffers to abject failure, bottom of the test championship? Well it certainly wasn't p.ssing momentum. Off to saffers where we pretty much get trounced before cronje gifts us a win in the last test - which at those desperate times probably constituted momentum. Which we took to a victorious home series over a fading windies side.(2000) then we went to pakistan and won. Then we went to sl and won. Good christ, in 18 months we've gone fro abject failures toworld beaters. The momentum is back. We're gonna win the ashes (can u see a pattern emerging here?) First stop pakistan at home. Comprehensively trounce them in the first match of summer 2001 before throwing away the 2nd match, i think stupidly in the last session of the match so we only draw 1-1 momentum gone, before the customary 4-1 thrashing meted out by the rampant aussies, sole victory courtesy of another remarkable victory totally against the momentum thanks to mark butcher playing out of his skin. So we're sh.te again despite being world beaters just a few months previous. Momentum didn't help us overcome an awesome aussie team there. next stop nz where i think we drew and india where we did v.well wth a young team but somewhat unluckily lost 1-0 i think. So not a great winter. 2002 brings the sri lankans who are on a run they are despatched easiy and we are 1-0 up against the indians, a bit of momentum with us, building up a head of steam.. Wham - we fk up the last test and it is 1-1. Off to Australia with a 3 series unbeaten run behind us. Can we win the ashes? No. 4-0 down, but thankfully i'dlearned my lesson by now and had 40 quid on us to win the last one at 14-1. See the bookies fall for this momentum thing too. They thought we had no chance. I thought we had no chance, which means we have tobe worth a punt. and it worked. Again we claim that as momentum despie it being a drubbing overall. 2003 Saffers at home - 2-1 down I think going into the last. Again I backed us at 10-3 I think. we were 40-1 stumps on day 1. Freddie growing as a player and others ensure we pull off another backs to the wall miracle and we win and therefore draw the series. Momentum. Then we lose in sri lanka which was to be our last sore memory for a while. Momentum gone. Then we win in windies (i thought we had no chance) Then we thrash NZ then we thrash Windies, then we go to Saffers and win, a mighty achievement, what a yar. Bangladesh are sent home swiftly and easily. Can we finally win the ashes? We haveall the momentum. boom thrashed at Lords. Boycott railing at us, we're all useless, Aussies gloating, can't believe we had the temerity to actually believe we could win. It's all over before it has even started. Then came 4 of the most extraordinary test matches of all time. It was worth the wait. but a bit of a rollercoaster wait.

Well that is from memory, hopefully not too many errors.
Report Lies, DamnLies, and Statistics December 30, 2009 3:42 PM GMT
wonder if they'll believe you're a pom now, pos??
Report riccardo December 30, 2009 3:42 PM GMT
That was a good example of momentum, you really kept it up from the first post to the second...
Report cricnut December 30, 2009 4:36 PM GMT
England play, best after a poor performance, Cardiff against Australia, scramble a draw, Next Test, at Lords, thump the Aussies, next match rained off, Headingly get thumped by Aussies, and onto the next and we beat them comfortably at The Oval. 1st Test here, turn a comfortable Draw into another scrambled draw and then Thump SA. So I reckon a lay of England should be the bet in the next test. We have to have consistancy and the only consistancy we have, is being inconsistant.
Report positively4thsteet December 30, 2009 4:51 PM GMT
And if you think are test form is inconsistent one day form is even worse.
Report cdog December 30, 2009 5:14 PM GMT
Great memories there postively4thstreet.
Report Lay Lay and Lay again December 30, 2009 5:29 PM GMT
Betfair have this as being played in johannesburg
Report cdog December 30, 2009 5:33 PM GMT
Then they are WRONG :)
Report Lay Lay and Lay again December 30, 2009 5:35 PM GMT
Yes i gathered that
Report Deadly Earnest December 30, 2009 5:36 PM GMT
England will benefit greatly from the bowlers not having to be flogged to get the result at Durban and most of the batsmen getting a decent hit.

By the time they hit Capetown, of the fast bowlers, only Broad will have done a decent amount of bowling in the last 7 days, and that was only 9 overs one day and 8 overs the next.

So there should be no reason for England to be flat at Capetown. Whether they are good enough, get the breaks with conditions and marginal dismissals etc remains to be seen. And SA were very impressive here against an Australian team that had beaten them in their previous 3 matches earlier this year.
Report smeagors December 30, 2009 6:57 PM GMT
just posted elsewhere that both these teams capable of blowing hot and cold .. eng had conditions in their favor re bowling but we saw in the ODI series that they are both capable of playing good or bad ckt .. i'd love to see eng dominate again .. think saf r bang in trouble with their bowling with fat jack not available ( at full pace ) and ntini clearly not up to tests standard sadly .. i do see the beginnings of a potentially solid team if they can carry on forward bearing in mind that swann/strauss apart the main contributors at durban were all players that have had various threads started about them being dropped on here .. lay the draw .. :)
Report Lix December 30, 2009 8:43 PM GMT
SA win if they play De wet for Ntini imo. this thread is reason enough to up the steaks :)
Report Sterling Morrison December 31, 2009 11:11 AM GMT
Ntini demoralising selection that uoset the team. Wait to see if they perist with the obvious error. De Wet in for Ntini and I would consider SA
Report trader pj January 4, 2010 8:44 AM GMT
thought this post was worth resurrecting!
Report Max and Paddy January 4, 2010 8:45 AM GMT
That's right. You tempt fate. You idiot.
Report Lix January 4, 2010 9:01 AM GMT
cheers PJ. All over SA here :)
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