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Dr Crippen
21 Aug 17 10:28
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Date Joined: 16 Apr 02
| Topic/replies: 49,694 | Blogger: Dr Crippen's blog
So who complained about that and why?
Pause Switch to Standard View The Hitler thread.
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Report salmon spray August 21, 2017 11:13 AM BST
If it was the one I think it was it had remained relatively civilised last time I looked at it.
Report Dr Crippen August 21, 2017 11:25 AM BST
It was simply a discussion on why Hitler rose to power so easily on the back of racism.
Although one poster was getting a bit hot under the collar.

I probably got the credit for that by bringing up a subject concerning alleged events that happened 100 years ago. 

By the way SS, a banned poster from here is posting under the name of Dr Crippen on YouTube and your name has been mentioned.

I don't need to tell you it isn't me. I post under a different name on Youtube and I haven't posted there for ages.
Report salmon spray August 21, 2017 11:32 AM BST
Thanks for the tip-off.
Is it one of the two usual threads ?
Report portmanpark August 21, 2017 11:35 AM BST
Was looking for it this morning.Thought it was a good thread.Pity.
Report portmanpark August 21, 2017 11:36 AM BST
Read some where breedingmad has been banned.Wonder if it had anything to do with it.
Report portmanpark August 21, 2017 11:36 AM BST
Read some where breedingmad has been banned.Wonder if it had anything to do with it.
Report Dr Crippen August 21, 2017 11:44 AM BST
Yes SS the PJ Harvey one.
Report Dr Crippen August 21, 2017 11:45 AM BST
I think that's very likely portmanpark.
Report Dr Crippen August 21, 2017 11:52 AM BST
He's taken them all down now after it was so obvious who it was.

He'll be assured of a warm welcome if he ever comes back here.
Report salmon spray August 21, 2017 12:14 PM BST
I've just been through the whole lot on that video/thread. It looks as though somebody ( Cox ? ) can control posts. He appears to be talking to Ron ( Russian ? ) most of the time but as far as I can see that guy has no posts.
can't see any under your name Crippen but Cox has been on since breedingmad was banned.
Report Dr Crippen August 21, 2017 1:33 PM BST
Yes SS all the Dr Crippen posts have been removed.

You can do that yourself under the edit tag on YouTube.

Which would be useful on here to save all the misunderstandings.
Report Dr Crippen August 21, 2017 1:42 PM BST
You can also change your username three times before they restrict you.

So it looks like the Betfair banned poster has used up his three usernames for now.
Report Dr Crippen August 21, 2017 1:44 PM BST
I don't know how many accounts you're allowed on there though.

I should have called this the Youtube thread instead of the Hitler thread.
Report STUDYFORM August 21, 2017 2:10 PM BST
Quelle surprise.
Report Slicer August 21, 2017 2:18 PM BST
I have logged on specially to see how that thread was developing. Someone obviously overstepped the mark. This banning and reporting of others hardly ever took place in the good old days. Such a shame it's got to this stage.  Breedingmad resorted to insulting me as he couldn't outdo me in debate, but I laugh at these people rather than reporting them. It would have to be something extraordinary for me to report anyone. I actually think there should be an official thread posted by BetFair notifying forunmites of who is banned and for how long.
Report STUDYFORM August 21, 2017 2:20 PM BST
It disappears - then crippen changes more history than he did in the original thread!
As was predicted by someone else within the thread.
Report Dr Crippen August 21, 2017 5:11 PM BST
It's the report button that's the problem Slicer.

They've made it too easy to complain now.
Report Dr Crippen August 21, 2017 5:49 PM BST
STUDYFORM please explain. I can't see how my position has changed.
Report not allowed to bet August 21, 2017 7:50 PM BST
interestingly it can be mentioning the ages of the profit's liddle frend wot can do you in without anyone hitting the butt on- or similar references if you get what I mean  nudge nudge
Report Arleystation August 21, 2017 7:51 PM BST
Anyone who refers to a fellow poster as "SS" on this particular thread should surely be banned tooDevil.
Report not allowed to bet August 21, 2017 7:59 PM BST
I will be stopping off at your station in 10 days time
Report Dr Crippen August 21, 2017 8:11 PM BST
I find the period just after the start of WW2 interesting.
Little is said about the pact that Hitler had with Stalin during over this first part of the war.

Because Russia in theory was our enemy at the time.

In fact they were discussing pooling their forces against the allies, and were talking about how they would divide up the British Empire after we'd capitulated.

Of course Hitler double crossed Stalin and launched operation Barbarossa while Stalin was thinking about it.
Report Dr Crippen August 21, 2017 8:27 PM BST
On the Severn Valley Railway natb?

I used to get off there to go fishing on the Severn Years ago. Two pubs one called the Harbour on the railway side and the Valencia across the river.

I've spent many a nights drinking there.
Report ufcdan August 21, 2017 10:56 PM BST
If their going to remove topics I'm not going to play anymore Sad Seriously was something said that was out of order ? It was legitimate question, given today the Alt right and Alt left there seems to be opposing forces in all countries why not back then ? Sad
Report Dr Crippen August 21, 2017 11:31 PM BST
Seriously was something said that was out of order ?

I can understand why someone might want the thread removed because of what we were discussing.
Report not allowed to bet August 22, 2017 7:55 AM BST
yes doctor
arley a beautiful setting
a walk down the steep hill past the pub over the long river footbridge for an ice cream in the village shoppe

back to bridgnorth for a few pints in the station pub  as a 2  6  4 MT  tank clanks around its train

I often seem to be there when the ale festival is on !!
Report dave1357 August 22, 2017 11:42 AM BST
has anyone seen not allowed to bet and moisok in the same room?
Report The Leopard August 22, 2017 12:27 PM BST
Bito ?
Report The Leopard August 22, 2017 12:28 PM BST
Obviously the were all naked Laugh
Report Dr Crippen August 22, 2017 12:43 PM BST
has anyone seen not allowed to bet and moisok in the same room?

Funny you should say that dave.
I had a drink with the pair of them one night.

Strangely moisok was wearing a beard and glasses with a bald head (looked like a pull on mask to me)
And not allowed to bet was either in the bog or outside for a breath of fresh air when moisok was about, and the reverse was also the case.

I never saw them together.
Report GoOnThen August 22, 2017 12:48 PM BST
I can see why some people would be upset by this thread.Give them their dues.
Report The Leopard August 22, 2017 12:52 PM BST
^ It's the way you tell them Plain
Report portmanpark August 22, 2017 8:20 PM BST
dr Crippen.....don't think that's right about hitler and stalin carving up and sharing the spoils.....stalin knew that hitler would invade eventually...........the pact bought him time and a buffer his part of Poland between him and the germans.....
Report Dr Crippen August 22, 2017 8:27 PM BST
According to what I read portmanpark, Hitler was short of vital raw materials and Russia supplied him with them then during the pact.

I also read that without these vital raw materials Germany's invasion of Russia would have been impossible.

If that's true Hitler was playing Stalin for a fool.
Report Dr Crippen August 22, 2017 8:31 PM BST
It's also true that Germany was supplying Russia with machine tools and machinery in return.
Report salmon spray August 22, 2017 10:35 PM BST
I think you'll find the general concensus is that Stalin didn't trust Hitler one inch but didn't fancy his military chances.Moreover he had a free hand in Finland which Russia had only lost after the 1st WW,and Stalin was essentially a successor to the Tsars.
Report Dr Crippen August 22, 2017 10:39 PM BST
I wonder what the truth is SS.
I read that Stalin didn't fear Germany because he thought the Germans could never defeat the Russian army.
Report portmanpark August 22, 2017 10:41 PM BST
ss...the finns gave the Russians a good fight.They say the finns were the only german ally who came out of the war untarnished.
Report lfc1971 August 22, 2017 11:02 PM BST
Stalin had a mental breakdown in 1941, he disappeared for 3 days and when Molotov and a couple of other leading soviets came to get him he thought they had come to shoot him.
Report lfc1971 August 22, 2017 11:09 PM BST
He refused to believe warnings that Germany would invade, he was warned by Churchill, and had a spy in Tokyo who warned him, and had a German communist spy shot for warning him ,

That's how the working classes operate, totally illogical .
Report lfc1971 August 22, 2017 11:17 PM BST
When he heard that the Germans had taken Minsk he visited his top generals and in a rage he reduced them to tears,
Molotov had to hand Zuchkov his handkerchief

"We've fcuked it up ! " Stalin shouted, and disappeared for 3 days.
Report lfc1971 August 22, 2017 11:32 PM BST
Yes , but that was an act of cowardice more than anything else, he feared Germany and feared being seen to break the pact and start adequate defences, even though he had been warned,

That's why he shot the spy who warned him, that is the dishonest way moral cowards act.
Report jollyswagman August 22, 2017 11:45 PM BST
but it is honest in a ammoral kind of way lfc???
Report lfc1971 August 22, 2017 11:58 PM BST
not really jollysswagman, I mean he shot the messenger, that's what they do.
Report jollyswagman August 23, 2017 12:00 AM BST
but did the messenger not deserve to be shot?
Report lfc1971 August 23, 2017 12:02 AM BST
Yes, but only by Hitler, it's a bit much to find that Stalin wants to shoot you as well.
Report jollyswagman August 23, 2017 12:06 AM BST
if only hitler and stalin had shot each other, leaving me and you in charge lfc LaughLaughLaughLaugh
Report lfc1971 August 23, 2017 12:12 AM BST
haha , well yes . I like war and I like peace, they seemed to be so much more simple and honourable then, than today.
Report lfc1971 August 23, 2017 12:14 AM BST
Then we were the heroes , no no I am not telling lies.
Report jollyswagman August 23, 2017 12:19 AM BST
no, no, no. i have gone off you. i like peace and i hate war.

peace  ..... what a lovely word, who would deny that?

war is such a coarse word. do the posh boys volunteer their own offspring for war?
Report lfc1971 August 23, 2017 12:31 AM BST
you're quite right swagman, of course .
goodnight.
Report tobermory August 23, 2017 2:49 AM BST

Aug 22, 2017 -- 8:20PM, portmanpark wrote:


dr Crippen.....don't think that's right about hitler and stalin carving up and sharing the spoils.....stalin knew that hitler would invade eventually...........the pact bought him time and a buffer his part of Poland between him and the germans.....


The 'buffer' idea was very poor strategically . The Soviets had strong defences on their 1939 border . When they got eastern Poland Stalin had the army  move up to there . So he had about a million troops stationed in an undefensible position on the new border and 100 miles back had strong fortifications with hardly anyone to man them . Hitler was a much better strategist than Stalin and Churchill , though still an amateur .The difference was the other 2 - inspite of their massive egos - did finally realize they were clueless  ,and allowed people who knew what they were talking about to make the decisions on where to attack or retreat .

Report tobermory August 23, 2017 2:58 AM BST

Aug 22, 2017 -- 10:41PM, portmanpark wrote:


ss...the finns gave the Russians a good fight.They say the finns were the only german ally who came out of the war untarnished.


The Finnish commander - Mannerheim - was maybe the best general of the war . Though not well known as they don't make movies about people fighting on the German's side.

Report lfc1971 August 23, 2017 9:56 AM BST
America had the greatest generals of WW2
Eisenhower kept the various allies happily working in concert
won the war with minimal casualties and no major defeat.

McArther in the Pacific campaign ( and his audacious campaign in Korea) may have been the greatest general of the 20c
And Pattons 7th army in Italy , and 3rd army in Europe.
Report lfc1971 August 23, 2017 10:18 AM BST
Not really doctor , Hitler had the majority of his forces in the west.
Report lfc1971 August 23, 2017 10:22 AM BST
Now America had to get its forces into Europe and into the Pacific campaign.
Against an enemy entrenched in Europe and the Pacific
This was a much more difficult task than anything undertaken by the European forces
Report Dr Crippen August 23, 2017 10:37 AM BST
Hitler had the majority of his forces in the west.

That is not what I understood lfc.
Report The Leopard August 23, 2017 10:47 AM BST
Agraphobia....... Crippen....a terrible affliction !
Report tobermory August 26, 2017 1:57 AM BST

Aug 23, 2017 -- 9:56AM, lfc1971 wrote:


America had the greatest generals of WW2Eisenhower kept the various allies happily working in concert won the war with minimal casualties and no major defeat.McArther in the Pacific campaign ( and his audacious campaign in Korea) may have been the greatest general of the 20cAnd Pattons 7th army in Italy , and 3rd army in Europe.


America did not have the best generals of WWII ! Only Patton would make the Top 10 . Eisenhower won his campaigns with overwhelming advantages of men and machinery ,and was regarded as clueless in strategy by several of his subordinates . MaCarthur was nowhere near the top 20 generals of the 20th century! He was routed by the Japanese in 1941 , despite having more men , then promptly ran away (leaving his army to the care of the Japanese camps ) and returned with overwhelming superiority in numbers etc . His Korean campaign was going well enough - again it ought to have considering the resources he had - until the Chinese stepped in and took back most of what he'd gained , at which point his only idea was to drop an atomic bomb.

Report tobermory August 26, 2017 2:20 AM BST
The Top 10 generals of WWII in no particular order imo

Manstein
Rommell
Mannerheim
Zhukov
Yamashita
Guderian
Rokossovsky
Slim
Patton
Rundstedt
Report tobermory August 26, 2017 2:22 AM BST
Dr C is quite right that the Germans did not have the majority of their forces in the west of course.

Though there were always substantial forces deployed against the western allies.
Report lfc1971 August 26, 2017 10:19 AM BST
tobermory, the Asian theatre of war in WW2 was seven times larger than the European theatre. America`s mobilisation was the most complex in history and  this was the task that faced MaCarthur. At the same time Eisenhower had to obtain a foothold in Europe and defeat Germany, again a much more difficult task than any facing the European powers.
That is why the American generals were the greatest in WW2, their responsibilities, and the breadth and nature and complexity of those responsibilities were much greater than any European general.
Report lfc1971 August 26, 2017 10:45 AM BST
do you know between 1941 and 42 150,000 Russians were executed for cowardice. How many American`s ? the US army was more prudent in valuing a soldiers life.

Did Hitler have most of his forces facing the western powers rather than east.
well at the end of the war German forces killed or captured by Soviet Union 5 million
german forces killed or captured by allies 8 million


These figures show that the allies were almost one and a half times as effective at neutralising German soldiers as their Russian army counterparts. (whose commanders of course didn't have to worry so much about the niceities and difficulties in taking prisoners faced by the American generals)
Report tobermory August 27, 2017 6:16 AM BST

Aug 26, 2017 -- 10:19AM, lfc1971 wrote:


tobermory, the Asian theatre of war in WW2 was seven times larger than the European theatre. America`s mobilisation was the most complex in history and  this was the task that faced MaCarthur. At the same time Eisenhower had to obtain a foothold in Europe and defeat Germany, again a much more difficult task than any facing the European powers.That is why the American generals were the greatest in WW2, their responsibilities, and the breadth and nature and complexity of those responsibilities were much greater than any European general.


Most of the Asian theatre was empty ocean . The US Navy won the decisive battles there and the British and Chinese armies killed far more Japanese soldiers on land than the Americans did . In judging generals you can't just ignore the resources available to them : Eisenhower had unlimited troops and materials and 2 years to prepare D Day . It's hardly a miracle that it came off .

Report tobermory August 27, 2017 6:17 AM BST

Aug 26, 2017 -- 10:45AM, lfc1971 wrote:


do you know between 1941 and 42 150,000 Russians were executed for cowardice. How many American`s ? the US army was more prudent in valuing a soldiers life.Did Hitler have most of his forces facing the western powers rather than east.well at the end of the war German forces killed or captured by Soviet Union 5 milliongerman forces killed or captured by allies 8 millionThese figures show that the allies were almost one and a half times as effective at neutralising German soldiers as their Russian army counterparts. (whose commanders of course didn't have to worry so much about the niceities and difficulties in taking prisoners faced by the American generals)


Are you not aware that German armies went west in the last month of the war precisely to surrender to the Americans and British ?

Report lfc1971 August 27, 2017 12:21 PM BST
Of course, that was why I included them in the figures .
They knew they would be in danger of being shot by the Russian generals, now if you think that is an example of good military leadership by the Russian generals I disagree.
I would cross them off your list of great generals of WW2 right there.
Report lfc1971 August 27, 2017 12:28 PM BST
You see people might think that Russia played a greater part in winning the war because they shot and killed a given number of Germans. but of course that didn't mean necessarily that they shot those soldiers on the field of battle.
Report lfc1971 August 27, 2017 12:45 PM BST
The Asian conflict being mainly water? No that's what made it so difficult .
British and Chinese killed more Japanese on land than America ?
What's  China got to do with it, they were defeated until America showed up.
And I think 100,000 British troops surrendered in Singapore, if it was so easy ,
Rather like the European conflict when there was the danger of 300, 000 British troops surrendering at Dunkirk.
Now that was the nature of the task facing the American generals.
Report Dr Crippen August 27, 2017 12:48 PM BST
I'm always more interested in the political shenanigans that causes these wars. Like who backed Hitler to enable him to gain power and for what reason?

Then there's the pact between Stalin and Hitler of which little is mentioned, but would have been sure defeat for the allies had it been escalated. Yet there was never any chance of that happening.

All this has to be viewed in conjunction with the causes of WW1. Supposedly precipitated by an assassination.
What was Britain doing making binding treaties with France, when France was doing the same with Russia?
Couldn't they visualise the inevitable outcome of that?
WW2 was inevitable after the conditions imposed on the Germans after WW1, so would the Germans have taken such strong issue with communist Russia without Hitler?
Report stewarty b August 27, 2017 3:35 PM BST
Like who backed Hitler to enable him to gain power and for what reason?


Could you not say the same about Saddam Dr C? Anyways I could put a lot of input into this thread but as I only type with one finger it can get a tad frustrating. What I will say is that my late father was a desert rat and fought against Rommel and his army. According to my father things never changed that much in North Africa until Montgomery was put in charge.
A cautious general by all means but a man who refused to go on the attack until he was provided with the right amount of men and equipment, eventually ending the war in NA.

I think all schoolchildren aged over fourteen should be given the choice to watch the splendid documentary The World at War. It's been over forty years since it has been made but I know I will not see a better one.

You would think a lot of lessons could be learned from it, but sadly not.
Report The_KAMIKAZEE_DRINKING_MACHINE August 27, 2017 4:56 PM BST
Sepp Dietrich. Clearly the best General in WW2.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03RdunM5zyk
Report Dr Crippen August 27, 2017 8:52 PM BST
The attack on Pearl Harbour.

The Americans were warned three days before the attack that something was brewing, and records show an attack was expected.
Didn't Roosevelt move the bulk of the American fleet to Pearl before the attack, and didn't an American admiral get removed for protesting about that decision?
The vulnerability of Pearl Harbour to attack along with that, has fuelled many conspiracy theories.
For an attack of that nature would give the Americans a legitimate reason to go to war.

And how fortunate that the American aircraft carriers were out at sea when the attack was launched.

The circumstances surrounding the Americans entering WW2 are as dodgy as the when they joined WW1.
Report stewarty b August 27, 2017 9:25 PM BST
Apparently Churchill was aware of the impending attack but rightly never informed the Americans. By that I mean they would have no choice but to get involved.
Report tobermory August 28, 2017 12:11 AM BST

Aug 27, 2017 -- 12:45PM, lfc1971 wrote:


The Asian conflict being mainly water? No that's what made it so difficult .British and Chinese killed more Japanese on land than America ?What's  China got to do with it, they were defeated until America showed up.And I think 100,000 British troops surrendered in Singapore, if it was so easy ,Rather like the European conflict when there was the danger of 300, 000 British troops surrendering at Dunkirk.Now that was the nature of the task facing the American generals.


The Chinese were never defeated at all , and were holding off half the Japanese army . More Americans surrendered in the Phillipines than British in Singapore . At least the defeated British general - Percival - went into captivity with his men .The American general - MaCarthur - got himself out .

Report tobermory August 28, 2017 12:14 AM BST

Aug 27, 2017 -- 4:56PM, The_KAMIKAZEE_DRINKING_MACHINE wrote:


Sepp Dietrich. Clearly the best General in WW2.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03RdunM5zyk


Think you will be on your own with that one !  Best General at being a Nazi maybe.

Report tobermory August 28, 2017 12:20 AM BST

Aug 27, 2017 -- 3:35PM, stewarty b wrote:


Like who backed Hitler to enable him to gain power and for what reason?Could you not say the same about Saddam Dr C? Anyways I could put a lot of input into this thread but as I only type with one finger it can get a tad frustrating. What I will say is that my late father was a desert rat and fought against Rommel and his army. According to my father things never changed that much in North Africa until Montgomery was put in charge.A cautious general by all means but a man who refused to go on the attack until he was provided with the right amount of men and equipment, eventually ending the war in NA.I think all schoolchildren aged over fourteen should be given the choice to watch the splendid documentary The World at War. It's been over forty years since it has been made but I know I will not see a better one.You would think a lot of lessons could be learned from it, but sadly not.


The 1st Battle of El Alamein in July '42 was the one that halted Rommel . Auchinleck was the British commander . After the battle Churchill demanded Auchinleck immediately take the offensive but he said he would need 6 weeks to be ready .He was sacked and replaced by Monty , who then decided he would need 3 months to prepare an attack Crazy Montgomery obviously did a very thorough job , but i think generals should be given higher marks for winning battles against the odds , rather than when they have more men and tanks + air superiority.

Report lfc1971 August 28, 2017 1:38 AM BST
During WW2 US forces sank 611 Japanese warships , 21 of Japan's 25 aircraft carriers, 2117 merchant vessels and over 400,000 Japanese sailors were killed .
The Chinese navy sank a total of 3 of Japan's merchant vessels.

US destroyed 20,000 Japanese aircraft . To aid China they flew in 650,000 tons of military equipment
By the end of the war the 14th Air Force had over 20,000 troops and 1000 aircraft based in China

During the course of WW2 fully 80% of Japanese battle fatalities were inflicted by US forces while only 10% by Chinese forces .
After the war the US never occupied a single inch of Chinese territory .
Report lfc1971 August 28, 2017 1:49 AM BST
the 14th air division based in China shot down 2,908 Japanese aircraft, losing 193.
They sank 99 warships and 18,000 smaller vessels transporting Japanese troops and supplies along China's inland waterways. They destroyed bridges and trucks and killed over 60,000 Japanese troops preventing further Japanese atrocities and the Japanese 6th army determined it had to retreat from southern China.
Report lfc1971 August 28, 2017 1:54 AM BST
After Japan's surrender in 1945 the WW2 allies decided to punish Japanese aggression by restoring all the territories that Japan annexed from china including Manchuria, Formosa , and the Korean Peninsula .
Report lfc1971 August 28, 2017 2:05 AM BST
There is one irrefutable fact , it was the United States, not China, not Russia, or any other nation that vanquished Japan in WW2.
Report Dr Crippen August 28, 2017 11:13 AM BST
By the way, I hope no one gets reported for giving Hitler a bad name on this thread.

You can't be too careful in the present climate.
Report stewarty b August 28, 2017 11:51 AM BST
There is one irrefutable fact , it was the United States, not China, not Russia, or any other nation that vanquished Japan in WW2.


That is true lfc but Russia were only weeks away from backing the US against Japan. Although this never happened, Stalin was not surprised when the two A bombs were dropped and he never got that information from the US...
Report lfc1971 August 28, 2017 12:05 PM BST
We have enough evidence of how Stalin and Russia helped countries in eastern Europe, and in Russia itself to realise that is is best not to see how they would help in Japan or China or Korea..although of course they did supply help to Mao who went on to enslave and murder a few million more and in N.Korea also they share the blame for that evil regime.

No we could see quite enough of Russia`s help, we already saw too much.
Report lfc1971 August 28, 2017 1:20 PM BST
How glorious to be an American General in WW2 ! ,and how beautiful and honourable to follow McArthur and his inviolable commands .
Old soldiers never die, they just fade away
no, no , I am not telling lies.
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