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thegiggilo
01 May 17 23:26
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Date Joined: 04 Aug 07
| Topic/replies: 9,219 | Blogger: thegiggilo's blog
A LEGEND AND GOAT!!Cool
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Report thegiggilo May 2, 2017 2:21 AM BST
By Telegraph Staff
7:48PM GMT 18 Jan 2010

Selby regained the Masters title with a thrilling final-frame victory at Wembley Arena, but O'Sullivan feels the 26 year-old blows too "hot and cold" to win over the course of the 17-day tournament at Sheffield's Crucible Theatre.
O'Sullivan, 34, believes he has at least three or four years left before considering retirement but also doubts he will add to his three world titles.
"As far as winning world titles, that is mission impossible for me," he said. "I'm too hot and cold to go in with any confidence in doing it.
"I don't think Selby has the game either to win a world title because of the same reasons. That is why it is tough, you are up against players that have that relentlessness."Shocked
The inconsistency of both players was illustrated during Sunday's final, although O'Sullivan did not let it affect him as it has previously in his career..

Any more tips Ronnie...Cool
Report moondan May 2, 2017 7:26 AM BST
Giggs,

I have been a fan of Selbys for at least a decade but to call him a goat yet is typical of the times and todays fan.
He has a few more to win yet and to call him the greatest of all time is just a joke.
I can put Hendry comfortably in front of him along with O'Sullivan, Higgins and Steve Davis, they have the evidence.

I remember old Ted Lowe christening Steve Davis the professor of snooker and my god has he tried to play the part since.
In his career each shot became overthought when little thought was necessary.
I can see history repeating itself with Selby.

I know the run of the ball has a great say in most matches and Selby's run of the ball against Ding proves that beyond doubt he was a very lucky boy indeed.
In the final he was lucky to get a clapped out Higgins who wasn't even a shadow of his former self and he struggled to overcome him.

We will see many mis-matches in snooker because the table has been dumbed down on the instruction of Hearn who believes that frame time is hindering tv from showing more because advertising requires a certain discipline.
That is the world we live in and also why snooker is a failing sport in the UK, unfortunately Selby could be another spanner in the works as he could become another pressure that the shot clock brigade will use.

At present Selby has much to prove to become the greatest of all time and while I have always respected your opinion and do not doubt your love of the game this is just a fanboyism that is not worthy of you.
Report thegiggilo May 2, 2017 9:22 AM BST
One of the GOATS not the goat,when have I ever said that seems to be a lt of seething on the snooker forum instead of giving credit to one of the greats..He made the whole championship. involved in the best match in a decade won,he has the best ever tv total clearance,he came from 6 frames behind in the final and has won it 3/4 years what more can you do..On top of that got the fanboys seething a purely memorable and enjoyable two weeks,not forgetting the blokes absolute class in every way..
Report jed.davison May 2, 2017 10:22 AM BST
Whatever one's distaste for his swaying about on the shot like a drunk navvy down the club, the boy is building a mightily impressive body of work, and while his place in the game's pantheon is up for debate, right now he is head and shoulders above the rest as a match-player. He's got the lot, and he never gives up. Hats off to the lad, a very worthy World Champion.
Report wondersobright May 2, 2017 11:20 AM BST
couldn't agree more with the last 2 posts, well said guys
Report Blackrock May 2, 2017 11:38 AM BST
He's not bad at singing either.Wink
Report Alec Eiffel May 2, 2017 1:55 PM BST
No doubting that Selby is the king of the castle atm, he has taken on all comers - Ding, Robertson, Trump, O'Sullivan and the clear evidence is that he is the better man, especially over the distance. As Jed put is he is building up an impressive body of work and for me that's the issue. The dominant players of recent and not so recent years - Davis, Hendry, O'Sullivan, Higgins (J) and Williams all played to a greater or lesser extent with a certain fluency. Selby is a winner - there's no argument there - but he doesn't half make it look like hard work and regardless of his record, it's difficult to reconcile his position as an all time great with someone whose style is so unbelievably laboured.
Report jed.davison May 2, 2017 2:11 PM BST
His cueing is horrible, it's an affront to the eye of the knowledgeable snooker fan, and with the possible exception of Rory McLeod there was nobody there this year who looks so second-rate before he has hit a ball.

I think though that it make it all the more meritorious that he is as good as he is - there's nothing natural about him, he must have worked like the proverbial Trojan to overcome his technical limitations.
Report thegiggilo May 2, 2017 2:49 PM BST
He didn't look to laboured to me in the marco fu match with that 143 try looking at how quick he won those franmes,then the semi against ding best match in a decade what was laboured about that fantastic match.It was obvious at 10-4 down he had gone,that's what makes him a great most would've given in, the only way to get back in the match is the ultimate bottle infact he knocked in a ton and an 83,the only time he plays slow is when he's struggling.
Selby was on his ''b'' game'' winning that final,played his best snooker to early that's how difficult it is to play well over the whole 17 days,as for cueing he's got every shot in the book there's only trump that can do more wuith the cueball than him...
Report macrocky May 2, 2017 4:12 PM BST
I thought it was a very average standard world championship.  Many players played poor stuff.
Ding was involved in all the best games and the 1st 3 sessions of ding v Selby was the tournament's best.
Selby isn't good on the eye. He doesn't make snooker exciting
The snooker fan will watch RONNIE or Ding anytime. Selby isn't very watchable even though he is number 1
Report peckerdunne May 3, 2017 10:18 AM BST
Average tournament indeed, not very enjoyable for large parts and has left me thinking the future is not so bright.

I am fairly sure i will be paying less attention to it in the future even though i have watched them all since it began at the crucible.

Ultimately Ding failed, mentally frail still, yet again, at the end of the day.
All the plaudits are a waste of time, he has not won it by now and i see no reason suggesting he will.

He might win plenty of event in the short format but the world's is probably beyond him.
I did think briefly he had found some calm serene fortitude, but he just has not got the cut.

Mark is class for me.If others cant outsmart him or control and dominate his game, giving he apparently lacks 'style' or whatever, well it just reflects poorly on the others with 'style Judd etc...

Barry has brought the game to the masses but killed its heartbeat..

It is truly like watching paint dry more often than not now.

The gushing hyperbole and soundbites are just for new fans of the ME NOW generation.
Report jed.davison May 3, 2017 10:51 AM BST
I think you're being harsh on Ding, he had a much tougher section of the draw than Selby - as it turned out and through no fault of Selby's of course - and had already played two humdingers before he met Selby. To say he failed through mental frailty is grossly unfair I think - ultimately he lost because he missed a  missable blue.

It's all very well saying that Selby is what he is through his superior will and determination, but it damns him somewhat if you then claim that his greatest danger, which is what Ding was, is frail.

I prefer to think that once again, the Crucible did what it set out to do - it found the best player in the world and placed its crown on his head.

I take your point about conditions - the table were definitely easier than they should be, and I was and am as critical as the next purist about that. But I think this was a good year, there were some absolutely great matches, and one - Selby/Ding - which was as good as any game of snooker I've seen.
Report Blackrock May 3, 2017 11:25 AM BST
Agree with Jed regards Ding. Whenever i thought Selby has him now, Ding fought back. It was a war more than a game of snooker, and Ding only just failed to a player with the strongest mental attitude the game has seen.

The pockets are still a big issue, and that's not going to change. I think we see so much great skill in the championships, that if somebody misses a pot we are shocked.

Can't wait for next year.Love
Report gobelins May 3, 2017 7:03 PM BST
I agree with a lot of what has been said, and there is absolutely no doubt that M.Selby is on a different level mentally to the rest of the field, but I can't agree with Blackrock when he says he has the strongest mental attitude the game has ever seen. S.Hendry and possibly S.Davis are above him in that respect, in my eyes, through their longevity.

There's no doubt Hendry couldn't win the way Selby does, but he was mentally superior in the 90s for entirely different reasons than Selby is now. He completely changed the way the professional game was played and was the best front runner there has ever been (a quality Selby doesn't get enough credit for due to the lack of long matches these days). And, unlike the supposed favourite for this years event, J.Trump, Hendry was absolutely merciless against inferior opposition. He had a run of 29 straight wins here (between 1992 and his defeat to K.Doherty in the 1997 final). In the 1992 final he beat J.White 18-14 (from 8-14 down) and in 1994 won the title with a fractured elbow in his left arm, with White missing a black off the spot at 17-17 - a ball he wouldn't have missed against anyone else in the game.

Some may argue that Hendry achieved greatness because he was he was simply the best player (by a long way) rather than through his mentality or strength of will - but he had a presence and the fear factor that Selby now has, but over a much longer period. Some will argue that the standard of opposition during this period was inferior to today, but I can't accept that. On the one hand you can't say the players of today are mentally weaker but also say the standard is better. Hendry's win in 1999 saw him beat P.Hunter, J.Wattana, M.Stevens, R.O'Sullivan and M.Williams - and it simply doesn't get any harder than that.
Report Blackrock May 4, 2017 11:33 AM BST
Gobelins - i have no doubt that Stephen Hendry is the greatest player ever to pick up a cue. But i believe Selby has a mental strength that is incredible.

He refuses to be beaten, and was absolutely knackered after his epic with Ding. But after taking a battering on Day One v Higgins, he said i will be fine tomorrow. I will win.

Cannot see how Steve Davis is mentally stronger than Selby. Davis lost an 8-0 lead to Alex in the UK i think, and we all remember Dennis Taylor turning him over. Would NEVER happen to Selby.
Report mafeking May 4, 2017 2:46 PM BST
also recovered from a similar massive deficit on day 1 of the final to win his first title against ronnie. looked cream crackered on that occasion as well
Report gobelins May 4, 2017 10:06 PM BST
Blackrock - I'm not disputing how mentally strong M.Selby is, far from it, he finds something, from somewhere, when he looks down and out, and to produce the comebacks he has against J.Higgins and R.O'Sullivan in World finals says more about how strong he is mentally than I ever could. But, that doesn't mean he has the strongest mental attitude the game has ever seen. There's another thread with the best ever breaks on it - watch S.Hendry's against S.Davis in a match of huge significance - made on the brink of defeat, and listen to his comments afterwards, particularly regarding his mindset before taking on the final blue.

You're right about S.Davis losing 2 substantial leads in massive finals, and probably right in saying Selby would never lose leads of that size. But, snooker in the 80s was THE sport in this country. Davis was the sporting megastar in this country in the 80s (he finished in the top 3 of Sports Personality Of The Year 5 times - no snooker player even makes the short-list these days). He had far, far, more pressure on him than any other sportsman, never mind snooker player for the majority of the decade, and the 2 defeats you speak of made the national news. He was quite literally hated for his success, and ordinary people, who were not really snooker fans, were genuinely delighted when he lost. He walked out to face J.White and A.Higgins at Wembley (in his home city) to incredibly hostile receptions and booing. The matches were played in football type atmospheres (as they were at Goffs in Ireland). Those defeats definitely left long-term scars for him, but to focus on these 2 defeats and suggest that Selby is definitively the mentally stronger because of them, is most unfair given Davis's incredible single mindedness, his level of success, his number of titles, and his insatiable quest for perfection - all achieved in an environment of pressure that today's players will never experience.
Report anfeild May 4, 2017 11:56 PM BST
Snooker is like test cricket. It was one of the most watched sport but people's attention span and time are limited. With cricket they could  change the format. Darts evolved through the pub scene where its a night out and its the pub atmosphere. Snooker there is really not much you can do. Making the pockets easier devalues the game. I used to love snooker. First season ive not really cared. And im a jimmy white era. First time ive not cared who won. The game is in a really poor state. The pockets are a big issue but the bigger issue is too many touraments. If the main aim is to move the game towards china fair enough but as a game snooker imo is in real trouble.
Report anfeild May 5, 2017 12:00 AM BST
Also selby is a great player but beating most players who are just earning a living by being average. He just wants it more. Ronnie has packed it in the rest are just happy to pick up pay checks. Selby is probably in the poorest era ever in snooker.
Report thegiggilo May 5, 2017 1:18 AM BST
It's been a weak era for 10+ years and lets not forget o'sullivans won 4 worlds out of his 5 since 2004 beating Alistair carter twice and Graeme dott and Barry Hawkins beating up what you could easily call average players.When looking back non of those world titles will be remembered,probably the only ones remembered will be alex Higgins if you were around at the time and the relentlessness of Hendry and how fantastic white was.In the main everything in between will be forgotten,although I think murphys was very memorable as he went for everything and got it never seen anyone win the worlds playing like that pity his game went to sh1t..
Report trebor May 5, 2017 1:23 AM BST
Why are we in the poorest era ever in snooker? well first of all we are not, but we are in a poorer era than Hendry's era.

I will give my opinion why maybe we are in a poorer era than when Hendry dominated the game, and the reason is Hendry himself!

Davis took the game to a new level, then Hendry took it to a higher level, but where Davis's game could be copied and success achieved by any player with patience, Hendry's style of play could not. Yet players for the last 15 years or so seem to believe that they must play like Hendry did, because he was so successful.
Hendry is possibly the best player of all time and for many years high on confidence, good mental strength and believed the way he played the game was the best way to play.
The reason I say you can't copy Hendry's style of play is because unless you really believe that you should be taking on a pot or opening the pack you wont commit to it with the confidence required, taking a shot on because Hendry would have is a completely different thing and will fail far to often.

Hendry himself had a fairly short career, he could not play his own style once low on confidence.

So Hendry did take the game to a new level, but unless you are brilliant player with great mental strength you can not copy it.
Report thegiggilo May 5, 2017 1:30 AM BST
Yes I know Graeme dott was world champion and deserved it but still showing the fragility of last 10+ years,i don't know why I missed mark Williams off as he played some of the best pressure snooker in 3 seasons I've ever seen although I can't specifically remember the finals similarly like Selby I remember how much bottle he had.
Report Blackrock May 5, 2017 12:32 PM BST
Gobelins - only my opinion that Selby is the mentally strongest, and im a massive Hendry fan.  You don't win 10 on the bounce in a  World final coming from 14-8 down without having balls of steel.

The London snooker fans have always been @ssholes [ i'm a Londoner btw] always cheering on the flambuoyant players, and giving little respect to others. The Nuggett did have his Romford based pals who turned up at events, but i never understood the point of booing somebody you have paid money to see.

In response to Anfeild , snooker has adapted to the limited attention span society we have today. Hearn has turned events into the best of 7 with 128 competitors turning up. A complete disaster imo but Hearn will say there is more money in the game now because of it.

That's why the World's are totally different class and is the benchmark for any player.
Report the.mad.dog.man June 6, 2017 3:29 PM BST
boring snooker
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